Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story
NeuroRev

Ashburn, VA

#150141 Jan 26, 2013
Stating that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is misguided. Religious people believe in their gods and religious stories based on cultural upbringing, religious childhood indoctrination, psychological conditioning, emotional conditioning, confirmation bias etc. None of this is evidence on any level. All these techniques condition the mind to believe and 'feel' that the proposed concepts (god and religion) are true. However strong the belief and feeling, this is still zero evidence for it being true. To be convinced of the validity of something with no evidence is to be misguided. One could postulate that a magic pink frog lives in the sky, and that this frog created the universe, earth, sun, people etc etc. Over the ages people have created amazing stories about the frog, written books on the frog, perform rituals for the frog, have a range of beliefs about the frog, organise funerals and weddings based on beliefs about the frog, have special frog-worshipping days, frog festivals etc. Over time these ideas about the magic pink frog have spread down the generations to millions and millions of people. There are huge frog-worshipping buildings, frog statues etc. People worship the magic frog by hopping, croaking, puffing up their cheeks etc. They do this often and in mass numbers. All this reinforces the idea that the magic pink sky frog is real. After all, surely millions of people can't be wrong?? But is any of this mass performance and spectacle evidence for the magic pink frog? No. Not at all. It is a false belief. Therefore it qualifies as a delusion. The strength of the deluded belief is so great that an adherent concludes that it must be true, so such people claim that a lack of belief in the magic sky frog is in itself a belief. This is misguided. A belief should be in proportion to the evidence, not the mass numbers of people and stories clinging onto an unsupported idea. So, to claim that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is nonsense. An atheist is merely one who discards a belief due to a lack of proper supporting evidence. The term atheist is not even necessary, just like how we don't have a term for people who don't believe in ghosts, palm reading or astrology. Before taking beliefs literally, take a look at whether the strength of the belief is based on evidence (causation) or merely a range of psychgological conditioning (brainwashing) techniques over time...
NeuroRev

Ashburn, VA

#150142 Jan 26, 2013
For example we could have people believing that the moon is made of cheese. Millions may believe it, but is this evidence? No. We could have millions of people screaming and chanting that the moon is made of cheese. This would be a mass spectacle, and it would be tempting to assume that because so many people believe it, it must be true... Even if 500 million or 2 billion people are simultaneously chanting and strongly believing this, it does not have any impact on reality. It simply distorts perception of reality, which most people get easily taken in by. All you would need to disprove this massive 2 billion strong delusion is a small moon rock that will fit on the palm of your hand. That's it. It is a sample from the moon. It is chemically and structurally compared to cheese and has no resemblance to it. Therefore the moon is not made of cheese. 2 billion people chanting and screaming "the moon is made of cheese! The moon is made of cheese! I believe the moon is made of cheese! We believe the moon is made of cheese! We believe it!!! We believe it!!!" means nothing and fails in any way to change reality. It is just a mass (2 billion strong) mega-delusion. The tiny moon rock is still closer to truth than 2 billion deluded screaming people...
Imhotep

United States

#150143 Jan 26, 2013
In an article titled "Is There a God?" commissioned, but never published, by Illustrated magazine in 1952, Bertrand Russell wrote:

"Many orthodox people speak as though it were the business of sceptics to disprove received dogmas rather than of dogmatists to prove them.

This is, of course, a mistake. If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes.

But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense.

If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time."

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#150144 Jan 26, 2013
NeuroRev wrote:
For example we could have people believing that the moon is made of cheese. Millions may believe it, but is this evidence? No. We could have millions of people screaming and chanting that the moon is made of cheese. This would be a mass spectacle, and it would be tempting to assume that because so many people believe it, it must be true... Even if 500 million or 2 billion people are simultaneously chanting and strongly believing this, it does not have any impact on reality. It simply distorts perception of reality, which most people get easily taken in by. All you would need to disprove this massive 2 billion strong delusion is a small moon rock that will fit on the palm of your hand. That's it. It is a sample from the moon. It is chemically and structurally compared to cheese and has no resemblance to it. Therefore the moon is not made of cheese. 2 billion people chanting and screaming "the moon is made of cheese! The moon is made of cheese! I believe the moon is made of cheese! We believe the moon is made of cheese! We believe it!!! We believe it!!!" means nothing and fails in any way to change reality. It is just a mass (2 billion strong) mega-delusion. The tiny moon rock is still closer to truth than 2 billion deluded screaming people...
Then you also have those that believe this material existence we are experiencing just popped out of nowhere. No ultimate cause, just a cloud of smoke that condensed and "poof!", here were are.

