Atheism requires as much faith as rel...

Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

There are 255496 comments on the Webbunny tumblelog story from Jul 18, 2009, titled Atheism requires as much faith as religion?. In it, Webbunny tumblelog reports that:

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Webbunny tumblelog.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213668 Feb 21, 2014
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
We reject them, because they have demonstrated a basic dishonest, and a very loose use of half-facts, partial truths and outright lies. This is because their **agenda** is not facts or even reality. Their **agenda** is to push their hideous religion onto the world-- whatever it takes. THAT is why they are rejected.
Here's a nice video I just watched examining and relating concepts like truth, absolute truth, reality, and ways of knowing. that relates not just to your comment above, but to the ones from lightbeamrider and Riverside Redneck about accuracy and the stuff from mtimber on absolute truths and absolute morals.



It's the second in a series - not the series called The Psychology of Belief from AntiCitizenX that you and I discussed yesterday on another thread, which links I can repost for those interested

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[2] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[3] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[4] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[5] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[6] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[7] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[8] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[9] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[10] http://www.youtube.com/watch...

The series this was second in is this one called Responding to Objections, also from AntiCitizenX

[1] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[2] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[3] http://www.youtube.com/watch...
[4] http://www.youtube.com/watch...

There's a lot of good on the Internet for those interested and able to invest the time - material that is of value when disputing apologists, and when considering philosophical issues such as the nature of truth and the limits of knowledge.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213669 Feb 21, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
Just came across this...
According to the Bible, our modern (?) arithmetic is all wrong. Ezra 1:7-11 says that...
30 + 1000 + 29 + 30 + 410 + 1000 = 5469.
Gosh. How could we be so wrong?
I've recently been apprised by some local philosophers that accuracy doesn't depend on the source, that either a proposition is accurate or it is not independent of the reader, which I think was meant to imply that I should trust material from Christian sources like that one.

Let me just ask you this: Might that arithmetic not be true on a flat earth visited by the Alien on a domesticated camel in the biblical Levant? After all, all things are possible to God, who is mysterious, and whose ways are beyond the ken of puny humans.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213670 Feb 21, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
If you had two working brain cells, you would realize that what IANS said was that he would not accept what an apologetics site says without confirmation from secular, independent sources.
That is correct, and thanks.

I added that if posters like lightbeamrider wanted seasoned skeptics to read their links, they should be to those respected secular sites, as it was overly optimisitic to think that we would be interested enough in theists' claims to visit their apologetics sites and chase down that independent confirmation ourselves.

I see a link to Answers in Genesis, for example, and that's the end of my interest even before I click it, and my guess is that I'm not alone. I've wasted enough time in the past on such resources to be willing to give them more.

The believers posting might not like that, but as I said, reputation and past experiences matter, and the apologetics sites have already expended all of their credibility..

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213671 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Why are you being intellectually dishonest?
< click >

End of discussion.

You should probably think about the liberties you take with others. Yes, I know that you are at war with most of the thread, but not me. I was not part of that. And I don't want to return to that.

But I also will not tolerate being called a liar by you. I am always honest, even when I am mistaken. Please do not project your loathsome Christian values onto me.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213672 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
You TOTALLY chopped up some posts there, buddy boy. More intellectual dishonesty? tsk,tsk,tsk mr freethinker
Again?

Yeah, I'm a freethinker, and you're Christian. And I'm a better person than you because of it.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213673 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
The real God or the Topix Atheist! nonexistent but always complained about god?
I don't anything about any real gods, but I do know that the god of the Christian bible is a hoax. making your religion a fraud. Shall I call you a liar for claiming otherwise?

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#213674 Feb 21, 2014
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>

Accepting claims on faith makes one a fool.
Adopting broad generalizations makes one wrong.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213675 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
You're the one ranting and raving about the decline of religion in America. Note that the further down religion goes, the higher immorality and evil go.
No, I don't note that. I note the opposite. It's the Christians that are most immoral. Look at the god you worship. Look at the Christian standard for moral truth. Look at your own behavior in your life and on this thread.

