Atheists

Mar 12, 2014 Full story: Lincoln Daily News 25

We read about the people who profess to be atheists, not believing that God exists, but I wonder really how many true atheists there are.

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“There is no god!”

Since: Jun 12

SŲdertšlje, Sweden

#1 Mar 12, 2014
Not worth the time to read

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“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#2 Mar 12, 2014
My response:

You wonder how many true atheists there are. I wonder what you think a true atheist is, or I would if you didnít continue on to reveal your complete ignorance in the matter. Atheists defeatist, pessimistic, negative, and fatalist? Your opinion, not fact. Atheists have no common world view because independence of thought begins most of us on the path of skepticism. Everything will end up in nothingness? What does that even mean?

Some atheists may deride Christians, but most donít. Christians are our friends, families, and neighbors. In spite of Biblical expectations that nonbelievers will spitefully use you, etc., the reality is much less dramatic: most of us simply ignore religious assertions except for intrusions that require some sort of response. Knock on my door, pamphlets in hand, refuse to leave when asked, and some of that derision may be in store for you.

As a group, atheists like science more than the general public does. Thatís an effect that atheism tends to have on us, but it is not the cause of atheism. In fact there is no universal cause. There are nearly as many ways to come to the conclusion that religious and supernatural claims are insupportable as there are atheists themselves. Christians love to stereotype us, but we canít even stereotype ourselves. We just donít have enough in common with each other.

The phrase ďChurch of AtheismĒ makes me chortle. Oddly enough, someone in the U.K has actually built oneówhat an odd thing to do. But there is no church of atheism in any real sense, and not faith is required to live without faith. Thatís a Christian myth. Nonbelievers and skeptics tend to look for evidence rather than purposely ignore it. In its absence, belief is held in abeyance. Why should it be otherwise?

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Amused

Lowell, MA

#3 Mar 13, 2014
The article proves nothing except that the author is so limited by his beliefs that he is incapable of imagining that they are not universally held, and those who claim not to believe are insincere in that claim. In that, he's not unlike the English speakers who can't seem to grasp that non-English speakers will not understand spoken English even if you speak loudly and slowly
It would do him a world of good (pun intended) if he traveled a bit and met people from other cultures, faith traditions, language backgrounds, etc..
Thinking

Beaconsfield, UK

#4 Mar 13, 2014
If only the author of this article was truly able to wonder.

“In God we trust”

Since: Dec 12

Cape Town, South Africa

#5 Mar 14, 2014
A true atheist is Charlie sheen. A drug addict or heavy drinker, having sex with random strangers and just not respecting anyone or even not having respect for himself.

A true christian is someone who has giving in to God and helps other such as Nelson Mandela and Billy Graham

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EdSed

Wishaw, UK

#6 Mar 14, 2014
This sort of prejudice is disgraceful....
Carchar king wrote:
A true atheist is Charlie sheen. A drug addict or heavy drinker, having sex with random strangers and just not respecting anyone or even not having respect for himself.
A true christian is someone who has giving in to God and helps other such as Nelson Mandela and Billy Graham
http://www.positiveatheism.org/writ/ghwbush.h...

http://www.gallup.com/poll/155285/atheists-mu...

but it's apparently still occurs quite often in the USA today. The USA has largely overcome prejudice against women, blacks and gays. It is high time to recognise it for what it is when non-believers are the target demographic.

Religion = superstition
Theology = mythology

The lighter side from Jonny Eve....
http://www.atheismuk.com/2012/03/31/atheism/y...
EdSed

Wishaw, UK

#7 Mar 14, 2014
NightSerf wrote:
My response:
You wonder how many true atheists there are. I wonder what you think a true atheist is, or I would if you didnít continue on to reveal your complete ignorance in the matter. Atheists defeatist, pessimistic, negative, and fatalist? Your opinion, not fact. Atheists have no common world view because independence of thought begins most of us on the path of skepticism. Everything will end up in nothingness? What does that even mean?
Some atheists may deride Christians, but most donít. Christians are our friends, families, and neighbors. In spite of Biblical expectations that nonbelievers will spitefully use you, etc., the reality is much less dramatic: most of us simply ignore religious assertions except for intrusions that require some sort of response. Knock on my door, pamphlets in hand, refuse to leave when asked, and some of that derision may be in store for you.
As a group, atheists like science more than the general public does. Thatís an effect that atheism tends to have on us, but it is not the cause of atheism. In fact there is no universal cause. There are nearly as many ways to come to the conclusion that religious and supernatural claims are insupportable as there are atheists themselves. Christians love to stereotype us, but we canít even stereotype ourselves. We just donít have enough in common with each other.
The phrase ďChurch of AtheismĒ makes me chortle. Oddly enough, someone in the U.K has actually built oneówhat an odd thing to do. But there is no church of atheism in any real sense, and not faith is required to live without faith. Thatís a Christian myth. Nonbelievers and skeptics tend to look for evidence rather than purposely ignore it. In its absence, belief is held in abeyance. Why should it be otherwise?
Absolutely. It can be a bit misleading to say that someone 'built an atheist church in the UK'. "..there is no church of atheism in any real sense.." is right.

