Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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132,481 - 132,500 of 226,355 Comments Last updated 1 hr ago

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#137732 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
You are way out of my league sweetheart. Iím like standing here on earth and you are soaring at 50,000.í
Yet you feel qualified to write this:
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
I tell you what, how about you showing me some of that real undeniable proof. Iím not talking about some scientific article written in Greek.
Iím talking about real proof, not speculation, nor could have, maybe, should have, kind of, may haves, suspected, presumed, alleged, assumed, we think, suppositions , hypothesis.
Real proof, you say itís out there. Let me see it. Donít send me off to some University web page that has no proof but a pages of professing a theory. I want to see facts and not theory.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137733 Nov 14, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks dude.
But I'd really prefer that you didn't call me sweetheart.

Since: Apr 11

Location hidden

#137734 Nov 14, 2012
15Nov12.....

.....And 'Elmo', your very dear Elmo of Sesame Street fame for 2 generations is now in the flap of infamy because 'his puppppettteeeer' has been accused of sexually abusing children since being on the children's TV series over the years.

Ps: By da vey, the puppeteer is a self-professed atheist'

Nothing is sacred anymore and it is ascribed to hateful, hypocritical, hAtheists like you lot.

Stand'em up against da wall and shoot this eeejit with a ball of its own schidt.

Forever and Ever
BobLoblah

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#137735 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
We know Chromosome 2 fused because it has teleomeres in the middle of it. They're only at the ends of chromosomes.
This is what a teleomere is: http://www.nature.com/scitable/topicpage/telo...
It didn't fuse gradually. It fused in one go. After that, it was organized gradually.
How do we know?
"The Evidence
Evidence for fusing of two ancestral chromosomes to create human chromosome 2 and where there has been no fusion in other Great Apes is:
1) The analogous chromosomes (2p and 2q) in the non-human great apes can be shown, when laid end to end, to create an identical banding structure to the human chromosome 2.(1)
2) The remains of the sequence that the chromosome has on its ends (the telomere) is found in the middle of human chromosome 2 where the ancestral chromosomes fused.(2)
3) the detail of this region (pre-telomeric sequence, telomeric sequence, reversed telomeric sequence, pre-telomeric sequence) is exactly what we would expect from a fusion.(3)
4) this telomeric region is exactly where one would expect to find it if a fusion had occurred in the middle of human chromosome 2.
5) the centromere of human chromosome 2 lines up with the chimp chromosome 2p chromosomal centromere.
6) At the place where we would expect it on the human chromosome we find the remnants of the chimp 2q centromere (4)."
http://www.evolutionpages.com/chromosome_2.ht...
and
"Let us re-iterate what we find on human chromosome 2. Its centromere is at the same place as the chimpanzee chromosome 2p as determined by sequence similarity. Even more telling is the fact that on the 2q arm of the human chromosome 2 is the unmistakable remains of the original chromosome centromere of the common ancestor of human and chimp 2q chromosome, at the same position as the chimp 2q centromere (this structure in humans no longer acts as a centromere for chromosome 2."
(same link above)
Going with your statement,{It didn't fuse gradually. It fused in one go. After that, it was organized gradually}.

Where is the gradual and slow change?

This Chromosome #2 fusing is telling me there was no gradual change.

But one very big major change.

This defies what evolution has been teaching.

So when did this fusing take place?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137736 Nov 14, 2012
_BobLoblah_ wrote:
15Nov12.....
.....And 'Elmo', your very dear Elmo of Sesame Street fame for 2 generations is now in the flap of infamy because 'his puppppettteeeer' has been accused of sexually abusing children since being on the children's TV series over the years.
Ps: By da vey, the puppeteer is a self-professed atheist'
Nothing is sacred anymore and it is ascribed to hateful, hypocritical, hAtheists like you lot.
Stand'em up against da wall and shoot this eeejit with a ball of its own schidt.
Forever and Ever
BobLoblah
Gotta update your OLD news, Boblbahsahalha:

"Tickle This Elmo Ö Kevin Clash, the Voice of Sesame Streetís Elmo Accused of Having ĎSexual Relationship with Underage Boy (Update: Accuser Recants Allegations)"

It turns out they had an adult relationship - so there!

http://scaredmonkeys.com/2012/11/13/tickle-th...

