Richard Dawkins - God is evil, pedoph...

Richard Dawkins - God is evil, pedophilesa not so bad

There are 3147 comments on the Examiner.com story from Sep 14, 2013, titled Richard Dawkins - God is evil, pedophilesa not so bad. In it, Examiner.com reports that:

"The God of the Qur'an is arguably the most unpleasant character in all fiction: jealous and proud of it; a petty, unjust, unforgiving control-freak; a vindictive, bloodthirsty ethnic cleanser; a misogynistic, homophobic, racist, infanticidal, genocidal, filicidal, pestilential, megalomaniacal, sadomasochistic, capriciously malevolent bully.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Examiner.com.

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2170 Feb 1, 2014
Thinking wrote:
In the UK, the age of consent and for marriage is 16. We see a lot of UK born Pakistani girls sent off to Pakistan in the school holidays to be married off against their will to some old filthy bastard. Their education ends. They sometimes get genitally mutilated at this age too. Poor things. We've recently changed the law to address yet another issue the muslim community can't or won't address itself.
https://www.gov.uk/forced-marriage
<quoted text>
that thing has got nothing to do with Islam, maybe that retarded thing is in the Pakistani culture,
The Islamic Marriage cannot be right and wouldn't be considered as valid without the girl Approval.
Mahmood

Keswick, Canada

#2171 Feb 1, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
that thing has got nothing to do with Islam, maybe that retarded thing is in the Pakistani culture,
The Islamic Marriage cannot be right and wouldn't be considered as valid without the girl Approval.
What is the miminum age for marriage for females in the Koran?

Where does it say in the Koran that a girl cannot be married without her consent?

Looking forward to your response and no hadiths please.

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2172 Feb 1, 2014
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
What is the miminum age for marriage for females in the Koran?
Where does it say in the Koran that a girl cannot be married without her consent?
Looking forward to your response and no hadiths please.
We understand from the Quran that a girl cannot be physically married until she is a woman,
As far as I know you may not find anything regarding the consent issue except in Sunnah and Hadiths.
Mahmood

Keswick, Canada

#2173 Feb 1, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
We understand from the Quran that a girl cannot be physically married until she is a woman,
As far as I know you may not find anything regarding the consent issue except in Sunnah and Hadiths.
So at what age does a child become a woman?

If I'm not mistaken, Mohammad in the Koran claims to have perfected the religion of Islam, in this case, why are you depending on hadiths?

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2174 Feb 1, 2014
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
So at what age does a child become a woman?
If I'm not mistaken, Mohammad in the Koran claims to have perfected the religion of Islam, in this case, why are you depending on hadiths?
when she reaches puberty, yes the saying you mentioned is actually a verse in the Quran and there is another verse which says

3:164 "Certainly did Allah confer [great] favor upon the believers when He sent among them a Messenger from themselves, reciting to them His verses and purifying them and teaching them the Book and wisdom, although they had been before in manifest error."

So Mohammed teaches us (his followers) the book and wisdom, Sunnah and Quran complete each other.

Mahmood

Keswick, Canada

#2176 Feb 2, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
when she reaches puberty, yes the saying you mentioned is actually a verse in the Quran and there is another verse which says
3:164 "Certainly did Allah confer [great] favor upon the believers when He sent among them a Messenger from themselves, reciting to them His verses and purifying them and teaching them the Book and wisdom, although they had been before in manifest error."
So Mohammed teaches us (his followers) the book and wisdom, Sunnah and Quran complete each other.
A girl can reach puberty at age 9, do you think its the right time to get her married?

In the Koran Mohmmad claimed that he had perfected the religion of Islam, if that is case, then why depend on hadiths?

5:03 "..........This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful".

My point is that Mohammad never perfected the religion of Islam.

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2177 Feb 2, 2014
Thinking wrote:
The islamist mantra of "If she's old enough to bleed, she's old enough to breed" will get you put on a sex offenders register in my society.
<quoted text>
its not only about girls, I don't see a problem for a boy to get married once he reached puberty as well, Why the hell not ??!

if you had the chance to get married at a very young age and of course you were financially capable , wouldn't you go for it ?

