Atheism Destroyed At Last! - The Deba...

Since: Jan 14

United States

#870 Apr 6, 2014
Reason Personified,
I am Consistency Personified. I can discuss from the 'beginning' of time to the 'end' of time, and you will never find me self-contradicting.
I still maintain that God is everything, i.e. all things put together, including you yourself.
So, whatever epithet you ascribe to God, wholly you are inscribing on your person.
We are, each and everyone of us, microcosms of the larger Universe, Nature, Truth, All, Cosmos, Love, Life, Intelligence, Mind, Existence, name It! It will still be God, all the same.

Since: Jun 12

Location hidden

#871 Apr 6, 2014
jide oni wrote:
Reason Personified,
I am Consistency Personified. I can discuss from the 'beginning' of time to the 'end' of time, and you will never find me self-contradicting.
I still maintain that God is everything, i.e. all things put together, including you yourself.
So, whatever epithet you ascribe to God, wholly you are inscribing on your person.
We are, each and everyone of us, microcosms of the larger Universe, Nature, Truth, All, Cosmos, Love, Life, Intelligence, Mind, Existence, name It! It will still be God, all the same.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#872 Apr 6, 2014
“A foolish consistency is the hobgoblin of little minds, adored by little statesmen and philosophers and divines.”

― Ralph Waldo Emerson, Self-Reliance

Since: Jan 14

United States

#873 Apr 6, 2014
Foolish consistency is more consistent with commonsense than with any inconsistency at all.
He who is consistently inconsistent is consistent, at least his inconsistency is well regulated and quite predictable; whereas, he who is inconsistently consistent is very much inconsistent indeed. such that his incidental consistency is so haphazard and unpredictable.
if consistent inconsistency passes muster, then foolish consistency will more than pass muster.
nightserf,
Expressing the superficial in a profound style is as ingenious as expressing the profound in a plain style.
i seldom quote great minds, because i am great myself, and i'd rather you guys started quoting me.
he who knows, and doesn't know that he knows, knows less than him who doesn't know, and knows that he doesn't know.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#874 Apr 6, 2014
jide oni wrote:
Foolish consistency is more consistent with commonsense than with any inconsistency at all.
He who is consistently inconsistent is consistent, at least his inconsistency is well regulated and quite predictable; whereas, he who is inconsistently consistent is very much inconsistent indeed. such that his incidental consistency is so haphazard and unpredictable.
if consistent inconsistency passes muster, then foolish consistency will more than pass muster.
nightserf,
Expressing the superficial in a profound style is as ingenious as expressing the profound in a plain style.
i seldom quote great minds, because i am great myself, and i'd rather you guys started quoting me.
he who knows, and doesn't know that he knows, knows less than him who doesn't know, and knows that he doesn't know.
That was merely a lame attempt at humor, right?

Since: Jan 14

Europe

#875 Apr 6, 2014
NightSerf wrote:
<quoted text>That was merely a lame attempt at humor, right?
Sense of humor, a mark of intelligence.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#876 Apr 6, 2014
jide oni wrote:
<quoted text>
Sense of humor, a mark of intelligence.
That rather depends on the quality of the humor, though, don't you think?

Since: Jan 14

Europe

#877 Apr 6, 2014
NightSerf wrote:
<quoted text>That rather depends on the quality of the humor, though, don't you think?
No. Sense of humor, an essentially positive trait.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#878 Apr 7, 2014
jide oni wrote:
<quoted text>
No. Sense of humor, an essentially positive trait.
So moronic humor shows intelligence?

Since: Jan 14

United States

#879 Apr 7, 2014
NightSerf wrote:
<quoted text>
So moronic humor shows intelligence?
Moronic clownishness. No moronic sense of humor.

Since: Jan 14

United States

#880 Apr 7, 2014
Answers needed:
Are man-made laws perfect?

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#881 Apr 7, 2014
jide oni wrote:
Answers needed:
Are man-made laws perfect?
Of course not, but there are no other laws for governing human behavior, and that's all that man-made laws do. I know that you claim that there are perfect laws from your god, but you haven't shown that your god exists, so the most logical conclusion is that those ones are man-made too. They're just made by people presuming to speak for a god or gods that do not, in fact, exist.

You still don't seem to understand that when you make assertions that your readers don't accept (and, so far, that seems to be all or most of them), that you must then do the work to substantiate those assertions according to their standards and requirements, not your own. You're not trying to convince yourself, after all. You've already done that. It was easy. Convincing others, especially this group of exacting skeptics, is hard work that, as of yet, you have been unwilling or unable to perform.

You have yet to convince anyone of anything in the course of either of your threads That should tell you something.

Since: Jan 14

United States

#882 Apr 7, 2014
Are the imperfect man-made laws the products of man's imperfect intelligence?

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#883 Apr 7, 2014
jide oni wrote:
Are the imperfect man-made laws the products of man's imperfect intelligence?
Partially, but it's more the natural result of imperfect processes for deciding about laws to govern human behavior and affaires. Everyone has their ow ideas about how things should be done, and one of the basic properties of the compromises that must be made as a result is that they don't please anyone completely. Still, it's better than in times and places where decisions are made autocratically by despots and dictators.

Still, the perfect laws that you claim come from your god actually come from the minds of those who would make themselves despots and dictators in the name of your god that no one except you actually believes to exist. Men who would be kings because they believe in their own greatness and that all should praise (worship?) them, but who are in fact pathetic little losers with delusions of grandeur.

Yes, people like you.

Exactly you, in fact.

Since: Jan 14

United States

#884 Apr 7, 2014
What are the imperfections of the man-made laws?

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#885 Apr 7, 2014
jide oni wrote:
What are the imperfections of the man-made laws?