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#137737 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
We don't know all the facts Hiding.
Here we have a established scientist that has advanced to the top.
Leading a team of other scientist.
He worked for NASA 15 years. This wasnít a probationary employee.
"Coppedge had worked on the Cassini mission to Saturn, starting as a contractor in 1996, and later becoming a full-time employee. But one of the projects he pursued on his own time was the promotion of intelligent design, the notion that the Universe and, most prominently, life itself, is too orderly to have come about without a designer.(Like many others in that movement, Coppedge is a self-identified evangelical Christian.)

"In 2009, he apparently got a bit aggressive about promoting these ideas at work, leading one employee to complain. The resulting investigation found that he had also aggressively promoted his opinion on California's gay marriage ban, and had attempted to get JPL's holiday party renamed to "Christmas party." (There's detailed background on the case here.) Coppedge was warned about his behavior at work, but he felt it was an infringement of his religious freedom, so he sued. Shortly after, as part of a set of cutbacks on the Cassini staff, he was fired."

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#137738 Nov 14, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks dude.
But I'd really prefer that you didn't call me sweetheart.
You have nothing to worry about dip sh**.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137739 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>No, I can accept that you believe god answers your prayers. Why do you care if I believe your prayers are answered? If you believe it, good for you. I hope your religion brings you more fulfillment than it appears to bring most of the people I've seen on here.
Cheers!

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137740 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>It wasn't really a rant. You should look into some of the research on the subject of free will - you will see that what we imagine as free will is more like an illusion of control after the fact.
Ahhhh....

So the illusion of control was the TV made me change the channel... mhmmmm...

Or was it the allure of the remote control that demanded my destiny to watch a different show? er, uh, set of commercials...

Right.

Go play with your GW voodoo doll.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137741 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>I believe Tide posted this video a while ago. Here it is again. It's a good beginner introduction. I recommend you check it out if you are interested in the subject.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =pCofmZlC72gXX
hehehe. The atheist "law firm".

Neat!

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137742 Nov 14, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Our decisions are bound by determining factors. These factors are knowable. Knowing these factors would allow predictability. If all of your decisions can be predicted before you make them, you cannot demonstrate freedom from these factors. You don't make choices freely. You are bound to make them exactly as the determining factors dictate. This is what makes free will an illusion, or at least a misnomer.
But I freely decided to respond to your post.

And I'm freely ending it.

Look at that! Free will!

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137743 Nov 14, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you consider a hamburger with cheese a hamburger?
No sir. That would be lasagna.

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#137744 Nov 14, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
"Coppedge had worked on the Cassini mission to Saturn, starting as a contractor in 1996, and later becoming a full-time employee. But one of the projects he pursued on his own time was the promotion of intelligent design, the notion that the Universe and, most prominently, life itself, is too orderly to have come about without a designer.(Like many others in that movement, Coppedge is a self-identified evangelical Christian.)
"In 2009, he apparently got a bit aggressive about promoting these ideas at work, leading one employee to complain. The resulting investigation found that he had also aggressively promoted his opinion on California's gay marriage ban, and had attempted to get JPL's holiday party renamed to "Christmas party." (There's detailed background on the case here.) Coppedge was warned about his behavior at work, but he felt it was an infringement of his religious freedom, so he sued. Shortly after, as part of a set of cutbacks on the Cassini staff, he was fired."
I donít believe itís proper to be trying to convert people on the job. Work is work and it should be about work.

None of us know this man nor have we worked at JPL. So all we know is what is in print.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137745 Nov 14, 2012
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean Judaism?
LULZ>...
No, you f_cking brick. I said Christianity..........