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2178 Feb 2, 2014
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
A girl can reach puberty at age 9, do you think its the right time to get her married?
of course if she wanted to, why not ??
as long as the one can know the difference between right and wrong; I Dont think its a problem to get married, if I had the chance to grow up with my wife I would be really glad.
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
In the Koran Mohmmad claimed that he had perfected the religion of Islam, if that is case, then why depend on hadiths?
5:03 "..........This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful".
My point is that Mohammad never perfected the religion of Islam.
I already gave you another verse which states that Mohammed should teach us his followers on how to apply the Quran and Islam through our lives.

there were lots of Sects appeared through history and claimed that the Quran itself may be enough to understand Islam they were called (Al Quraniyoon) or Ahl al-Qur&#702;&#257;n.

if you believe in Quran I can prove to you that Allah order us to follow Sunnah in numerous verses such as
59:7"...And whatever the Messenger has given you - take; and what he has forbidden you - refrain from. And fear Allah ; indeed, Allah is severe in penalty."
Mohammed did complete the message of Islam as he (PBUH) recited and made sure that his companions and followers have memorized the whole Quran and wrote it down, and taught them every aspect of life.

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2179 Feb 2, 2014
Mahmood wrote:
<quoted text>
In the Koran Mohmmad claimed that he had perfected the religion of Islam, if that is case, then why depend on hadiths?
5:03 "..........This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you and have approved for you Islam as religion. But whoever is forced by severe hunger with no inclination to sin - then indeed, Allah is Forgiving and Merciful".
My point is that Mohammad never perfected the religion of Islam.
Perhaps I didn't get your point, that verse "This day I have perfected for you your religion and completed My favor upon you..." was one of the last verses revealed to Mohammed (PBUH)
or the last verse, I am not sure , because it was revealed before the death of Mohammed by a very short time.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#2180 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
my point is , we can easily understand from the original context of the Hadith that the Flick didn't upset Aisha because she and Mohammed continued their conversation .
…

…
So yes the Prophet (peace be upon him) did have difficulties in his marriage. I think This is absolutely fine. If he didn't then he wouldn't have been a good example for us to follow since we can't look up to him to know how to deal with difficult situations that happen between couples.
And my point is that she said (actually chose to document) that it was painful and flicks are not painful unless deliberately and forcefully aimed at a tender spot such as a bare nipple

However a thump/push/strike in the breast of a woman is painful, can be extremely so. So much so that is it used as one method of torture by those so wonderfully enlightened and sick minded governments that seem to proliferate in you neck of the woods.

You really have no comprehension of the psychology of human beings do you? The victims in abusive relationships are subservient to their abuser and grateful for any contrition the abuses may offer after a violent attack. The vary fact that the abuser has chosen (by the will of allah) to talk to his victim would have given Aisha hope. It’s all part of the abusers strategy.

You as a Muslim choose to treat women in the way your god books teaches and you see nothing wrong with that, you see nothing that goes against decency, morality and human rights in that teaching. Non Muslims on the other hand see your treatment of women (and animals) as degrading, disgusting, often violent, immoral and against the very essence of equality of gender taught by human rights

So you are welcome to interpret and live by the mores of your 1400 year old god book as best suits your reason for belief. Me and the vast majority of the population will stick with the reality of real life every time

One final point, an abuser will never see themselves as the abuser but often as the victim and give the excise of “they made me do it”.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#2181 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
not only Mohammed is my prophet, we love and respect all prophets, besides we don't worship him or any prophet, worshiping Mohammed is considered as the greatest sin which is Shrik , we only worship Allah the creator, the greatest and the almighty.
Mohamed and all prophets were human beings but with miracles to prove their prophethood,
why would Mohammed be a power mad or violent ; you do know that he lived his whole life with no wealth and he even died and his armor was mortgaged to a Jew in Medina , he mortgaged his armor to get some food for his wives..!! so if it wasn't about the money, why would he do anything ??
<quoted text>
that's non-sense girls in Jordan which is with a very normal temperature girls reach puberty at the age range 11-13
"Puberty in girls usually starts at any time between 8 and 13 years of age, periods usually start about two years after the start of puberty."
http://www.netdoctor.co.uk/womenshealth/facts...
<quoted text>
No I dont pick hadiths as I like, we muslims unlike you take in consideration All the islamic teachings in both Quran and Sunnah, we don't just take one hadith and Jump to non sense conclusions.
<quoted text>
you previously claimed that fear shouldn't be used as a factor to straight things up and make people better and also claimed that fear was only used during slavery ..etc
when I mentioned Prisons, punishments and death sentence you seem that you changed your mind.
we are talking about the human nature and what drives them to do good or bad, so in response to your question fear of god got to do with everything not only criminality, for instance I wouldn't kill an ant although killing an ant wont take me to jail in any country in the world but I know that there is an almighty who is watching me, I hope you see the big picture.
And yet you hang on every word documented, act in the way his dictated, give him epaulets in the form of - praise be unto him – this all sounds very much like worship.

