Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

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#137739 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>No, I can accept that you believe god answers your prayers. Why do you care if I believe your prayers are answered? If you believe it, good for you. I hope your religion brings you more fulfillment than it appears to bring most of the people I've seen on here.
Cheers!

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137740 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>It wasn't really a rant. You should look into some of the research on the subject of free will - you will see that what we imagine as free will is more like an illusion of control after the fact.
Ahhhh....

So the illusion of control was the TV made me change the channel... mhmmmm...

Or was it the allure of the remote control that demanded my destiny to watch a different show? er, uh, set of commercials...

Right.

Go play with your GW voodoo doll.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137741 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>I believe Tide posted this video a while ago. Here it is again. It's a good beginner introduction. I recommend you check it out if you are interested in the subject.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =pCofmZlC72gXX
hehehe. The atheist "law firm".

Neat!

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137742 Nov 14, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Our decisions are bound by determining factors. These factors are knowable. Knowing these factors would allow predictability. If all of your decisions can be predicted before you make them, you cannot demonstrate freedom from these factors. You don't make choices freely. You are bound to make them exactly as the determining factors dictate. This is what makes free will an illusion, or at least a misnomer.
But I freely decided to respond to your post.

And I'm freely ending it.

Look at that! Free will!

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137743 Nov 14, 2012
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Would you consider a hamburger with cheese a hamburger?
No sir. That would be lasagna.

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#137744 Nov 14, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
"Coppedge had worked on the Cassini mission to Saturn, starting as a contractor in 1996, and later becoming a full-time employee. But one of the projects he pursued on his own time was the promotion of intelligent design, the notion that the Universe and, most prominently, life itself, is too orderly to have come about without a designer.(Like many others in that movement, Coppedge is a self-identified evangelical Christian.)
"In 2009, he apparently got a bit aggressive about promoting these ideas at work, leading one employee to complain. The resulting investigation found that he had also aggressively promoted his opinion on California's gay marriage ban, and had attempted to get JPL's holiday party renamed to "Christmas party." (There's detailed background on the case here.) Coppedge was warned about his behavior at work, but he felt it was an infringement of his religious freedom, so he sued. Shortly after, as part of a set of cutbacks on the Cassini staff, he was fired."
I donít believe itís proper to be trying to convert people on the job. Work is work and it should be about work.

None of us know this man nor have we worked at JPL. So all we know is what is in print.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137745 Nov 14, 2012
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean Judaism?
LULZ>...
No, you f_cking brick. I said Christianity..........

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137746 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Uhm...ah...ok, let's try this. You like medicine? You hate disease?
If yes:
evolution = good
creationism = bad
If no:
evolution = bad
creationism = good
So now you equate evolution to modern medicine?!?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137747 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>It's not really a hobby. Fetish would be the better word.
You love hearing about crabs?

Dude...

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137748 Nov 14, 2012
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
When I learn to speak Japanese I'm going to come train with you and we'll rule from the shadows.
I'm going to change my name to Shinobu Suzuki.
I tried taking a train to Japan.

I tried & I failed.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#137749 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
I donít believe itís proper to be trying to convert people on the job. Work is work and it should be about work.
None of us know this man nor have we worked at JPL. So all we know is what is in print.
BWAHAHAHAHA

Great dodge.

I happen to know something about the litigation, but I can't discuss it.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137750 Nov 14, 2012
timn17 wrote:
<quoted text>Preaching to your co workers about the majesty of jesus and the lies of the evolutionist cabal is a pretty good indicator of his inability to think objectively.
And would preaching to your coworkers about the awesomeness of evolution vs. the stupidness if religion be an equal indicator of objective thinking?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137751 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Going with your statement,{It didn't fuse gradually. It fused in one go. After that, it was organized gradually}.
Where is the gradual and slow change?
This Chromosome #2 fusing is telling me there was no gradual change.
But one very big major change.
This defies what evolution has been teaching.
So when did this fusing take place?
Eagle...why does the Chromosome fusion have to be gradual according to evolutionary theory?

On the contrary, the fusion itself could only happen in one go. After that, evolution gradually changed it to what it is today (some mutations on the teleomeres, some rearranging of DNA).