There is an organisation (they have no buildings that I know of) that is referred to as the 'Atheist Church' but that is tongue in cheek. It pokes fun at the idea of 'a church', it isn't one per se. It's name is the Sunday Assembly...
http://sundayassembly.com/

Nightserf gets it, but I think British humour doesn't travel well and so the humor seems to be lost sometimes.
EdSed

Wishaw, UK

#8 Mar 14, 2014
"We read about the people who profess to be atheists, not believing that God exists, but I wonder really how many true atheists there are."
I wonder how many true believers there are.

In the 21st century, I think it's quite obvious to most people that there are no such things as gods or fairies - if they think about it. There is no evidence of an interventionist god, far less a specifically Abrahamic one, or any of those so far defined....
godchecker.com

Religion (and other superstitions) offer humanity no end of a lesson.
Amused

Lowell, MA

#9 Mar 14, 2014
EdSed wrote:
...
In the 21st century, I think it's quite obvious to most people that there are no such things as gods or fairies - if they think about it....
The key part of that statement being "if they think about it". That punches a hole in the main premise large enough to drive a semi-trailer through. The main reason for the persistence of religion is that religious belief is not the product of a rational process. One cannot reason people out of positions they have not adopted as a result of reasoning. Indoctrination is not just a process of inculcating beliefs in the target. It is also a process of stunting the target's capacity for questioning those beliefs.
EdSed

Wishaw, UK

#10 Mar 14, 2014
Amused wrote:
<quoted text>
The key part of that statement being "if they think about it". That punches a hole in the main premise large enough to drive a semi-trailer through. The main reason for the persistence of religion is that religious belief is not the product of a rational process. One cannot reason people out of positions they have not adopted as a result of reasoning. Indoctrination is not just a process of inculcating beliefs in the target. It is also a process of stunting the target's capacity for questioning those beliefs.
All true enough.

People don't like to think they're irrational though and some do respond to reason. I have noted at least one religionist who has rejected religion after attending debates here.(I feel sure it makes those who can think, think!:-)

If nothing else, I think our comments help to undermine the indoctrination and contradict the idea that disbelief in god(s) is somehow negative or mistaken. At least religionists can no longer seriously imply that disbelief in god(s) is somehow odd or disreputable. Just as indoctrination is a process, so is the deprogramming.
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Indoctrination

“In God we trust”

Since: Dec 12

Cape Town, South Africa

#11 Mar 14, 2014
EdSed wrote:
"We read about the people who profess to be atheists, not believing that God exists, but I wonder really how many true atheists there are."
I wonder how many true believers there are.
In the 21st century, I think it's quite obvious to most people that there are no such things as gods or fairies - if they think about it. There is no evidence of an interventionist god, far less a specifically Abrahamic one, or any of those so far defined....
godchecker.com
Religion (and other superstitions) offer humanity no end of a lesson.
I thought about it and realize it's impossible for our universe to come from nothing, science the greatest invention ever, doesn't have a clue how the universe came from nothing

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“BAS in Electrical Engineering”

Since: Jan 14

Location hidden

#12 Mar 14, 2014
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
I thought about it and realize it's impossible for our universe to come from nothing, science the greatest invention ever, doesn't have a clue how the universe came from nothing
That is true and we may never know what was before the big bang. We can however make educated guesses on what was before it and then see if we can prove those theories.
Amused

Lowell, MA

#13 Mar 14, 2014
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
I thought about it and realize it's impossible for our universe to come from nothing, science the greatest invention ever, doesn't have a clue how the universe came from nothing
Not exactly true. Science has clues, but not enough to form a hypothesis capable of being tested. That said, the fact that we don't have enough knowledge yet isn't a License to Make Stuff Up, which is what the creation story is: stuff made up by people so primitive they didn't yet understand the concept of keeping their excrement out of their food.

We don't know the answer with any certainty. We may or may not ever know the answer with any certainty. Some folks are incapable of tolerating ambiguity and prefer a lie that provides certainty to uncertainty. If that's what gets you through the day, that's sad, but do what you have to do. Just please don't get in the way of people who are actually interested in reality and facts.

