Atheism, antifoundationalism, and pol...

Atheism, antifoundationalism, and politics

There are 5 comments on the Politics in the Zeros story from Jun 18, 2012, titled Atheism, antifoundationalism, and politics. In it, Politics in the Zeros reports that:

Over the past couple of years, I've trended strongly towards antifoundationalism, which is a rejection of fundamental truths or beliefs as a basis for analysis or inquiry.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Politics in the Zeros.

“I Am No One Else”

Since: Apr 12

Seattle

#1 Jun 18, 2012
AA founder requires that the people in that group be stupid and broken, AA doesn't build up self realization or self inspiration it only tears the self down, just like religion. That is why it's no more successful than being without it.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#2 Jun 18, 2012
Quote, "..the beliefs that a person holds are beliefs they accept as true. That’s just as true for a scientist as it is for a Christian."
Science is based on evidence and reason. Christianity is superstition.

One should only believe anything as far as it can be justified by evidence and reason.
Amused

Lowell, MA

#3 Jun 18, 2012
What an irrational screed. The author makes the classic theist assumption that values systems can only be built upon a foundation of belief in a god. If this assumption is false, the rest of his argument falls like a house of cards.

Let's look for a moment at whether that assumption is true or false. Christians and jews point to the ten commandments as the foundation for their system of right and wrong. Taking out the 4 commandments that deal with men's relations with god, and the six remaining commandments are:
Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.

You shall not murder.

You shall not commit adultery.

You shall not steal.

You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.

You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”

Buddhists revere the Buddha as an enlightened teacher, but as a human teacher, not a deity. Buddhism is neutral on the questioin of creation, and buddhism is compatible with atheism, in that no belief in a creator/god is necessary to buddhist belief. The bedrock of buddhist morality is the Five Precepts. They are:

1. Don't kill.
2. Don't lie.
3. Don't steal.
4. Don't drink alcohol.
5. Don't commit adultery.

Remarkably similar to the commandments. So, apparently, entirely without reference to any divine command, an atheistic society arrived at essentially the same value system. This would demonstrate that values systems can exist as internally consistent, coherent systems without the need to invent a god to command them.

The author then goes on to suggest, based upon no evidence whatsoever, that atheists reject the values of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". Quite apart from the fact that there is no evidence suggesting that atheists do, in fact, reject these supposed foundational values, the author neglects to mention that the phrase "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" was penned by a deist, not a theist. Perhaps the author did not grasp that a creator god that is indifferent to the fate of his creation imparts no values, but merely leaves his creations to work things out for themselves, a position much closer to how atheists derive their values than theists do.

Perhaps the author is incapable of understanding that life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness are more dear to atheists who believe that this life is the only one you will get and that it is finite than it is to those who believe in an eternal afterlife where they will be rewarded and attain complete happiness.

All in all, a poorly reasoned, fact-free bit of reciting theist biases and assumptions.
redneck

Glendale, OR

#4 Jun 18, 2012
KittenKoder wrote:
AA founder requires that the people in that group be stupid and broken, AA doesn't build up self realization or self inspiration it only tears the self down, just like religion. That is why it's no more successful than being without it.
I read a book by a professional con man. He claimed to find easy prey by attending AA meetings.
havent forgotten

Lamoni, IA

#5 Jun 25, 2012
Thank you for the first rate review and commentary, now I do not have to read the article. But it was useful in provoking your fine reply.
Amused wrote:
What an irrational screed. The author makes the classic theist assumption that values systems can only be built upon a foundation of belief in a god. If this assumption is false, the rest of his argument falls like a house of cards.
Let's look for a moment at whether that assumption is true or false. Christians and jews point to the ten commandments as the foundation for their system of right and wrong. Taking out the 4 commandments that deal with men's relations with god, and the six remaining commandments are:
Honor your father and your mother, that your days may be long upon the land which the Lord your God is giving you.
You shall not murder.
You shall not commit adultery.
You shall not steal.
You shall not bear false witness against your neighbor.
You shall not covet your neighbor’s house; you shall not covet your neighbor’s wife, nor his manservant, nor his maidservant, nor his ox, nor his donkey, nor anything that is your neighbor’s.”
Buddhists revere the Buddha as an enlightened teacher, but as a human teacher, not a deity. Buddhism is neutral on the questioin of creation, and buddhism is compatible with atheism, in that no belief in a creator/god is necessary to buddhist belief. The bedrock of buddhist morality is the Five Precepts. They are:
1. Don't kill.
2. Don't lie.
3. Don't steal.
4. Don't drink alcohol.
5. Don't commit adultery.
Remarkably similar to the commandments. So, apparently, entirely without reference to any divine command, an atheistic society arrived at essentially the same value system. This would demonstrate that values systems can exist as internally consistent, coherent systems without the need to invent a god to command them.
The author then goes on to suggest, based upon no evidence whatsoever, that atheists reject the values of "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness". Quite apart from the fact that there is no evidence suggesting that atheists do, in fact, reject these supposed foundational values, the author neglects to mention that the phrase "life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness" was penned by a deist, not a theist. Perhaps the author did not grasp that a creator god that is indifferent to the fate of his creation imparts no values, but merely leaves his creations to work things out for themselves, a position much closer to how atheists derive their values than theists do.
Perhaps the author is incapable of understanding that life, liberty and the pursuit of happiness are more dear to atheists who believe that this life is the only one you will get and that it is finite than it is to those who believe in an eternal afterlife where they will be rewarded and attain complete happiness.
All in all, a poorly reasoned, fact-free bit of reciting theist biases and assumptions.

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