You are likely referring to the immorality in government. That correlated with the rise of evangelical Christianity in Congress during the same time period in which religiosity was decreasing in the general population. The government is more immoral than ever, as are the captains of industry that it caters to, but not the people.

As the number under the influence of your church continues to diminish and are replaced with people embodying humanist principles, moral behavior among typical citizens will increase. That's always been true.

And as long as Americans keep electing religious zealots, the American government will continue to decay.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
That baby wouldn't have AIDS if the mom wasn't a slut. That wife wouldn't have AIDS if her husband wasn't cheating trash. What was immoral about what I wrote?
I rest my case.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213676 Feb 21, 2014
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Nonsense. Religion isn't involved at all. The church and preacher are decorations like the cake, and just as optional.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
On my wedding, religion was involved.
I thought that you were talking about marriage, not its celebration. I don't care about your wedding, or your wedding cake, or your wedding ring. Your religion had nothing to do with your marriage. Nothing.

Some people celebrate their divorces as well. Those are also two separate things, and the celebration part just as optional.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213677 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Do you know that to denigrate is to criticize unfairly? Why do you need to be unfair about it? How's that moral?
That is one definition of the word, but not the one I had in mind. Try this
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/denigrate

There is nothing about unfairness on that page.

My denigration of Christianity is fair. It is based on the evidence of its fruit, some of which is you.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213678 Feb 21, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
RR said that AIDS was God's punishment for immorality and deviance.
RiversideRedneck wrote:
Actually, he didn't. What RR said was: "AIDS is not a medical mystery. It's God's wrath on the sexual deviant and immoral. There is only one cure for it; be sexually moral. You'll never even worry about contracting it or any other STD." I didn't say punishment.
I feel a word jumble a-comin'

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213679 Feb 21, 2014
Six_Of_One wrote:
No, but someone else asked me something along those lines. But, no connection. I like the balance and measured view in the saying "six of one, half dozen of the other". Hence, the name. Pleasure to meet you ;-)
Nice to meet you as well, Six. We have a lot of fun here and learn some things, too. I hope you´ll find it to your liking.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213680 Feb 21, 2014
Six_Of_One wrote:
So babies with AIDS weren't being sexually moral? Really? Besides sounding insane, you sound quite cold. I imagine you have zero sense of compassion. It wouldn't syrprise me if you also believed that every victim in the world is really to blame for their own victimization.
He learned these values from his church, which calls this love. Several of the Christians posting on these threads post just like him.

He and they like to tell us what their bible and Jesus teach, but we can see what his church teaches and what he has learned, which is what matters.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#213681 Feb 21, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
I have great compassion for people that have AIDS not through their own choices, like babies born with it or medical mishaps .. I don't consider someone contracting AIDS because of sexual immorality to be a victim. it.
Your compassion ends where submission to your faith based values does.

We really don't need your religion in the world. We really don't need people to be taught like you were.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213682 Feb 21, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
The Big Bang is a myth ("Let there be light" isn't in the first verse idiot)?
Life didn't begin genderless from the earth?
And once again... put up or shut up.
<quoted text>
I noted two significant prophesies that you clearly see today. I also noted three significant creation facts.
You assert that the Bible is 'completely' worthless fiction. I proved you wrong.
SMile.
<quoted text>
I see you conceded the issue about Creation.
I think a whole culture that has maintained it's identity for over 3000 years and an world-wide Church are pretty clearly seen. LOL.
Smile.
blacklagoon wrote:
<quoted text>I asked you to show me the prophesies that can be "clearly seen" today, so far nothng.
I would also enjoy seeing your three significant creation "facts." Understand that a FACT is something supported by evidence and not just because a ancient book says so.
So lets see your prophecies and your creation facts, I can't wait to see these.
Honey, if you can't see all the Churches in YOUR community or the Synagogue, no one can help you.

The Big Bang, origins of life and genderless life forms are all supported by scientific evidence.

