Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 258473 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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Since: Sep 10

Hermosa Beach, CA

#153075 Feb 10, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I spent a bit of this time of year up the other way in Monterey back in 1976, and spent a lot of that around Point Sur. Watching the whales, seals, and sea otters. A beautiful spot. Big change in temperature around that bend.
I was in Monterey a month ago. Sea otters were doing their backstroke, and the seals and sea lions were all over the place. The aquarium is also fantastic.

Didn't get down to Point Sur, just to Pacific Grove. It's beautiful everywhere in that area.

Eagle12

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#153076 Feb 10, 2013
Mikko wrote:
<quoted text>
stop babbling nonsense!
I don’t mean to anger you or cause you any harm. I don’t see you as a big offender in my view. I just want you to know that respect doesn’t cost anything.
GenoGirl

Inverness, UK

#153077 Feb 10, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I was in Monterey a month ago. Sea otters were doing their backstroke, and the seals and sea lions were all over the place. The aquarium is also fantastic.
Didn't get down to Point Sur, just to Pacific Grove. It's beautiful everywhere in that area.
Aww I love seals, and it sounds like an epic place

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#153078 Feb 10, 2013
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
The First Cause must account for:
1. Laws of logic.
Wrong, the laws of logic are not physical events, so causality doesn't apply to them at all.
2. Laws of morality.
Wrong. Morality is defined by humans for human purposes.
3. Laws of nature.
Wrong once again. It is self-contradictory to talk about the cause of physical laws since causality is based on such physical laws.
4. Existance of intelligence.
Wrong. If there was a first cause, it was so far removed from the first intelligence as to make the connection tenuous at best.
5. Purpose and meaning to life.
Wrong, as explained to you many times.

You haven't shown there *is* a first cause: to do that, you have to first show there isn't an infinite regress of causes and *then* show that any two events have a common cause. Neither has been shown and both are unlikely.

Even if you show there is a first cause, you haven't shown that it is an intelligent creator of the universe. Even a 'first cause' can be accidental (say, a scientist in a multi-dimensional universe learns how to create small dimensional universes like ours, but does so by mistake).

Your problem is that the first cause argument is so full of holes, swiss cheese manufacturers would be sued for having so much empty space.

Since: Sep 10

Hermosa Beach, CA

#153079 Feb 10, 2013
GenoGirl wrote:
<quoted text>
Aww I love seals, and it sounds like an epic place
Do you live close to the Gleaneagles Hotel? I have wanted to go there!
Turkey

Oswego, NY

#153080 Feb 10, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
All topix posters are liars .
There's the truth!
This is especially true of the atheists. It is also true that Dave makes fools of all of the topix atheists regularly. Its quite amusing. Dave makes a mockery of even the most ardent psuedo elite atheists.
GenoGirl

Inverness, UK

#153081 Feb 10, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you live close to the Gleaneagles Hotel? I have wanted to go there!
No I said it sounds awesome, and Id love to go and see it sometime

Since: Sep 08

Lamar, CO

#153082 Feb 10, 2013
GenoGirl wrote:
<quoted text>
Aww I love seals, and it sounds like an epic place
The view is stunning in March, especially in the morning.

Had one of my God looking out for me moments along that highway. Some sheer cliff driving. Was heading north late in the day and curved into the setting sun with a sharp right curve coming up. A large tractor trailer was coming the other way around that tight curve. I was totally blinded.

There used to be a rusted wreck of a car that went 1000 ft off the cliff you could look down and see. Was a sort of tourist attraction.
blacklagoon

Boston, MA

#153083 Feb 10, 2013
Eagle12 wrote:
Back to Mars.
Undoubtedly, Mars looked very much earth at one time. With running rivers, polar ice caps and lakes. Plenty of Carbon Dioxide in the atmosphere. Even rain, wind and a few storms.
We only see the remains of what once was this very wet planet. With lots of water one would think there would be life. Trees, grass, fish, whales, animals of every sort. Even sea shells and crustaceans along with their fossils.
No trees, no fossils, no remains of fish or whales. Nothing, nothing but soil, and rocks. Completely lifeless and no evidence there ever was life. Lot’s of evidence of water both liquid and frozen. But no evidence of life.
What does that tell us? Life is not self creating. If it was so easy then we would have seen an abundance of evidence by now. If we had a wealth of evidence that life existed on Mars. That in itself would say that life could self create. Magically build the complex DNA codes needed for life to start and replicate.
The pendulum swings against self creation on Mars. There among the desolate dunes on Mars is a lack of evidence. That life can mystically and magically appear without purposely being designed and constructed.
I am making every attempt here to be civil. Your contention that if Mars had once possessed life we should know about it. Thats the same as someone walking to the edge of a desolate beach, scooping up some water, kicking over same sand and declaring,,,NOPE NO LIFE EXISTS HERE!!!! Hopefully you can see how stupid that is. We have a few roving probes analyzing rocks and soil, thats it. Imagine an Alien probe landing in the middle of the Sahara desert, what would the find? Two rovers on a planet basically the size of Earth, and you have concluded that there is no evidence of life on Mars? REALLY?? You might very well be right, but lets at least wait until a manned mission has spent considerable time looking for sign of life before we say NO LIFE THERE. It somewhat angers me that the only reason you make such a ridiculous and unfounded statement is because you are desperately trying to support your religious beliefs, and it has nothing to do with real discovery. And if they fine evidence of life then what will you say? Don't answer I already know....."See how God has created life even on planets other than our own"

Since: Sep 08

Lamar, CO

#153084 Feb 10, 2013
Turkey wrote:
<quoted text> This is especially true of the atheists. It is also true that Dave makes fools of all of the topix atheists regularly. Its quite amusing. Dave makes a mockery of even the most ardent psuedo elite atheists.
Thank you for the compliment, but all I really do is assist them in their efforts. They do try hard.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#153085 Feb 10, 2013
macumazahn wrote:
<quoted text>You are aware that, on a quantum level, there are uncaused effects?
Therefore the universe caused itself and always was.

