Atheists, give up your lost religion and seek the truth of Jesus

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Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#81
Dec 5, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
Not Mom or Dad, my own study and reason.
You live in the Bible Belt and not surprisingly adopted fundamentalist Christianity as your religion. The things that everyone around you in family, teachers, associates, etc. are chanting are "The Truth" you have, shockingly, decided are, in fact, The Truth™.

Had you been born and raised in Saudi Arabia and Mom and Dad had prostrated themselves 5 times a day in the direction of Mecca, what religion do you think you would have studied, applied reason to, and found to be The Truth™?
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
In the ancient past, the people were given ample empirical evidence; the difference is only time, since we didn't live when God was making Himself known directly.
Or those old Bronze Age fables about God speaking through burning bushes, etc. were just that -- fables. Isn't that a much simpler, less tortured and convoluted explanation than "God was making Himself known directly in Bible times, but he doesn't anymore"? Apply a little of that "reason" to the question. It shouldn't be hard.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
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I am open minded to anything sensible. That's the problem, evo makes no sense,
??? It has made perfect sense to the world's scientists for the past 150 years.

Every creature of every species is slightly different from its parents when it is born.

There is no known barrier to the accumulation of these changes and differences.

Eventually, some part of each species is so different from the original species that it no longer mates with the original and is considered a new species.

This is what the fossil record shows. It's what the DNA genome shows.

There isn't the slightest bit of controversy about it in science. Some continuing and healthy debate about how the mechanisms work exactly, but no controversy at all about the fact that evolution occurs.

The only ones who disagree, really, are a small group of American fundamentalist Christians who feel their chosen Bible interpretation is threatened and cannot be correct if evolution occurs.

And since they have been TOLD and PROGRAMMED that this interpretation is correct, then 150 years of science and the entire world scientific community must be wrong and part of a giant Satanic conspiracy, as thoroughly improbable as that is.

“Putten the SIN ”

Since: Nov 08

back in Wisconsin

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#82
Dec 5, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
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Atheism is the belief that there is no God, or gods, and that we all came into existence through evolution. Atheism is, IOW, a religion whose god is the self and whose prophet is time.
Soooo what about all those Atheists that dont believe in evolution??

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

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#83
Dec 6, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
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Funny, Education used to be Bible-based and produced some of the greatest thinkers in history. I say that current "education" is what is dumbing people down!
Some thinkers in history were christian for sure however given 2000 years of being beaten around the head with the god book, it is relatively few compared to say the last few humndred years when education began to cover subjects wider than learning to say prayers in Latin

It seems that your education may be dumbing you down but don’t paint everyone with your brush.

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

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#84
Dec 6, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
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I don't have to produce the proof. You have a computer and the Internet; there are numerous sites that provide the proof much better than I could!
Yes, believe me I looked, I have done serious research both for myslef and during my time at university. Guess what? There is none… NONE… as I suspect you already know, so lying about it simply shows you to be a liar.

This is exactly the reason why I say that YOU CANNOT PROVIDE ANY PROOF.

However if you can provide just one (that’s ONE… O – N – E) link to genuine peer reviewed academic work that suggest proof does exist I will review it.

BTW you should know that those compeers and Internet were developed by quantum science, not religion

“I started out with nothing”

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

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#85
Dec 6, 2013
 

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Good Without God wrote:
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Satan is ludicrous!
Nope I’ve met Ludicrous and he assures me he is not satan…;-)
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#86
Dec 6, 2013
 

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FollowerofChrist wrote:
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I don't have to produce the proof. You have a computer and the Internet; there are numerous sites that provide the proof much better than I could!
Can you give us the name of one single qualified, PhD'ed working biologist who is NOT a Christian and NOT religious, and yet who thinks the world is young and species were special-created all at once BASED SOLELY ON THE EVIDENCE?

“Reason's Greetings!”

Since: Feb 11

Pale Blue Dot

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#87
Dec 6, 2013
 

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gotnatas wrote:
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Soooo what about all those Atheists that dont believe in evolution??
When will they realize that Atheism and Evolution have nothing to do with each other? Maybe when they start thinking for themselves?

“Putten the SIN ”

Since: Nov 08

back in Wisconsin

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#88
Dec 6, 2013
 
MrDesoto1 wrote:
<quoted text>
When will they realize that Atheism and Evolution have nothing to do with each other? Maybe when they start thinking for themselves?
Most definitely.

Hey maybe if we conflate enuff things together that will make our position right. GENIUS!!

