Atheism requires as much faith as religion?

Atheism requires as much faith as religion? bearvspuma : The only problem with this rationalization is that ita s assuming all athiests are so because theya re intelligent in the ways of science and reasoning and all people that believe in a form of god are unintelligent. Full Story

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209748 Feb 1, 2014
Tide with Beach wrote:
Why not? Do you not believe that you believe in the same deity that Jews do?

Who is this "God" you speak of, if not YHWH?
God and Yahweh are the same being.

It's just "god" in different languages.

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#209749 Feb 1, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>What I have tried to make clear, and you fail completely to grasp, is that not everyone thinks the same way. For me, molestation is wrong. There are others that think differently. Ergo, "don't molest" is not a moral absolute.

You keep talking on this one point. However, your position is that EVERY moral point is an absolute. You have failed completely to prove that point. All you have done is assert it without evidence.

You are still working under the fallacy that one example proves all examples. This is not the case.

Is lying wrong? Most of the time. Can you not conceive of a situation where lying is justified? Do you have no imagination whatsoever?
Okay, now we have it.

In an atheistic universe you cannot appeal to transcendent moral standards so you have to allow others the moral "right" to molest children.

As an atheist you have to accept that child molestation is not absolutely morally wrong, and you would rather do this than allow that there are absolute moral standards which God has revealed to humanity.

You would permit child molestation as an acceptable morality rather than accept God as Creator.

I think it is plain for everyone to see, the morality that atheism supplies...

Child molestation or God?

You chose child molestation...

And you think your atheistic morality is one to crow about?

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#209750 Feb 1, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Curious that you'd capitalize Jesus but not God....
Anyway, the proof is not available from a stranger on an Internet argue site, or any person for that matter.
It's available from God.
Jesus is the proper name of a man who more than likely existed. God is a generic category.

Glad to help.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209751 Feb 1, 2014
Tide with Beach wrote:
<quoted text>
Necessity provides no means of invention, but the scientific method does.
Observation: Rock cut Ogg foot. Ogg walk on many rocks. Ogg only cut foot once.
Hypothesis: Only sharp rock will cut Ogg foot.
Prediction: Ogg find sharp rock, use it to cut other things.
Experiment: Ogg find many rocks. Round rocks no cut. Only sharp rock cut. Edge must be thin to cut easily.
Conclusion: Ogg can collect sharp rocks and use to cut things.
Why are you assuming that Ogg cut his foot on a rock?

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209752 Feb 1, 2014
Aerobatty wrote:
I am under no illusion that you will ever take any word that does not agree with your fantasy.
Quitter.

Of you're not willing to back up your statements, perhaps you shouldn't make them.

“Turning coffee into theorems”

Since: Dec 06

Trapped inside a Klein Bottle

#209753 Feb 1, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
You confuse the figure of forced sacrifice with self-sacrifice.
Your analogy has no strength.
I don't recall in the story Abraham sacrificing himself, or being asked to sacrifice himself..

There is also the story of Jephthah in Judges 11:29-40. God required Jephthah to sacrifice his daughter, and Jephthah did it.

And you probably find this a morally uplifting story as well.

Jeez.

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#209754 Feb 1, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
You asked for 5, I pointed you to 10.
I am not sure why you would consider that a failure?
If you want to be pedantic, take the first 5 commandments.
Its obvious that you're deliberately avoiding the questions being asked of you (questions - plural) but I will keep pointing this out so that others will see.

Again:

Define what you mean by "absolute moral standards".

Explain why you feel "absolute moral standards" are necessary.

Give 5 examples of these "absolute moral standards".

Explain why only Christianity can account for these alleged "absolute moral standards."

Still waiting….

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209755 Feb 1, 2014
Aerobatty wrote:
It wasn't always a desert.
Ya, it was like molten lava or something like 40 gillion years ago.....

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#209756 Feb 1, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>My Gawd, just how stupid are you?

What part of "don't harm others" do you not get. Apparently the whole concept.
You have already admitted that child molestation is not absolutely morally wrong.

Now you are saying harm is absolutely morally wrong!

You sound very confused...

