Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Jul 18, 2009 Read more: Webbunny tumblelog 237,766
Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Read more
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

#179359 Oct 7, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Maybe, just maybe, if you spent more time studying science, specifically cosmology, you wouldn't rant so childishly about the origin's of the universe. There are so many great books about cosmology, and I KNOW you don't want to exercise that most horrible of all human traits being willfully ignorant. So let me suggest an excellent book that will bring you up to speed on the universe. Stephen Hawking's book entitled A Brief History of Time, The Universe In a Nutshell. Very easy reading, even though dealing with some very complex concepts.
After reading this book and any others that will boost your intelligence level, you will no longer rant so childishly about the majesty of the universe.
The main problem with the mindset that you have is this. You have a pre-conceived notion about the origin's of the universe and life on our planet. Once you accept that Goddidit, you immediately cease exploration. You have fallen into the "It's so complex and I can't begin to understand it so Goddidit" trap. Once you accept that all investigation is over. Thats why you don't even make an attempt to understand other possibilities. As soon as you say 'I DON'T KNOW" Then and only then does the journey of discovery begin. Read Hawking's book, stop being a bewildered child when to look up at the night sky. It's never to late to GROW UP>!!!
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins is an Atheist as you are well aware. The man is obviously brilliant. I donít find hard to believe heís intelligent. But Mr. Hawkins is a theorist. The science of cosmology is a science based not on absolutes but theories.

You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.

I donít deal in theories Sir because theyíre like a**holes just about everybody has got one. For example thereís no less than 20 theories are out there on how life started on the earth. Mr. Hawkins is a philosophical dreamer in the world of cosmology.

When it comes down to it Mr. Hawkins is speculating. Toss in a few complex mathematical equations that no one understands including Mr. Hawkins. The result is unfortunately good people like yourself get duked into believing this hocus pocus nonsense.

If it was so easy to happen on itís own why doesnít scientist recreate the event? Would you like me to answer that? They canít do it. Because it is far more complex then just creating by happenstance.
blacklagoon

Revere, MA

#179360 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins is an Atheist as you are well aware. The man is obviously brilliant. I donít find hard to believe heís intelligent. But Mr. Hawkins is a theorist. The science of cosmology is a science based not on absolutes but theories.
You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.
I donít deal in theories Sir because theyíre like a**holes just about everybody has got one. For example thereís no less than 20 theories are out there on how life started on the earth. Mr. Hawkins is a philosophical dreamer in the world of cosmology.
When it comes down to it Mr. Hawkins is speculating. Toss in a few complex mathematical equations that no one understands including Mr. Hawkins. The result is unfortunately good people like yourself get duked into believing this hocus pocus nonsense.
If it was so easy to happen on itís own why doesnít scientist recreate the event? Would you like me to answer that? They canít do it. Because it is far more complex then just creating by happenstance.
A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next stepóknown as a theoryóin the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.

You are laboring under gross misinterpretation of the word THEORY. Notice in the above the fact that the hypothesis is supported with REPEATED TESTING. If enough EVIDENCE.........accumulated. It becomes accepted as a VALID EXPLANATION.

You seem to think a Theory is simply some scientists best guess. It goes way beyond guess work.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

#179361 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins is an Atheist as you are well aware. The man is obviously brilliant. I donít find hard to believe heís intelligent. But Mr. Hawkins is a theorist. The science of cosmology is a science based not on absolutes but theories.
You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.
I donít deal in theories Sir because theyíre like a**holes just about everybody has got one. For example thereís no less than 20 theories are out there on how life started on the earth. Mr. Hawkins is a philosophical dreamer in the world of cosmology.
When it comes down to it Mr. Hawkins is speculating. Toss in a few complex mathematical equations that no one understands including Mr. Hawkins. The result is unfortunately good people like yourself get duked into believing this hocus pocus nonsense.
If it was so easy to happen on itís own why doesnít scientist recreate the event? Would you like me to answer that? They canít do it. Because it is far more complex then just creating by happenstance.
He won't get what you said. It's just bad comprehension skills.
blacklagoon