Maybe if I say up is down and left is right that will make it so??
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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Dec 7, 2013
 

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To those of you who are harping on "qualifications" and "peer review": Creation scientists who write for the major sites, CM, ICR, AIG, are highly qualified with the same degrees as your evolutionists. They are simply not seeking to eliminate God from the picture. And peer review is nothing more than a biased, back-patting. Yes, it has some merits, but it is also completely biased and still allows poor work to seep through. How many peer reviewed papers have proven to be completely wrong?!

I'd love to see just ONE of you all admit that the only reason evolutionary theory exists at all is that it allows for the removal of the "devine foot," as one of your own, Richard Lewontin, admitted!
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#91
Dec 7, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
To those of you who are harping on "qualifications" and "peer review": Creation scientists who write for the major sites, CM, ICR, AIG, are highly qualified with the same degrees as your evolutionists. They are simply not seeking to eliminate God from the picture.
There is no such thing as a "creation scientist." Such people are Christian religionists working a Christian religious agenda deceptively frosted with a bit of sciencey-sounding language.

Check out the Answers in Genesis "Statement of Faith" page:
http://www.answersingenesis.org/about/faith

Scroll to the very bottom, where you read:

"6. No apparent, perceived or claimed evidence in any field, including history and chronology, can be valid if it contradicts the Scriptural record."

In other words, "our strict interpretation of the Bible trumps science, no matter what the scientific evidence says."

These people are NOT doing science, but religious apologetics.

A scientist actually doing REAL SCIENCE does not start with the assumption that a literal reading of the Genesis Creation Myth is factual history, then tries to (somehow) make all the evidentiary pieces fit into that absurd paradigm.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
And peer review is nothing more than a biased, back-patting. Yes, it has some merits, but it is also completely biased and still allows poor work to seep through. How many peer reviewed papers have proven to be completely wrong?!
Whether "poor" work occasionally seeps through is not the point.

The main merit of peer-reviewed science is that it eliminates right off the bat NON-science like Christian religious apologetics that is attempted to be slipped deceptively in public school SCIENCE classes.
FollowerofChrist wrote:
I'd love to see just ONE of you all admit that the only reason evolutionary theory exists at all is that it allows for the removal of the "devine foot," as one of your own, Richard Lewontin, admitted!
Why would anyone admit that? It's a lie.

Evolutionary theory explains what we plainly see and measure and record. Fundamentalist Christian Creationism does NOT, and is absurdly far from being able to do so. You have to DISREGARD 99% of the geological, biological, fossil and DNA evidence in order to "preach" Christian Creationism.

I have given you a number of web links to Protestant Christian groups and individuals who say evolution is correct because the evidence supports it. I can give you more.

see below
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#92
Dec 7, 2013
 
I went to the following webpage, which is on the site of the Souther Baptist Convention.

THis page lists all the colleges and universities that are affiliated with the Souther Baptists.

One of the first list is Samford University, which has a biology major.

On the Samford University website, I find this:

http://howard.samford.edu/uploadedFiles/Howar...

Statement on Evolution

Scientific understanding is advanced by the rigorous review of evidence about natural phenomena. Evolution, a foundational concept in biology, has been established through empirical evidence, and the consensus of the scientific community is that evolution is the best
explanation for the origins of biological diversity. Because an understanding of evolution is critical to the advancement of human health, the preservation of our environment, and an understanding of biological processes, our department strongly supports the teaching of evolution as an essential component of a quality education in the sciences.

Many scientists who study evolution hold deep religious convictions, and many religious organizations have issued statements in support of teaching evolution. The biology faculty at Samford University support the university’s mission to nurture persons for God, for learning,
forever, and believe in the compatibility of science and religion in regard to human origins and biological diversity. One of the benefits of a Samford education is an opportunity to view life from multiple perspectives, and many Samford faculty members have taken an active role in leading discussions about human origins in a variety of scholarly and religious settings.

For further reading:
The American Scientific Affiliation ( http://www.asa3.org/ )

AAAS Dialogue on Science, Education and Religion
( http://www.aaas.org/spp/dser/ )

The Center for Theology and the Natural Sciences
( http://www.ctns.org/about.html )

ELCA Alliance for Faith, Science, and Technology
( http://www.elca.org/faithandscience/ )

Episcopal Church Committee on Science, Technology, and Faith
( http://www.episcopalchurch.org/science/ )

The Metanexus Institute
( http://www.metanexus.net/metanexus_online/con... )

The Clergy Letter Project
( http://www.uwosh.edu/colleges/cols/clergy_pro... )
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#93
Dec 7, 2013
 
The chances are good that I will find this kind of support from college science departments ALL OVER THIS LIST of Baptist colleges and universities!

Why is that, Follower?

Do you think ANY of these accredited Christian colleges and universities teach that the world is only 6,000 years old and all the evidence points to that?