What miracles? Why, because that was the way to be. Money is not everything in power, look at the late JC was also skint for all his life and look what he became, he’s wound up with twice as many followers as Moh has.

Yes and girls in the UK, that is considerably colder than Jordan, also reach puberty between 11 and 13, sometimes even earlier. I for example had my first period not long after my 10th birthday. Even the link you provided gives no reference to temperature being a factor.

So reading the book as it was written is nonsense. Thank you – you have just agreed with what I said (thought you will never admit it)- zap goes your religion from your own mouth

Honey, as I have said previously, you are not very good at the human psychology thing, there is very little fear of prison, if there were then the prison population would be zero.

What drives people to good and bad is their morality, which began to develop in homo sapiens before homo sapiens were homo sapiens and whole aeons before gods were even though of. Without morality there would be no civilisation

You say you wouldn’t kill an ant yet you revel in suicide bombings of those who oppose you which incidentally means anyone else who juts happens to be in the blast radius

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#2182 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
so you call my religion a myth and according to your response you seem that you dont understand my religion, So please stop throwing accusations and just Admit that you nearly know nothing about it.
<quoted text>
Actually I have a bachelor degree of science in marketing, I studied in one of the best universities in my country, so I am totally aware of maslow's hierarchy of needs.
<quoted text>
What if I tell you that pleasing my god will never happen unless I made everyone around me happy and made my best to change things from bad to good ??
pleasing Allah isn't by praying only, praying is only a part.
2:177 "Righteousness is not that you turn your faces toward the east or the west, but [true] righteousness is [in] one who believes in Allah , the Last Day, the angels, the Book, and the prophets and gives wealth, in spite of love for it, to relatives, orphans, the needy, the traveler, those who ask [for help], and for freeing slaves; [and who] establishes prayer and gives zakah; [those who] fulfill their promise when they promise; and [those who] are patient in poverty and hardship and during battle. Those are the ones who have been true, and it is those who are the righteous. "
<quoted text>
I meant if your life is that perfect ; there is no doubt that someday it will end so its not that perfect, perfection is something that cannot be improved, if your life can be improved in any aspect then its not perfect either.
<quoted text>
Check the above response, because all those you mentioned make the life imperfect, I intended to bring some scriptures and Hadiths with detailed description of Jannah (Heaven), so we may make a comparison between this life and the hereafter.
Hey don’t wet you pants, all religions are myth, not just yours, It really does not matter how much I know or don’t know about them. In the case of the 3 abrahamic religions (which included yours) I have studded some aspects of the Tanakh from several standpoints so I probably know far more about the origins of you god than you do. Of course as a good funnymentalist you will deny this and I will reply, facts will beat faith in any scientific discussion.

Yup and I have a BA, a BSc, an MA and 2 MSc’s, not one in marketing. At least with an MSc in marketing you will always be able to get a job in some Indian call centre phoning up Brits at lunch time on Sunday or just before you are going to bed, thus waking the children, and try to sell you replacement double glazing, a new boiler to replace you perfectly adequate existing boiler or cavity wall and/or loft insulation that you already have. A new one I received yesterday was the government sponsored kitchen scappage scheme which for some reason no government had ever heard about. Note I have even less tolerance of marketing lies and BS than I do for religious lies and BS.

What if you tell me anything? It’s still down to you telling me with no evidence of any allah. If you choose to do good then that’s great, why blame a god for your own choices?

Of course my life will end, are you saying that the perfect life is immortality? Immortality would get awfully boring after a few million years don’t you think? Sorry good bud, even the immortal jellyfish has to die sometime. My life is exactly as I would wish it and that includes dying when my time comes. I can think of nothing that could improve my life, how about you?

So waking up in the morning makes life imperfect?- go figure?

