Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#158532 Mar 4, 2013
Well you could play the blob with zero special effects needed.
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Spoken like the little punk you are.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#158533 Mar 5, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
There are also atheists and agnostics in science who do not accept the theory of evolution as stated, nor abiogenesis. They object on scientific and logical grounds.
Yeah. What, 4? 10?

I've read the links you've posted to the ID stuff, gone through the court transcripts - none of their statements were compelling. Few of them seemed to understand what natural selection was and how it worked - very similar to how you incorrectly describe it, actually.

To be honest, Buck, there's a lot of scientists in my field who don't actually get how evolution works. So I'm not surprised that some scientists might object to it - it's a matter of not comprehending it, not being satisfied with how the theory is incorrectly and illogically implemented sometimes.

I was at an evolutionary anth seminar and one women's presentation, I just wanted to stand up and say "clearly you don't know what you're talking about and the rest of us are embarrassed for you. Could you stop?"

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#158534 Mar 5, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
You added another component to natural selection to get what you claim is evolution. That's my point - natural selection is not evolution.
I agree natural selection is the proposed mechanism of evolution.
But it is not evolution.
Passing the trait that allowed survival is in no way a different process than if the trait had not aided survival. That is simple reproduction.
Nothing in the example offered yet is evolution.
Natural selection is not evolution. If it were, we would have no use for the term "evolution". We would simply say the process of natural selection gives us our biologic diversity.
If you divorce science from logic, it ends up being mush - which is what attempts to describe evolution has become.
I'm not sure why you're not understanding my words. I never wrote that natural selection was THE mechanism of evolution. I wrote:

natural selection is a mechanism of evolution. It is the mechanism which produces adaptation.

I'm assuming you're confused b/c some other poster is telling you that natural selection IS evolution. It's not. It's just one mechanism of many. I would never write that it is the only mechanism.

If we might get a bit more advanced in this conversation? What we call "mechanisms of evolution" aren't really as separate as the categories that we constructed here - those "mechanisms" are merely for our benefit, so that we can parse nature into recognizable and therefore understandable pieces. But nature is messy; it's not so neatly organized.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#158535 Mar 5, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
You will take whatever you're told.
David Berlinski:
'Darwin,' Richard Dawkins has remarked with evident gratitude,'made it possible to be an intellectually fulfilled atheist.' This is an exaggeration, of course, but one containing a portion of the truth. That Darwin's theory of evolution and biblical accounts of creation play similar roles in the human economy of belief is an irony appreciated by altogether too few biologists."
The same can easily be said about what Berlinski believes - which isn't actually capable of being tested scientifically.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158536 Mar 5, 2013
The mind and body can go separate ways. Dreams, NDEs, hypnosis, and exercising of will need to be explained better to support the belief that mind is all of the physical body.

Those last two are mental disciplines done on an individual basis. Hypnosis and going into trances overrides the body. People have been known to cut their own arms and legs off to survive, as have some animals. This is pretty high order thought for just the mind being a slave of the body.

How can such mental discipline be passed down in genes?

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#158537 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
The mind and body can go separate ways. Dreams, NDEs, hypnosis, and exercising of will need to be explained better to support the belief that mind is all of the physical body.
Those last two are mental disciplines done on an individual basis. Hypnosis and going into trances overrides the body. People have been known to cut their own arms and legs off to survive, as have some animals. This is pretty high order thought for just the mind being a slave of the body.
How can such mental discipline be passed down in genes?
Your mind and body separated years ago but never rejoined.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#158538 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
The mind and body can go separate ways. Dreams, NDEs, hypnosis, and exercising of will need to be explained better to support the belief that mind is all of the physical body.
Those last two are mental disciplines done on an individual basis. Hypnosis and going into trances overrides the body. People have been known to cut their own arms and legs off to survive, as have some animals. This is pretty high order thought for just the mind being a slave of the body.
How can such mental discipline be passed down in genes?
People have been know to put a bullet in their head too. High order thought? Fight or flight is a good bedtime story. There is also another choice. Not everybody cares about life, Dave. It is what it is until it isn't. Not a big deal.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158539 Mar 5, 2013
To demonstrate how sharp the Topix atheist mind is.

I have posted my NDE at least 3 or 4 times over the last couple of years. Wasn't exactly one that you could call a religiously inspired one. Not that such stopped Topix atheists from ranting about how I'm such a godbot and fundamentalist,yada, yada, yada.

Not a one of them took note of the fact I didn't cry out to a higher power to come get me.

Topix atheists have mental issues with obsession. paranoia, and projection.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158540 Mar 5, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
People have been know to put a bullet in their head too. High order thought? Fight or flight is a good bedtime story. There is also another choice. Not everybody cares about life, Dave. It is what it is until it isn't. Not a big deal.
You are wandering off track, there.

I still have guns I bought from the widow of a guy that left his brains all over his office walls that she had to clean up. That was because he couldn't see any escape from the debts and life he had created in his head. But he had the will to do it.

It is not all fight or flight. This exercise of will is done all the time. Conquering the body as in heavy exercise to political ambition.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#158541 Mar 5, 2013
Dizzy wrote:
I'm not sure why everyone care so much about religion... Who cares what someone else believes in? So atheist don't believe in deity's it's not that big of a deal! And so Christians and other religions have God(s)... People care to much. If everyone would stop judging others for what they do/believe the world would be a much nicer place... If you believe that's fine! If you don't that's fine too!!


And we could easily agree with that if religion didn't try to dictate science in public schools or create laws based on biblical falsehoods.

Believe what you want. But many of us are tired of religion interfering in our daily lives.