If not, WHY NOT?
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#94
Dec 7, 2013
 
I forgot to post the link to the Souther Baptist Convention listing their affiliated colleges and universities. Here it is:

http://www.sbc.net/colleges.asp
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#95
Dec 7, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
I'd love to see just ONE of you all admit that the only reason evolutionary theory exists at all is that it allows for the removal of the "devine foot," as one of your own, Richard Lewontin, admitted!
http://www.don-lindsay-archive.org/creation/q...

Here is what Richard C. Lewontin actually thinks:

It is time for students of the evolutionary process, especially those who have been misquoted and used by the creationists, to state clearly that evolution is a FACT, not theory, and that what is at issue within biology are questions of details of the process and the relative importance of different mechanisms of evolution.

It is a FACT that the earth with liquid water, is more than 3.6 billion years old. It is a FACT that cellular life has been around for at least half of that period and that organized multicellular life is at least 800 million years old.

It is a FACT that major life forms now on earth were not at all represented in the past. There were no birds or mammals 250 million years ago.

It is a FACT that major life forms of the past are no longer living. There used to be dinosaurs and Pithecanthropus, and there are none now.

It is a FACT that all living forms come from previous living forms. Therefore, all present forms of life arose from ancestral forms that were different. Birds arose from nonbirds and humans from nonhumans.

No person who pretends to any understanding of the natural world can deny these facts any more than she or he can deny that the earth is round, rotates on its axis, and revolves around the sun.

The controversies about evolution lie in the realm of the relative importance of various forces in molding evolution.

R. C. Lewontin "Evolution/Creation Debate: A Time for Truth" Bioscience 31, 559 (1981) reprinted in Evolution versus Creationism J. Peter Zetterberg ed., ORYX Press, Phoenix AZ 1983

“Reason's Greetings!”

Since: Feb 11

Pale Blue Dot

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#96
Dec 7, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
To those of you who are harping on "qualifications" and "peer review": Creation scientists who write for the major sites, CM, ICR, AIG, are highly qualified with the same degrees as your evolutionists. They are simply not seeking to eliminate God from the picture. And peer review is nothing more than a biased, back-patting. Yes, it has some merits, but it is also completely biased and still allows poor work to seep through. How many peer reviewed papers have proven to be completely wrong?!
I'd love to see just ONE of you all admit that the only reason evolutionary theory exists at all is that it allows for the removal of the "devine foot," as one of your own, Richard Lewontin, admitted!
See Below for "A List of Scientists Who Became Creationists After Studying the Evidence" in 2013:
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#97
Dec 7, 2013
 

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Gillette wrote:
The chances are good that I will find this kind of support from college science departments ALL OVER THIS LIST of Baptist colleges and universities!
Why is that, Follower?
Do you think ANY of these accredited Christian colleges and universities teach that the world is only 6,000 years old and all the evidence points to that?
If not, WHY NOT?
Very easily explained: the Bible say that in the latter days there will be a great falling away from the faith. This is all nothing more than further proof that the Bible is true and correct. These are all compromisers who have chosen, for whatever reason, to err on the side of humanism rather than stick with the truth of the Bible.

And what you said in another post about the statement of faith of AIG, that any science that contradicts the Bible is wrong, is correct. If it says something that goes against the Bible, then it must be man's science, or the interpretation thereof, that is in error.
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#98
Dec 7, 2013
 

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Gillette wrote:
<quoted text>
http://www.don-lindsay-archive.org/creation/q...
Here is what Richard C. Lewontin actually thinks:
It is time for students of the evolutionary process, especially those who have been misquoted and used by the creationists, to state clearly that evolution is a FACT, not theory, and that what is at issue within biology are questions of details of the process and the relative importance of different mechanisms of evolution.
It is a FACT that the earth with liquid water, is more than 3.6 billion years old. It is a FACT that cellular life has been around for at least half of that period and that organized multicellular life is at least 800 million years old.
It is a FACT that major life forms now on earth were not at all represented in the past. There were no birds or mammals 250 million years ago.
It is a FACT that major life forms of the past are no longer living. There used to be dinosaurs and Pithecanthropus, and there are none now.
It is a FACT that all living forms come from previous living forms. Therefore, all present forms of life arose from ancestral forms that were different. Birds arose from nonbirds and humans from nonhumans.
No person who pretends to any understanding of the natural world can deny these facts any more than she or he can deny that the earth is round, rotates on its axis, and revolves around the sun.
The controversies about evolution lie in the realm of the relative importance of various forces in molding evolution.
R. C. Lewontin "Evolution/Creation Debate: A Time for Truth" Bioscience 31, 559 (1981) reprinted in Evolution versus Creationism J. Peter Zetterberg ed., ORYX Press, Phoenix AZ 1983
Evolution is not a fact and anyone who says so lies, or is misinformed! Again, it is all an agenda to remove God from the picture. If the "evidence" one day points to Spongebob Squarepants as the creator, evolutionists would probably be ok with it! Fools, all of them!
FollowerofChrist