If you know anything about meiosis, you can understand why the fusion had to happen in one event. If you don't know anything about meiosis, it works like this:

During meiosis, all your chromosomes are divided into two (non-identical) as one germline cell becomes two sperm cells (I'm oversimplifying). They recombine in the egg.

Prior to meiosis, the germline cells divide by mitosis - that breaks them apart at the centromeres, replicates each chromosome, divides the cell wall (with each half cell taking half the identical chromosomes). Then, meiosis and, if the sperm is lucky, recombination.

The division of chromosomes is done by enzymes. They act like scissors, cutting the chromosomes in half. During mitosis, that's done at the centromeres. During meiosis, that's done at roughly the halfway mark. Immediately after mitosis, different enzymes stitch the chromosomes back together. After meiosis, the stitching has to wait until fertilization with the egg.

The "stitching" enzymes will stitch anything they find. So if, for whatever reason, the chromosomal material couldn't get out of the way in time, the enzyme would include it in the stitching. It's a dumb enzyme, right?

That's what happened. In this one, extremely rare instance, the wrong chromosome was too slow in being moved out of the cell half. So it got stitched together, making chromosome 22.

That could only happen in one event. It couldn't happen in more than one event, b/c the event requires the genetic material from both parts of the now chromosome 22. Secondly, it's such an unlikely event that it would extremely improbable to have, say, 1/4 of a chromosome being attached and then, at some later date, another quarter and another. Third, we only find 2 teleomere fragments in the middle of chromosome 22, not a several - so, only one event.

Next, Darwin was wrong about many details about evolution. He is 160 years out of date. Sorry. Compared to what we know now, Darwin was drawing on chalk boards. Yes, he came up with the central theory, but he was wrong on the speed, didn't know anything about genetics, and added some garbage to his book that simply doesn't work.

The speed of evolution is only limited to the mutation rate and the kinds of mutations that can occur. That's it. When environments change very rapidly - say, a large meteor hits the planet - species either evolve or go extinct. If the mutation rate is slow and the species is a specialist, it's probably going extinct. If the mutation rate is high, it might be ok.

Last - what changes are you going to see in morphology with the fusion of the chromosomes? Why would you see any change in morphology?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137752 Nov 14, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
BWAHAHAHAHA
Great dodge.
I happen to know something about the litigation, but I can't discuss it.
But Mike says you can!

Geoff? Frank? Tim? Uh...

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137753 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you equate evolution to modern medicine?!?
Should I start with the alphabet song and just work my way up?

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#137754 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Ahhhh....
So the illusion of control was the TV made me change the channel... mhmmmm...
Or was it the allure of the remote control that demanded my destiny to watch a different show? er, uh, set of commercials...
Right.
Go play with your GW voodoo doll.
The basic consensus is (I think) that our decisions are made "for us" by our brain - then after the fact it appears to have been a conscious decision. "We" may still retain veto power over these decisions that arise from the unconscious.

There have been a couple interesting studies on this. Here's a summary of one:

http://www.wired.com/science/discoveries/news...

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#137755 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
And would preaching to your coworkers about the awesomeness of evolution vs. the stupidness if religion be an equal indicator of objective thinking?
Who does that? If someone were to go around at work insulting people's religious beliefs, he/she should be fired too. However, I don't think there would be anything wrong with discussing a scientific theory. People shouldn't be so touchy about it. Does gravity upset you?

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#137756 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
But Mike says you can!
Geoff? Frank? Tim? Uh...
How do you tell the sex of a chromosome?

Pull down its genes.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#137757 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Why is it ok for you and not me?
You presuppose that prayer doesn't work & go from there...
No, I have actually seen the reports, the complete ones, not the cherry picked ones. It has never demonstrated any amount of success beyond that of chance. You're just as well off tossing the dice or wishing.

Perfect example:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Days_of_Prayer_f...
http://www.msnbc.msn.com/id/42705038/ns/weath...

Guess when it did finally rain, during the atheist convention, long after the prayers. I like this example because if prayer works, then your god clearly prefers the company of atheists.

Since: Sep 11

Location hidden

#137758 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
You love hearing about crabs?
Dude...
Correction - I love hearing about eagle's crabs.

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