Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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#129331
Oct 13, 2012
 

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KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
So when your god commanded the Isrealites to slaughter and rape, that was not justified?
To allege that the God of the Bible is some sort of “monster” for ordering Israel to destroy the inhabitants of Canaan exhibits an ignorance of biblical teaching. Those inhabitants were destroyed because of their wickedness (Deuteronomy 9:4; 18:9-14). They were so evil that their Creator no longer could abide their corruption. That they had numerous opportunities to repent is evident from the prophetic books (Nineveh did repent, for example, and for a time stayed the day of destruction). Complaining about Jehovah’s order to destroy innocent children is a vain gesture when one realizes that the children were spared an even worse fate of being reared as slaves under the domination of sin. Instead of having to endure the scourge of a life of immorality and wickedness, these innocents were ushered early into the bliss of Paradise. If the male children had been allowed to mature, they most likely would have followed the pagan ways of their forefathers, and eventually would have taken vengeance on the Israelites. Killing the males not only prevented them from falling into the same abominable sins as their parents, but also kept Israel from having to battle them later. Just like the children in Noah's time when God destroyed all but eight these children would of grown up to be as there parents, because evil was the norm, so that meant these children didn't have a chance so it was better for the children to die and go to heaven thsn grow up and go to hell, don't you agree?

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#129332
Oct 13, 2012
 

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Mike Duquette wrote:
<quoted text>Not sure if anyone ever said this. Possibly it was a creationist pamphlet creating a straw man.Science certainly does not make such a claim, nor needs to for evolution of birds.
Birds evolved from dinosaurs. None of the differences between dinosaurs and birds needed to occur at once.
BUT!! The self-proclaimed smart people here say that "a species evolves, not an individual".....

A species "evolving" to a better suited species is impossible. ONE individual wolud havebto start the chain reaction...

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#129333
Oct 13, 2012
 

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Drew Smith wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope.
It doesn't mean that all of the genes mutate at the same time. A mutation can appear in one individual, and if favorable then spread throughout the entire population over time (a number of generations).
Then go talk to Hiding. Shevseems to think that a species evolves, not an individual...

And she claims to be a teacher (and a PhD student at the same time).

Y'all can't seem to get your stories straight....

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#129334
Oct 13, 2012
 
Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
Proof?
Show us one scientific theory which has a goddidit term.
Matter, now can you prove he didn't? Now prove how and when matter was made, as God says, in the beginning he created the heavens and earth and that would include matter.

“cdesign proponentsists”

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#129335
Oct 13, 2012
 

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Eagle12 wrote:
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Oh yes it would.
That is a false assumption that you’re making.
See this is a misnomer you’re entertaining. A false one at that. You are only repeating what someone else has told you.
You never been on the cutting edge of Bio Chemistry research. I’m telling you that evolution stops for the majority research scientist the minute they pass the course. It is not necessary or applied in Chemistry and Bio Chemistry related to pharma research and production.
We’re talking here modern science, modern research science. You won’t see a chart on the evolution of man hanging in any of these pharmaceutical research facilities.
Don’t take my word for it, go a visit a pharma research facility. Take a tour, talk to the scientist. See for yourself.
http://www.historyofvaccines.org/content/arti...

Viruses and Evolution
Just as natural selection has shaped the evolution of humans, plants, and all living things on the planet, natural selection shapes viruses, too. Though viruses aren’t technically living – they need a host organism in order to reproduce – they are subject to evolutionary pressures

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#129336
Oct 13, 2012
 
Some people feel they are smarter than God and of course God has a reply to that, which is, My thoughts are nothing like your thoughts,” says the Lord.

“And my ways are far beyond anything you could imagine.

9For just as the heavens are higher than the earth,

so my ways are higher than your ways

and my thoughts higher than your thoughts.

“Think&Care”

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#129337
Oct 13, 2012
 
Gate Keeper 1 wrote:
<quoted text>Sorry, you are wrong. Your statement of falsehood, in an attempt to recover your loss does not become valid, by simply seeking unverifiable consensus.
And neither does your quoting Aquinas demonstrate your views are correct. The arguments Aquinas gave were faulty: they did not prove what he claimed.