Are you saying that natural ageing is not perfect? I suggest you take this one up with your god, or are you saying that your god was not capable of creating perfection in life?

You cannot make any comparison between life and the hereafter because no one know buck sh|t about any hereafter and of course if you make any such claim I will of course require evidence that I know you do not have so cannot give.

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#2183 Feb 3, 2014
Opps sorry I meant BSc in marketing you will always be able to get a job in some Indian call centre

But if course with an MSc you would stand a better chance

“Evil Atheist :-)”

Since: Mar 07

Location hidden

#2184 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
its not only about girls, I don't see a problem for a boy to get married once he reached puberty as well, Why the hell not ??!
if you had the chance to get married at a very young age and of course you were financially capable , wouldn't you go for it ?
Do you realise the danger a young girl faces having to give birth to a full sized baby when her pelvis is still growing?
Do you have any idea just how many women (let alone girls) used to die in childbirth?

Yet because your prophet had sex with a 9 year old girl you dismiss all that and calmly claim that any girl who bleeds can breed!

That's the insane logic of cult followers desperate to defend their faith at all cost.

And that's what religion does to otherwise rational minds and that's why I reject it all!

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2185 Feb 3, 2014
Igor Trip wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you realise the danger a young girl faces having to give birth to a full sized baby when her pelvis is still growing?
Do you have any idea just how many women (let alone girls) used to die in childbirth?
Yet because your prophet had sex with a 9 year old girl you dismiss all that and calmly claim that any girl who bleeds can breed!
That's the insane logic of cult followers desperate to defend their faith at all cost.
And that's what religion does to otherwise rational minds and that's why I reject it all!
its a good thing you are still alive, I previously sent you a Hadith regarding the sun rise and still looking forward for your response.

for the marriage issue that was only my opinion and I made it clear before that I dont have a problem with such a marriage as long as it guarantees no harm or any side effects, and that take us back to one of Mohammed's authentic Hadiths Mohammed Said "There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm. "
it is considered as a golden Rule and before doing anything this Rule should be taken in consideration.

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2186 Feb 3, 2014
Igor Trip wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you realise the danger a young girl faces having to give birth to a full sized baby when her pelvis is still growing?
Do you have any idea just how many women (let alone girls) used to die in childbirth?
Yet because your prophet had sex with a 9 year old girl you dismiss all that and calmly claim that any girl who bleeds can breed!
That's the insane logic of cult followers desperate to defend their faith at all cost.
And that's what religion does to otherwise rational minds and that's why I reject it all!
Ibn 'Abbas (A.S.) narrated that the Prophet (PBUH) was asked:

"Where does the sun set, and where does it rise from? The Messenger of Allah (PBUH) answered, "It is going in a (nonstop) regular motion; it does not cease or disappear. It sets in one place and rises in another, and sets in another place and rises elsewhere and so on. So, some people would say the sun has set and others would say it has just risen (at the same moment)."

“When you treat people as they ”

Since: Nov 10

treat you they get offended.

#2187 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
its a good thing you are still alive, I previously sent you a Hadith regarding the sun rise and still looking forward for your response.
for the marriage issue that was only my opinion and I made it clear before that I dont have a problem with such a marriage as long as it guarantees no harm or any side effects, and that take us back to one of Mohammed's authentic Hadiths Mohammed Said "There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm. "
it is considered as a golden Rule and before doing anything this Rule should be taken in consideration.
You cannot guarantee no harm in exactly the same way as you cannot guarantee that a suicide bomber attacking a military target will not also kill innocent people.

But still you accept both the situations on the “assumption” that it will all turn out how you hope.

And when it all goes tits up you shrug your shoulders and blame allah

“Evil Atheist :-)”

Since: Mar 07

Location hidden

#2188 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
its a good thing you are still alive, I previously sent you a Hadith regarding the sun rise and still looking forward for your response.
for the marriage issue that was only my opinion and I made it clear before that I dont have a problem with such a marriage as long as it guarantees no harm or any side effects, and that take us back to one of Mohammed's authentic Hadiths Mohammed Said "There should be neither harming nor reciprocating harm. "
it is considered as a golden Rule and before doing anything this Rule should be taken in consideration.
Sorry for missing your post of the hadith. I'll reply below.

The only way anyone can reduce the potential harm of child birth is to wait until the girl has stopped growing, and that's long after her first period.
Pregnancy at an earlier age greatly increases the chances of her and her baby dying.

