Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137512 Nov 14, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I can't disagree with your assessment. However, as for myself, I have always hated being cold, especially damp cold. It was painful. I would have died very young in ages past.
Unless you were born some place warm. Hell, maybe you would have been an explorer and left for warmer places.

I'd have died young, too, if it makes you feel any better. But for the grace of modern medicine.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137513 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't be stupid. Lots of atheists post links & quotes from atheist websites.
How can evilbible.com exist if the Bible is truly the word of a deity? are deities' words all that corruptible?

That's pretty funny.

I think you just disagree with their interpretation, but they see their website as an expose.

:)

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137514 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Catholics are Christians. In fact, your version of religion is simply a changed version of theirs.
Nope. From wiki:

Catholicism is distinguished from other forms of Christianity in its particular understanding and commitment to tradition, the sacraments, the mediation between God, communion, and the See of Rome.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137515 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope. From wiki:
Catholicism is distinguished from other forms of Christianity in its particular understanding and commitment to tradition, the sacraments, the mediation between God, communion, and the See of Rome.
Oh, my mistake. I forget that it's acceptable practice to quote-mine wikipedia while ignoring history in the support of your fragile belief system.

Fact:

- From about 100 AD all Christians were Catholic. That changed when Luther nailed his 99 theses on a Catholic church and broke away from the dominant religion

- Luther subtracted 7 books from the Bible that he didn't like

- The Catholics developed most of the theology surrounding Christianity, including the concept of the Holy Trinity

- All Protestant religions, including yours, trace back to Catholicism

If we were to draw a "clade" of Christian religions, yours is a progeny of Catholicism, a derived Catholic religion. Your religion didn't come to exist all by itself, but has a direct lineage straight back to Catholicism - all Christian religions do.

The larger question is: why do you need to ignore history?

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#137516 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Catholics are Christians. In fact, your version of religion is simply a changed version of theirs.
You can separate yourself from them all you want. That's no problem. I would, if I was a Christian - mainly because of the past. But Luther was a total jerk, too. Racist, sexist to boot. I'd also separate myself from that dirtbag.
While you're at it, you should edit out all the immoral stuff from your Bible. Start a Christian religion that is based solely on the moral teachings of Jesus (but leave out the immoral teachings of Jesus). Separate it utterly from science, use it to build a system of spirituality and personal growth that is positive in believers' lives and the lives of others.
That would be a religion worth believing in. Can you do it?
The Jefferson Bible.

"Jefferson's condensed composition is especially notable for its exclusion of all miracles by Jesus and most mentions of the supernatural, including sections of the four gospels which contain the Resurrection and most other miracles, and passages indicating Jesus was divine."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Jefferson_Bible

"In extracting the pure principles which he taught, we should have to strip off the artificial vestments in which they have been muffled by priests, who have travestied them into various forms, as instruments of riches and power to themselves. We must dismiss the Platonists and Plotinists, the Stagyrites and Gamalielites, the Eclectics, the Gnostics and Scholastics, their essences and emanations, their logos and demiurges, aeons and daemons, male and female, with a long train of … or, shall I say at once, of nonsense. We must reduce our volume to the simple evangelists, select, even from them, the very words only of Jesus, paring off the amphibologisms into which they have been led, by forgetting often, or not understanding, what had fallen from him, by giving their own misconceptions as his dicta, and expressing unintelligibly for others what they had not understood themselves. There will be found remaining the most sublime and benevolent code of morals which has ever been offered to man. I have performed this operation for my own use, by cutting verse by verse out of the printed book, and arranging the matter which is evidently his, and which is as easily distinguishable as diamonds in a dunghill. The result is an octavo of forty-six pages, of pure and unsophisticated doctrines" - Thomas Jefferson

I have a version in .doc(I think), or .pdf.

Ar Ar is more than welcome to take a look at it. It's freely available online.

At 46 pages, it's just about right in size, and doesn't strain credulity so much like the NT does. None of that removes the issue of there being little to no proof of the Jesus having been a literal person, and I think Jefferson was operating under that premise, and sought to focus on the message or doctrine contained in the NT(he stated as as such).

“Live Good, & Feel Good.”

Since: Aug 09

Atl.

#137517 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Boss!!! Long time!
I'm glad you're good - that's great! I bet you enjoyed Korea. Most of the cute girls there are Christian, right? I hope you met some :)
I'm in your country right now and enjoying the food, people, architecture and, most of all, indoor warmth.
anyohaseyo!
hello back to you hiding! Yeah the girls there are indeed pretty. But there are pretty women everywhere and in every culture. What was a worthy task to me, is finding that one pretty girl, and dedicate to that one pretty girl for life. I refuse go through what general petraeus is going through right now. my, his nights and bed must be very cold..brrr!!