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#129338
Oct 13, 2012
 

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Mikko wrote:
<quoted text>
the ware christian and what ever you say doesn't change it and the christian churches approved of it all
There is only one church , that is the Church of Christ. God being pure love is incapable of doing anything evil. Just as heat is the absence of cold so is Love the absence of evil. My thoughts are nothing like your thoughts,” says the Lord.

“And my ways are far beyond anything you could imagine.

9For just as the heavens are higher than the earth,

so my ways are higher than your ways

and my thoughts higher than your thoughts. Reas your bible and read Acts chapter 1 and 2 and you will see how and when the Church of Christ started and how your to worship him. Romans 16:16 Mark 16:16

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

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#129339
Oct 13, 2012
 
preterism wrote:
Some people feel they are smarter than God and of course God has a reply to that, which is, My thoughts are nothing like your thoughts,” says the Lord.
“And my ways are far beyond anything you could imagine.
9For just as the heavens are higher than the earth,
so my ways are higher than your ways
and my thoughts higher than your thoughts.
Exodus 21:1 Now these are the judgments which thou shalt set before them.

2 If thou buy an Hebrew servant, six years he shall serve: and in the seventh he shall go out free for nothing.

3 If he came in by himself, he shall go out by himself: if he were married, then his wife shall go out with him.

4 If his master have given him a wife, and she have born him sons or daughters; the wife and her children shall be her master's, and he shall go out by himself.

“Think&Care”

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#129340
Oct 13, 2012
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
Many uncaused causes just pushes things back. You still need an original cause.
Wrong. It is quite possible to have many uncaused causes and your argument fails to show otherwise. It doesn't 'push things back' because those uncaused causes are, um, uncaused.
Infinity does not exist in reality.
Proof?
From nothing comes nothing. Nothing cannot produse anything.
Never heard of quantum fluctuations, huh?
Design does not need intelligence is an illogical assumption. To have design you need intelligence.
No, my pint is that complexity doesn't require an intelligence. Not all complexity is designed.

“Think&Care”

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#129341
Oct 13, 2012
 
lightbeamrider wrote:
Uncreated outside time and space.
Why not many things uncreated outside of space and time?
In math if you have an infinite number of days past you never get to today.
I guess you don't know much math, huh? Your statement is simply false. It assumes there is a *beginning* and *then* an infinite time. In actuality, it is possible there is only a finite time between any two events, but an infinite amount of time in the past.

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

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#129342
Oct 13, 2012
 
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Uh...baby...it has undergone evolution. Again, the horseshoe crab you are looking at is a different species than the one of hundreds of millions of years ago. You just refuse to listen.
Here, paper demonstrating that modern horseshoe crabs are different than those in the past. It's technical, but perhaps that technicality will provide you some insight on why your comments are grossly oversimplified to the point of not containing information.
http://www.pnas.org/content/early/2012/09/07/...
"The basic arrangement of limbs in euarthropods consists of a uniramous head appendage followed by a series of biramous appendages. The body is divided into functional units or tagmata which are usually distinguished by further differentiation of the limbs. The living horseshoe crabs are remnants of a much larger diversity of aquatic chelicerates. The limbs of the anterior and posterior divisions of the body of living horseshoe crabs differ in the loss of the outer and inner ramus, respectively, of an ancestral biramous limb. Here we report a new fossil horseshoe crab from the mid-Silurian Lagerstätte in Herefordshire, United Kingdom (approximately 425 Myr B.P.), a site that has yielded a remarkably preserved assemblage of soft-bodied fossils. The limbs of the new form can be homologized with those of living Limulus, but retain an ancestral biramous morphology. Remarkably, however, the two limb branches originate separately, providing fossil evidence to suggest that repression or loss of gene expression might have given rise to the appendage morphology of Limulus. Both branches of the prosomal limbs of this new fossil are robust and segmented in contrast to their morphology in Cambrian arthropods, revealing that a true biramous limb was once present in chelicerates as well as in the mandibulates."
Sweets, these words were taken right out of your reference. These are the words of creative imaginations of science.

{evidence to suggest that}

{might have given rise to the}

I see in the fossil record a horseshoe crab 500 mya. Today’s horseshoe crab looks identical. Some minor changes noted by biologist, ok no problem. Basically the horseshoe crab has remained unchanged.

The earth and the oceans have changed a lot in 500 million years. Yet the horseshoe crab remains unchanged even though it’s environment was and is constantly changing.

