Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

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#150086
Jan 25, 2013
 
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
If you will recall, in previous statements you were insinuating that “humble her,” was rape which I very much disagreed.
http://www.gotquestions.org/Bible-rape.html...
Question: "What does the Bible say about rape?"
Answer: The Bible does address the issue of rape. As expected, when the Bible mentions the crime of rape, it is depicted as a gross violation of God’s design for the treatment of the human body (Genesis 34). The Bible condemns rape whenever it is mentioned. For example, there is a particular passage in the laws given to the nation of Israel before entering the Promised Land under Joshua’s leadership. This passage (Deuteronomy 22:13-29) spoke directly against forcing a woman into a sexual encounter against her will, or what we know today as rape. This command was meant to protect women and to protect the nation of Israel from committing sinful actions.
Deuteronomy 22:25-27 mentioned the punishment the Mosaic Law commanded for a man who raped a woman. The man was to be killed by stoning while the woman was considered innocent. Though the Mosaic Law was for the nation of Israel during the time of Moses, the principle is clear that rape was sinful in the eyes of God and led to the most extreme punishment possible—death for the rapist.
There are some difficult passages in the Old Testament, however, in relation to this issue. Critics of the Bible are quick to point to Numbers 31 (and other similar passages) in which the Israelites were allowed to take female captives from nations they conquered. Critics make the accusation that this is an example of the Bible condoning, or even promoting, rape. However, the passage says nothing about raping the captive women. It is wrong to assume that the captive women were to be raped. Again, Deuteronomy 22:25-27 condemns rape, even advocating the death penalty for perpetrators of rape. In the Numbers 31 passage the soldiers were commanded to purify themselves and their captives (verse 19). Rape would have violated this command (see Leviticus 15:16-18). The women who were taken captive are never referred to as sexual objects. Did the captive women likely eventually marry amongst the Israelites? Yes. Is there any indication that rape or sex slavery was forced upon the women? Absolutely not.
In the New Testament, rape is not mentioned directly, but within the Jewish culture of its writers, rape would have been considered as sexual immorality. As such, both Jesus and His followers (including the apostle Paul) spoke against sexual immorality, even offering it as justifiable grounds for divorce when a person actively committed sexual acts outside of the bond of marriage (Matthew 5:32). This would not, however, apply to the victim of rape, only the one who committed the act.
That's all great apologetics garbage, but it fails to address the simple point he made, any arranged or forced marriage in which sex is performed is inherently rape.

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

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#150087
Jan 25, 2013
 
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
That's all great apologetics garbage, but it fails to address the simple point he made, any arranged or forced marriage in which sex is performed is inherently rape.
I have yet to see any proof.

Please prove that these “War Brides,” were forced.

Conjecture and assumptions on your part does not constitute proof.

I’ll be waiting…………………………

Proof not conjecture.

Since: Dec 11

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#150088
Jan 25, 2013
 
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Can you substantiate your claim with proof?
It's substantiated by the verses. Ancient Israelite marriages did not require the consent of the woman. The women who were CAPTURED by soldiers were married by the man's choice alone.

Conjugal relations were an expected part of wifely duties. The Israelites did not consider those sexual encounters to be rape, but I, and any reasonable person who does not view a wife as property of her husband, does.

“It's all about the struggle”

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#150089
Jan 25, 2013
 
Serah wrote:
<quoted text>Funny how atheists hang out in Christian forums eh? Nothing better to do I suppose :)
Yeah, it's funny how some hang out in church's too.

One of the most foul-mouthed posters here attends this one:

" http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/File:Boston_Ave.... ;

Since: Sep 08

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#150090
Jan 25, 2013
 
The_Box wrote:
<quoted text>
It's substantiated by the verses. Ancient Israelite marriages did not require the consent of the woman. The women who were CAPTURED by soldiers were married by the man's choice alone.
Conjugal relations were an expected part of wifely duties. The Israelites did not consider those sexual encounters to be rape, but I, and any reasonable person who does not view a wife as property of her husband, does.
Every single culture since the beginning of time has captured "brides". Most all also captured slaves. This brought new blood into the group, plus lessened the chances of genocide inflicted upon the enemies.

So you are indicting the entire human race for bad behavior in your view, in addition to gods?

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#150091
Jan 25, 2013
 
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
I have yet to see any proof.
Please prove that these “War Brides,” were forced.
Conjecture and assumptions on your part does not constitute proof.
I’ll be waiting…………………………
Proof not conjecture.
Oh, the sweet irony...

Since: Dec 11

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#150092
Jan 25, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Every single culture since the beginning of time has captured "brides". Most all also captured slaves. This brought new blood into the group, plus lessened the chances of genocide inflicted upon the enemies.
Really? Virtually no modern cultures practices that. Why? Because women are not viewed as the property of men. Women are not simply tools for male pleasure and babymaking.
Dave Nelson wrote:
So you are indicting the entire human race for bad behavior in your view, in addition to gods?
Yes, any culture which thought it was okay to capture women as property and subject them to marriage and sex without their consent is guilty of mistreating women. That was rape.

It appears that "everyone else was doing it!" is your best defense for the barbaric practices of the Israelites, approved by the Israelite god.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

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#150093
Jan 25, 2013
 
The_Box wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? Virtually no modern cultures practices that. Why? Because women are not viewed as the property of men. Women are not simply tools for male pleasure and babymaking.
<quoted text>
Yes, any culture which thought it was okay to capture women as property and subject them to marriage and sex without their consent is guilty of mistreating women. That was rape.
It appears that "everyone else was doing it!" is your best defense for the barbaric practices of the Israelites, approved by the Israelite god.
Oh this was practiced by many to settle dispute and bring peace to Kingdoms. Such was the way to bring peace, and still is to some degree, just the contracts are less binding in modern times.

