Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

[timn17]

RiversideRedneck wrote:

<quoted text>
Oh, that's easy.
I do see the difference.
Next.

So, you see the difference, but you continue to insist that everyone is a hard atheist.

[timn17]

RiversideRedneck wrote:

<quoted text>
If you wouldn't be so fearful of the word "faith", you'd understand.
Atheists have faith in their opinion that there is no god.
Done.
Since it's not fact, it's belief, or faith...

So, if I think that collecting stamps is a dumb hobby, I have faith that collecting stamps is a dumb hobby?

[Dave Nelson]

Drew Smith wrote:

<quoted text>
I question people who I already understand because I want them to understand themselves.

LOL!!

[Dave Nelson]

timn17 wrote:

<quoted text>What are you talking about? You think that because a planet is beholden to gravity, that we are beholden to EM, because we have iron in our blood? I never said that I wasn't a part of the universe, but that does not mean that the forces of the universe have a literal control over me. Yes, I am restrained in what I can do and see, but that doesn't me that we are literally remote controlled by some higher power. You are making connections that aren't there.

Relax, relax.

I am just pointing out the wiring is there. Really.

[RiversideRedneck]

blacklagoon wrote:

<quoted text>We all can read what your immoral holy book has to say, its you that insists on interpreting it to eliminate these immoralities. You just can't accept it can you. You and I have gone over this before and calling slaves SERVANTS doesn't change the FACT that the bible tells you how to BUY slaves, how to MARK them as your property, how badly you may BEAT them, and how keeping loved ones hostage forces you to remain a slave. When one person OWNES another, it's called SLAVERY.

Wait. The Bible tells *me* how to buy slaves?! Are you certain?

You wanna argue the invalidity of the Bible because it says that water has a face?

Moronic child.

[Clementia]

Drew Smith wrote:

How does it do that?
<quoted text>
Why not just see *yourself* in all, so that you try not to hurt anyone, because if you hurt them, you hurt yourself?
It's called "empathy".
It doesn't require belief in a god.

I see God in all because I see no difference between me and them, But I only see no difference between me and them, becuase I see God in them.

I do see myself in them, I see the same God within me, within you!

Some people like hurting themselves, so then they will hurt other people because they'll think they're hurting themselves! Isn't it called sadomasochism?

Well maybe I don't have empathy then, but that's just how I see things.

You sound like one of those nutty christians trying to convert me!They ask too many questions too!

[timn17]

Dave Nelson wrote:

<quoted text>
Relax, relax.
I am just pointing out the wiring is there. Really.

You are pointing out that the "wiring is there" therefore we are being controlled by a deity. Sure, a deity is possible, but the fact that EM exists is certainly not proof for it. I'm sure if I believed in god, I could find all the proof I needed too.

[RiversideRedneck]

Clementia wrote:

<quoted text>
Really? Is the Bible like the koran? Sorry, I've never been tempted to read the Bible.
Redneck, do you have a good explanation for all that? Why is the Bible saying that?

The bible doesn't "tell you how to buy slaves", as numnuts puts it. In modern times, slavery is generally considered a “bad thing”. Historically speaking, on the other hand, in first-century Rome, in the Bible and the United States of America, it was usually considered a quite "good thing" (except possibly by the slaves).

The scripture he's fond of quoting clearly says servants, not "slaves". While easily translated as "slavery", it was more like getting someone to come work for you for free... oh, wait, that is "slavery" ;)

The New Testament makes no condemnation of slave ownership but does have advice for Christian slaves and also regulates how Christian slave owners should treat the slaves they own.

All of this is now obsolete. A rightly so. The Bible teaches us to respect the laws of the land. The laws of slavery has since changed, for the better. I'm sure God is happy about that.

[Croco_Duck]

ALL GLORY TO THE CROCODUCK!

[RiversideRedneck]

timn17 wrote:

<quoted text>So, you see the difference, but you continue to insist that everyone is a hard atheist.

