Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
<quoted text> You said particles are fuzzy. Not hard thingies. Perhaps that fuzzy stuff is thought, waves of some sort that then gathers other fuzzy stuff to create "life". Waves shaping waves. Kind of creating its own little world. Fuzz creates the hard stuff that then creates more fuzz. We have fuzzy thinking Topix atheists, so it must be possible. Or something like that.
<quoted text> If God was outside of time and space, as He created it, then He would have to reveal that fact in some form. To do this, He has shown, through prophecy, that this is the case. It is a logical conclusion. 1. To prove God is eternal, He has to show knowledge that He operates outside the bounds of time. 2. God reveals the future through prophecy, operating outside of time. 3. God proves He is eternal. Second Part: 1. The universe had a start, a first cause that was not of the universe. 2. That first cause has to show that it is outside of time. 3. God has shown He is outside of term and therefore the first cause. Plenty of evidence that God is the Creator, using very simple logic. God presents His own argument here: Isa 42:8 I [am] the LORD: that [is] my name: and my glory will I not give to another, neither my praise to graven images. Isa 42:9 Behold, the former things are come to pass, and new things do I declare: before they spring forth I tell you of them.
No, the atheist wants to present the godidit argument as invalid whilst retaining the rockdidit argument as valid.
The "goddidit" answer is not an answer. It's usually referred to as the god of the gaps fallacy.
Is anyone saying a rock did anything? Anyone? Can you provide a quote from an atheist? You are committing the strawman argument fallacy.
I am making the Transcendental Argument for the existance of God. You can of course match that and make the transcendental argument for the creative powers of rocks if you want, but that might be a tough one...
Have you made your argument for the existence of God? I must have missed it.
<quoted text> It makes sense, and to emphasize a portion of a phrase you used above: "allows us to make the best choice possible." *Allow**Choice* That indicates, to me, we're only exercising a semblance of free will in an environment that we have very little latitude in the choices available to draw from. The discussion surrounding free will is always thought provoking, because at times you can almost convince yourself we do have free will in what we do from day to day, but upon further examination, we're really at the whim of our environment. There is one thing we do have 100% free will in. The choice to die. Any of us can choose to die in various ways, and that is pure free will if a person chooses that, but, who wants to choose death in order to exercise 100% free will?
<quoted text> I don't think it matters. Being "god" is supposed to be "outside" of time... this gets sticky. I guess it is both. I'm not using my own beliefs here. I just find this argument to be problematic for atheists and think that showing the incompatibility of omniscient and omnipotent to hold more weight
I agree but the scenario you presented was very challenging. I really want to get my head wrapped around it. Perhaps you could PM me and we could go into it more in depth. If you don't want to that's cool too.
<quoted text> How could the Creator of the universe be invented 3500 years ago? The basis premise of God, is that He is without cause. He is the first cause. That means He was self existent before the universe was created.
How many stories, do you know of, describing the beginning of the universe? Every religion and culture, just about, has the same blind faith as you do.
When is the earliest know writings of your god? About 3,500 years ago, if I am not mistaken.