Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 258484 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

Thinking

Poole, UK

#231513 Jun 30, 2014
Neither has your god myth.

But it's killed plenty.
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Atheism my friend has never stopped anyone from dying and it never will.
Thinking

Poole, UK

#231514 Jun 30, 2014
Morality predates your religion.
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
I would actually argue that it is the principals of Christianity that has made the western world excel the way that it has.
The fact is that Christianity was a strong influence for abolitionism, women's suffrage, and civil rights. That's just here in the US. I think you should wonder what fairness would look like without Christianity.
Thinking

Poole, UK

#231515 Jun 30, 2014
Your beliefs don't stack up.

Your god should just stop childhood leukaemia now, and worry about whether I bow and scrape to it later.
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why should God answer the prayer of one who in his whole life never bothered to acknowledge him or even spend 5 minutes in prayer?
Then when a life threatening illness comes to your child you expect God to be a genie in a bottle and grant you your wish because you demand it.
If God had delivered the child from leukemia would you have given him the credit? Or would you have continued living you life as before without acknowledging God in your everyday life?
It’s always so tragic when a child dies by any means. We take the life of a child for granted. We assume they’ll out live us and never die. But children do die my friend and are not immune from dying.
I’ve never suffered the loss of a child. I can’t image the anguish and pain from such a loss. But this I know, the bible says, Matthew 19:14,
“But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”
For in heaven my friend are many children running and playing from generations gone by. Because they left this life and are living in a place of eternal joy doesn’t mean God is not God or able to do anything.
Death comes to us all my friend and it is a fact of life. All things that live must die and it's been that way since Adam & Eve.
Thinking

Poole, UK

#231516 Jun 30, 2014
Great documentary on the Evolutionary reasons for altruism, complete with crap BBC Micro Model B graphics.

Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree, they aren't Christian only, but I am in the industry and have found that a majority of them are. I have also found that a majority of volunteers, employees, even administration are. When it comes to funding as well, I predict that you would see a drastic decline in the money coming in for a lot of humanitarian efforts. A lot of people are putting a lot of money in a lot of baskets every week for no other reason than because they are trusting God with their assets.(Or, if they're inconsistent to not feel guilty.)
There is also the whole question of why should I help the less fortunate. I think we can all agree that we are under no obligation to. We can have the humanist argument that we are wired to, which will work until it doesn't feel good anymore. Or the socialist argument that we should because it would be unfair not to, which will work until we get resentful.
I found a few articles on atheism and charitable donations, all trying to spin it one way or another. The numbers remain the same though, atheists give less.
Lab28

Anaheim, CA

#231517 Jun 30, 2014
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Moron.. We help out our friends and fellowman, because we are able, they need help and because it's the right thing to do. Not because anything else, and mind you if able I would not turn away even those who would cause your feeble mind to terminate itself , at the mere sight of those who need it.
Now, now, there is no need to resort to name calling.
Lab28

Anaheim, CA

#231518 Jun 30, 2014
Thinking wrote:
Morality predates your religion.
<quoted text>
Actually, I would argue that morality is a product of my religion. That wasn't really my point, but yeah, sure, okay let's talk about morality.

On what authority do we even set values? We in the western world see injustice for what it truly is. For instance we look at the rights of women in some middle eastern countries and hopefully you look at that and say, that is not just. But in those countries, it is totally okay. To them that is what is morally right... Even when you know in your heart that it is not. It's a moral relativism that occurs when people adopt their ideas of right and wrong based on the culture around them.

So, what's the point? Yeah we've had morals forever, but what are they based on? Many cultures have established a system of morals that we know is abhorrent. But on what authority can we even establish that. Especially if we are the product of random.

[I actually posted this a few days ago. The last time you said morality predates my religion]

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#231519 Jun 30, 2014
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, I would argue that morality is a product of my religion. That wasn't really my point, but yeah, sure, okay let's talk about morality.
On what authority do we even set values? We in the western world see injustice for what it truly is. For instance we look at the rights of women in some middle eastern countries and hopefully you look at that and say, that is not just. But in those countries, it is totally okay. To them that is what is morally right... Even when you know in your heart that it is not. It's a moral relativism that occurs when people adopt their ideas of right and wrong based on the culture around them.
So, what's the point? Yeah we've had morals forever, but what are they based on? Many cultures have established a system of morals that we know is abhorrent. But on what authority can we even establish that. Especially if we are the product of random.
[I actually posted this a few days ago. The last time you said morality predates my religion]
Morality dies not mean equality when religion is concerned.
Lab28

Anaheim, CA

#231520 Jun 30, 2014
Thinking wrote:
Great documentary on the Evolutionary reasons for altruism, complete with crap BBC Micro Model B graphics.
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =I71mjZefg8gXX
<quoted text>
That's like forty five minutes long, bro. What are we trying to establish? That we were designed to be altruistic and cooperative? I agree.
ChristINSANITY is EVIL

Windsor, Canada

#231521 Jun 30, 2014
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Atheism my friend has never stopped anyone from dying and it never will.
Actualy it did,,It never told anyone to kill in its name!

