Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

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Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.
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123,761 - 123,780 of 226,292 Comments Last updated 8 min ago

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#128256 Oct 7, 2012
RiversideRedneck wrote:
LOL, you athitards are the biggest intollerant bigots out there....
I don't see any of you OR any of us Christians bad-mouthing any politicians that believe in evolution...
But as soon as one disagrees with it, oh boy! You bigots fire in full force!
Anyone who doesn't "believe" in evolution doesn't understand science. Period. So a politician who is on a committee for Science and Technology who doesn't understand science is dangerous. Where do you think such an uninformed, ignorant man is going to take your good country?

Do you believe that kind of man is the right person for the job? Will he be able to push reforms so that you can compete with China?

“In the beginning God Created..”

Since: Feb 12

Southern Illinois

#128257 Oct 7, 2012
scaritual wrote:
<quoted text>
I had previously responded to EMS servant in this post http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/TUGI0DVLL... concerning the Ipuwer Papyrus. The dates for the Ipuwer Papyrus and its date of origin do not align with the "Exodus" myth.
Simply, it just doesn't add up.
Ipuwer Papyrus info @wikipedia.
"The dating of the original composition of the poem is disputed, but several scholars have suggested a date between the late 6th dynasty and the Second Intermediate Period (ca. 1850 BCE-1600 BCE),[4] and appears to describe how the Hyksos took over Egypt.
The theme of this work had previously been taken either as a lament inspired by the supposed chaos of the First Intermediate Period,[5] or as a plea to Pepi II Neferkare depicting the fall of the Old Kingdom.[7][8] The admonitions may not be a discussion with a king at all however. Otto was the first to suggest that the discussion was not between Ipuwer and his king, but that this was a discussion between Ipuwer and a deity. Fecht showed through philological interpretation and revision of the relevant passages that this is indeed a discussion with a deity.[9] Modern research suggests that the papyrus dates to the much later 13th dynasty, with part of the papyrus now thought to date to the time of Pharaoh Khety, and the admonitions of Ipuwer actually being addressed to the god Atum, not a mortal king.[10] The admonitions are thought to harken back to the First Intermediate Period and record a decline in international relations and a general impoverishment in Egypt."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipuwer
Old Kingdom 2686–2181 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Kingdom
The First Intermediate Period 2181-2055 BCE.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Intermedia...
Middle Kingdom 2055–1650 BCE - The Middle Kingdom of Egypt is the period in the history of ancient Egypt stretching from the establishment of the Eleventh Dynasty to the end of the Thirteenth Dynasty, between 2055 BCE and 1650 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_Kingdom_o...
13th Dynasty or Dynasty XIII was from approximately 1802 BCE until ca. 1649 BCE for 153 years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Dynas...
2nd Intermediate Period 1650–1550 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Intermedi...
Wakhare Khety I (also Akhtoy) was a pharaoh of the Ninth dynasty of Egypt who reigned ca. 2150BCE during the First Intermediary Period.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wakhare_Khety_I
Wankhare Khety II was a local ruler of the Egyptian 9th / 10th Dynasty during the First Intermediate Period (ca. 21st century BC)
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Wankhare_Khety_I...
http://www.reshafim.org.il/ad/egypt/texts/ipu...
The dates assigned back in the early 1900's have been shown to be inaccurate, and are not the accepted dates today.
Apologetic sites still utilize the data that is in error, and that's not surprising.
There is plenty of information concerning the correct dating and age of the Ipuwer Papyrus and the reasons for those dates.
You are welcome to provide any proof that will rebut the above.
There’s always opposition to Jewish history.

The most hated people in all the world just because of their recorded history and belief in the One True God.