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137746 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Uhm...ah...ok, let's try this. You like medicine? You hate disease?
If yes:
evolution = good
creationism = bad
If no:
evolution = bad
creationism = good
So now you equate evolution to modern medicine?!?

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137747 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>It's not really a hobby. Fetish would be the better word.
You love hearing about crabs?

Dude...

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137748 Nov 14, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
When I learn to speak Japanese I'm going to come train with you and we'll rule from the shadows.
I'm going to change my name to Shinobu Suzuki.
I tried taking a train to Japan.

I tried & I failed.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#137749 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
I donít believe itís proper to be trying to convert people on the job. Work is work and it should be about work.
None of us know this man nor have we worked at JPL. So all we know is what is in print.
BWAHAHAHAHA

Great dodge.

I happen to know something about the litigation, but I can't discuss it.

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137750 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>Preaching to your co workers about the majesty of jesus and the lies of the evolutionist cabal is a pretty good indicator of his inability to think objectively.
And would preaching to your coworkers about the awesomeness of evolution vs. the stupidness if religion be an equal indicator of objective thinking?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137751 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Going with your statement,{It didn't fuse gradually. It fused in one go. After that, it was organized gradually}.
Where is the gradual and slow change?
This Chromosome #2 fusing is telling me there was no gradual change.
But one very big major change.
This defies what evolution has been teaching.
So when did this fusing take place?
Eagle...why does the Chromosome fusion have to be gradual according to evolutionary theory?

On the contrary, the fusion itself could only happen in one go. After that, evolution gradually changed it to what it is today (some mutations on the teleomeres, some rearranging of DNA).

If you know anything about meiosis, you can understand why the fusion had to happen in one event. If you don't know anything about meiosis, it works like this:

During meiosis, all your chromosomes are divided into two (non-identical) as one germline cell becomes two sperm cells (I'm oversimplifying). They recombine in the egg.

Prior to meiosis, the germline cells divide by mitosis - that breaks them apart at the centromeres, replicates each chromosome, divides the cell wall (with each half cell taking half the identical chromosomes). Then, meiosis and, if the sperm is lucky, recombination.

The division of chromosomes is done by enzymes. They act like scissors, cutting the chromosomes in half. During mitosis, that's done at the centromeres. During meiosis, that's done at roughly the halfway mark. Immediately after mitosis, different enzymes stitch the chromosomes back together. After meiosis, the stitching has to wait until fertilization with the egg.

The "stitching" enzymes will stitch anything they find. So if, for whatever reason, the chromosomal material couldn't get out of the way in time, the enzyme would include it in the stitching. It's a dumb enzyme, right?

That's what happened. In this one, extremely rare instance, the wrong chromosome was too slow in being moved out of the cell half. So it got stitched together, making chromosome 22.

That could only happen in one event. It couldn't happen in more than one event, b/c the event requires the genetic material from both parts of the now chromosome 22. Secondly, it's such an unlikely event that it would extremely improbable to have, say, 1/4 of a chromosome being attached and then, at some later date, another quarter and another. Third, we only find 2 teleomere fragments in the middle of chromosome 22, not a several - so, only one event.

Next, Darwin was wrong about many details about evolution. He is 160 years out of date. Sorry. Compared to what we know now, Darwin was drawing on chalk boards. Yes, he came up with the central theory, but he was wrong on the speed, didn't know anything about genetics, and added some garbage to his book that simply doesn't work.

The speed of evolution is only limited to the mutation rate and the kinds of mutations that can occur. That's it. When environments change very rapidly - say, a large meteor hits the planet - species either evolve or go extinct. If the mutation rate is slow and the species is a specialist, it's probably going extinct. If the mutation rate is high, it might be ok.

Last - what changes are you going to see in morphology with the fusion of the chromosomes? Why would you see any change in morphology?

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