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

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#129343
Oct 13, 2012
 
Evolution is the change over time in the frequency of alleles in a *population*. The individual is not the population.
Populations (species) evolve. Individuals don't.
<quoted text>
The word "evolution" is *always* a noun. Did you notice that "-ion" ending?
<quoted text>
Nope. Individuals don't evolve. Species do.
Dave Nelson wrote:
A species is a collection of individuals.
Which was never in dispute.
Dave Nelson wrote:
"1
: one of a set of prescribed movements
2
a : a process of change in a certain direction : unfolding
b : the action or an instance of forming and giving something off : emission
c (1): a process of continuous change from a lower, simpler, or worse to a higher, more complex, or better state : growth (2): a process of gradual and relatively peaceful social, political, and economic advance
d : something evolved
3
: the process of working out or developing"
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/evo...
None of which are the definition of "evolution" when used in scientific biological contexts. Funny how you intentionally omitted the *relevant* definition from Merriam-Webster, which was definition *4*. Why did you knowingly fail to provide that definition, knowing that it was the only *relevant* one?

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#129344
Oct 13, 2012
 
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why not many things uncreated outside of space and time?
Could be.
<quoted text>
I guess you don't know much math, huh? Your statement is simply false. It assumes there is a *beginning* and *then* an infinite time. In actuality, it is possible there is only a finite time between any two events, but an infinite amount of time in the past.
Infinity does not exist in reality. In space and time. It exists as a concept. In order to have infinite amount you have to have infinite time. You do not have infinite time. You have finite time. I know that much about math. My example included an infinite amount of days which is in space and time. All you have is an imaginary concept. That is not hard science.

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#129345
Oct 13, 2012
 
It doesn't mean that all of the genes mutate at the same time. A mutation can appear in one individual, and if favorable then spread throughout the entire population over time (a number of generations).
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Then go talk to Hiding. Shevseems to think that a species evolves, not an individual
Hiding is correct. Species evolves. Individuals don't.

Nothing in what I said above is a claim that individuals evolve.

“In the beginning God Created..”

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#129346
Oct 13, 2012
 
River Tam wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't personally know any atheists that want to thwart your freedoms. I love diversity. Some of my best friends are Christians. Some of my friends are Daoists. Don't put your Nativity scene on my government's property and I won't steal your baby jesus doll. It's as simple as that :)
In a case in my city a couple of years ago. A large building that once housed a business was donated to a local church. This donated building was located on the main street of the city. The city government blocked the use of this building as a church.

It seems the city didn’t want a church on the main street. They wanted the church to move somewhere in the back and out of the way. The city was in violation of the Religious Freedom Restoration Act of 1993. This law came about because governments were zoning out churches.

Once the city realized that the public was aware of the law. The rescinded their decision reluctantly. So government has and does try to block religious freedom.

When it comes to nativity scenes. I’m in agreement with you. These nativity scenes should not be on government property. There are plenty of churches and private property to display nativity scenes.

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#129348
Oct 13, 2012
 
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong. It is quite possible to have many uncaused causes and your argument fails to show otherwise. It doesn't 'push things back' because those uncaused causes are, um, uncaused.
You did not read the two articles posted. It remains highly speculative there is uncaused causes. Besides it does not change cause and effect at macro levels. All you have is assumption in a new branch hardly anybody understands. Created under artificial conditions. Lab conditions.
Proof?

Never heard of quantum fluctuations, huh?

No, my pint is that complexity doesn't require an intelligence. Not all complexity is designed.
Read a little about it. There is no reason other than anti theism to assume complexity design order happens for no reason.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

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#129349
Oct 13, 2012
 
preterism wrote:
<quoted text> Matter, now can you prove he didn't? Now prove how and when matter was made, as God says, in the beginning he created the heavens and earth and that would include matter.
Yet another godbot who is incapable of answer a simple question.

“In the beginning God Created..”

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#129350
Oct 13, 2012
 
Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
And once again you prove that godbots can answer a simple question.
{And once again you prove that godbots can answer a simple question}.

A compliment coming from you???

Thank you but I tend to believe this is one of your bumbling and clumsy goofs.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

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#129351
Oct 13, 2012
 
CORRECTION:-

Yet another godbot who is incapable of answering a simple question.

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