Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

#127121 Oct 2, 2012
And I asked you what other kind of atheists there were. You failed to respond to that question.
Dave Nelson wrote:
True intellectual and self reasoned ones.
True intellectual and self-reasoned atheists use science as a tool.

So I'm still waiting for you to describe atheists who don't use science.

Since: Sep 10

San Francisco, CA

#127122 Oct 2, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
"You, you may say
I'm a dreamer, but I'm not the only one
I hope some day you'll join us
And the world will be as one"
Are you supplying the dope?
See?

It's not difficult to bring out the cynical in you, Dave.

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

#127123 Oct 2, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
There are two kinds of atheist.
First: The ever loving sweet, kind, mild mannered, and respectful atheist.
The second, are the butthead, irreverent, loud mouth, obnoxious, cantankerous, narcissistic, vain, egotistical sh** head a**holes.
:)
Of course, one should give respect only to those who earn it.

Not to those who engage in childish insults rather than actual debate.

Since: Feb 08

Tampa, FL

#127124 Oct 2, 2012
You mean, the way that theists categorize people as "sinners" or "believers"? Those are also categories made by humans.(Not just men. Women, too.)
Eagle12 wrote:
Everyone is a sinner, past, present or future.
Really? What sin did babies who died at or near birth commit?

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#127125 Oct 2, 2012
Catcher1 wrote:
<quoted text>
See?
It's not difficult to bring out the cynical in you, Dave.
Cynicism can keep you from becoming a meal.

It's an evolutionary thing.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#127126 Oct 2, 2012

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#127127 Oct 2, 2012
Drew Smith wrote:
And I asked you what other kind of atheists there were. You failed to respond to that question.
<quoted text>
True intellectual and self-reasoned atheists use science as a tool.
So I'm still waiting for you to describe atheists who don't use science.
These sort.

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/List_of_atheist_...

Versus your canned variety you find on here. Science is not a tool for them. It is a vague thingy they use as a basis for their blatherings that doesn't even support those blatherings, which tend to be very emotional in nature.

Science can not prove or disprove the supernatural. The natural has an origin, otherwise it wouldn't be natural.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127128 Oct 2, 2012
Too much to follow! Let's try piecing it out.
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>Honey you have no idea how I act and you guesswork is nothing more than guesswork. You let yourself down by making such statements.
Just to clarify, I only meant that you are held to the same laws, as women in Saudi Arabia. Yes, I was only guessing, but if a Saudi lady called me, Honey, and was caught, she be severely reprimanded by the religious police and the males in her family.

We have had a few,'honor' killings, in the last year, here in America.

I do not respect murders.

Since: Sep 10

San Francisco, CA

#127129 Oct 2, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
<quoted text>
Cynicism can keep you from becoming a meal.
It's an evolutionary thing.
Very sad.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127130 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>
I believe that in the post I last replied to you made the distinction quite vehemently but perhaps it’s simple personality conflict and misunderstanding.
If we were sitting down, at the local pub, the conversation would have gone much better. We are both make assumptions and jumping to conclusions.

“The eye has it...”

Since: May 09

Russell's Teapot

#127131 Oct 2, 2012
Hidingfromyou wrote:
Thank you for this, Scar. Insightful!
I'd replace your use of "mind" with "brain."
Yeah, I slip between the two terms and I in all instances, I mean that gray organ encased in or skull. With whatever peripheral body components supporting that, too.

lolerbat...=>I understand where you're coming from though.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
Our conscious selves are products of evolution, selected to feel as if they were separate from the body, while remaining intimately tied to it, except under unusual circumstances.
I agree, the "overseer" view works pretty good. Separation from pure instinct that doesn't need the consciousness so much, and the consciousness that allows us to plan for future events, enjoy a sunset, or appreciate the sound of cicada in the distance.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
I see human spirituality as a brain state. It increases the depth and wisdom of our understanding of the world around us, and our bodies, by being otherworldly, not mundane. That doesn't mean that it exists in a separate, non-physical domain, though.
Yeah. Agreed.
Hidingfromyou wrote:
I believe your drug experiences highlight the brain state of mind. There's nothing wrong with that, it doesn't diminish us one bit. Entirely human, it cannot be ridiculed or made less of - thank you.
It's pretty cool to be completely shut off from the stimulus of your surroundings, and see that the brain does an impressive job in maintaining that anchor. I have to think that came about by evolutionary process too.

Just imagine, you undergo a massive trauma 100,000 - 50,000 years ago. You're out cold. The last thing you recall is slipping and falling down a cliff. Before that, you and a friend had been attacked by a tiger, you saw that friend torn to pieces and devoured. While you're out - do you relive that fall and your friends horrific death over and over till someone finds you and brings you back to health or you regain consciousness?

Just off hand I could imagine if you did relive it over and over, you might awake to insanity. Or, while unconscious, you might thrash violently as it played over and over(alerting a predator to your location?). Or that could worsen an already severe injury.

None of those scenarios creates a "positive survival advantage".

That's all speculation, but people have often proposed *why* would the brain evolve such a response mechanism/*happy place* when seriously injured or close to death. I think it's a response to injury and has little to do with impending death, IMO.

