Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#146277 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's look at what the OED has to say about guns.
Definition of gun
noun
a weapon incorporating a metal tube from which bullets, shells, or other missiles are propelled by explosive force, typically making a characteristic loud, sharp noise.
Note how OED - the voted BEST dictionary - disagrees with you.
However - seeing as definitions can vary, I'd like to point out that you keep saying that guns can be used as tools, but WEAPONS ARE TOOLS. Tools that are meant to cause harm.
Who voted them the " best dictionary"? You?

Merriam-Webster would disagree with you....

www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gun

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#146278 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again - your argument is flawed. Something's intent is not defined by how people use it (as I said - many people use books to prop things up. Doesn't mean books are made to do that, does it?). It is defined what the people who make it make it to do. Guns are made to harm.
Once again, your logic fails. TNT was not intended for killing.
LorenEberly

Sunbury, OH

#146279 Jan 1, 2013
Agreement to Avoid Fiscal Cliff:
The majority of US the Government of this Representative Republic that vote and the nonvoters that sit on their dead hands and whine; Successfully reelected Obnoxious President, Governor, Representatives of US the Government, County Commissioners, Township Trustees, Mayors, City Council, School Administrators and Board Members.
That defies USA Labor Law, The Constitution, and demands of Natural Law: what Mother Nature, God, or Whatever Power decreed to be the reality of the real world, democracy, capitalism, the US Constitution, and free, fair, and affordable commerce and common sense demands.
Demanding every Stockholder, corporation, farmer, business, outsourcer sweatshop, and nonprofit, tax-exempt, organization and Church; markets the cost in the wholesale and retail price of his or her product and service; of every American Citizen, worker, consumer, and taxpayers wages (union contract), healthcare, pension, investment and independent business profit.
This enables every American Citizen, worker, consumer, and taxpayer to pay healthcare insurance premium or pay healthcare provider. Pay ALL taxes and pay for every product and service they use for life. With same percentage of their wages, investment profit, and independent business profit.
And enables every parent to educate, love, nurse, nurture, discipline, protect, and provide; for every child (job) they conceive. And fund schools, infrastructure, local and national security, government services, and etc.; with money derived from wages, investment profit, and independent business profit.
President and Elected Officials holding Union workers, consumers, taxpayers, and America’s grandchildren’s children, Government employees, Parents, Teachers, Veterans, Police, Firemen, and Fathers disqualified for affirmative action with white skin, Representatives deny Collective Bargaining Rights accountable.
To fund Illegal drug users and Immigrants, lottery, casino, and keno losers, unemployed Union workers replaced with nonunion workers, Human Traffickers, waitresses that pander for life for $2.00 per hour, slaves in enterprise zones, low-income child labor, consumers, and taxpayers, volunteers without wages, and nonunion workers willing to work for fewer wages than they can afford life. That pays with welfare checks, food stamps, housing vouchers, and Medicaid.
And pay sales tax on the more stock dividends (money) OPEC Nations, Enron Stockholders, Wal-Mart Stockholders, Hillarys, Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders (money marketers) market quarterly. In the wholesale and retail price of every product and service Human Beings use for life. And School Boards and Government needs to build, maintain and operate schools, infrastructure, and provide local and national security, and Government services. That gets only product or service.
Needed to measure and maintain the strength and growth of this UNAFFORDABLE economy and distribute money Human Beings cannot digest, burn in internal combustion engines, or burn to heat and cool their American Dream. Into OPEC Nations, Enron Stockholders, Wal-Mart Stockholders, Hillarys, Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders portfolios.
Created Ohio’s $1.35 trillion budget deficit, the $40 trillion social security and the $16 trillion national debt and demands America’s grandchildren’s children pay Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders interest with this debt until they are 18 years old.
Defying USA Labor Law, the Constitution, and Realities demands is bankrupting USA. Makes free, fair, and affordable commerce IMPOSSIBLE; Makes funding schools IMPOSSIBLE; Makes balancing every budget IMPOSSIBLE. And put Union workers, consumers, taxpayers, and Americas grandchildren's children on fiscal cliff.
America’s grandchildren’s children cannot afford life and pay this debt with the $7.25 per hour Government mandated labor wage in a hundred million years.