Still waiting for the proof such can be done on the physical level, and not in the imagination using numbers.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#150145 Jan 26, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Then you also have those that believe this material existence we are experiencing just popped out of nowhere. No ultimate cause, just a cloud of smoke that condensed and "poof!", here were are.
Still waiting for the proof such can be done on the physical level, and not in the imagination using numbers.
Hey look, its that annoying creationist with no proof of god back again, to get crush in debate until he dissapears again back to the discovery institute.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#150146 Jan 26, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
In an article titled "Is There a God?" commissioned, but never published, by Illustrated magazine in 1952, Bertrand Russell wrote:
"Many orthodox people speak as though it were the business of sceptics to disprove received dogmas rather than of dogmatists to prove them.
This is, of course, a mistake. If I were to suggest that between the Earth and Mars there is a china teapot revolving about the sun in an elliptical orbit, nobody would be able to disprove my assertion provided I were careful to add that the teapot is too small to be revealed even by our most powerful telescopes.
But if I were to go on to say that, since my assertion cannot be disproved, it is intolerable presumption on the part of human reason to doubt it, I should rightly be thought to be talking nonsense.
If, however, the existence of such a teapot were affirmed in ancient books, taught as the sacred truth every Sunday, and instilled into the minds of children at school, hesitation to believe in its existence would become a mark of eccentricity and entitle the doubter to the attentions of the psychiatrist in an enlightened age or of the Inquisitor in an earlier time."
You were taught the history of mankind, and a very wide variety of other things in this existence alleged to exist, and how they came about. All based upon books and oral histories. Including "scientific" thought.

See a psychiatrist.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#150147 Jan 26, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You were taught the history of mankind, and a very wide variety of other things in this existence alleged to exist, and how they came about. All based upon books and oral histories. Including "scientific" thought.
See a psychiatrist.
Says the person who wants us all to believe that Jesus rode on the backs of dinosaurs.
bohart

Newport, TN

#150148 Jan 26, 2013
NeuroRev wrote:
Stating that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is misguided. Religious people believe in their gods and religious stories based on cultural upbringing, religious childhood indoctrination, psychological conditioning, emotional conditioning, confirmation bias etc. None of this is evidence on any level. All these techniques condition the mind to believe and 'feel' that the proposed concepts (god and religion) are true. However strong the belief and feeling, this is still zero evidence for it being true. To be convinced of the validity of something with no evidence is to be misguided. One could postulate that a magic pink frog lives in the sky, and that this frog created the universe, earth, sun, people etc etc. Over the ages people have created amazing stories about the frog, written books on the frog, perform rituals for the frog, have a range of beliefs about the frog, organise funerals and weddings based on beliefs about the frog, have special frog-worshipping days, frog festivals etc. Over time these ideas about the magic pink frog have spread down the generations to millions and millions of people. There are huge frog-worshipping buildings, frog statues etc. People worship the magic frog by hopping, croaking, puffing up their cheeks etc. They do this often and in mass numbers. All this reinforces the idea that the magic pink sky frog is real. After all, surely millions of people can't be wrong?? But is any of this mass performance and spectacle evidence for the magic pink frog? No. Not at all. It is a false belief. Therefore it qualifies as a delusion. The strength of the deluded belief is so great that an adherent concludes that it must be true, so such people claim that a lack of belief in the magic sky frog is in itself a belief. This is misguided. A belief should be in proportion to the evidence, not the mass numbers of people and stories clinging onto an unsupported idea. So, to claim that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is nonsense. An atheist is merely one who discards a belief due to a lack of proper supporting evidence. The term atheist is not even necessary, just like how we don't have a term for people who don't believe in ghosts, palm reading or astrology. Before taking beliefs literally, take a look at whether the strength of the belief is based on evidence (causation) or merely a range of psychgological conditioning (brainwashing) techniques over time...
Have atheists discarded their beginning of life theory? It sure isn't supported by any proper evidence.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#150149 Jan 26, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
Hey look, its that annoying creationist with no proof of god back again, to get crush in debate until he dissapears again back to the discovery institute.
You would have to come up with something rational and intelligent for this to be a debate.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#150150 Jan 26, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
Says the person who wants us all to believe that Jesus rode on the backs of dinosaurs.
I think it is recorded he rode into Jerusalem on the back of one of your ancestors.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#150152 Jan 26, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You would have to come up with something rational and intelligent for this to be a debate.
Projection.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#150153 Jan 26, 2013
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it is recorded he rode into Jerusalem on the back of one of your ancestors.
Your mom!?!?!