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137518 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
How can evilbible.com exist if the Bible is truly the word of a deity? are deities' words all that corruptible?
Free will. That's how.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137519 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, my mistake. I forget that it's acceptable practice to quote-mine wikipedia while ignoring history in the support of your fragile belief system.
Fact:
- From about 100 AD all Christians were Catholic. That changed when Luther nailed his 99 theses on a Catholic church and broke away from the dominant religion
- Luther subtracted 7 books from the Bible that he didn't like
- The Catholics developed most of the theology surrounding Christianity, including the concept of the Holy Trinity
- All Protestant religions, including yours, trace back to Catholicism
If we were to draw a "clade" of Christian religions, yours is a progeny of Catholicism, a derived Catholic religion. Your religion didn't come to exist all by itself, but has a direct lineage straight back to Catholicism - all Christian religions do.
The larger question is: why do you need to ignore history?
I don't ignore history. I know that Christians came from Catholics. But we are very different.

Christians don't do some things that Catholics do:

Attend mass.
Pray to Mary.
Have beads.
Confession to man.
Funny robes.
Priests.
Idolize the Virgin Mary.
Idolize the pope.
Have a pope.
Deny birth control.

Etc etc etc

We're vary different. I'm nothing like a catholic.
Thinking

Dalry, UK

#137520 Nov 14, 2012
Where is your sect on Evolution? The vatican position is to accept Evolution as a process, which is pretty rational given the incredible amount of evidence we now have.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't ignore history. I know that Christians came from Catholics. But we are very different.
Christians don't do some things that Catholics do:
Attend mass.
Pray to Mary.
Have beads.
Confession to man.
Funny robes.
Priests.
Idolize the Virgin Mary.
Idolize the pope.
Have a pope.
Deny birth control.
Etc etc etc
We're vary different. I'm nothing like a catholic.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137521 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't ignore history. I know that Christians came from Catholics. But we are very different.
Christians don't do some things that Catholics do:
Attend mass.
Pray to Mary.
Have beads.
Confession to man.
Funny robes.
Priests.
Idolize the Virgin Mary.
Idolize the pope.
Have a pope.
Deny birth control.
Etc etc etc
We're vary different. I'm nothing like a catholic.
Yes, of course Protestants are different than Catholics! No one is disputing that - and no one is blaming Protestants for the actions of Catholics. Or, no one should. We can still look at the actions of Christianity throughout the ages - well, any religion, really - and draw lessons from it, without casting blame on today's religions. Warning, yes, but not blame.

Catholics are still Christians, though. You don't have a monopolgy on Christianity just because you're Protestant. Catholics just aren't Christians exactly like you. Mormons and Jehovah's Witnesses, for that matter, are Christian sects. Again, not like you are, though they still believe in God, Jesus and the Holy Spirit. They just add extra, stupid stuff to the core principles.

Here's a thought experiment: of the two, Shinnyo-en Buddhism and Catholicism, which falls under the umbrella of Christianity?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#137522 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't ignore history. I know that Christians came from Catholics. But we are very different.
Christians don't do some things that Catholics do:
Attend mass.
Pray to Mary.
Have beads.
Confession to man.
Funny robes.
Priests.
Idolize the Virgin Mary.
Idolize the pope.
Have a pope.
Deny birth control.
Etc etc etc
We're vary different. I'm nothing like a catholic.
BTW, Anglicans do most of the above and are Protestant.

I know, I know...you're also not Anglican.

:)
Loren Eberly

Mansfield, OH

#137523 Nov 14, 2012
Deficit and Debt:

The majority of us the Government of this Representative Republic that vote and the nonvoters that sit on their dead hands and whine; reelecting Obnoxious President, Governor, Representatives of US the Government, County Commissioners, Township Trustees, Mayors, City Council, School Administrators and Board Members.

That defies USA Labor Law, The Constitution, and demands of Natural Law: what Mother Nature, God, or Whatever Power decreed to be the reality of the real world, democracy, capitalism, the US Constitution, and free, fair, and affordable commerce and common sense demands.

Demanding every Stockholder, corporation, farmer, business, outsourcer sweatshop, and nonprofit, tax-exempt, organization and Church; markets the cost in the wholesale and retail price of his or her product and service; of every worker, consumer, and taxpayer's wages (union contract), healthcare, pension, investment and independent business profit.

Enables every worker, consumer, and taxpayer to pay healthcare insurance premium or pay healthcare provider. Pay ALL taxes and pay for every product and service they use for life. With money derived from wages, investment profit, and independent business profit.

