Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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“Think&Care”

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#177264
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's make this simple. Let's say everything that formed our visible universe was in a sphere 10 mm in diameter.
OK. Now, you do realize there is more material outside of that sphere that is NOT part of the observable universe, right? The *whole* universe has no edges.
Then Poof!!!! or less, let's say it expanded to fill this solar system.
As part of the overall expansion of the whole universe, yes.
How did the surface of that sphere get out to past Pluto? Let's say the interior surface, because that is what we would see looking outward.
There is no edge because there is material outside.
The BBT says space was created with that expansion. We are back to the volume thing again, which is a most important component of our reality.
The universe as a whole is expanding. The small part of it that composes our observable universe (that which is in our light cone) is expanding with it. There are no edges to the universe as a whole. There is not an 'edge' between the observable universe and the rest; it is just where we haven't seen yet because light moves at a finite speed and the universe is not infinitely old.
You know I have a different idea of what this existence is, but I would like you to explain that in the physical sense based upon the physics we accept as physical and built a model of the BBT on.
OK, an analogy. We model space as the two dimensional surface of a balloon. As time passes, the balloon is expanding. From any particular point on the balloon, the 'observable' part is a small circle on that balloon that expands along with the balloon. In this analogy, the radius is *time*. Space is the balloon itself. Space has no edges and is expanding.

In this analogy, time begins when the radius is zero. Just after that, the whole balloon is very small, but the part observable from any point is a much smaller circle on that balloon. As the balloon expands, so does the circle.

Our observable universe corresponds to that circle. It was smaller in the past because the universe as a whole was smaller in the past. Just like the balloon itself, the universe has no edge. It looks the same at every point at any particular time.

These are *basic* aspects of the BB theory. The only 'deep' concepts is that space can be curved and have no boundaries, it can expand, and the observable part can be a small part of the whole.

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

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#177265
Sep 13, 2013
 

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every game wrote:
... you can't refute Christianity.
Anyone can refute christianity, all you need is to break your indoctrination, a little logic and a belief that things have progresses since the iron age.

1 Can you provide evidence that a god (any god exists)? There are 3700+ claimed deities which include 2400 gods claimed to posses omnipotence. Also note that E=MC^2 shows that the god depicted in Revelation 19:6 (KJV) cannot exist in this universe at the same time as you.

2 Will you falsify the first law of thermodynamics? Unless of course you use the special pleading argument that your god did it by magic out of nothing,(funny how you can deny that nature could not do such a thing yet insist that a mythological and invisible beard in the sky can)

3 explain a talking snake, donkey etc.

4 explain how salt can be manufactured from carbon.

5 explain how the ark was made to the dimensions specified using the technology of the period.(FYI, it is impossible to make even using todayís technology)

6 explain how around 8 to 9 million species (mostly 7 of each) could be gathered from then unknown continents and stored in said ark for about a year

7 explain where the food for more than 56 million animals was stored and kept fresh for about a year using the technology available.

(Methinks you have not actually considered the logistics of the ark story, The ark story on itís own provides enough evidence to refute the abrahamic religions)

8 provide evidence that the late jc existed as depicted in the babble.(note there is data that shows the person you worship was in fact the bastard son of a roman soldier named Pantera, the child grew to be a terrorist and was crucified for his crimes, he was extracted from the cross by his terrorist opos and seen around town, later dying of blood poisoning caused by the nails used to hang him, there is no contrary evidence)

9 explain why the current versions of the babble (NT) should be accepted as gospel considering it was selectively compiled by committee some 300+ years after events.(note that the Torah, on which the OT (and much of the NT) is based tells a lot that the christian religion omits, including the identity of the father of the person you call jesus, see above). Over the centuries the book was edited and changed to such an extent that in the early 1600ís it had to be rationalised (again by committee), not using the original text but a variety of contemporary bibles that sounded right. Guess what, now, juts over 400 years later there are over 200 English versions and who knows how many in other languages. Those versions gave given rise to around 40,000 different sects of christianity, each claiming there sect is correct.

10 why, when science offers falsifiable fact should anyone place their faith in any one of 40,000 different unevidenced and unprovable stories based on unevidenced and unprovable tales of 2000 years ago?

Will that do fro refuting christinaity or do you want more?

“Think&Care”

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#177266
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =1YvWaLSOOIQ
For those of you that missed this wonderful video. Most of you have all ready visited youtube, therefore there are no virus risk, as Thinking would suggest.
The video gets all of the physics wrong. It gives *one* quote from Hawking (that the universe had a beginning), but gets essentially every other aspects wrong. It gives a false version of the first law of thermodynamics (ignoring the aspect of time), falsely assumes that htere had to be something before the universe (time began along with the universe--it is part of the universe), claims that there was an energy transfer into the universe (which would violate the first law), and then identifies this energy as a deity (without showing any other properties, such as intelligence).