“Evil Atheist :-)”

Since: Mar 07

Location hidden

#2190 Feb 3, 2014
hazem selawi wrote:
<quoted text>
Ibn 'Abbas (A.S.) narrated that the Prophet (PBUH) was asked:
"Where does the sun set, and where does it rise from? The Messenger of Allah (PBUH) answered, "It is going in a (nonstop) regular motion; it does not cease or disappear. It sets in one place and rises in another, and sets in another place and rises elsewhere and so on. So, some people would say the sun has set and others would say it has just risen (at the same moment)."
Do you have a source for this hadith as I can't find one on the internet.

Hadiths are dodgy anyway. Here are some more.

Sahih Bukhari Volume 004, Book 054, Hadith Number 421.
Sahih Bukhari Book 54. Beginning Of Creation

Bismillah-Hir-Rahman-Nir-Rahee m
Narated By Abu Dhar : The Prophet asked me at sunset, "Do you know where the sun goes (at the time of sunset)?" I replied, "Allah and His Apostle know better." He said, "It goes (i.e. travels) till it prostrates Itself underneath the Throne and takes the permission to rise again, and it is permitted and then (a time will come when) it will be about to prostrate itself but its prostration will not be accepted, and it will ask permission to go on its course but it will not be permitted, but it will be ordered to return whence it has come and so it will rise in the west. And that is the interpretation of the Statement of Allah: "And the sun Runs its fixed course For a term (decreed). that is The Decree of (Allah) The Exalted in Might, The All-Knowing." (36.38)
http://hadithcollection.com/sahihbukhari/87/4...

Sahih Bukhari Volume 006, Book 060, Hadith Number 326.
Sahih Bukhari Book 60. Prophetic Commentary on the Qur'an (Tafseer of The Prophet (PBUH))

Bismillah-Hir-Rahman-Nir-Rahee m
Narrated By Abu Dharr : Once I was with the Prophet in the mosque at the time of sunset. The Prophet said, "O Abu Dharr! Do you know where the sun sets?" I replied, "Allah and His Apostle know best." He said, "It goes and prostrates underneath (Allah's) Throne; and that is Allah's Statement:
http://hadithcollection.com/sahihbukhari/93-s...

Since: Oct 13

Location hidden

#2191 Feb 3, 2014
Igor Trip wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you have a source for this hadith as I can't find one on the internet.
Hadiths are dodgy anyway. Here are some more.
Sahih Bukhari Volume 004, Book 054, Hadith Number 421.
Sahih Bukhari Book 54. Beginning Of Creation
Bismillah-Hir-Rahman-Nir-Rahee m
Narated By Abu Dhar : The Prophet asked me at sunset, "Do you know where the sun goes (at the time of sunset)?" I replied, "Allah and His Apostle know better." He said, "It goes (i.e. travels) till it prostrates Itself underneath the Throne and takes the permission to rise again, and it is permitted and then (a time will come when) it will be about to prostrate itself but its prostration will not be accepted, and it will ask permission to go on its course but it will not be permitted, but it will be ordered to return whence it has come and so it will rise in the west. And that is the interpretation of the Statement of Allah: "And the sun Runs its fixed course For a term (decreed). that is The Decree of (Allah) The Exalted in Might, The All-Knowing." (36.38)
http://hadithcollection.com/sahihbukhari/87/4...
Sahih Bukhari Volume 006, Book 060, Hadith Number 326.
Sahih Bukhari Book 60. Prophetic Commentary on the Qur'an (Tafseer of The Prophet (PBUH))
Bismillah-Hir-Rahman-Nir-Rahee m
Narrated By Abu Dharr : Once I was with the Prophet in the mosque at the time of sunset. The Prophet said, "O Abu Dharr! Do you know where the sun sets?" I replied, "Allah and His Apostle know best." He said, "It goes and prostrates underneath (Allah's) Throne; and that is Allah's Statement:
http://hadithcollection.com/sahihbukhari/93-s...
that is another Hadith describing the end of times, when the sun will rise from the west , its considered to be the greatest and the last sign of the end of times.

"but it will be ordered to return whence it has come and so it will rise in the west "
I think its scientifically accepted that someday the sun will appear as its rising from the west , as the earth will start to rotate in a reverse direction.

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