I look forward to you explaining this contradiction.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209757 Feb 1, 2014
Aerobatty wrote:
Your imaginary one.
I have no imaginary god, so....

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#209758 Feb 1, 2014
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>What god?

You're at war with reality.

And you're losing.

Miserably.
Do you have an actual argument to make?

“Turning coffee into theorems”

Since: Dec 06

Trapped inside a Klein Bottle

#209759 Feb 1, 2014
RiversideRedneck wrote:
<quoted text>
Ya sure, your hormone level can be measured.
Emotions aren't hormones, though.
You said so yourself.
Prove that they aren't. Every indication is that they actually are, or at least they are tied so closely together as to be indistinguishable.
EXPERT

Redding, CA

#209760 Feb 1, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>Clearly you don't understand the difference between "absolute for everyone" and "absolute for me". Until you can grasp the difference this conversation is useless.

Religion has damaged your brain.
Oh I love this one,

What's true for you isn't true for me...

Well, here is my challenge, if I stand in front of a train going 120mph and get hit, I will be dead.

Now if you don't believe the same will happen to you, then by all means...

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#209761 Feb 1, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you believe it is absolutely morally wrong to lie?
As an atheist you cannot claim that position.
Therefore your testimony is refuted on that alone.
Also, God has made it clear that you do know and He cannot lie.
So I reject your claim on both grounds.
1. You cannot be trusted to tell the truth.
2. God can be trusted.
No, I do not believe it is absolutely morally wrong to lie. No one does.

Everyone can provide examples of when they have lied for any number of very good reasons.

As for the rest of your post, simply repeating that "I know" god is real but I'm somehow denying it just makes you look kind of pathetic.

“Turning coffee into theorems”

Since: Dec 06

Trapped inside a Klein Bottle

#209762 Feb 1, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
Implied in this is anyone who isn't an atheist is not human.
If I do not agree with you I am subhuman.
If I present a different perspective than yours I am subhuman.
This is just a veiled version of ad hominem trying to reduce the other person by attacking their character so that your argument can stand.
Or rather that your lack of an argument can be hidden.
Do you have anything other than ad hominem to present?
Might I ask you to stop being so intellectually lazy?
My Gawd, you really are dumber than a box of rocks.

He was talking about YOU, and only you.

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#209763 Feb 1, 2014
mtimber wrote:
<quoted text>
You are claiming victory without producing an argument to support your claim.
Again I ask you to provide an argument.
If absolute morality does not exist, why do you appeal to absolute moral positions?
I have not made any claim because you refuse to define the topic of discussion (well, you don't really understand the topic of discussion…even though you started it).

Again:

Define what you mean by "absolute moral standards".

Explain why you feel "absolute moral standards" are necessary.

Explain why only Christianity can account for these alleged "absolute moral standards."

Since: Jan 13

Location hidden

#209764 Feb 1, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
<quoted text>So show me this absolute moral source? Where is he hiding?

If he is an absolute moral source, why did he change his mind between the Old Testament and the New Testament?
I have already identified Him, repeatedly.

But you need to first figure out whether absolute morality exists.

If your own epistemology is broken, you cannot critique another.

At this point the only thing you have been able to show from your worldview, is that child molestation is a valid moral choice for some people.

With such a degraded concept of morality, I am not sure you have the right intellectual tools for a deep discussion on the moral nature of God.

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#209765 Feb 1, 2014
Aerobatty wrote:
<quoted text>
What god?
You're at war with reality.
And you're losing.
Miserably.
Yes, but it is loads of fun watching mtimber flail about...

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209766 Feb 1, 2014
Just Think wrote:
Jesus is the proper name of a man who more than likely existed. God is a generic category.
Glad to help.
Jesus Christ existed.

Virtually all scholars of antiquity agree to that.

I'll take their word for it, not yours.

You're of no help.

“Ditat Deus”

Since: Jul 12

Location hidden

#209767 Feb 1, 2014
Darwins Stepchild wrote:
Prove that they aren't. Every indication is that they actually are, or at least they are tied so closely together as to be indistinguishable.
Emotion is a subjective, conscious experience that can be influenced by hormones like dopamine.

If they were the same thing, it couldn't influence itself..

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