It could be due to attrition of the ones whose brain didn't have the capability to shut down the peripherals and *play a movie*, while you are in danger and defenseless, while the trait of being able to do so, was passed on and eventually gained dominance. I dunno.

Again, it's just speculation. When people ask why that would occur in humans *BY SO CALLED EVOLUTIONARY PROCESSES!", I don't see it as an unreasonable process or hypothesis, if you get me.

Those intricacies of the brain may never be fully explained as to why that happens. But I think it might, some day.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127132 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>And I believe that you did not, you wording was along the lines of “I am just an average Joe”, I did go back to find it hence my comment but perhaps it’s simple personality conflict and misunderstanding.
I believe that I said something along the lines of, "The average Joe, whether, christian, muslim, or Atheist, only wants to get through life, as comfortably and easy as possible; giving their children more and better opportunities than they had."

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127133 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>Wow I nearly laughed then, exactly but you really do not realise what you have just written do you?
Why the deletions? Not willing to offer an argument?
Sorry, but I have no clue what you are talking about here.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127134 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>Yet are you not one who claimed the filmmaker was not responsible for his actions and hence this discussion/disagreement? Or have I been wasting my time?
What laws did he break?

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127135 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
Nor do I honour the christian god (the same god by the way), certainly the “many” Muslims I know have no problem with that,
I know that they are the same god; I am not a christian!
ChristineM wrote:
I cannot say the same about christians who have repeatedly hurt me since the age of four.
Since we are not sitting in a pub, I will tell you; you sound a bit of a bigot here. Maybe with some justification, but still! I am sure that not every christian hurt you, nor has everyone, who ever hurt you, been christian.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#127136 Oct 2, 2012
ChristineM wrote:
<quoted text>No you have not seen any such thing. You may have read it in the your local supermarket hate sheets.
Another one of my faults. I just cannot resist sending your own words back to you.

"Honey you have no idea how I act and you guesswork is nothing more than guesswork. You let yourself down by making such statements."

I am not 100% certain, but I believe it was shown on BBC America. Again, if I am not mistaken, France had a few places, too.

I do my best to tell the truth, always; I like having credibility. Also, I have a terrible memory, so telling the truth makes my life easier. No, I do not expect, or even hope for, credibility on Topix; it is just the way I try to live, no matter where I am.

Since: Sep 08

Location hidden

#127137 Oct 2, 2012
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Moral_status_of_...

Concern for animals is based upon one thing. They have something like a soul. An intangible something that humans can relate to.

There is zero room for such a thing in evolutionary thinking. Animals are food. The limit on concern would be limited to maximizing the yield. There is just no place for concern for an animals feelings or right to life to exist from that viewpoint.

PETA could not exist without a supernatural or metaphysical belief behind it. Pretty much the same with vegetarianism. We don't have canine teeth to eat fruits and berries.

Those atheists that claim evolution as the sole reason for our existence can not care for an animal except as a possession to fill some need in them. There is no moral reason within their view to justify caring for the emotional and physical nature of creatures other than themselves and what they possess.

They are the scum of the earth. They would shoot Bambi just for the purpose of sneering at a theist and saying "Have your Jesus resurrect it. ha ha ha". Just to show how clever they are. ha ha ha

They have no soul.

Stamp out mass produced atheists. Oh, that is done already. I mean stop the stamping out of them.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#127138 Oct 2, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
"Before the encounter between the two forces, Mustafa Kemal told his troops:
I don’t order you to fight, I order you to die. In the time it takes us to die, other troops and commanders can come and take our places.[3]
—Mustafa Kemal"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_career_...
This man is worshiped in Turkey.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mustafa_Kemal_At...
He wasn't what you would call a fan of religions, yet his life and dedication to ideals kind of created one.
It isn't easy ordering your people to die for the greater needs of the group.
You are one of 7 billion. You will submit your life to a god or a man. Take your choice.
30,000+ gods to select from, 32,000 christian sects, 4 billion Hindi gods but of course only "Dave Nelson" is right.

I will ask you the same questions I have asked of other godbots and have never had a reply:-

1. How did you pick the god you follow?
2. How much research did you do?

No ducking just answer these two simple questions.

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#127139 Oct 2, 2012
Dave Nelson wrote:
"Before the encounter between the two forces, Mustafa Kemal told his troops:
I don’t order you to fight, I order you to die. In the time it takes us to die, other troops and commanders can come and take our places.[3]
—Mustafa Kemal"
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Military_career_...
This man is worshiped in Turkey.
http://en.wikiquote.org/wiki/Mustafa_Kemal_At...
He wasn't what you would call a fan of religions, yet his life and dedication to ideals kind of created one.
It isn't easy ordering your people to die for the greater needs of the group.
You are one of 7 billion. You will submit your life to a god or a man. Take your choice.
I will not ask you to die for me, I may tell you only the willing to die for us are worthy and. Gentlemen I intend to go in harms way , those not willing best leave now.

“Formerly "Richard"”

Since: Mar 12

In the beginning e=mc^2

#127140 Oct 2, 2012
Eagle12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone is a sinner, past, present or future. All fall into two of the three categories.
Speak for yourself.

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