Information against pre War World II Jewish history can’t be trusted. Even in these times there’s people making claims there wasn’t even a holocaust.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#128258 Oct 7, 2012
Gate Keeper 1 wrote:
<quoted text>In an article entitled "Gays on the March" in 1975, Time magazine quoted gay activist Barbara Gittings who stated:
What the homosexual wants, and here he is neither willing to compromise nor morally required to compromise — is acceptance of homosexuality as a way of life fully on a par with heterosexuality." In response, Time opined, "It is one thing to remove legal discrimination against homosexuals. It is another to mandate approval....It is this goal of full acceptance, which no known society past or present has granted to homosexuals, that makes many Americans apprehensive.[3]
A primary goal of the homosexual agenda is to promote the lifestyle in public schools. This occurred quickly and intensely after gay marriage was imposed in Massachusetts, where homosexual relationships are taught to children as young as kindergartners, as recounted by the decision of Parker v. Hurley.[4]
In a 1992 report by John Leo in U.S. News and World Report, he notes some books which were part of New York City's public school curriculum.
The first-grade book, "Children of the Rainbow", stated on page 145, which states that teachers must "be aware of varied family structures, including...gay or lesbian parents," and "children must be taught to acknowledge the positive aspects of each type of household." Another children book is Heather Has Two Mommies, which is about a lesbian couple having a child through artificial insemination. Another book, Gloria Goes to Gay Pride, states, "Some women love women, some men love men, some women and men love each other. That's why we march in the parade, so everyone can have a choice."
Leo commented,
A line is being crossed here; in fact, a brand new ethic is descending upon the city's public school system. The traditional civic virtue of tolerance (if gays want to live together, it's their own business) has been replaced with a new ethic requiring approval and endorsement (if gays want to live together, we must 'acknowledge the positive aspects' of their way of life).
John 8:44-45
King James Version (KJV)
44 Ye are of your father the devil, and the lusts of your father ye will do. He was a murderer from the beginning, and abode not in the truth, because there is no truth in him. When he speaketh a lie, he speaketh of his own: for he is a liar, and the father of it.
45 And because I tell you the truth, ye believe me not.
What has any of that got to do with supernovas?

Or are you trying to say supernovas are in fact homosexual?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#128259 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
Who is Rep Paul Broun?
A Chemist, Congressman and also a Medical Doctor. Let me assure his views on evolution are shared by many in the scientific and medical community.
His views are not shared in the scientific community. Perhaps the medical community, but that will change.
I’m not denying the fact that a very large portion of the scientific community really believes in evolution.
It's just a process, not something you "believe" in.
There’s also many who don’t believe in it and remain silent for fear of retribution.
That's quite silly. Once you have tenure, you're protected so that you can say whatever you like - the whole point of tenure is to protect new and controversial ideas. There simply are no biological scientists who disagree with evolution. Ok...well, there are what, 5 ID people who don't produce research on ID and basically test the proximate level of biology?
The Congressman was hired by the people of the 10th Congressional District. He doesn’t give a damn about any retaliation.
No matter what you think of the Congressman. He is not unintelligent. His educational background is worthy of respect. So often Christians are viewed by atheist as stuck in the 14th century. Anti-science but nothing could be further than the truth.
Clearly he doesn't bring his critical thinking to his religion or to biological science.
Thousands if not millions of Christians are scientist or working in a science related field including the medical field. I support the Congressman right to free speech and right not to believe in Evolution. I see evolution like a hot air balloon. It takes a lot of hot air to keep it moving.
That's b/c you don't understand it. I should start talking about all the medical failures that happened b/c medicine doesn't have an evolutionary framework - like misunderstanding malaria and fever.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#128260 Oct 7, 2012
Gate Keeper 1 wrote:
<quoted text>No, we had a troglodyte senator, tehn we made him president. A gay minded greener who denies life and dreams of private clubs.
What is your anger against gays? Look we all know you a closet queer so come out already and admit it.
Anon

Lakewood, OH

#128261 Oct 7, 2012
Gate Keeper 1 wrote:
<quoted text>Maybe, he wassimply reacting to Obama, who in 2009, declared gay pederast Harvey Milks Day and Obama said "He came to recruit us all and to change America".
Broun's proposal was in May 2009, Obama's declaration was in August 2009.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#128262 Oct 7, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
He has a BS in chemistry and is an MD.
He is chairman of this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Ho...
Vice chairman of this:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Ho...
And on these two committees:
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Ho...
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/United_States_Ho...
He became a Congressman in 2007. Has won re-elections by large majorities. Not even contested this coming one.
Has done well in just 5 years. Must have something on the ball.
No, all it demonstrates is the low level of education of those who voted for him.

