Is the bible a fairy tale?
Imhotep

Orlando, FL

#1666 May 20, 2013
Snevaeh legna wrote:
<quoted text>
Ook al ben ik een domme Christen met mijn Sky God, IK kan je met vrijwel iedereen, niet Bob! Lol
Kan MIJ niet schelen wat iedereen vindt. het is een persoonlijke keuze ...
Je hebt recht op je fantasie├źn is een vrije wereld.
Ik ben een seculiere humanist.
Bob is niet zo slecht dat hij krijgt soms meeslepen.

Ik ben meer pragmatische ik omgaan met feiten

Ik voel religie is belachelijk niets meer dan georganiseerd bijgeloof

“ IT'S A CHOICE !!!”

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#1667 May 20, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>

Mr Crick is een andere zaak volledig!
Ik denk dat je weet wat ik bedoel
Buck is meer nerveus dan een lange staart kat in een kamer vol met schommelstoelen!
Lol
I would hate to be a cat as well...

U heeft ons namelijk altijd goed voor mij, en het is leuk om te volgen!:)
Imhotep

Orlando, FL

#1668 May 20, 2013
Snevaeh legna wrote:
<quoted text>
I would hate to be a cat as well...

U heeft ons namelijk altijd goed voor mij, en het is leuk om te volgen!:)
Ik ben het eens het is leuk om te volgen.
Organiseren religie is al stervende
En in een paar generaties zal het waarschijnlijk worden gegaan
Met het internet Ik denk dat het gedoemd is te veel informatie beschikbaar
Ik heb genoten van het chatten met je
Nu de armen van Morpheus wachten zie je later!

“ IT'S A CHOICE !!!”

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#1669 May 20, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Ik ben het eens het is leuk om te volgen.
Organiseren religie is al stervende
En in een paar generaties zal het waarschijnlijk worden gegaan
Met het internet Ik denk dat het gedoemd is te veel informatie beschikbaar
Ik heb genoten van het chatten met je
Nu de armen van Morpheus wachten zie je later!
Goede nacht mijn vriend, slaap lekker! Post met je morgen ...:)
Andre

Durban, South Africa

#1670 May 21, 2013
Imhotep wrote:
<quoted text>
Perhaps we should investigate this first before we discuss these 'teachings'. Ok? ;)
You see I have this problem... with both Moses & Jesus.
WHY?......etc.
Just two points:

1)We agree then that the teachings of Jesus Christ will not support
a)Christianity being regarded as dangerous or
b)"a disaster" or
c) teachings that you will disagree with.
Thus, it should not be a problem if a person accepts Christianity?

2)In respect of the "problems" you have, can you please provide me with information that disproves beyond doubt any statement of fact in the Bible? For the purposes of discussion, can you limit it to one or two, so we can analyse it properly?

You may consider that it was once claimed that Moses could not have written the Pentateuch as the written word did not exist at the time. This was disproved ( tablets in the Eblaite Kingdom proved writing 800 years before Moses). So for any argument to hold water, it should not be mere speculation or doubt, but fact.

I do not have a problem with people expressing doubt. What I do however find a little sad is that remarks are often made that are stated as fact but not based on fact or close scrutiny of available evidence. On the basis of this, I have come to the conclusion that opposition to Christianity is not based on evidence, but a "heart" issue. It is basically a rejection of the message of the Bible and the demands it makes on us to "surrender all to Jesus"

Have a great day!

Then

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#1672 May 21, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
I can't read a damn word of that. But I sense it is not a compliment.
What's the matter? suddenly can't interpret the bullsh*t that your cult promotes like speaking in tongues?

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#1673 May 21, 2013
Andre wrote:
<quoted text>
Just two points:
1)We agree then that the teachings of Jesus Christ will not support
a)Christianity being regarded as dangerous or
b)"a disaster" or
c) teachings that you will disagree with.
Thus, it should not be a problem if a person accepts Christianity?
2)In respect of the "problems" you have, can you please provide me with information that disproves beyond doubt any statement of fact in the Bible? For the purposes of discussion, can you limit it to one or two, so we can analyse it properly?
You may consider that it was once claimed that Moses could not have written the Pentateuch as the written word did not exist at the time. This was disproved ( tablets in the Eblaite Kingdom proved writing 800 years before Moses). So for any argument to hold water, it should not be mere speculation or doubt, but fact.
I do not have a problem with people expressing doubt. What I do however find a little sad is that remarks are often made that are stated as fact but not based on fact or close scrutiny of available evidence. On the basis of this, I have come to the conclusion that opposition to Christianity is not based on evidence, but a "heart" issue. It is basically a rejection of the message of the Bible and the demands it makes on us to "surrender all to Jesus"
Have a great day!
Then
When you theists become honest and realise that lying to people about god is not smart or clever, we will be willing to welcome you into the real world.