Religion flies planes into buildings,,

Science flies us to the stars
Lab28

Anaheim, CA

#231522 Jun 30, 2014
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text> Morality dies not mean equality when religion is concerned.
"a renewal in which there is no distinction between Greek and Jew, circumcised and uncircumcised, barbarian, Scythian, slave and freeman, but Christ is all, and in all." -Colossians 3:11

"God created man in His own image, in the image of God He created him; male and female He created them. " -Genesis 1:26

"For the grace of God has appeared, bringing salvation to all men," -Titus 2:11

It really isn't right that some people will discriminate while proclaiming themselves Christian. It's actually inconsistent with the message from the bible. But people will continue to be people.

But I'm not entirely sure to what you're referring. If you're talking about what I think you're talking about it's somewhat of a complicated situation that generally ends up in everyone being frustrated if you look at what scripture says about it. But I think it's foolish to argue moral doctrine to the unsaved. If I tell someone they ought to be married before having sex, they're going to look at me as though I'm living in the nineteenth century. Best to have a full understanding of grace before even attempting to contemplate specific moral doctrines.
ChristINSANITY is EVIL

Windsor, Canada

#231523 Jun 30, 2014
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>

I found a few articles on atheism and charitable donations, all trying to spin it one way or another. The numbers remain the same though, atheists give less.
Actualy atheists give way more then xians considering how few atheists there is,,

Google atheist charities..

Btw why do you xians expect anyone to give you anything,why don't you get of your lazy azz and go work?
I feed me and my family why should I feed yours?

Proud people would never accept a handout or even a tip,.

http://youtu.be/f8mNkkqXETo
Lab28

Anaheim, CA

#231525 Jun 30, 2014
ChristINSANITY is EVIL wrote:
<quoted text>
Actualy atheists give way more then xians considering how few atheists there is,,
Google atheist charities..
Btw why do you xians expect anyone to give you anything,why don't you get of your lazy azz and go work?
I feed me and my family why should I feed yours?
Proud people would never accept a handout or even a tip,.
http://youtu.be/f8mNkkqXETo
It is getting more and more clear that it is time for me to go.

“The Bible is no science book”

Since: Jan 08

Location hidden

#231526 Jun 30, 2014
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
I agree, they aren't Christian only, but I am in the industry and have found that a majority of them are. I have also found that a majority of volunteers, employees, even administration are. When it comes to funding as well, I predict that you would see a drastic decline in the money coming in for a lot of humanitarian efforts. A lot of people are putting a lot of money in a lot of baskets every week for no other reason than because they are trusting God with their assets.(Or, if they're inconsistent to not feel guilty.)
There is also the whole question of why should I help the less fortunate. I think we can all agree that we are under no obligation to. We can have the humanist argument that we are wired to, which will work until it doesn't feel good anymore. Or the socialist argument that we should because it would be unfair not to, which will work until we get resentful.
I found a few articles on atheism and charitable donations, all trying to spin it one way or another. The numbers remain the same though, atheists give less.
There are fewer of us. Look at it this way, if none were Christian the ones that gave as a Christian would still have the same feelings for their fellow man and donate anyway and help feed and serve the less fortunate.

I don't know anything about trusting god with your assets. Are people donating money just to god? I didn't think he needed any of our earthly wealth. I did see where one preacher was taking peoples money they thought was being invested and he spent it on himself. The trouble is, there are too many people who speak for god that don't have a conscious and just take the flock for a ride.

The money given to the church is spent on the church, the preacher, and a million other projects, and very little go to the less fortunate.

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231527 Jun 30, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
This pretty much discounts all your claims. Again.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/berdache
By the way, I read the accounts from a gay site.
Smile.
Reading comprehension is far from you, hey. Here, from your own site, above. Exactly what I have been telling you:

" Due to the derogatory implications implicit in the etymology of berdache, contemporary Native Americans have suggested that its scholarly use be discontinued. Among the alternatives in current use, the most widely employed is two-spirit. Other scholars use specific native terms, such as winkte (from Lakota) or nadle (from Navajo), or else use a literal translation, such as "man-woman," of a native word."

It's the multisyllabic word "etymology" that's throwing you off. You mistakenly thought that meant Native Americans were anti-two spirit people. Rather, they're against the word b/c the word itself is insulting - like calling a white person a cracker or a Japanese person "nip," etc.