If he is representative of the caliber of your elected officials and he been placed in position of responsibility then it is no wonder the US is going down hill.

“MEET ROSEMARY-She Seeks Home”

Since: Oct 10

With Established Harem

#128263 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
There’s always opposition to Jewish history.
The most hated people in all the world just because of their recorded history and belief in the One True God.
Information against pre War World II Jewish history can’t be trusted. Even in these times there’s people making claims there wasn’t even a holocaust.
.. it's funny how Christians now embrace Jews after thousands of years of persecution ..

.. why is that ??..

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

#128264 Oct 7, 2012
What is the evidence that he is "intelligent"?
Given that evolution is extremely well supported by the available evidence, what does "guessing" have to do with it?
When did any atheist claim that he shouldn't be allowed freedom of speech?
Dave Nelson wrote:
He has a BS in chemistry and is an MD.
I didn't ask what the evidence was that he had an education. I asked you what the evidence was that he is "intelligent". Please answer the question that was actually asked.
Dave Nelson wrote:
And does he have to take an intelligence test to be appointed to those positions?

Or just know the right people?

Which is it?
Dave Nelson wrote:
And being a member of a House committee is evidence of intelligence? Aren't *all* Representatives members of committees?
Dave Nelson wrote:
He became a Congressman in 2007. Has won re-elections by large majorities. Not even contested this coming one.
Imagine that: A Republican winning by a large majority in a district dominated by Republicans.

Not exactly an impressive achievement.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#128265 Oct 7, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
<quoted text>
Anyone who doesn't "believe" in evolution doesn't understand science. Period. So a politician who is on a committee for Science and Technology who doesn't understand science is dangerous. Where do you think such an uninformed, ignorant man is going to take your good country?
Do you believe that kind of man is the right person for the job? Will he be able to push reforms so that you can compete with China?
How long will it be before the US becomes a basket case and the laughing stock of the world.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#128267 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
If evolution has such a convincing argument.
I'll reply, as soon as you fix your statement so that it becomes a sentence.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#128268 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Keep your day job.
No se preocupe.

Since: Sep 10

Long Beach, CA

#128269 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
There’s always opposition to Jewish history.
I have a friend who makes Jewish beer.

He brews it.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#128270 Oct 7, 2012
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text> Found your post and it is not where your link goes. The date is in dispute. It is similiar to the book of Lamentations. You are fixating on alleged differences in dating and ignoring how the text is similar to the Exodus account. Not a surprise. Gonna try this link again.
http://www.specialtyinterests.net/ipuwer.html
From your link: "The information we have regarding the provenance of the Papyrus Ipuwer is that it was copied by 19th Dynasty scribes and constitutes a part of what is known as the Papyrus Leiden 334."

Notice, that it says it was >copied< in the 19th Dynasty.

More about the 19th Dynasty and timeline.

"The Pharaohs of the 19th dynasty ruled for approximately one hundred and ten years: from ca 1292 to 1187 BCE." http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Nineteenth_Dynas...

As I said before, the dates do not match. Some more information.

"An Egyptian named Ipuwer wrote it at the end of the Middle Kingdom, around 1650 B.C.E.; scribes copied it in the 19th Dynasty, in the 1200s B.C.E" - Roger Isaacs, Author,'Talking With God'

Ipuwer Papyrus info @wikipedia.