No, no further down this line of questioning. I, for one, and not here to be interrogated or subjected to socratic manipulation, i.e. a series of questions designed to control the conversation, avoid rebuttal,and lead the dialogue to a pre-planned conclusion. I don't allow myself to be drawn into manipulative dialogue.

If you have some more cogent points to make, do so. Set them out in one clear post that follows some sort of logical progression. If your points are as convincing as you hope this line of socratic dialogue would be if I allowed it continue, I will see it. If not, I will point out its shortcomings and maybe you can amend it satisfactorily. But I have my doubts about that.

So far, you have failed to differentiate yourself in your failed mission to this community of atheists, nonbelievers, and skeptics from others who have tried the same thing before you. You are just as certain that your religion is only true one and that minds that have cleared themselves from the others will be free to see the truth in yours.(Yes, we've seen this before.) Your approach in the beginning has the same basic mix of forced congeniality and arrogance. You presume that you are superior to other forum participants, but try to hide that most of the time.(You tipped your hand when you wrote that we should be praising you.)

But the sad fact is that you are average at best both as a writer and a thinker. Since this is a place where people express ideas by writing, that puts you at a distinct disadvantage. In spite of this, some of us have given you the courtesy of reading your posts, thinking about them, and responding. If you've not received the acclamation that you had hoped for, it is because you have failed to overcome the skepticism that attracts people to this forum in the first place.

At this point, though, I suspect that I've read everything that you have to offer. I'll continue to peek in in case you surprise us with something new, but failing that, I'm pretty much done with you. I wish you happiness, long life, and good health, though, and hope that you will eventually free yourself of your delusions.

Since: Jan 14

United States

#886 Apr 7, 2014
Are man-made laws imperfect?
Yes.
Are the imperfect man-made laws the products of the imperfect intelligence of man?
Yes.
What are the imperfections of the man-made laws?
1. They are violable,
2. They are
changeable,
3. They have
exceptions.
Are there perfect laws that naturally operate on man and all of existence?
Yes.
Can you give an example of the perfect laws?
1. The law of balance,
2. The law of economy of life (death),
3. The law of natural justice etc.
What are the perfections of the natural laws?
1. They are inviolable,
2. They are permanent,
3. They have no exceptions.
If the imperfect man-made laws are the products of the imperfect intelligpence of man, aren't the perfect natural laws the products of perfect intelligence?
Yes.
Isn't the perfect intelligence superior to the imperfect intelligence?
Yes.
Isn't the superior intelligence supreme after all?
Yes, It is.
Isn't the supreme intelligence a thing, an entity or a being?
Yes, It is.
Then, a supreme being is evident.
Thinking

Wellingborough, UK

#887 Apr 7, 2014
More bollocks from you.
jide oni wrote:
Are man-made laws imperfect?
Yes.
Are the imperfect man-made laws the products of the imperfect intelligence of man?
Yes.
What are the imperfections of the man-made laws?
1. They are violable,
2. They are
changeable,
3. They have
exceptions.
Are there perfect laws that naturally operate on man and all of existence?
Yes.
Can you give an example of the perfect laws?
1. The law of balance,
2. The law of economy of life (death),
3. The law of natural justice etc.
What are the perfections of the natural laws?
1. They are inviolable,
2. They are permanent,
3. They have no exceptions.
If the imperfect man-made laws are the products of the imperfect intelligpence of man, aren't the perfect natural laws the products of perfect intelligence?
Yes.
Isn't the perfect intelligence superior to the imperfect intelligence?
Yes.
Isn't the superior intelligence supreme after all?
Yes, It is.
Isn't the supreme intelligence a thing, an entity or a being?
Yes, It is.
Then, a supreme being is evident.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#888 Apr 7, 2014
The hypothetical law of balance is an attempt to assert that Newton's third law (for every action, there is an equal and opposite reaction), which is not actually a law in modern scientific parlance, but an element of one aspect of the theory of inertia, is also a metaphysical principle. Its association with real science is supposed to lend it credence and avoid the skeptic's natural response, "Interesting idea, but is it true?" Unlike Newton's principle, though, it cannot be tested via the scientific method. Its support consists of stories that seem to support it, but for every one of those, I can find one that calls it into question.

The "Law of Balance," then, is not a law at all, but one more philosophical abstraction that has no more support than anything else in the collection of claptrap that is religion.

As far as I can tell, the "Law of Economy (Death)" is jide oni's own invention, which he will share for $21.98 in a book self-published via Lulu. From what he's written here, I gather that it combines the Hindu principles of karma and reincarnation to promote the idea that spiritual life is neither created nor destroyed and that everything comes out even in the end.

Again, an interesting idea with no reason for a skeptic to see it as more than a complex exercise in wishful thinking.

The phrase "natural justice" has meaning in English law, but I'm pretty sure that's not what jide oni means. I think it's another aspect of his view karma and reincarnation combining to make everything come out even. Again, to a skeptic, it's only an interesting bit of wishful thinking.

These "laws" do not exist outside of the imaginings of oni and people like him. As such, they cannot be inviolable or permanent.(How is it that oni doesn't even realize that inviolability is the same as having no exceptions?)

Man's laws have been a work in progress as long as they have existed. Like all other such endeavors, they move towards perfection, albeit slowly, and without the possibility of reaching it, as man's collecting intelligence grows over time.

But just as Oni's laws do not exist, nor does the perfect intelligence that he conjures to have created them.

No perfect intelligence.

No supreme intelligence.

No supreme being.

No evidence.

No logic.

No reason. No QED.

It's just another set of The Emperor's New Clothes. No substance. an intricate weave of nothing at all.

Since: Jan 14

Europe

#889 Apr 7, 2014
Thinking wrote:
More bollocks from you.
<quoted text>
killer bollocks?

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