Smile.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213683 Feb 21, 2014
KiMare wrote:
<quoted text>
Sure you did and sure Newton's law does.
There is a direct connection between an action and a reaction. YOU even mocked what I meant when I misstated it.
For instance; Your hate and bigotry is making you obtuse...
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>
You don't know much about Newton's Law, do you. It is talking about forces in physics, that if A places a force on B, then B places an equal force on A. Nothing more.
As usual, you don't have a clue what you are talking about.
No hate. No bigotry. No mocking. Correcting a misconception is not mocking. Disagreement is not hatred nor bigotry.
And you are one serious hypocrite, with all your SMiles and SMirks to talk about hatred in others.
As usual, projection.
You prove my point. Your bigotry is making you stupid.

Newton's Law asserts that any force exercised causes something. That same principle is the basis of our debate here, or the basis of every belief system including religions.

SMile.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213684 Feb 21, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>
BTW...you never did address the points I made about your failed attempt at equating "let there be light" to the Big Bang.
Guess you couldn't.
Sure I did.

Genesis 1:1 is the Big Bang.

Genesis 1:3 is the first step of order God brought to the universe.

Two distinct acts.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213685 Feb 21, 2014
KiMare wrote:
The Big Bang is a myth ("Let there be light" isn't in the first verse idiot)?
Life didn't begin genderless from the earth?
And once again... put up or shut up. I noted two significant prophesies that you clearly see today. I also noted three significant creation facts.
You assert that the Bible is 'completely' worthless fiction. I proved you wrong.
SMile.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You proved yourself wrong. Those words are worthless. You don't seem to know what worthless means. How are any of the words you cited of any value to anybody?
If I gave you directions to a location you wanted to get to, those words would be of value to you. They would make your life a little better or a little easier.
If I gave you a recipe to a meal that you could make and enjoy, those words would be of value to you.
If I wrote a users manual to a device that made it possible for you to use it to your advantage, those would also be valuable words.
If I wrote a good screenplay that became a movie that you enjoyed, that would be of value.
But the dreck you listed above is worthless, like the fortune in a Chinese cookie. Neither can be used to any advantage, the definition of useless, a synonym of worthless.
You've based your life on the words from that book. I've asked you several times what value you think they have been to you in terms of your intellect, personality and character. You refuse to answer, which is probably your best option, but your inability to point to any benefits tends to confirm the belief that the book and its contents have been of no value to you, unless you consider the sloppy comfort of superstition valuable despite the costs.
1. NOTHING you said addresses the points I made. I noted three incredible facts just affirmed by science, and two prophecies that YOU witness today. Those undermine the assertion that the Bible is worthless, and you have no rational response!
2. But even more idiotic, you deny the fact that millions of people across this country take time every week to gather and use the Bible to motivate good, benevolent behavior.
This is serious denial, you really need to get some help! Do you understand that your hateful bigotry is making you blind?

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213686 Feb 21, 2014
KiMare wrote:
Every act solicits a like reward.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You're the guy who said that I didn't know what motivates you to do the things you call charitable. I know that you believe that you are watched and will be judged for what you do. You have just posted your the quid pro quo understanding of it, which others realize is inescapable under such the circumstances. There is no mystery there - nothing hidden.
You can never know the sublime pleasure of doing good for goodness sake, unseen by anybody but yourself, and with no hope of praise or reward. It's a godlike feeling. You look for the divine in the air. I look for it in myself and others.
There goes that severe denial again...

I'm the one that states the principle that behavior solicits it's own reward, and you make the idiotic claim that I don't believe it.

I accurately note that you don't know my belief system, yet you are determined to assign one to me and then falsely/ignorantly judge it's tenants.

You agree that good behavior sows it's own reward, but reject that when I so act, I will never reap the benefit.

Your responses are mind-boggling foolish. Seriously, you are making atheists look bad!

Smirk.

“KiMare'a the Monster Mutation”

Since: Nov 10

Location hidden

#213687 Feb 21, 2014
KiMare wrote:
if you can't explain how the Bible beat science by 3,000 years with three significant aspects of creation, just admit it! You already look like a fool claiming that Proverbs 8 is meaningless poetry. A room full of scientists would not agree with you, trust me.
Smirk.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
You're entertaining the thread's unbelievers with your faith based idols, which is also why no rational skeptic would trust you.
Um, that is not a rational response, it is troll behavior. I thought you didn't practice that...

Smile.

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