"The dating of the original composition of the poem is disputed, but several scholars have suggested a date between the late 6th dynasty and the Second Intermediate Period (ca. 1850 BCE-1600 BCE),[4] and appears to describe how the Hyksos took over Egypt.
The theme of this work had previously been taken either as a lament inspired by the supposed chaos of the First Intermediate Period,[5] or as a plea to Pepi II Neferkare depicting the fall of the Old Kingdom.[7][8] The admonitions may not be a discussion with a king at all however. Otto was the first to suggest that the discussion was not between Ipuwer and his king, but that this was a discussion between Ipuwer and a deity. Fecht showed through philological interpretation and revision of the relevant passages that this is indeed a discussion with a deity.[9] Modern research suggests that the papyrus dates to the much later 13th dynasty, with part of the papyrus now thought to date to the time of Pharaoh Khety, and the admonitions of Ipuwer actually being addressed to the god Atum, not a mortal king.[10] The admonitions are thought to harken back to the First Intermediate Period and record a decline in international relations and a general impoverishment in Egypt."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ipuwer

Old Kingdom 2686–2181 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Old_Kingdom

The First Intermediate Period 2181-2055 BCE.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/First_Intermedia...

Middle Kingdom 2055–1650 BCE - The Middle Kingdom of Egypt is the period in the history of ancient Egypt stretching from the establishment of the Eleventh Dynasty to the end of the Thirteenth Dynasty, between 2055 BCE and 1650 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Middle_Kingdom_o...

13th Dynasty or Dynasty XIII was from approximately 1802 BCE until ca. 1649 BCE for 153 years.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Thirteenth_Dynas...

2nd Intermediate Period 1650–1550 BCE
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Second_Intermedi...

Apologetic sites still utilize the data that is in error, and that's not suprising.

There is plenty of information concerning the correct dating and age of the Ipuwer Papyrus and the reasons for those dates.

You are welcome to provide any proof that will rebut the above.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#128271 Oct 7, 2012
Happy Lesbo wrote:
<quoted text>
.. it's funny how Christians now embrace Jews after thousands of years of persecution ..
.. why is that ??..
Televangelism starting in the 70's. Pat Robertson and crowd.

The primary support of Israel was the liberal Democrats up until Jimmy Carter and the Camp David accords, with a backlash by the liberals against treatment of the Palestians. Israel's rightwing was in trouble. Then up pops the televangelists on the media, very much Christian Zionists, who became very Republican and hawkish about total support for Israel. Prior to this Republicans were not known for being big fans of Israel.

I've witnessed the changes myself.

Funny coincidence, isn't it?

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#128272 Oct 7, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
There’s always opposition to Jewish history.
The most hated people in all the world just because of their recorded history and belief in the One True God.
Information against pre War World II Jewish history can’t be trusted. Even in these times there’s people making claims there wasn’t even a holocaust.
No, no, the Hindus have the One True God, too. So do the Buddhists - and Buddha was nice enough to keep that hidden.

Hey, if you have found "the one true god" can you tell me why Mormons exist? Did they find the "one true Christianity"? And, if so, why aren't you a Mormon?

Since: Mar 11

Florence, KY

#128273 Oct 7, 2012
As hom attacks the concession speech of one who knows they have lost.

I accept your surrender my weak winded Christhole.
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>Go comb the gnats out of your hair and for crying out loud buy some flea drops for that poor cat.

Since: Mar 11

Florence, KY

#128274 Oct 7, 2012
I prefer the honest if at times seemingly cold nature of reality than a comforting delusion.
modernhippie wrote:
I hope you all don't mind my interrupting your boxing match, but may I pose a question?
If you could use your imagination for a moment and pull back from your current convictions, then contemplate that you now have the ultimate choice.
That whatever you WISHED to be true would be so.
Would it be different from what you feel certain of now?
My question is experimental in nature, not meant to be inflammatory.

“Why does my ignorance”

Since: Mar 11

justify your deity?

#128275 Oct 7, 2012
Richardfs wrote:
<quoted text>
How long will it be before the US becomes a basket case and the laughing stock of the world.
Uhm...ah...I hate to tell you this...but...ah...

Well, we're rooting for you!

Since: Mar 11

Florence, KY

#128276 Oct 7, 2012
Bottom line you refuse to accept facts when they go against what your preacher teaches.
lightbeamrider wrote:
<quoted text>Found your post and it is not where your link goes. The date is in dispute. It is similiar to the book of Lamentations. You are fixating on alleged differences in dating and ignoring how the text is similar to the Exodus account. Not a surprise. Gonna try this link again.

http://www.specialtyinterests.net/ipuwer.html

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