Fairmont, WV

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#99
Dec 7, 2013
 

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Here it is in a nutshell:
Believe on Jesus and be saved, or believe in your god, yourselves, and be lost!
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#100
Dec 7, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
<quoted text>
Very easily explained: the Bible say that in the latter days there will be a great falling away from the faith. This is all nothing more than further proof that the Bible is true and correct. These are all compromisers who have chosen, for whatever reason, to err on the side of humanism rather than stick with the truth of the Bible.
And what you said in another post about the statement of faith of AIG, that any science that contradicts the Bible is wrong, is correct. If it says something that goes against the Bible, then it must be man's science, or the interpretation thereof, that is in error.
Thanks for confirming that what you "preach" here (badly and ignorantly, I might add) is not science but religion.

Th various courts in the US have agreed, as they have forbidden the teaching of Jesus Freak "creationism" in public schools.

As for all these other Christians -- Baptists, by the way -- being "not Real Christian™ like yourself, well, you're just being silly.

Here is what the Southern Baptists believe and confess. Sound familiar, "Christian"?

"I. The Scriptures

The Holy Bible was written by men divinely inspired and is God's revelation of Himself to man. It is a perfect treasure of divine instruction. It has God for its author, salvation for its end, and truth, without any mixture of error, for its matter. Therefore, all Scripture is totally true and trustworthy. It reveals the principles by which God judges us, and therefore is, and will remain to the end of the world, the true center of Christian union, and the supreme standard by which all human conduct, creeds, and religious opinions should be tried. All Scripture is a testimony to Christ, who is Himself the focus of divine revelation.

Exodus 24:4; Deuteronomy 4:1-2; 17:19; Joshua 8:34; Psalms 19:7-10; 119:11,89,105,140; Isaiah 34:16; 40:8; Jeremiah 15:16; 36:1-32; Matthew 5:17-18; 22:29; Luke 21:33; 24:44-46; John 5:39; 16:13-15; 17:17; Acts 2:16ff.; 17:11; Romans 15:4; 16:25-26; 2 Timothy 3:15-17; Hebrews 1:1-2; 4:12; 1 Peter 1:25; 2 Peter 1:19-21.

II. God

There is one and only one living and true God. He is an intelligent, spiritual, and personal Being, the Creator, Redeemer, Preserver, and Ruler of the universe. God is infinite in holiness and all other perfections. God is all powerful and all knowing; and His perfect knowledge extends to all things, past, present, and future, including the future decisions of His free creatures. To Him we owe the highest love, reverence, and obedience. The eternal triune God reveals Himself to us as Father, Son, and Holy Spirit, with distinct personal attributes, but without division of nature, essence, or being.

A. God the Father

God as Father reigns with providential care over His universe, His creatures, and the flow of the stream of human history according to the purposes of His grace. He is all powerful, all knowing, all loving, and all wise. God is Father in truth to those who become children of God through faith in Jesus Christ. He is fatherly in His attitude toward all men.

Genesis 1:1; 2:7; Exodus 3:14; 6:2-3; 15:11ff.; 20:1ff.; Leviticus 22:2; Deuteronomy 6:4; 32:6; 1 Chronicles 29:10; Psalm 19:1-3; Isaiah 43:3,15; 64:8; Jeremiah 10:10; 17:13; Matthew 6:9ff.; 7:11; 23:9; 28:19; Mark 1:9-11; John 4:24; 5:26; 14:6-13; 17:1-8; Acts 1:7; Romans 8:14-15; 1 Corinthians 8:6; Galatians 4:6; Ephesians 4:6; Colossians 1:15; 1 Timothy 1:17; Hebrews 11:6; 12:9; 1 Peter 1:17; 1 John 5:7.

B. God the Son

Christ is the eternal Son of God. In His incarnation as Jesus Christ He was conceived of the Holy Spirit and born of the virgin Mary. Jesus perfectly revealed and did the will of God, taking upon Himself human nature with its demands and necessities and identifying Himself completely with mankind yet without sin.

Etc. etc.

http://www.sbc.org/bfm/bfm2000.asp

And yet, their science departments teach that evolution occurred and occurs! LOL
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

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#101
Dec 7, 2013
 
FollowerofChrist wrote:
Here it is in a nutshell:
Believe on Jesus and be saved, or believe in your god, yourselves, and be lost!
Live in that terrified little world of your Christian cult programming.

The rest of us prefer to live in reality.

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