It id through your own choise that you choose to have the opinions of a stupid person - in denial of scientific facts because your ego cannot take it.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#1674 May 21, 2013
Yo cover up your bitterness about the fact that god is not real, with wishy washy language and distraction.

When it comes down to it your a a dishonest person selling us a dishonest cult of liars. That is how your faith virus grows itself.

Relgion is no more than a chain letter carried by ignorant fearful idiots.
spudgun

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#1675 May 21, 2013
Andre wrote:
<quoted text>
..In respect of the "problems" you have, can you please provide me with information that disproves beyond doubt any statement of fact in the Bible?..
Try this google search
http://www.google.co.uk/#gs_rn=14&gs_ri=p...

Just one example Noah is recorded as living 950 years. How insanely stupid is this? If you cannot see the problem, then you are very brainwashed or lying.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#1676 May 21, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
That is incorrect, and incorrect for the same reasons it was incorrect when you said it earlier.
In the BB Theory, it is A FALSE STATEMENT to say the universe has no cause, for reasons I outlined, namely, that you do not know if time as prescribed by the BB is absolute time, you do not know if causality, in principle, requires time, and you do not know if all potential causality is detectable.
What we do know, IN PRINCIPLE, indicates the opposite, which is, that something that begins to exist REQUIRES cause. You offer exception to that with no facts.
And under the BB theory, none of that happens.
Your only objection is reduced to an observational bias and your attempted expansion of that bias into principle.
Sorry, that is how science is done: via observation.
Absent a fact-based rationale to uphold your exception, it is rightly maintained that the PRINCIPLE stands, which is:
That which begins to exist has a cause.
More accurately, everything that has a cause has a physical cause.

We know of many things that begin without causes.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#1677 May 21, 2013
[QUOTE who="KJV
"]<quoted text>
You don't know?
The edge of the universe is where it meets nothing.[/QUOTE]

I was asking in the balloon analogy. Where is the boundary in that analogy?

As to your statement, there is no 'where it meets nothing'. You're not very good with the concept of curved space, are you?
Imhotep

Orlando, FL

#1678 May 21, 2013
Andre wrote:
<quoted text>
Just two points:
1)We agree then that the teachings of Jesus Christ will not support
a)Christianity being regarded as dangerous or
b)"a disaster" or
c) teachings that you will disagree with.
Thus, it should not be a problem if a person accepts Christianity?
2)In respect of the "problems" you have, can you please provide me with information that disproves beyond doubt any statement of fact in the Bible? For the purposes of discussion, can you limit it to one or two, so we can analyse it properly?
You may consider that it was once claimed that Moses could not have written the Pentateuch as the written word did not exist at the time. This was disproved ( tablets in the Eblaite Kingdom proved writing 800 years before Moses). So for any argument to hold water, it should not be mere speculation or doubt, but fact.
I do not have a problem with people expressing doubt. What I do however find a little sad is that remarks are often made that are stated as fact but not based on fact or close scrutiny of available evidence. On the basis of this, I have come to the conclusion that opposition to Christianity is not based on evidence, but a "heart" issue. It is basically a rejection of the message of the Bible and the demands it makes on us to "surrender all to Jesus"
Have a great day!
Then
The alleged works of Jesus as indicated in the Bible don't support it being dangerous.

But the history of religion is appalling it's violent and destructors. It is the clergy the leaders of these churches that are dangerous not the legend itself.

Give some thought to this and give me your opinion...

Like those of the Jewish writer Josephus, the works of the ancient historians Pliny, Suetonius and Tacitus do not provide proof that Jesus Christ ever existed as a "historical" character.

Pliny the Younger, Roman Official and Historian (62-113 CE)
Tacitus, Roman Politician and Historian,(c. 56-120 CE)
Suetonius, Roman Historian (c. 69-c. 122 CE)

When addressing the mythical nature of Jesus Christ, one issue repeatedly raised is the purported "evidence" of his existence to be found in the writings of Flavius Josephus, the famed Jewish general and historian who lived from about 37 to 100 CE.