Revere, MA

#179362 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins is an Atheist as you are well aware. The man is obviously brilliant. I donít find hard to believe heís intelligent. But Mr. Hawkins is a theorist. The science of cosmology is a science based not on absolutes but theories.
You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.
I donít deal in theories Sir because theyíre like a**holes just about everybody has got one. For example thereís no less than 20 theories are out there on how life started on the earth. Mr. Hawkins is a philosophical dreamer in the world of cosmology.
When it comes down to it Mr. Hawkins is speculating. Toss in a few complex mathematical equations that no one understands including Mr. Hawkins. The result is unfortunately good people like yourself get duked into believing this hocus pocus nonsense.
If it was so easy to happen on itís own why doesnít scientist recreate the event? Would you like me to answer that? They canít do it. Because it is far more complex then just creating by happenstance.
When used in non-scientific context, the word ďtheoryĒ implies that something is unproven or speculative. As used in science, however, a theory is an explanation or model based on observation, experimentation, and reasoning, especially one that has been tested and confirmed as a general principle helping to explain and predict natural phenomena.

Any scientific theory must be based on a careful and rational examination of the facts. In the scientific method, there is a clear distinction between facts, which can be observed and/or measured, and theories, which are scientistsí explanations and interpretations of the facts. Scientists can have various interpretations of the outcomes of experiments and observations, but the facts, which are the cornerstone of the scientific method, do not change.

As indicated above, you are not using the word *theory* in scientific terms, and think it means unproven or speculative.

It is scientific THEORY that has advanced medicine and most likely had a hand in saving your wife and baby during childbirth. It also saved your children from diseases, via vaccinations, that killed millions not so long ago. Scientific THEORY has improved your life in so many ways, from longevity to organ and joint replacements. Scientific THEORY gave us wings and propelled us to the moon and beyond. Scientific THEORY has given to world-wide travel, communications, clean water, abundant food, and has created a period of wellbeing that could only be dreamed of a hundred years ago. So when you say "I don't deal in Theories" you are talking in ignorance, THEORIES are the cornerstone of our civilization, you'd do well to show some respect and gratitude for all that it has done for you and your loved ones.

In the end, it always comes down to educating one's self. If for no other reason that this:

"To be scientifically literate is to empower yourself to KNOW when someone else is full of shit"
blacklagoon

Revere, MA

#179363 Oct 7, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
He won't get what you said. It's just bad comprehension skills.
Where's that proof you say you had on the existence for souls? Maybe you didn't comprehend what I asked for???

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#179364 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins is an Atheist as you are well aware. The man is obviously brilliant. I donít find hard to believe heís intelligent. But Mr. Hawkins is a theorist. The science of cosmology is a science based not on absolutes but theories.
You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.
I donít deal in theories Sir because theyíre like a**holes just about everybody has got one. For example thereís no less than 20 theories are out there on how life started on the earth. Mr. Hawkins is a philosophical dreamer in the world of cosmology.
When it comes down to it Mr. Hawkins is speculating. Toss in a few complex mathematical equations that no one understands including Mr. Hawkins. The result is unfortunately good people like yourself get duked into believing this hocus pocus nonsense.
If it was so easy to happen on itís own why doesnít scientist recreate the event? Would you like me to answer that? They canít do it. Because it is far more complex then just creating by happenstance.
It can't be recreated because the energy level is far beyond any particle accelerator yet devised. But the conditions up to
the period after the initial expansion can be simulated.

Hawking is a theoretical cosmologist and a astrophysicist, he deals in much beyond your ability to understand. The fact you do not understand doesn't make his hypothesis invalid. It doesn't make them correct, but it does give us his idea of how it IS possible. He has made a few very significant discoveries, that has advanced our understanding of the universe. With black bodied radiation , black holes and he developed a mathematical proof for black holes. He proved Einstein's theory of general relativity. Through math and science, Stephen redefined the Big Bang theory. Also Stephen Hawking proved the universe has no boundaries.

I think he has a little more than hocus pocus, it's called math and physics, and the science of the universe. Many people understand his work, many study his work. He has been a credit to humanity, the fact he does not believe in god, and can show how this universe could be created without one threatens your belief to the core. Which means...you're afraid of him.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179365 Oct 7, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Magic, you can create fire with two words!
:)

It is magic all the way down, with these people.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179366 Oct 7, 2013
Little Blue Alien wrote:
<quoted text>
I'll bet you've put many things 'behind you' too.
What does a chicken and a gay man have in common?
They both love cockfighting!
COCKA-DOODLE-DOO!!!!
What is it, with you Genuine Christiansô and your obsession with gay sex?

Hmmm?

