Atheism to Defeat Religion by 2038

Apr 25, 2012 Full story: Psychology Today 23,565

My blog posts on religion have attracted a lot of controversy. Religious people are annoyed by my claim that belief in God will go the way of horse transportation, and for much the same reason, specifically an improved standard of living.

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rio

Beckenham, UK

#12379 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
If the churches keep more in taxes not paid than they spend on matters of values to the taxpayers, then they are a burden on the taxpayers. In America, this is estimated to be in excess of 71 billion dollars a year. I'm pretty sure that the churches don't spend nearly that on matters of interest to the general public, and I sure wouldn't take their word for it.
I speak about the UK, which is what I know best.

Churches, like the Church of England, have to maintain the many buildings they own.
They have to provide a stipendary (wages) for their clercy.
They have to subsidide parishes, pay gas, water and electricity bills and other expenses.
They support their own education centers for priesthood.
They finance their media, publish books, pamphlets, CD, DVD, educational material, etc...
Churches also financially support charities, their own and others too.
Churches conduct pastoral duties towards the hospitals, the hospices, the retirement homes, the prisons, the schools, the universities, etc...

I think the public purse is better off exempting churches from taxations than having to support them!

Just look at Germany, where the churches are state supported, and clerics paid by the government, it's an outcry every year when the collossal bill is discussed at the Bundestag! Church goers in Germany pay a special tax to finance the religious expenses afforded by the country. It's an endless subject of discord.

I much prefer the British system. We don't pay for churches, they are financed by voluntary contributions, taxations and the gestion of their portfolio.

I cannot comment about the USA.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12380 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
<quoted text>
Hearing about spirituality is not the same as experiencing it. Try it sometime, you might like it.
What would a Christian know about spirituality? How could you possibly know anything about it given your beliefs? Hint: it has nothing to do with magic, ghosts or spirits.

“Leave That Thing Alone!”

Since: Nov 07

Location hidden

#12381 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
It's undermining your mythology.
Because your church has cast itself in the role of the alternative to science, every scientific achievement is perceived as a setback for religion.
How about that Higgs boson? How about a standing for scientific prophecy and the scientist at CERN who found that it exactly where it was prophesied! And not in terns of vague riddles, either - like Psalms, Isaiah, Nostradamus, Chinese fortune cookies, horoscopes and the Magic 8-Ball. Specific energies.
The prophets of science told us EXACTLY where to look and EXACTLY what we would find there, something never seen before. The physicists said, "Look at this very high energy, and if we're right about reality, you'll find Higgs." And lo and behold, it was. There is absolutely nothing in your bible even remotely resembling that.
Science is broken? Hardly. Our magic is greater than your god.
Excellent post, sir!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12383 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
Only when you don't understand the use of metaphors in transcendent thought.
Transcendent? From Pat Condell:

"The word "transcendent" is very popular with religious hustlers because they never have to explain precisely what they mean by it, other than some vague superior state of understanding more profound than mere reason ... If you hear a senior clergyman (and you will) using the word “transcendent" to explain the nonsense he claims to believe, then you know two things: one: he doesn't know what he's talking about, and two: he doesn't want you to know what he's talking about either.

"Faith-peddlers like to put themselves beyond question by claiming that their faith transcends reason, the very thing that calls it to account. How convenient. Yes, faith transcends reason the way a criminal transcends the law.

"Faith doesn't transcend reason at all. Faith sidesteps reason. It runs away from reason."
rio

Beckenham, UK

#12384 Feb 5, 2013
rio wrote:
<quoted text>
they are financed by voluntary contributions, taxations and the gestion of their portfolio.
I meant donations, not taxation!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12385 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
<quoted text>
That which is beyond the ordinary range of human comprehension cannot be objectified...hence the necessity for metaphors.
Here in the 21st century, you are forced to call your scriptures that have been discredited "metaphor," analogous to somebody caught in a lie saying that he was "Just kidding ... don't be so literal."

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#12386 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
It's undermining your mythology.
Because your church has cast itself in the role of the alternative to science, every scientific achievement is perceived as a setback for religion.
How about that Higgs boson? How about a standing for scientific prophecy and the scientist at CERN who found that it exactly where it was prophesied! And not in terns of vague riddles, either - like Psalms, Isaiah, Nostradamus, Chinese fortune cookies, horoscopes and the Magic 8-Ball. Specific energies.
The prophets of science told us EXACTLY where to look and EXACTLY what we would find there, something never seen before. The physicists said, "Look at this very high energy, and if we're right about reality, you'll find Higgs." And lo and behold, it was. There is absolutely nothing in your bible even remotely resembling that.
Science is broken? Hardly. Our magic is greater than your god.
Not to mention the top quark before that and the W and Z particles before that. And that doesn't mention the host of particles that aren't fundamental (being made of quarks, for example) but are accurately predicted by the theory. And it isn't just the energies, it is also the spins, the parities, the interaction strengths, and other specific properties of the particles.