And enables every parent to educate, love, nurse, nurture, discipline, protect, and provide; for every child (job) they conceive. And fund schools, infrastructure, local and national security, government services, and etc.; with money derived from wages, investment profit, and independent business profit.

This don’t enable Union workers, consumers, taxpayers, and America’s grandchildren’s children, Government employees, Parents, Teachers, Veterans, Police, Firemen, and Fathers disqualified for affirmative action with white skin, Representatives deny Collective Bargaining Rights accountable.

To fund Illegal drug users and Illegal Immigrants, lottery, casino, and keno losers, unemployed Union workers replaced with nonunion workers, Human Traffickers, waitresses that pander for life for $2.00 per hour, slaves in enterprise zones, low-income child labor, consumers, and taxpayers, volunteers without wages, and nonunion workers willing to work for fewer wages than they can afford life. That pays with welfare checks, food stamps, housing vouchers, and Medicaid.

Pay for all stimulus packages, tax abatements, tax incentives, tax refunds, tax credit, and tax exemptions.

Pay sales tax on the more stock dividends (money) OPEC Nations, Enron Stockholders, Wal-Mart Stockholders, Hillarys, Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders (money marketers) market quarterly. In the wholesale and retail price of every product and service Human Beings use for life. And School Boards and Government needs to build, maintain and operate schools, infrastructure, and provide local and national security, and Government services. That gets only product or service.

Needed to measure and maintain the strength and growth of this UNAFFORDABLE economy and distribute money Human Beings cannot digest, burn in internal combustion engines, or burn to heat and cool their American Dream. Into OPEC Nations, Enron Stockholders, Wal-Mart Stockholders, Hillarys, Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders portfolios.

Or support free, fair, and affordable commerce; funding schools; balancing every budget; Union workers, consumers, taxpayers, and Americas grandchildren's children paying Ohio’s $1.35 trillion budget deficit, the $40 trillion social security and the $16 trillion national debt. America’s grandchildren’s children are responsible to pay Chinese, Foreign and Domestic Investors and Stockholders interest with this debt until they are 18 years old.

America’s grandchildren’s children cannot afford life and pay this debt with the $7.25 per hour Government mandated labor wage in a hundred million years.

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#137524 Nov 14, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thanks for proving my point that your a sh**head, stupid.
Strong faith in you God there. I rest my case!

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137525 Nov 14, 2012
Thinking wrote:
Where is your sect on Evolution? The vatican position is to accept Evolution as a process, which is pretty rational given the incredible amount of evidence we now have.
<quoted text>
Evolution has sects? Is that because it's a belief system too?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137526 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes, of course Protestants are different than Catholics! No one is disputing that

----- then -----

Catholics are still Christians, though.
Stop it, Hiding... You're killing me...

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#137527 Nov 14, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
BTW, Anglicans do most of the above and are Protestant.
I know, I know...you're also not Anglican.
:)
Catholicism is a denomination, hence a subset, of Christianity.

All Catholics are Christians, but not all Christians are Catholics.

A Christian refers to a follower of Jesus Christ who may be a Catholic, Protestant, Gnostic, Mormon, Evangelical, Anglican or Orthodox, or follower of another branch of the religion.

A Catholic refers to a Christian who follows the Catholic religion as transmitted through the succession of Popes of Rome and the Vatican Empire across history.

The Pope is the leader of the Catholic church. The Catholic Church is the largest of the Christian Churches - about 60% of Christians are Catholic.

Since: Mar 11

Lexington, KY

#137528 Nov 14, 2012
So Catholics aren't Christian?

Bwahahahahahahahahahahahahahah a!
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't ignore history. I know that Christians came from Catholics. But we are very different.
Christians don't do some things that Catholics do:
Attend mass.
Pray to Mary.
Have beads.
Confession to man.
Funny robes.
Priests.
Idolize the Virgin Mary.
Idolize the pope.
Have a pope.
Deny birth control.
Etc etc etc
We're vary different. I'm nothing like a catholic.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#137529 Nov 14, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
I can't disagree with your assessment. However, as for myself, I have always hated being cold, especially damp cold. It was painful. I would have died very young in ages past.
Maine, where I lived for almost half of my adult life, has a saying: There's not bad weather, just bad clothes. Keep your head and feet warm and the rest of you body will be just fine.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#137530 Nov 14, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>Free will. That's how.
So your god's not omniscient.
Thinking

Dalry, UK

#137531 Nov 14, 2012
Numpty.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Evolution has sects? Is that because it's a belief system too?

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