“In God we trust”

Since: Dec 12

Cape Town, South Africa

#14 Mar 14, 2014
Amused wrote:
<quoted text>
Not exactly true. Science has clues, but not enough to form a hypothesis capable of being tested. That said, the fact that we don't have enough knowledge yet isn't a License to Make Stuff Up, which is what the creation story is: stuff made up by people so primitive they didn't yet understand the concept of keeping their excrement out of their food.
We don't know the answer with any certainty. We may or may not ever know the answer with any certainty. Some folks are incapable of tolerating ambiguity and prefer a lie that provides certainty to uncertainty. If that's what gets you through the day, that's sad, but do what you have to do. Just please don't get in the way of people who are actually interested in reality and facts.
Nah, if you can't prove the universe came from nothing, then why should i be a atheist.

We christians live just a balanced lives as any other person, we don't criticise other's beliefs, because we have the discipline and respect for the choices people make in their lives.

But for atheists, respect isn't even in the dictionary.

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Amused

Lowell, MA

#15 Mar 15, 2014
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah, if you can't prove the universe came from nothing, then why should i be a atheist.
We christians live just a balanced lives as any other person, we don't criticise other's beliefs, because we have the discipline and respect for the choices people make in their lives.
But for atheists, respect isn't even in the dictionary.
Christians respect those who are different from them? I'm sure that's news to Jews, gays, atheists and a host of others who don't think like Christians.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#16 Mar 15, 2014
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah, if you can't prove the universe came from nothing, then why should i be a atheist.
We christians live just a balanced lives as any other person, we don't criticise other's beliefs, because we have the discipline and respect for the choices people make in their lives.
But for atheists, respect isn't even in the dictionary.
You're right. Questions about he origin of the universe and whether deities exist independently of human belief, while not mutually exclusive, are not necessarily interlinked either. And some Christians do live as yourdescribe, but enough others do not to affect outsider's views of Christian behavior. Most nonbelievers with whom I have personally interacted understand that the range of Christian belief and behavior is very wide. The same can be said of all of the world's major faiths.

The same is true of nonbelievers. There probably are some who have little respect for other people or their way of life, but that attitude is less viable in a small ideological minority than it is among the majority. Most of us move smoothly among the believing majorities around us, enjoying the company of Christians and other believers in relationships of friendship and mutual or one-sided (atheists for believers) respect.

In a forum like this, attitudes get more extreme. That's because we don't have to deal with each other person-to-person in the real world. We don't have to "pull punches" or be polite, especially when we are called on assertions that we cannot or do not substantiate.

All that said, a case can be made that believers should, at some point in their lives, try to remember how they came to believe as they do and decide anew whether those beliefs are due for revision or even rejection. Doing so is essential to the process of intellectual maturation. Unreserved retention of childhood beliefs stunts intellectual growth by giving precedence to more emotional approaches to such evaluations. Do their beliefs hold up to a hard-headed skeptical approach? If not, where can they go from here?

These are not questions that anyone can answer for another, but refusing to ask them at all inhibits the integration of the mind and the emotions into a consistent understanding of oneself, one's surroundings, and the world/universe as a whole. Should you become an atheist? Perhaps not--probably not. Should you seriously reconsider what your parents and preachers taught you before you were old enough to evaluate it critically? Absolutely.
Thinking

Stockbridge, UK

#17 Mar 17, 2014
Yet Nelson Mandela was a very untrustworthy husband who had much extra marital sex.
Carchar king wrote:
A true atheist is Charlie sheen. A drug addict or heavy drinker, having sex with random strangers and just not respecting anyone or even not having respect for himself.
A true christian is someone who has giving in to God and helps other such as Nelson Mandela and Billy Graham
Thinking

Stockbridge, UK

#18 Mar 17, 2014
Reality is hardly affected by what you merely wish for.
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
I thought about it and realize it's impossible for our universe to come from nothing, science the greatest invention ever, doesn't have a clue how the universe came from nothing
Thinking

Stockbridge, UK

#19 Mar 17, 2014
You previously posted all Atheists are despicable people.
I don't hold the same position regarding all believers.

You are a scummy hater and unworthy of respect.
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah, if you can't prove the universe came from nothing, then why should i be a atheist.
We christians live just a balanced lives as any other person, we don't criticise other's beliefs, because we have the discipline and respect for the choices people make in their lives.
But for atheists, respect isn't even in the dictionary.

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“BAS in Electrical Engineering”

Since: Jan 14

Location hidden

#20 Mar 17, 2014
Carchar king wrote:
<quoted text>
Nah, if you can't prove the universe came from nothing, then why should i be a atheist.
We christians live just a balanced lives as any other person, we don't criticise other's beliefs, because we have the discipline and respect for the choices people make in their lives.
But for atheists, respect isn't even in the dictionary.
If that were true then what are the crusades about? I am also pretty sure that I would never have to defend my disbelief to a god if it weren't for religious people. I am constantly berated because of religious people. At least the ones that speak up anyway.

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