All in all, much better 'prophesies' than some non-sense about feet of clay or iron.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12387 Feb 5, 2013
TerryL wrote:
<quoted text>Every year the nut-job republicans, in various state assemblies, introduce bills in an attempt to force the teaching of unsupportable myth (creationism/intelligent design) as science to unsuspecting public school students. The fact that those bills are normally shot down before going very far, doesn't offset the fact that they are introduced in the first place! One would think that being shot down over and over and over again that the idiots would get a clue and stop wasting tax payer monies trying to push their religious agendas on people that don't want it!!
Take it up with your state congressmen.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12388 Feb 5, 2013
TerryL wrote:
<quoted text>I'll "live and let live" the day christians start to do the same.
An eye for an eye. The more you comment, the more Christian-like you seem. In many ways orthodox religion and science are similar. Both loudly proclaim their search for truth. Both treat their beliefs as truth, with which no one should tamper. They each have their own vocabulary which is used to enforce their "exclusive" organizations. They both claim to have the way to truth...science by studying the objective world as if were mere objects without intrinsic values. This is where they part ways. Science, in stating that the universe is an accidental creation, a meaningless happenstance clearly conveys a belief that the universe and man's existence has no value...a belief that separates man from his own mystical nature...for who can rely upon the accidental bubblings of hormones and chemicals that somehow form a stew called consciousness? All that remains is what pleasure or accomplishment can somehow be wrested from man's individual biological processes.

“Citizen_Patriot_ Voter_Atheist!”

Since: May 09

Earth,TX

#12389 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
<quoted text>
If the story had not been reported in the newspapers, no one would have known it was a hoax. It would have remained one of science's dirty little secrets.
Think about it. It was science that released the findings to the news media.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12390 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in the 21st century, you are forced to call your scriptures that have been discredited "metaphor," analogous to somebody caught in a lie saying that he was "Just kidding ... don't be so literal."
Oddly enough, your interpretation of the Bible is far more literal than a Christian.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12391 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Transcendent? From Pat Condell:
"The word "transcendent" is very popular with religious hustlers because they never have to explain precisely what they mean by it, other than some vague superior state of understanding more profound than mere reason ... If you hear a senior clergyman (and you will) using the word “transcendent" to explain the nonsense he claims to believe, then you know two things: one: he doesn't know what he's talking about, and two: he doesn't want you to know what he's talking about either.
"Faith-peddlers like to put themselves beyond question by claiming that their faith transcends reason, the very thing that calls it to account. How convenient. Yes, faith transcends reason the way a criminal transcends the law.
"Faith doesn't transcend reason at all. Faith sidesteps reason. It runs away from reason."
If you can have reason without faith, you can have faith without reason.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12392 Feb 5, 2013
Khatru wrote:
<quoted text>
What about "Honour they father and mother"?
Is that an absolute rule?
I said nothing about absolutes. I said the Ten Commandments have influenced our laws as well as our culture.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12393 Feb 5, 2013
Givemeliberty wrote:
So those scientists are looking in their microscopes and saying hmmm... Red blood cells, white blood cells, leukocytes, god stuff, stem cells... Oh wait delete that about about god stuff!
So what is the god stuff levels in our blood? What is the proper range of god stuff?
Lmfao!
<quoted text>
Lame attempts at comedy won't disquise the fact that science doesn't have an answer.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12394 Feb 5, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
I am afraid of the fact that every time the Christians get into power, they decide that those who disagree with them deserve to die.
Your paranoia shows the ways in which private beliefs can distort actual events. The Catholic Church hasn't held political power since the Dark Ages. While the paranoid is convinced that his distorted view is valid, this does not change other people's perception of the same happening.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12395 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
Our very laws, ethics and altruistic ideals are loosely centered around the Ten Commmandments.
“The Ten Commandments fit the United States like $10 shoes, from the first, where we install the "almighty" dollar as an idol, to the last, when we rely on covetousness to turn the wheels of commerce. We keep the Sabbath holy by shopping for bargains and allow and excuse false witness for advertising and political spin. We have been casual about killing for a nation that believes in "Thou shall not kill." And as for adultery, we apparently couldn't have a Congress without it. Beyond all that, we revere the Ten Commandments to shreds.” Tom Blackburn
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12396 Feb 5, 2013
Science will forever escape opening up into any great vision of the meaning of life. As a group, scientists rigorously oppose the existence of telepathy or clairvoyance, or any philosophy that brings these into focus. Only lately, have some begun to think in terms of mind over matter, and even such a possibility disturbs them profoundly, because it shatters the foundations of their scientific stance. But, like the Popes, they are coming along slowly but surely.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12397 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
Spirituality will never fade away.
I hope not. I just want your church to fade away.
insidesecrets wrote:
When you can stop obsessing on religion to the point of fear, your intolerance will dissappear.
Thanks for the heads up. Watch for your church's social clout to disappear before our efforts to reduce it do.
insidesecrets wrote:
You can make your preference known without contempt, rudeness and disrespect.
Or, I can express my contempt and disrespect anyway. Why shouldn't I? What respect has your church ever shown for me, an atheist? Your church deserves no respect because it offers none.
insidesecrets wrote:
There is room enough for every sail (including Christianity) out on the intellectual sea.
See if you can stay afloat.
insidesecrets wrote:
Every theology and philosophy contains wisdom.
Nonsense about theology. It is kin to astrology and phrenology.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#12398 Feb 5, 2013
insidesecrets wrote:
To deny the Christian a voice because of your own personal bias is to be a bigot.
Here's what I call bigotry:

