Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

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#149918
Jan 24, 2013
 

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polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Clearly you did not understand my argument. If there was an earliest life, then anything before it was non-life. That is the definition of 'earliest'. But causes come before the effects (part of the nature of causality). So any cause for the *earliest* life had to be non-living.
<quoted text>
This is wrong. Science shows that life is a complex collection of chemical reactions and nothing else. There is every reason to believe the organization required comes about via the laws of nature and that, therefore, life came from non-life.
You said particles are fuzzy. Not hard thingies. Perhaps that fuzzy stuff is thought, waves of some sort that then gathers other fuzzy stuff to create "life". Waves shaping waves. Kind of creating its own little world.

Fuzz creates the hard stuff that then creates more fuzz.

We have fuzzy thinking Topix atheists, so it must be possible.

Or something like that.
Anon

Lakewood, OH

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#149919
Jan 24, 2013
 

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Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You said particles are fuzzy. Not hard thingies. Perhaps that fuzzy stuff is thought, waves of some sort that then gathers other fuzzy stuff to create "life". Waves shaping waves. Kind of creating its own little world.
Fuzz creates the hard stuff that then creates more fuzz.
We have fuzzy thinking Topix atheists, so it must be possible.
Or something like that.
When you have a graduate degree in physics, I'll give your arguments credibility. Right now you're just a Topix scientist, and that doesn't amount to much.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

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#149920
Jan 24, 2013
 

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RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Just because God knows what choices you will make doesn't mean He makes those choices for you.
Simple as that.
That's correct, but what I said is still true. Here's why:

If the future is knowable, then there is fate. It doesn't matter who, if anyone, knows that fate, it's if it is knowable at all.

Now supposedly God is not only omniscient, but also omnipotent, which necessarily means that God not only knows the future, but created it too.

And if you look at what you said "Just because God knows what choices you will make" , well, if God knows what choices you will make, then that is what you do. You might think you have free will, but that is because you can't see the future. You are blissfully ignorant of your fate. But God knows, and you are his little automaton. Sorry, but that's how it would work. And is yet another reason why the whole Christian ideology clockwork falls apart. Christian ideology is predicated on the idea of free will, but it also makes claims about an omniscient and omnipotent God. Sorry, can't have both. Fail.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

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#149921
Jan 24, 2013
 

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christianity is EVIL wrote:
<quoted text>
IF god created ALL
he created your future also,
NO free will
simple indeed
I find this concept very easy to understand, but somehow religious people have a hard time getting it. I have a little pet theory that those who go in for magical thinking really have cognitive problems with certain types of logic, just as religious people claim that atheists lack some special God detector.

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#149922
Jan 24, 2013
 
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
You some how seem to believe that God must adhere to your line if reasoning. What a hoot!
Pretty funny.
But no so funny that you were able to refute the logical argument! D'oh!

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#149923
Jan 24, 2013
 

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AntiFreakMachine wrote:
<quoted text>
It makes sense, and to emphasize a portion of a phrase you used above:
"allows us to make the best choice possible."
*Allow**Choice*
That indicates, to me, we're only exercising a semblance of free will in an environment that we have very little latitude in the choices available to draw from. The discussion surrounding free will is always thought provoking, because at times you can almost convince yourself we do have free will in what we do from day to day, but upon further examination, we're really at the whim of our environment.
There is one thing we do have 100% free will in.
The choice to die.
Any of us can choose to die in various ways, and that is pure free will if a person chooses that, but, who wants to choose death in order to exercise 100% free will?
If we truly had free will we would never be able to prove it. We could however prove we did not, if someone knew the future, thus negating the possibility of free will.
Anon

Lakewood, OH

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#149924
Jan 24, 2013
 
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
You said particles are fuzzy. Not hard thingies. Perhaps that fuzzy stuff is thought, waves of some sort that then gathers other fuzzy stuff to create "life". Waves shaping waves. Kind of creating its own little world.
Fuzz creates the hard stuff that then creates more fuzz.
We have fuzzy thinking Topix atheists, so it must be possible.
Or something like that.
When you get your graduate degree in physics, I'll give your arguments credence. Until then, you're simply a Topix scientist, and that doesn't amount to very much.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

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#149925
Jan 24, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
It does apply, how can you have an absolute standard of evil, without an absolute standard of good?
You are appealing to that as the basis for your argument, my question is, upon what basis do you make that appeal?
Where do you get absolute morality from?
I don't. The question is a subjective one, based on your opinion. No absolute morality required.