I think you are trying to compensate for your own secret fantasies.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179367 Oct 7, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Considering the company of people I have tht you accuse of lying and being evil, thank you.
Until and if you prove your hate-god is real?

You are, in fact, a liar.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179368 Oct 7, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
You are so absolute. You are a Fundamentalist.
Nope.

I just fight fire with fire.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179369 Oct 7, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Wait minute you admitted to having a clergy many pages ago
Nope. That was you-- fantasizing.

And lying-- I cannot forget that you LIE pretty much 100% of the time.

But you are a horrid person; I bet you have no friends.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#179370 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Doctor, thank you for your sincere rebuttal. Mr. Hawkins
Who?

Who is this "Hawkins" you keep writing of-- there is no such a person.

You've been schooled on this one multiple times.

Yet?

You keep repeating the deliberate error....

... why?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#179371 Oct 7, 2013
Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
I do think you overkill requesting proof, in many cases you should know better. The there is "no" evidence of UFOs was the latest and greatest. Some of your questions, suggest you should be reading not writing. The atheist that use to post online had enough respect for the topic and themselves to post a question like "Could you, Prove souls to me?" They would not belittle themselves with the claim that there is zero proof of that, and they would be aware of experiments showing souls do have a weight, according to those that feel they have proven it. In stead of answering such buffoonery, I strongly advise your expanding your reading.
Souls have been proven? I take it you can link me to the scientific literature on the subject?

No?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#179372 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>

You and I can agree something big happened in the cosmos at some point and time. Mr. Hawkins believes that matter always existed, just started coming together after trillions and trillions of years floating in the vacuum of space.
That's... not what happened.
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

#179373 Oct 7, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>
A scientific theory summarizes a hypothesis or group of hypotheses that have been supported with repeated testing. If enough evidence accumulates to support a hypothesis, it moves to the next stepóknown as a theoryóin the scientific method and becomes accepted as a valid explanation of a phenomenon.
You are laboring under gross misinterpretation of the word THEORY. Notice in the above the fact that the hypothesis is supported with REPEATED TESTING. If enough EVIDENCE.........accumulated. It becomes accepted as a VALID EXPLANATION.
You seem to think a Theory is simply some scientists best guess. It goes way beyond guess work.
Well Doctor, How do you explain the 20 plus theories on how life started on the earth? All of them are supposed to be supported hypothesis.

And when you get into theories involving cosmology. How in the hell are you going to recreate that in a lab? So here we have unsupported hypothesis. Granted there are some scientific observations but those observations donít resolve the issues of how it all started.

This is why the science of cosmology is full of theoretical philosophers, which is what Hawkins happens to be. Now we have gone beyond scientific study into an area of faith like a religion. Doctor you have cosmology religion based on philosophy.
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

#179374 Oct 7, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
It can't be recreated because the energy level is far beyond any particle accelerator yet devised. But the conditions up to
the period after the initial expansion can be simulated.
Hawking is a theoretical cosmologist and a astrophysicist, he deals in much beyond your ability to understand. The fact you do not understand doesn't make his hypothesis invalid. It doesn't make them correct, but it does give us his idea of how it IS possible. He has made a few very significant discoveries, that has advanced our understanding of the universe. With black bodied radiation , black holes and he developed a mathematical proof for black holes. He proved Einstein's theory of general relativity. Through math and science, Stephen redefined the Big Bang theory. Also Stephen Hawking proved the universe has no boundaries.
I think he has a little more than hocus pocus, it's called math and physics, and the science of the universe. Many people understand his work, many study his work. He has been a credit to humanity, the fact he does not believe in god, and can show how this universe could be created without one threatens your belief to the core. Which means...you're afraid of him.
Hawkins contributions in science falls into the philosophy section. He is a dreamer and thatís what it all amounts too. Has any of his stuff advanced medicine or science for mankind? No, because itís irrelevant.

Name some hard spin offs directly attributed to Hawkins so called discoveries. Something that dramatically changed life on the earth or in space. His stuff is Nil, itís a box car of theoretical philosophy. Nothing he claims is tangible.

Itís all unproven hocus pocus rhetoric. But who believes it and takes it to the bank? You Atheist. A homeless man living under a bridge in New York has had the same contribution and probably just as good observations on space as Hawkins.