“Don't be so dichotomous.”

Since: Jan 11

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#150094
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
Do you have an example you would like to put forward?
Is there a point to this?

Cut to the chase.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

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#150095
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
What, like nothing exploded, that kind of story that requires immense faith?
Special pleading.
New name, same old bullshit.

BBT VS goddidit
Mounds blind faith
of
evidence

You're right! Why not ignore the mounds of evidence and go with blind faith?!?!? Brilliant! No more tests in science class! Yeah!!!

“Don't be so dichotomous.”

Since: Jan 11

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#150096
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
This is an example of a rock of the gaps fallacy, which is a variant of the argument from ignorance.
You fill what you do not understand with "arockdidit".
See how arbitrary claims work?
Do you have a logical reasoned response to make instead, or do you just want to make arbitrary claims and expect others just to accept them?
Haven't we went over the strawman fallacy?

I do not propose that a rock has ever done anything.

Do you have reading comprehension problems?

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

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#150097
Jan 25, 2013
 
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
If you will recall, in previous statements you were insinuating that “humble her,” was rape which I very much disagreed.
You may disagree all you want. You can ignore all you want. You can lie all you want.

You ignored: Deu 21:11 And seest among the captives a beautiful woman, and hast a desire unto her, that thou wouldest have her to thy wife;

Notice that the woman does not have a choice in the matter.

Deu 21:12 Then thou shalt bring her home to thine house; and she shall shave her head, and pare her nails;

Does this sound like something a woman would do of her own free will?

Deu 21:14 And it shall be, if thou have no delight in her, then thou shalt let her go whither she will; but thou shalt not sell her at all for money, thou shalt not make merchandise of her, because thou hast humbled her.

You said the "humbling her" was a good thing! In fact, you said something really stupid like, "I am very humbled by your praise." was the same as "He humbled her."

As I have said many times, you are either willfully stupid or a troll and I cannot help either.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

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#150098
Jan 25, 2013
 
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
New name, same old bullshit.
BBT VS goddidit
Mounds blind faith
of
evidence
You're right! Why not ignore the mounds of evidence and go with blind faith?!?!? Brilliant! No more tests in science class! Yeah!!!
Damn, I had the spaced out so nice!

BBT = Mounds of evidence
goddidit = blind faith + denying evidence

Since: Dec 11

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#150099
Jan 25, 2013
 

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TheBlackSheep wrote:
You said the "humbling her" was a good thing! In fact, you said something really stupid like, "I am very humbled by your praise." was the same as "He humbled her."
He said that?

The primary definition of the Hebrew word is "defile".

It's the same word used in Genesis 34:2.
"When Shechem son of Hamor the Hivite, the ruler of that area, saw her, he took her and violated her."

“Don't be so dichotomous.”

Since: Jan 11

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#150100
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
...
You can only tell a line is curvy if you have a straight line to measure it against...
This is poorly worded. You can't tell if a line is curvy unless you know what "curvy" is, which can be defined mathematically. You don't need to know what "straight" is to know what "curvy" is. You need to know what "straight" is to know what "not straight" is, but "curvy" doesn't need that reference.
mtimber wrote:
The whole of scientific endeavour is built on the assumption that absolutes exist.
No. Do you really believe that? That is amazingly ignorant.
mtimber wrote:
No absolutes, no science.
LOL
mtimber wrote:
Morality is the same, no absolutes, no subjective interpretation of those absolutes.
No morality...
Put some clothes on that assertion!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

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#150101
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
This is an example of a rock of the gaps fallacy, which is a variant of the argument from ignorance. You fill what you do not understand with "arockdidit".
Tide with Beach wrote:
Haven't we went over the strawman fallacy? I do not propose that a rock has ever done anything. Do you have reading comprehension problems?
I told him this Wednesday. "Arockdidit" is a Christian straw man:
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T...

Apparently, he didn't care.

Since: Sep 08

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#150103
Jan 25, 2013
 
The_Box wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? Virtually no modern cultures practices that. Why? Because women are not viewed as the property of men. Women are not simply tools for male pleasure and babymaking.
<quoted text>
Yes, any culture which thought it was okay to capture women as property and subject them to marriage and sex without their consent is guilty of mistreating women. That was rape.
It appears that "everyone else was doing it!" is your best defense for the barbaric practices of the Israelites, approved by the Israelite god.
Oh, by many others and their gods, or even no gods, too.

I think you got dropped on the wrong planet. People live here.

BTW, warfare being the thing it is, the destroyed economies and lands, reduced availability of men, etc, it could be very difficult for the ladies to make a living. Other than short term recreational leases of their bodies. They could have starved to death.

“Don't be so dichotomous.”

Since: Jan 11

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#150104
Jan 25, 2013
 
It aint necessarily so wrote:
I told him this Wednesday. "Arockdidit" is a Christian straw man:
http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T...
Apparently, he didn't care.
Ah, so you've met.

Have you seen the movie Dinner for Schmucks?

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

Since: Sep 08

The Borderland of Sol

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#150105
Jan 25, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you have an example you would like to put forward?
The Albigensian Crusade was not a very good example of "love one another".

Since: Dec 11

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#150106
Jan 25, 2013
 
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, by many others and their gods, or even no gods, too.
I think you got dropped on the wrong planet. People live here.
So the god of the Old Testament is simply another flawed person stuck in the circumstances of his culture?
Dave Nelson wrote:
BTW, warfare being the thing it is, the destroyed economies and lands, reduced availability of men, etc, it could be very difficult for the ladies to make a living. Other than short term recreational leases of their bodies. They could have starved to death.
So the rapists are doing the women a favor by claiming them as sex-wives after they kill their families? What great guys.

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