In Josephus's Antiquities of the Jews appears the notorious passage regarding Christ called the "Testimonium Flavianum" ("TF"):

"Now, there was about this time, Jesus, a wise man, if it be lawful to call him a man, for he was a doer of wonderful works,--a teacher of such men as receive the truth with pleasure. He drew over to him both many of the Jews, and many of the Gentiles. He was [the] Christ; and when Pilate, at the suggestion of the principal men amongst us, had condemned him to the cross, those that loved him at the first did not forsake him, for he appeared to them alive again the third day, as the divine prophets had foretold these and ten thousand other wonderful things concerning him; and the tribe of Christians, so named from him, are not extinct at this day."

The are: No sculptures, no drawings, no markings in stone, nothing written in his own hand; and no letters, no commentaries, indeed no authentic documents written by his Jewish and Gentile contemporaries, Justice of Tiberius, Philo, Josephus, Seneca, Petronius Arbiter, Pliny the Elder, et al., to lend credence to his historicity."

In the final analysis there is no evidence that the biblical character called "Jesus Christ" ever existed.

All of these historians were born well after the alleged events.

'Hearsay' is not 'evidence' for a reason!

Caesar by comparison is easily verified.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#1679 May 21, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
And under the BB theory, none of that happens.
<quoted text>
Sorry, that is how science is done: via observation.
<quoted text>
More accurately, everything that has a cause has a physical cause.
We know of many things that begin without causes.
Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
Andre

Durban, South Africa

#1680 May 21, 2013
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
When you theists become honest and realise that lying to people about god is not smart or clever, we will be willing to welcome you into the real world.
It id through your own choise that you choose to have the opinions of a stupid person - in denial of scientific facts because your ego cannot take it.
Hi Skeptic.
(1)You have not really addressed the issues that I have raised. Maybe you would like to comment on the point made?
(2)Do you suggest I lie? Kindly explain how you arrive at this conclusion.
(3) Please mention the scientific "facts" that I deny? Jus three or four would be great.
Have a great day
Andre

Durban, South Africa

#1681 May 21, 2013
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
Try this google search
http://www.google.co.uk/#gs_rn=14&gs_ri=p...
Just one example Noah is recorded as living 950 years. How insanely stupid is this? If you cannot see the problem, then you are very brainwashed or lying.
Hi spudgun, the argument is the nature of Jesus' teachings and whether you would agree they are sound or whether they would be "dangerous" to adhere to. If you could please?

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#1682 May 21, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Everything that begins to exist has a cause.
That's what you keep claiming. But I see you still have only bald assertion and no proof.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#1683 May 21, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
And under the BB theory, none of that happens.
<quoted text>
Sorry, that is how science is done: via observation.
<quoted text>
More accurately, everything that has a cause has a physical cause.
We know of many things that begin without causes.
The BB is caused.

The cause? We do not know.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#1684 May 21, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>

And under the BB theory, none of that happens.
"Under the BB theory", you did not type that post.

But you did, and there is no conflict.

Buck Crick

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#1685 May 21, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
That's what you keep claiming. But I see you still have only bald assertion and no proof.
I have tons of proof.

Metric tons.

Everything that exists is proof.

“ad victoriam”

Since: Dec 10

arte et marte

#1686 May 21, 2013
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Are you kidding me??
There is absolutely no way you are a physicist.
You do not have the intellect.
1. No, I do not have to show it. You are the one eliminating even the POSSIBILITY! You are the one relying on the fact that universe time is absolute time to do so. Your assertion falls without it. So prove it.
2. This is simply a repeat of your circularity fallacy. On top of that, you included (point 1 and 2) bald assertions for which you fail to produce proof.
3. No. It is NOT possible to have t>0 without t=0. This would render t>0 incoherent.
For your thesis to have merit, you must prove that:
(a) Causality requires time.
(b) Universe time is Absolute time.
(c) That causal order is temporal order, not observationally, but principally.
You have offered NO PROOF of any of these 3 points, only your assertions.
I do not see any reason to believe that you CAN offer such.
You lost another one to pig farmer.
It's over.
I hate to get between you twos before he kicks you around intellectually, while you want yo kick him physically.

But.... THIS

1. No, I do not have to show it. You are the one eliminating even the POSSIBILITY! You are the one relying on the fact that universe time is absolute time to do so. Your assertion falls without it. So prove it.
Doesn't make any sense at all, because time is relative, but there wasn't a single point in time, that was without time on some clock. Even the time outs left on the score board have to follow this , Alabama or not.

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