It's only with the advent of the internet that the atheist voice is starting to be heard. Before that, we were pretty much muzzled by religious hatred. I still can't talk to most of my family about my atheism without creating major rifts.

I love them for who they are, religion and all, but I can practically guarantee that if I spoke my thoughts on religion, I would be irrevocably cast out.

Why is that?

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#158542 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
To demonstrate how sharp the Topix atheist mind is.
I have posted my NDE at least 3 or 4 times over the last couple of years. Wasn't exactly one that you could call a religiously inspired one. Not that such stopped Topix atheists from ranting about how I'm such a godbot and fundamentalist,yada, yada, yada.
Not a one of them took note of the fact I didn't cry out to a higher power to come get me.
Topix atheists have mental issues with obsession. paranoia, and projection.
You live with people. You die alone.

It's a personal experience Dave.

I was hit by a large metal object too, Dave. I lost my leg and neither of us died. When we do, look me up. I'll be the Asian girl with one leg.

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#158543 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You are wandering off track, there.
I still have guns I bought from the widow of a guy that left his brains all over his office walls that she had to clean up. That was because he couldn't see any escape from the debts and life he had created in his head. But he had the will to do it.
It is not all fight or flight. This exercise of will is done all the time. Conquering the body as in heavy exercise to political ambition.
It only matters if you care. Do you care?

If you do, stop talking about your NDE or OBE and start getting on with your life.

Or not.
Imhotep

United States

#158544 Mar 5, 2013
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
And we could easily agree with that if religion didn't try to dictate science in public schools or create laws based on biblical falsehoods.
Believe what you want. But many of us are tired of religion interfering in our daily lives.
It's only with the advent of the internet that the atheist voice is starting to be heard. Before that, we were pretty much muzzled by religious hatred. I still can't talk to most of my family about my atheism without creating major rifts.
I love them for who they are, religion and all, but I can practically guarantee that if I spoke my thoughts on religion, I would be irrevocably cast out.
Why is that?
Easy as 1-2-3

1. Keep your religion out of our lives..
2. Keep religious dogma out of government.
3. Cease attempting to force your beliefs on others.

You will never never hear about atheism again.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158545 Mar 5, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
You live with people. You die alone.
It's a personal experience Dave.
I was hit by a large metal object too, Dave. I lost my leg and neither of us died. When we do, look me up. I'll be the Asian girl with one leg.
A very mature statement you made there in the first sentence. You had good influences in your younger years to shape your high intelligence. You have some bitterness, but it will pass as you mature even more.

You can bet I will be looking you up when that time comes, but I won't be looking for an Asian girl with one leg.

I lost a life, little one, but got another one. More to it than you know.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158546 Mar 5, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
It only matters if you care. Do you care?
If you do, stop talking about your NDE or OBE and start getting on with your life.
Or not.
I bring it up only as an example of the mind having a link to some place else besides the body. I got over it a long time ago.

You prefer I let these idiots rant on about mind and spirit being strictly a material thing? Why would I do that?

Explain how humans have such an ability to override the material if we are strictly a product of it.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158547 Mar 5, 2013
http://www.santafenewmexican.com/Local%20News...

Sounds like something Topix atheists under stress will gravitate to.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158548 Mar 5, 2013

Since: Oct 10

Location hidden

#158549 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I bring it up only as an example of the mind having a link to some place else besides the body. I got over it a long time ago.
You prefer I let these idiots rant on about mind and spirit being strictly a material thing? Why would I do that?
Explain how humans have such an ability to override the material if we are strictly a product of it.
If it makes you happy to rage against them, then I'm good with that. Do you have a significant other? Girlfriend, wife?

I don't mean to pry. I'm here to learn. Feel free to tell me to fuckoff at any time.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#158550 Mar 5, 2013
"Santa Muerte, Spanish for Saint Death, is a sacred figure and feminine skeletal folk saint venerated primarily in Mexico and the United States. As a figure made holy by popular belief, the saint of death developed through syncretism between Mesoamerican indigenous and Spanish Catholic beliefs and practices. Santa Muerte, the name in Spanish, literally translates to "Saint Death" or "Holy Death".[1] Since the pre-Columbian era Mexican culture has maintained a certain reverence towards death,[2] which can be seen in the widespread commemoration of the syncretic Day of the Dead.[3] Elements of that celebration include the use of skeletons to remind people of their mortality.[4] The worship is condemned by the Catholic Church in Mexico as invalid, but it is firmly entrenched among Mexico's lower working classes and various elements of society deemed as "outcasts"."

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Santa_Muerte

"Outcasts". Worship of mortality.

Topix atheists.

Incredibly disturbed and motivated to rant and rail against a religion that condemns such a belief, screaming about the "atrocities" committed by that religion when it wasn;t the religion but the people within it. The same people and motivations you have everywhere in any organization. Yet they worship the inherent "goodness" of people. An atheist will rob you blind, lie cheat, steal, and murder the same as anyone else will. They believe in you being slave to other men instead of a deity.

They have some head issues.
Free Mind

Wesley Chapel, FL

#158551 Mar 5, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
The mind and body can go separate ways. Dreams, NDEs, hypnosis, and exercising of will need to be explained better to support the belief that mind is all of the physical body.
Those last two are mental disciplines done on an individual basis. Hypnosis and going into trances overrides the body. People have been known to cut their own arms and legs off to survive, as have some animals. This is pretty high order thought for just the mind being a slave of the body.
How can such mental discipline be passed down in genes?
Great question. In dogs, I believe a lot of mental discipline can be passed down. I'll wager there have been plenty of studies to support same in humans.

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