Find some spaced out dope head living in the desert of New Mexico. He can give the same unproven, mumbo-jumbo about relativity but with a little more humor.
Eagle 12

Troy, IL

#179375 Oct 7, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Who?
Who is this "Hawkins" you keep writing of-- there is no such a person.
You've been schooled on this one multiple times.
Yet?
You keep repeating the deliberate error....
... why?
Whatever his name is because it doesnít matter. His contribution to science is nil.

Stephen Hawking, the space philosopher, dreamer, theoretical physicist and cult leader. All his so called contribution to science is imaginary.

All he has done is rallied a cult following and thatís it. Heís just a mascot like some schools have a bull dog for a mascot. Thatís all he is a freaking mascot.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#179376 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Well Doctor, How do you explain the 20 plus theories on how life started on the earth? All of them are supposed to be supported hypothesis.
And when you get into theories involving cosmology. How in the hell are you going to recreate that in a lab? So here we have unsupported hypothesis. Granted there are some scientific observations but those observations donít resolve the issues of how it all started.
This is why the science of cosmology is full of theoretical philosophers, which is what Hawkins happens to be. Now we have gone beyond scientific study into an area of faith like a religion. Doctor you have cosmology religion based on philosophy.
How I envy you.
blacklagoon

Revere, MA

#179377 Oct 7, 2013
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Well Doctor, How do you explain the 20 plus theories on how life started on the earth? All of them are supposed to be supported hypothesis.
And when you get into theories involving cosmology. How in the hell are you going to recreate that in a lab? So here we have unsupported hypothesis. Granted there are some scientific observations but those observations donít resolve the issues of how it all started.
This is why the science of cosmology is full of theoretical philosophers, which is what Hawkins happens to be. Now we have gone beyond scientific study into an area of faith like a religion. Doctor you have cosmology religion based on philosophy.
In science there can be more than one hypothesis. And I seriously doubt there are 20 theories on how life started on Earth. The most accepted answer is biogenesis. Life from non-living. Science is pretty sure that biogenesis is possible they just don't know the exact details just yet.

You do know that it is perfectly acceptable to say "I don't know" Once again when you say I don't know the journey of investigations begins. Only when you think you have the absolute correct answer does the investigation cease. What exactly would you have science do, stop all investigation, abandon all the Theories, and simply say as you, It's so complex that it is beyond understanding so God MUST have done it?

The science of cosmology is far from theoretical philosophy, and those who do the investigation do so using science not philosophy, where did you get such a lame ass idea? I don't know who Hawkins is. I always thought he was a character in the story Treasure Island. Stephen HAWKING, is the cosmologists who has turned that science on its ear with his discoveries.

I've posted this before but you apparently missed it. When science fails to have the answer, which happens frequently, God is inserted into that gap. Its an argument as old as mankind, its called THE GOD OF THE GAPS. Here is how it works. There was a time when Thunder and lightning were believed to be cause by an angry God, and a time when sickness was attributed to demons, or witches, or an angry God, were volcanos, earthquakes and tsunamis, were caused by God. In each and every case, science discovered the real answer. Static electricity for thunder storms, germ theory for illnesses, plate tectonics for volcanos, earthquakes and tsunamis. All of these answers pushed the God explanation out of the way. if this is how you want to play this game of Goddidit, then be prepared to watch as your God becomes an EVER RECEDING POCKET OF SCIENTIFIC IGNORANCE. Science WILL discover how to create life from non-life....God is pushed out of the way..........The answer as to how our universe came to be will be discovered at some point........God is pushed out of the way. One hundred years from now, with science answering so many questions that could only be answered with God, God will become totally unnecessary for most of us. Oh, there will be the hangers on who will shout and preach and beat their chests and proclaim God is still the answer. But these are the same people who now reject science because it conflicts with there dogmatic beliefs. Sound familiar? What a sweet day that will be, and then maybe our species can begin to remove all those religious barriers that have kept us apart for thousands of years. Just think, a new beginning for mankind, one without the divisiveness and hatred that religion spawns.

“There is no god!”

Since: Jun 12

SŲdertšlje, Sweden

#179378 Oct 7, 2013
Bongo wrote:
<quoted text> Youre an idiot, if you think you freaks can give it and not get it back youre mistaken. You are the hatheist.. You are a typical member of a small minority of the irrelegious
Thank you again for showing us how hateful you and your religion is

and what is a hatheist ?(hat heist?)

/I'm proud to be irreligious!

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