The *only* part of the vieo that is correct is that Hawking said the universe had a beginning. All the rest is pure garbage.

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

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#177267
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =1YvWaLSOOIQ
For those of you that missed this wonderful video. Most of you have all ready visited youtube, therefore there are no virus risk, as Thinking would suggest.
Instead of making these attempts to balk from what is the clear truth. You should celebrate. Atheism is a rather ugly belief. It's not a fact and thank God for that. Afterwards do count your blessings. One atheist here even responded to my comparison of atheistic truth vs theistic truth as the atheist being sub human. I still believe that some of you don't host a soul. As depressing as that may be you could still rejoice, knowing there is a God, and celebrate all the same, being happy for your brother man. Understand God is perfect and you won't be able to understand all that is laid out for you. For some of you, you do have a soul, and you deny it. Not just in your mind either. Discover your own immortality and connection to God and The Universe. By all means break away from those childish belief of a God that is not perfect. You've all ready took the first step in that by recognizing the jive talk of a God that is not perfect. Those stories just are not true made up by man to... well if you must it is case by case, do a fair research, getting to know some of the finer people in your area.
The truth be told as I am doing. There is no argument. In regards to this. Go out and discover that everyday. The only words you should have remaining are. Thank You.
You donít know much about the interent do you? there is ALWAYS a virus risk if clicking a link supplied by someone you do not trust

Wrong, it is considerably more fact than belief in a bronze age ideal with no evidence to back it up. When you can disprove E=MC^2 only then can you honestly say that atheism is not fact. But hey, you are christian so when has honesty ever come into your belief.

Can you provide evidence that suggest we do posses a soul?

Of course we rejoice, that physics, nature and time can combine to create such wonders as an entire universe and all it holds.

Note, I have done a fair bit of research into the babble and the period of JC, you may laugh but I was once christian myself but thatís another story. That research lead me to help compile material that has been used as a basis for at least 5 books. Honey, I know what you are trying to make non believers belief. Sorry, an unprovable falsehood based on the superstition of bronze age man and a god child based on terrorism and lies is not the way to go, it may suite your limited comprehension of life but thatís up to you.

“Robert Stevens”

Since: Dec 08

Jersey City , NJ

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#177268
Sep 13, 2013
 

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An open letter I sent to the believers that continue to post here.

In m final conclusion from taking part in "Atheist require as much faith as religion" is that their bad comprehension skills serve as a buffer from facing the world. It is a sad existence that they should work on over coming. I have read treads that are really dead, but people still post there as a support group. Atheist actually sharing real every day issues they have. In between you could read and see they are socially challenged. The ones at this tread are yet to advance that far.

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#177269
Sep 13, 2013
 

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ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah so your god(s) give you the ability of prescience, or is it perhaps davesworld delusion? Clairvoyance, wow. Your world of magic and myth grows more weird by the day
How ignorantly wrong you can be, I guess itís a side effect of your godbot guesswork.
FYI, I am 33 years old and weigh the same (exactly) that I did when I was 18, my measurements are the same to within ľ inch and I wear the same dress size. I exercise regularly by taking long walks and cycling, other than that I take no special actions, just natural I suppose.
Perhaps you should spend a little more time in the gym if bits of your are busting out as you seem to suggest. Oh yes and I hear those spas do a good line in waxing to remove your excess hair. Not sure if they can do much with your unsightly ear and nasal hair though.
You projection using your own deteriorating age ridden body is simply a consequence of your emotional jealousy
I thought you posted you were about 42 some time back.

Thirty three is pretty young yet. Too young to know what you think you know.

However, enjoy it while you can. Women have about 20 years of being pretty blossoms, then they fade rapidly. They need plenty of plastic and artificial coloring to maintain those petals. While one may be inclined to brave thorns to pick a fresh rose, that inclination to smell it, much less to pick it, drops rapidly. Especially since the thorns get harder and sharper while those petals fall apart.

You have about 5 years left of lower maintenance. There will be no magic to change that.

After that is when your real intellectual ability starts to develop. You will be less distracted by those passing by to take a sniff, unless you have money hanging on those thorns, and much more time to consider just what living is.

Start working on dulling those thorns.

You have to have a poetic soul, which takes time to develop, to understand what I was portraying there, and how it relates to the living process. Birth, growth, breeding, watching what is happening, and leaving the scene. Humans and plants do the same thing.