I don't like repeating myself but it's ok.

Since: Sep 08

Lamar, CO

#153086 Feb 10, 2013
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>I am making every attempt here to be civil. Your contention that if Mars had once possessed life we should know about it. Thats the same as someone walking to the edge of a desolate beach, scooping up some water, kicking over same sand and declaring,,,NOPE NO LIFE EXISTS HERE!!!! Hopefully you can see how stupid that is. We have a few roving probes analyzing rocks and soil, thats it. Imagine an Alien probe landing in the middle of the Sahara desert, what would the find? Two rovers on a planet basically the size of Earth, and you have concluded that there is no evidence of life on Mars? REALLY?? You might very well be right, but lets at least wait until a manned mission has spent considerable time looking for sign of life before we say NO LIFE THERE. It somewhat angers me that the only reason you make such a ridiculous and unfounded statement is because you are desperately trying to support your religious beliefs, and it has nothing to do with real discovery. And if they fine evidence of life then what will you say? Don't answer I already know....."See how God has created life even on planets other than our own"
Mars is just a touch over half the diameter of Earth. The moon is a little more than a quarter.

The aliens would find lots of signs of life in the Sahara. Or at the beach.

Since: Sep 10

Hermosa Beach, CA

#153087 Feb 10, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
The view is stunning in March, especially in the morning.
Had one of my God looking out for me moments along that highway. Some sheer cliff driving. Was heading north late in the day and curved into the setting sun with a sharp right curve coming up. A large tractor trailer was coming the other way around that tight curve. I was totally blinded.
There used to be a rusted wreck of a car that went 1000 ft off the cliff you could look down and see. Was a sort of tourist attraction.
Well, it's not an easy place to extricate the car.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#153088 Feb 10, 2013
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
The First Cause must account for:
1. Laws of logic.
2. Laws of morality.
3. Laws of nature.
4. Existance of intelligence.
5. Purpose and meaning to life.
Now, if each of these are logically taken back to the First Cause, God is self evident.
But, if you want to deny God, then you have to avoid taking these back to the First Cause.
And this is your problem.
Because you are inherently predisposed to reject God, you have to reject any line of reasoning that leads back to God.
And as God is the foundation of all reasoning, you have to reject reason itself.
You do that by abandoning the laws of logic which will lead an open mind back to God.
The truth is self evident.
Error is just as self evident, as it rests on absurdity and arbitrary inconsistency.
Which you would of course expect when someone is denying the truth.
As has been displayed over and over again when your worldview has been examined and discussed.
WHY would a simple answer need to explain everything to you? No th4re doesn't even and doesn't even..... have to be an answer to "your" questions for it to have all taken place.

Let alone there having to be an answer you would understand.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#153089 Feb 10, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
"Therefore the universe caused itself and always was."
LOL!!!
Sounds like a wild card to me.
Instead of goddidit you say shit happens.
Your scientific approach is remarkable.

No actually the shit did happen.
Your assertion there was a god involved.......
Doesn't include any evidence.
Yet it in fact it did happen. That's what I am saying.

Now since we see it happened, but do not see any gods.

WTF would be the reason we could think one was responsible for it?

Your belief, superstition or fantasy?

Please.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#153090 Feb 10, 2013
Turkey wrote:
<quoted text> This is especially true of the atheists. It is also true that Dave makes fools of all of the topix atheists regularly. Its quite amusing. Dave makes a mockery of even the most ardent psuedo elite atheists.
That you are the largest of all liars in topix is a axiom.

King of liars what a Turkey!

Since: Sep 08

Lamar, CO

#153091 Feb 10, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, it's not an easy place to extricate the car.
Is it still there?

Since: Sep 08

Lamar, CO

#153092 Feb 10, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
No actually the shit did happen.
Your assertion there was a god involved.......
Doesn't include any evidence.
Yet it in fact it did happen. That's what I am saying.
Now since we see it happened, but do not see any gods.
WTF would be the reason we could think one was responsible for it?
Your belief, superstition or fantasy?
Please.
"WTF would be the reason we could think one was responsible for it?"

A deity whipping it up, or carving it out of its territory seems a bit more logical than your magic poof. Of course, it could have just taken a dump, and here you are.

Since: Sep 10

Hermosa Beach, CA

#153093 Feb 10, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Is it still there?
I don't know, but I doubt it--it's been what, almost 40 years?

On another note though, although the sardine canneries immortalized by Steinbeck are all gone, they have done a wonderful job of preserving the aura and the history in Monterey itself. The "downtown" area, with the shimmering ocean and its sealife performing alongside, is one of the more beautiful places I have visited--anywhere.
Thinking

Cullompton, UK

#153094 Feb 10, 2013
Were what?
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
In a universe were free will is permitted, suffering is also a consequence of the rejection of God...

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