Since: Oct 12

Location hidden

#150154 Jan 26, 2013
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Her sweet?
Huh?
Catcher, does he do it on purpose? I believe he does, nobody can be like that in the real world...NOBODY!!!!

@Tide.....i didn't do anything....i never even drove a rock. You seem to know a lot about it..what u hiding?

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#150155 Jan 26, 2013
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
Projection.
You do that a lot.

However, your film stock is a little washed out. Overexposed or got moldy.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#150156 Jan 26, 2013
Clementia wrote:
<quoted text>
Catcher, does he do it on purpose? I believe he does, nobody can be like that in the real world...NOBODY!!!!
@Tide.....i didn't do anything....i never even drove a rock. You seem to know a lot about it..what u hiding?
Oh yeah?

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#150157 Jan 26, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm like a Candy Cane. Beware the hook.
Catcher will find your Engrish fraws :)
Hugs,:)

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#150158 Jan 26, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
You have no proof of god. That means you can stop lying about it now.
Seriously, stop lying about a god you have no proof of.
Try talking about something you do have proof of so that you can avoid being an immoral liar, there's a good creationist troll.
My good man I have no proof for you but I have plenty for myself.

God canít be proven but he can be experienced.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#150159 Jan 26, 2013
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
My good man I have no proof for you but I have plenty for myself.
God canít be proven but he can be experienced.
Things that are not proven but can be experienced are called delusions.

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#150160 Jan 26, 2013
www.scribd.com/doc/31322017 ...
Have a nice forever!

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#150161 Jan 26, 2013
NeuroRev wrote:
Stating that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is misguided. Religious people believe in their gods and religious stories based on cultural upbringing, religious childhood indoctrination, psychological conditioning, emotional conditioning, confirmation bias etc. None of this is evidence on any level. All these techniques condition the mind to believe and 'feel' that the proposed concepts (god and religion) are true. However strong the belief and feeling, this is still zero evidence for it being true. To be convinced of the validity of something with no evidence is to be misguided. One could postulate that a magic pink frog lives in the sky, and that this frog created the universe, earth, sun, people etc etc. Over the ages people have created amazing stories about the frog, written books on the frog, perform rituals for the frog, have a range of beliefs about the frog, organise funerals and weddings based on beliefs about the frog, have special frog-worshipping days, frog festivals etc. Over time these ideas about the magic pink frog have spread down the generations to millions and millions of people. There are huge frog-worshipping buildings, frog statues etc. People worship the magic frog by hopping, croaking, puffing up their cheeks etc. They do this often and in mass numbers. All this reinforces the idea that the magic pink sky frog is real. After all, surely millions of people can't be wrong?? But is any of this mass performance and spectacle evidence for the magic pink frog? No. Not at all. It is a false belief. Therefore it qualifies as a delusion. The strength of the deluded belief is so great that an adherent concludes that it must be true, so such people claim that a lack of belief in the magic sky frog is in itself a belief. This is misguided. A belief should be in proportion to the evidence, not the mass numbers of people and stories clinging onto an unsupported idea. So, to claim that atheism requires as much faith as religious belief is nonsense. An atheist is merely one who discards a belief due to a lack of proper supporting evidence. The term atheist is not even necessary, just like how we don't have a term for people who don't believe in ghosts, palm reading or astrology. Before taking beliefs literally, take a look at whether the strength of the belief is based on evidence (causation) or merely a range of psychgological conditioning (brainwashing) techniques over time...
Thank you for dropping in and sharing your thoughts on the matter. Your right in that a lot of faith is passed down from generation to generation. From the outside I can understand you particular view.

In my case I went exploring to find God. I had been exposed to Atheism and faith. A search for truth began and over several years I became convinced thereís a God. Until one is willing to take the journey with an open mind. They will never experience God.

The journey Iím talking about is a plunge into the spiritual side. It is there one can experience God. God canít be proven but he can be experienced.

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