[1] "The fool says in his heart,'There is no God.' They are corrupt, their deeds are vile; there is no one who does good" - Psalm 14:1

[2] "But the fearful, and unbelieving, and the abominable, and murderers, and whoremongers, and sorcerers, and idolaters, and all liars, shall have their part in the lake which burneth with fire and brimstone." - Revelation 21:8 And the result of such hate speech is predictable:

[3]“No, I don’t know that atheists should be considered as citizens, nor should they be considered as patriots. This is one nation under God.”– George H. W. Bush

[4]“Settle it therefore in your minds, as a maxim never to be effaced or forgotten, that atheism is an inhuman, bloody, ferocious system, equally hostile to every useful restraint and to every virtuous affection; that, leaving nothing above us to excite awe, nor round us to awaken tenderness, it wages war with heaven and with earth: its first object is to dethrone God, its next to destroy man.”- Rev. Robert Hall

Sorry, but your church deserves all of the contempt that can be heaped upon it for that. I intend to use similar language regarding your vile abomination of a church wherever possible.

Your church is the moral equivalent of whoremongers and murderers. It should be cast into a lake of fire.

I don't see where your church should even be considered patriotic. It continually tries to undermine the secularist underpinnings of the US Constitution. It is contemptuous of church-state separation.
insidesecrets

Albuquerque, NM

#12400 Feb 5, 2013
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Beofre you proceed any further, you should probably know that secularists don't accept scientific opinions from theists - just from the consensus of experts in good standing in the relevant scientific fields. If the experts say that the theory of evolution is sound and valid science, then the issue is settled until and unless they say otherwise. You and your church have no vote.
If a scientist told you to leap off the nearest cliff to adjust a chemical imbalance, would you do it?
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>But don't go feeling picked on! It's not just theists that the scientists ignore. If rodeo clowns were to say that "scientific peer review [is] ultimately tilted towards positive results," nobody would bat an eye at that, right? So why should it be different when you theists say it? It shouldn't.
Likewise, if a consortium of crack whores were to publish a position paper saying, "researchers engage in significance chasing," nobody would care about that, either - right? Can you see why that makes sense? It's not just you.
Likewise, nobody cares what NAMBLA, Domino's Pizza, or the NFL have to say about evolution, either. Not a one of them has a say or gets a vote on what constitutes good science. So please don't feel discriminated against.
If it comforts you to know, my lay opinion doesn't matter to the experts either, even though I happen to agree with them.
So where do you think that the opinions of theists rank relative to those of the clowns, whores and pedophiles? Not surprisingly, it's beneath all of them. Why?
Whereas crack whores and rodeo clowns are merely unqualified to contradict the experts, the theists actually have an agenda to subvert science, which places their opinions just a tad lower.
You have zero standing in the Great Conversation.
There is no great conversation among atheists. There are only those who refuse to examine what they believe preferring to project their fear of religion in general on Christians specifically. But then, cults deal with fear primarily using it as a stimulus to incite its members to pursue a common goal.

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