“I am but a humble duck.”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#146280 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
Once again, your logic fails. TNT was not intended for killing.
Nor was it intended for use by common civilians.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146281 Jan 1, 2013
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
That was a misinterpretation. It's supposed to be repeatedly spanked. That's one of his lessons that I follow.
Kinky. I like it. Who knew getting closer to God would be so much fun?

“I am but a humble duck.”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#146283 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
Let's search to only the definitions that support our cause and ignore all the rest! Just like a fundie.
No, I chose the ONLY definition of the noun "gun" in the OED. The rest are examples of guns.

Someone needs to learn how to use a dictionary!
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/engl...

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146284 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>

Why would jesus allow someone in his party carry a weapon? Goes against everything that he preached.
Indeed. Yet more Biblical contradictions.
And if you were present at the time and see jesus pick up the ear and reattach it, wouldn't you be too flabbergasted to arrest him?
Of course, as you pointed out, had Jesus been consistent, and a truly effective messiah, healing a wound that should have never happened in the first place would not have been necessary. This is pretty typical of Christian thinking in my experience. They celebrate and give credit to God for, say, curing cancer, but never stop to think about the necessity for the cancer in the first place.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#146285 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Nor was it intended for use by common civilians.
Miners aren't common civilians?

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#146286 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
Nor was it intended for use by common civilians.
Who said that? You could buy it in the General Store, until too many people robbed banks with it.

Do not lie for your cause.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#146287 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I chose the ONLY definition of the noun "gun" in the OED. The rest are examples of guns.
Someone needs to learn how to use a dictionary!
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/engl...
Indeed... www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/gun

But neither definition defines a guns purpose as to "kill people", as you suggest.

“I am but a humble duck.”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#146288 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
I do! The 2nd Amendment!
Few problems with the 2nd Amendment.

First, it was very likely intended for military. Not civilians. If the Founding Fathers wanted everyone to have the right to bear arms, they would have mentioned it in another, separate amendment. This is why for 200 years after the founding of our nation, it WASN'T considered a right to own a gun. Not until the mid 20th century.

Second, when it was written the only "arms" people had were inaccurate, single shot rifles. Using it as a standard for all modern weaponry is obviously outdated.

Owning something that has such a capability of damage should be a privilege. Not a right.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146289 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
I respect you and Richard's opinions; what would you have us do?
What do we do if the government, as so many have done in the past, becomes too corrupt? With the 99%'er out there, the switch to socialism is not too far in our future.
I'm imagining a bunch of vigilantes armed with rifles and handguns setting off to confront the police and military. I can't imagine that will go well.
What will you do during a disaster? Most people that I have seen have handled things quite well, but what happens when someone decides that they need your food more than you?
What happens when you and said someone are both armed? What if said someone has more armed friends than you do? And where does such escalation stop? Am I safer with a scud missile in my garage than a handgun, just in case?
I don't dwell on these two issue much, not very much at all, but I would like to be ready to handle them, when they happen. If I am not mistaken, history does tell us that they will happen.
I don't see how the daily social cost of a society flooded with guns is worth the price against an imagined social apocalypse. Moreover, if you are really worried about such a breakdown of society, your best bet is to form an armed and trained vigilante gang. Because if it's just you with a gun and an armed group, you are screwed anyway.
You are, from what I can tell from your posts, a very intelligent person; how many governments disarmed their people to better control them? How many of those were what we would call, good governments?
Thanks. But again, what are my odds against the police and military? I hardly think rifles and handguns, even en masse, are keeping them in check.

“I am but a humble duck.”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#146290 Jan 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Miners aren't common civilians?
You misunderstand the use of the term "common civilians." The average person does not know how to use TNT.

People who should be allowed to use TNT should be

a)educated on the use of it

and b) have a good reason to use it (no - using TNT because it is loud or fun is not a good reason)

This is how guns should be regulated, too. If people

a) know how to use them

and b) have a good reason to use them (no - using guns because it is loud or fun is not a good reason), they should be allowed to use them.

“I am but a humble duck.”

Since: Dec 12

Location hidden

#146291 Jan 1, 2013
TheBlackSheep wrote:
<quoted text>
Who said that? You could buy it in the General Store, until too many people robbed banks with it.
Do not lie for your cause.
So we should regulate something when people start to misuse it?