"Slavery, rape and putting every infant to the sword isn't evil?"

So, do you think they are evil or not?

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

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#149926
Jan 24, 2013
 
Dave Nelson wrote:
I am troubled by the quality of maturity, rationality, and intellect that has recently gathered on this forum. People such as mtimber and EmpAtheist, among others.
The quality is too high. It's unnatural for this forum.
Something must be happening.
Sock in mouth you do decree.

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#149927
Jan 24, 2013
 
Dave Nelson wrote:
Free will is just the ability to take a course of action based upon emotion instead of training and experience. Taking risks one doesn't have to. The soul's desires to experience versus the conscious mind's "knowing" cause and effect.
So if you do something based on "training and experience" you are not exerting free will? Wha?

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#149928
Jan 24, 2013
 
mtimber wrote:
^^Totally circular...
Aside from your head ..what else is new?

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

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#149929
Jan 24, 2013
 

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mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Name something that isn't caused.:-)
In your case thinking.
Anon

Lakewood, OH

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#149930
Jan 24, 2013
 
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
When you have a graduate degree in physics, I'll give your arguments credibility. Right now you're just a Topix scientist, and that doesn't amount to much.
Damn double post. Look at the time lag. Thought the first one didn't take

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

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#149931
Jan 24, 2013
 
The_Box wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, and the modern term for marrying and having sexual relations with a 'bride' you've taken by force is RAPE.
<quoted text>
Who says he wants to have a loving relationship? The impetus for the marriage in this scenario is physical attraction. The soldier wants to have sex with the woman. If she does not please him, she is ditched.
<quoted text>
BS. World War II "war brides" were not captives forced to marry. They were women who soldiers met during the war or afterwards.
I can't believe you'd compare these two things.
<quoted text>
The 'rubble left behind' solely because of other atrocious laws demanding extermination of enemy males, including the elderly and children.
Deuteronomy 21:10-14 IS atrocious. And so is your defense of it.
Just to make it clear as with many Atheist you are making your own assumptions not based in scripture. Rape was a crime punishable by death. If it happened it was illegal and risky for the perpetrator.

Who says a soldier doesnít want to have a loving relationship with a former enemy female?

Your assertions are not scripturally based. If Iím wrong then please supply the scripture that says marriage was a form of forced rape. If you canít supply biblical proof just say you have no proof.

The women were war brides from a defeated enemy. No where does it say they were forced to marry and forced to have sex. Nor does the scripture imply of forced rape.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

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#149932
Jan 24, 2013
 
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>and yet...no god
I keep finding a burning bag of shit.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

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#149933
Jan 24, 2013
 
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
:-)
The typical Topix atheist will challenge you to define rationality. Then they will argue about the definition given in the dictionary, stating flatly they are free to define it for themselves as they see fit. Like the term atheism.
They do that a lot. It helps in their logic development process.
To them such is rational.
In your very limited reason skills, there are many things beyond the scope of.
But lets not dwell on your misfortune or shortcomings . Davey boy.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

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#149934
Jan 24, 2013
 
Anon wrote:
<quoted text>
When you have a graduate degree in physics, I'll give your arguments credibility. Right now you're just a Topix scientist, and that doesn't amount to much.
Someone with a graduate degree in physics would be unlikely to make the word-salads that Dave does.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

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#149935
Jan 24, 2013
 
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>Wow. Not even close. Where do you get this stuff?
In his hot tub.

He's been contemplating his fart bubbles again.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

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#149936
Jan 24, 2013
 
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>A total evasion.
Yah.

Right.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

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#149937
Jan 24, 2013
 
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>You are so far behind the times it's scary, scientists at Arizona state have begun new investigations into lifes origin rejecting the premise that life is like baking a cake,..all you need is the right chemicals in the proper amount and walla! life! It's a 19th century concept.
Walla?

Now who the heck was it that always said "walla"?

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