Relax, your youth and energy scares me more than the thorns. I almost remember being like that once upon a time. As you start wilting you are more loathe to waste energy.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

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#177272
Sep 13, 2013
 
Just outside the observable universe , there is a sign that say's..The End. Beyond that, there is a infinite wall of Russel's teapots stacked up.
Barring the way so nobody can escape being entombed
in universe. You know when you're almost there because the signs say...You can't get there from here.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#177273
Sep 13, 2013
 
nanoanomaly wrote:
<quoted text>Don't let Bob bully you into registering. It's how him and his gang of trolls stalk people. If you register you'll end up having the freaks following you around your home town, and I don't mean your online Topix home page.
LOL!

My stalker is cute when she tells the world of her imaginary "troubles"....

... too funny!

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#177274
Sep 13, 2013
 
Thinking wrote:
I was registered once but religitards wanted to get hold of my family details, the little charmers.
The death threats they resorted to only proved to me how weak their belief system is. Their time is passing.
<quoted text>
Interesting. I'm not at all surprised, though.

I've got death threats too.

And ugly private messages as well-- I block'em now.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#177275
Sep 13, 2013
 
followerofSatan wrote:
<quoted text>
and you are
Good for nothing, yellow bellied, egg headed, chicken legged, twig boned, fish lipped, prune skinned, pea brained, skunk backed, wing tied, web toed, bottom dwelling, scum gathering, slime coated, stink covered, swine based, toilet drinking, sewer loving, fungus smothered, drippy nosed, aft sniffing, fore pimpled, pock faced, mama dressed, twinkly eyed, slick fingered, fancy footed, wig headed, mirror minded, self serving, cheese brained, milk toast, half pint, sissy feathered, lily livered, one eyed, short sighted, money grubbing, fame seeking, comfort needing, rock stupid, liquor craving, self medicated loser whosebr uni-owed, fur covered family tree starts with primates, and ends at the zoo. You twit."
Monty Python?

:D

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#177276
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =1YvWaLSOOIQ
Helpful hint: HIT MUTE RIGHT AT THE START, to avoid the shytty soundtrack. All the "points" are just written.

Point 1: "nothing cannot come from nothing".

This "point" in the video has no basis in reality. No modern scientific basis for the Universe's origins makes this ludicrous claim.

Only **THEIST** do-- they claim that their god made the universe from **nothing** in a direct violation of pretty much every scientific principle there is.

Point 2: "Energy is eternal" is bullshit. Energy can become matter and vice versa. So this point is flat wrong too.

Point 2 is belabored by repetition of the lie-- which doesn't help their false case.

Point 3: they contradict themselves-- they point out the universe in it's **present** form, had a beginning (they fail to address that it could have existed in a **different** form).

And if their idiotic point 2 were true? Then point 3 is false. If point 3 is true? Then their stupid point 2 is false!

THE VIDEO CONTRADICTS ITSELF! And this is only 30 seconds in!

LOL!

They go on to quote-mine Stephen Hawking with a snippet that has the **appearance** of seeming to **agree** with their lies. They even abuse a photo of him in their ugly video-lie.

Point 4: is so ludicrous, it is almost not worth the bother-- but in point 4, the talk about "before time"-- which is senseless. You cannot have a "before time" any more than you can have "north of the north pole".

Point 4a: they allude to "power beyond anything we can imagine"... and ... wait for it... THEY GO AHEAD AND IMAGINE IT ANYHOW!

They go on to **DEFINE** this "beyond imagination" power by what it supposedly did...(and they got their imaginary vision WAY TOO LOW, too-- only billions of galaxies... that is **WAY** too low for what humans have observed in the visible universe)

<laughing out loud here at their stupid>

Point 5: "a separate eternal energy-source".... think about this one for a bit. They are actually implying that energy has to be USED UP somehow, or you would not need an energy **source**... in direct **contradiction** their point 2. They are implying with the statement "energy source" that energy WAS CREATED at some point.

FAIL! Humorously so.

Point 5a: their whole "outside the universe" is silly-- if it's outside? It is not-- by definition-- inside. And so it doesn't matter. If it **is** inside? Then it's not **outside**. These people are idiots.

Point 6: Here? They jump from an insentient, mindless "energy source" (a giant pink bunny with a drum, perhaps?) to their all-powerful GOD in ONE STROKE.

No preamble. No argument for HOW we go from a giant battery to an IMPOSSIBLY COMPLEX GOD.

Nothing so sophisticated as that.

Fail: special pleading.

Point 7: more special pleading. They also admit that it could have been a giant energizer pink bunny-- as mindless as **they** appear to be.

But they **insist** that it **must** be an infinitely-complex self-aware being. Why? Well...**because**.. order and shyt.. and **because**.... <laughing> "And DESIGN!" they insist-- without showing ANY ACTUAL DESIGN.