Hmm.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146292 Jan 1, 2013
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Those who twist Scripture will twist any or all of the Bible, but they will often base their teachings on an obscure or problematic text. Peter acknowledges that some of Paul’s writings are “difficult to understand”(verse 16). These seem to be the starting point for the truth twisters. They begin with a problematic passage, developing their unorthodox doctrines, and then turn to the clear, emphatic texts, denying what they dogmatically teach.
False teachers do not stop with Paul’s writings but distort the Scriptures as a whole. Problem passages written by Paul are only the tip of the iceberg. These perverters of Scripture do not stop here; they are not content unless they have twisted “the rest of the Scriptures” as well. Since the Scriptures agree, then one who sets aside the teaching of one author must, to be consistent, set aside other texts as well.
Those who twist Scripture are described by Peter as “untaught and unstable.” The term “untaught” is rendered “ignorant” by the translators of the King James Version. The two terms “untaught” and “unstable” are introduced by a common article. This seems to indicate these two terms are to be viewed as interrelated. Like “love and marriage,” these terms go together “like a horse and carriage.” In other words, those who are “untaught” are “unstable,” and those who are “unstable” are also “untaught.”
And atheist love to twist Scripture.
So they are by Biblical accounts are indeed "unstable" and "untaught" or "ignorant".
In sum, even the Bible acknowledges that it is contradictory and opaque. BTW, you are quick to assume that Paul, for example, was the actual author of all the texts attributed to him. That's not consistently true, according to Biblical scholars. As to translation issues, that's just another quagmire for the Bible as a supposedly inspired textbook by a deity with a message for all of humanity. How difficult would it be for an omnipotent God to clarify it's message regularly in everyone's native languages? Maybe God only cares about those who read ancient Hebrew, Greek, and Aramaic.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146293 Jan 1, 2013
Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
Guns are designed to do two things kill and wound.
The NRA said that guns are simply tools, yet I've found they make really lousy screwdrivers. And never mind trying to hammer anything with them.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#146294 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
No, I chose the ONLY definition of the noun "gun" in the OED. The rest are examples of guns.
Someone needs to learn how to use a dictionary!
http://oxforddictionaries.com/definition/engl...
I thought you were an Atheist? The one thing that I thought that I could count on from Atheists is logic and honesty.

I understand that you believe that guns are only meant for one purpose. I understand that has been deeply drilled into you. Many subject are similar to that.

Abortion: Is it murder or simply the removal of some cells? I personally do not agree with abortion, in most cases, but I cannot see me forcing my opinion on others. At some point, we need to sit down and talk. At some point, that group of cells is a human life.

To some, that point is at conception and others not until the baby can breath on its own. We cannot run a country with those two groups having their way. We have to come to some compromise.

We have one group that believe that firearms should be completely eliminated and another group that believes civilians should have access to the same weapons the military has.

You know there is a place where you can drive a tank?
Drive a Tank
550 West Cherry Street
Kasota, Minnesota 56050

Being an Old Tanker I thought this would be great! But you know, I cannot drive an American Tank. Not even an old M48! Just because we have given in and allowed our government to ban the sale of American Tanks to Americans.

Used to be that an American, with a clean record, could buy an old Tank! What changed?

Used to be that we could say the Pledge without "one nation under god" in it! What changed?

Used to be that our country's motto change from "E Pluribus Unum" to "In God We Trust". Why?

It all started around 1950's when people were scared.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146295 Jan 1, 2013
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I just shoot cans.
You know....
MexiCans
AfriCans
Puerto RiCans
:)
*facepalm*

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#146296 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
So we should regulate something when people start to misuse it?
Hmm.
That is called a "Nanny government". Instead of proper education, we will just outlaw it.

“Credulity is not a virtue”

Since: Apr 09

San Francisco

#146297 Jan 1, 2013
WesTheDuck wrote:
<quoted text>
So we should regulate something when people start to misuse it?
Hmm.
Depends on the history, scope, and consequences of the misuse. IMHO, guns qualify on all three counts.

I really don't get why anyone would be against the very strict regulation (and registration) of guns. It's like complaining about the necessity for having a license to drive.

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