You should just listen to younger, smarter, wiser and better looking Hiding because, let's face it, you know nothin' John Snow.

:)

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231528 Jun 30, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
This pretty much discounts all your claims. Again.
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/berdache
By the way, I read the accounts from a gay site.
Smile.
Here, this will help educate you:

http://bermudaradical.wordpress.com/2010/03/2...

It's pretty complex, though. I'm worried that, with your limited reading comprehension, you're not going to understand the nuances the author is trying to impart. Prove me wrong though and learn something about the world that is entirely different than your subjective religious reality.

Good luck!

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231529 Jun 30, 2014
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
1. Someone else asked the age old question : "If Hitler accepted Christ he would go to heaven?"
2. See 1.
3. I am saying it would be inconsistent for anybody to accept the gift of the holy spirit and then immediately destroy the temple for it (their body)
4. No
5. N/A
If I ran around deciding I knew who was in hell based on my knowing who God lets in and who he doesn't, it would really, really make me out to be a liar at the funerals of people I know aren't saved. No more on the salvation of dead people.
I think you should read Kurt Vonnegut's discussions of heaven. He was an atheist, but he had a very nice understanding of how heaven could only work. Whenever someone passed away, he would say "I am sure they are up in Heaven now."

So, when Vonnegut interviews Hitler, Hitler is in Heaven. There's a complex philosophical argument for why that is the only possible outcome of a benevolent deity - a very similar argument to the one put forth by Catcher about institutional torture and why it is entirely unacceptable.

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231530 Jun 30, 2014
Lab28 wrote:
<quoted text>
Okay, let's pretend for a second that I am wrong. That I am simply sending up prayers to someone who doesn't exist, and that I have been reading about stories that didn't happen.
Let's say I spend day after day remaining focused on God, praying for His presence in my life, and that I am giving credit to any possible good I can muster to an imaginary entity. Let's say I am giving freely to others because grace was freely given to me but there is no grace because there was no Christ. I am putting the needs of others before my own pointlessly, and I am trying to remain humble and obedient when there isn't anything to be humble for or obedient to.
What will I lose for it? I sure will be disappointed when I die I guess, but my faith has brought me a lot of joy and purpose to my life. I have also seen others turn to Christ and have seen them really change for the better. But if there is no God and no Christ, what do we miss out on? Because we gave up on selfishly sucking every pleasure we possibly could out of life? Because we stopped looking for fulfillment and purpose in things that were destined to fail us?
I guess the joke will sure be on us.
Well, it's real for you. However much I cannot imagine a reality that includes deities, your personal reality is one.

You and I live in different subjective realities. I have no doubt that, for you, when you are walking through a forest, you experience a Created world, where each of the wonders you behold is only in existence because of your deity's actions.

You won't be disappointed when you pass away if my subjective reality mirrors whatever the objective reality is - you'll just cease. But you'll have lived and died as a believer, and interacted with all your friends and family as a believer - and I suspect that's important and deeply meaningful for you.

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231531 Jun 30, 2014
waaasssuuup wrote:
<quoted text>
hahaha....no problemos!
oh you'll be quoted alright:
"each person will give an account for their every idle word spoken" - Jesus (my paraphrase)
All of us are heading toward an end, it's true.

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231532 Jun 30, 2014
Thinking wrote:
Why would I kill a child? I'm not even slightly religious.
<quoted text>
hahaha!

“A sentient umbrella speaks”

Since: Mar 11

Some stable somewhere

#231533 Jun 30, 2014
Eagle 12 wrote:
<quoted text>
Why should God answer the prayer of one who in his whole life never bothered to acknowledge him or even spend 5 minutes in prayer?
Then when a life threatening illness comes to your child you expect God to be a genie in a bottle and grant you your wish because you demand it.
If God had delivered the child from leukemia would you have given him the credit? Or would you have continued living you life as before without acknowledging God in your everyday life?
It’s always so tragic when a child dies by any means. We take the life of a child for granted. We assume they’ll out live us and never die. But children do die my friend and are not immune from dying.
I’ve never suffered the loss of a child. I can’t image the anguish and pain from such a loss. But this I know, the bible says, Matthew 19:14,
“But Jesus said, Suffer little children, and forbid them not, to come unto me: for of such is the kingdom of heaven.”
For in heaven my friend are many children running and playing from generations gone by. Because they left this life and are living in a place of eternal joy doesn’t mean God is not God or able to do anything.
Death comes to us all my friend and it is a fact of life. All things that live must die and it's been that way since Adam & Eve.
Hi Eagle!

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