Point 8: repeating their point 7 does not make the idiocy of it any better. Still no demonstration of this "design" or "order"...

IN FACT? THE UNDERLYING PRINCIPLES OF OUR UNIVERSE ARE PRETTY CHAOTIC. Not orderly at all....

Fail.

Their final slide? Just the usual whining from religious fuckery.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#177277
Sep 13, 2013
 

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polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
The video gets all of the physics wrong. It gives *one* quote from Hawking (that the universe had a beginning), but gets essentially every other aspects wrong. It gives a false version of the first law of thermodynamics (ignoring the aspect of time), falsely assumes that htere had to be something before the universe (time began along with the universe--it is part of the universe), claims that there was an energy transfer into the universe (which would violate the first law), and then identifies this energy as a deity (without showing any other properties, such as intelligence).
The *only* part of the vieo that is correct is that Hawking said the universe had a beginning. All the rest is pure garbage.
Indeed it was... I watched the whole thing-- The Hawkings misquote is only about 1/2 way in, and he is never mentioned again.

Hint: MUTE THE SOUND FIRST. It's a major improvement... <heh>
blacklagoon

Brookline, MA

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#177279
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Robert Stevens wrote:
<quoted text>
Mr Hawking nor myself denies evolution. I do disagree with some details others have, that THEY CAN'T PROVE. The monkey in the middle. If we came from a tree primate. 1. Our feet would be much different then they are. 2. We would be so much more stronger and faster. We'd be able to beat the 50 pound monkey that could rip us to shreds. You are a fool for trying to put words in my mouth or thoughts in my head. As Orwell claimed you would, worm meat.
Your ignorance level on the process of evolution is startling. "If we came from a tree primate.?" That is NOT what evolutionary biology claims, you really do have to stop reading creationists bullshit. We and the great apes SHARE a common and ancestry. I do hope your intelligent enough to understand the meaning of the word SHARE.

You really took a big hit on this post, waving the big red flag of ignorance is NEVER a good idea. Now......go a read some real science books!!!!

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#177280
Sep 13, 2013
 

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blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Your ignorance level on the process of evolution is startling. "If we came from a tree primate.?" That is NOT what evolutionary biology claims, you really do have to stop reading creationists bullshit. We and the great apes SHARE a common and ancestry. I do hope your intelligent enough to understand the meaning of the word SHARE.

You really took a big hit on this post, waving the big red flag of ignorance is NEVER a good idea. Now......go a read some real science books!!!!
You made a glaring mistake here: you assume he could ... read.

:D

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#177281
Sep 13, 2013
 

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blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Your ignorance level on the process of evolution is startling. "If we came from a tree primate.?" That is NOT what evolutionary biology claims, you really do have to stop reading creationists bullshit. We and the great apes SHARE a common and ancestry. I do hope your intelligent enough to understand the meaning of the word SHARE.
You really took a big hit on this post, waving the big red flag of ignorance is NEVER a good idea. Now......go a read some real science books!!!!
There is no sharing. Those ancestors are long dead.

You can share an ice cream cone, you can not share a dead ancestor.

You can say great apes are DERIVED from a common ancestor.
LCNLin

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#177282
Sep 13, 2013
 

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blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>Your ignorance level on the process of evolution is startling. "If we came from a tree primate.?" That is NOT what evolutionary biology claims, you really do have to stop reading creationists bullshit. We and the great apes SHARE a common and ancestry. I do hope your intelligent enough to understand the meaning of the word SHARE.
You really took a big hit on this post, waving the big red flag of ignorance is NEVER a good idea. Now......go a read some real science books!!!!
...whines,
alas proves nothing other than he is person who has become extremely vocal about his atheism and is trying to convince others of his fantasy views.

Obviously regarded as an embarrassment by fellow atheists.
LCNLin

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#177283
Sep 13, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
There is no sharing. Those ancestors are long dead.
You can share an ice cream cone, you can not share a dead ancestor.
You can say great apes are DERIVED from a common ancestor.
His posts are comical and amusing if one is NOT under the spell of atheist philosophy.
Peace

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

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#177288
Sep 13, 2013
 

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every game wrote:
<quoted text>
You're really pissed off , aren't you?
Nope.

I do find you sad and funny at the same time.

A also pity you for your loss.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#177289
Sep 13, 2013
 

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every game wrote:
<quoted text>
Your hatred, once again in a state of erection.
Do you believe that is what your Jewsus(jesus) would have done?

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

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#177290
Sep 13, 2013
 

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every game wrote:
<quoted text>
*yawn*
Of course! My entire post was 200% over your feeble abilities.

I pity you for your loss.

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