As far as I'm concerned, you can't be an atheist at all unless you BELIEVE there are no gods (not even one). It's not enough to not believe in God/gods, or we're going to have to call my cats atheists.

So that's what all atheists have in common: they see the universe as being deity-free. They are the opposite of theists, who think the universe includes a deity (or two, or three...).

[RiversideRedneck]

timn17 wrote:

<quoted text>So, if I think that collecting stamps is a dumb hobby, I have faith that collecting stamps is a dumb hobby?

Yup. Now go find a stamp collecting thread & "prove" to the stamp collectors how stupid and wrong they all are.

[Clementia]

Drew Smith wrote:

<quoted text>
I question people who I already understand because I want them to understand themselves.

I understood myself fine before you came along and started confusing me, lol.

Look, I wasn't forced into this belief, we aren't muslims or fanatic christians, I've even been an atheist for a while. I first read GGS and researched sikhi on my own and I then I chose to believe it. I don't listen to my mecca (golden temple), I read, try to understand and only follow the path set by GGS!

[Dave Nelson]

timn17 wrote:

<quoted text>You are pointing out that the "wiring is there" therefore we are being controlled by a deity. Sure, a deity is possible, but the fact that EM exists is certainly not proof for it. I'm sure if I believed in god, I could find all the proof I needed too.

You are part of a system. If you are intelligent, then the system is.

Timmy, those voices in your head.....?

[Croco_Duck]

RiversideRedneck wrote:

All of this is now obsolete. A rightly so. The Bible teaches us to respect the laws of the land. The laws of slavery has since changed, for the better. I'm sure God is happy about that.

What if laws changed to favor rights for gay people in marriage? Would that be cool with God?

[Dave Nelson]

http://dfw.cbslocal.com/2012/11/19/cbs-11-inv...

Can you imagine a bus?

[RiversideRedneck]

Clementia wrote:

<quoted text>
I understood myself fine before you came along and started confusing me, lol.
Look, I wasn't forced into this belief, we aren't muslims or fanatic christians, I've even been an atheist for a while. I first read GGS and researched sikhi on my own and I then I chose to believe it. I don't listen to my mecca (golden temple), I read, try to understand and only follow the path set by GGS!

Hold on there! Don't confuse Muslims & fanatic Christians. They are wholly different. Nobody is forced to be Christian, nobody. It's all a personal choice.

[Drew Smith]

So you're saying that you think that people should "look at God scientifically", but you can't offer a way to do that?
Then how do you know that it can be done?

Clementia wrote:

Because I have faith in science!

Can fictional characters be looked at scientifically?

[RiversideRedneck]

Croco_Duck wrote:

<quoted text>
What if laws changed to favor rights for gay people in marriage? Would that be cool with God?

No that's different. God made man to be with woman. That's totally different than slavery laws.

It's like if the laws changed so that murder is legal. God still wouldn't condone it. You could justly get away with it from your country, but you'll pay the price later...

[Clementia]

RiversideRedneck wrote:

<quoted text>
The bible doesn't "tell you how to buy slaves", as numnuts puts it. In modern times, slavery is generally considered a “bad thing”. Historically speaking, on the other hand, in first-century Rome, in the Bible and the United States of America, it was usually considered a quite "good thing" (except possibly by the slaves).
The scripture he's fond of quoting clearly says servants, not "slaves". While easily translated as "slavery", it was more like getting someone to come work for you for free... oh, wait, that is "slavery" ;)
The New Testament makes no condemnation of slave ownership but does have advice for Christian slaves and also regulates how Christian slave owners should treat the slaves they own.
All of this is now obsolete. A rightly so. The Bible teaches us to respect the laws of the land. The laws of slavery has since changed, for the better. I'm sure God is happy about that.

OMG, so the Bible did say it, but to fit in with modern thinking you ignore it? huh? How can you pick and choose which bits to follow? Is the Bible not all true then?

Why would God not condemn keeping slaves?

[Drew Smith]

You don't have reasons for your choices? Are your choices random?

Aura Mytha wrote:

Simply put , she chose to believe.

And I asked why that choice was made.