Don't dictate beliefs

Don't dictate beliefs

There are 11177 comments on the The Star Press story from Sep 5, 2012, titled Don't dictate beliefs. In it, The Star Press reports that:

No one else can say otherwise? That is basically saying those who do "believe in God" are better? Hardly.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at The Star Press.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7729 Dec 6, 2012
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
God gave man will, but it isn't "free." There are consequences for our actions.
That's not what's meant by "free will" in the context of Christianity.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
It believe that it is not that God is not able to be in the presence of a sinful man as it is that a sinful man would not be able to abide with God.
Christians typically shift the blame for failures and shortcomings in the world to man and devils. If possibilities for man are limited in any sense, you need to blame the omnipotent and omniscient one that chose to make him that way, not man himself.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
God created this word as a place for us, His children, to learn, grow, have experiences, and strive to become more like him.
Why would that be necessary for an omnipotent god?
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
I do not subscribe to the notion that this life is an audition process for an angelical choir.
Then you are in a small minority of Christians.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
By doing our best to become more like him and learn about him we are worshiping him. The best compliment you can give some one is to strive to emulate them. We worship God by trying to seek out his will and trying to do as he would have us do.
How is that worship? I have tried to emulate a variety of role models in my lifetime, but worship none of them.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7730 Dec 6, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
your god changes his mind, which contradicts the claim that he is perfect
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
Perfect is complete, I agree. BUT a perfect teacher who understands the students has a perfect/ complete teaching repertoire to meet the needs and teach to the understanding of the student. This is how God teaches his Children. I hope that answered that inquiry.
There was no inquiry - just a comment. The god of the bible is not perfect. It changes its mind. Perfect cannot change without becoming imperfect. If a god changes its mind, for example, at best, it either just became perfect, or just ceased being perfect.

It's pretty easy to discern that Christian doctrine is anthropogenic, not divinely authored. It's ancient authors weren't up to creating a seamless, consistent myth. Many mistakes were made, such as calling a god perfect, then cataloging its imperfections and contradictions.

Since: Mar 11

Cuyahoga Falls, OH

#7731 Dec 6, 2012
Sam is a Mormon. He thinks Yahweh is giving him his own planet.
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
That's not what's meant by "free will" in the context of Christianity.
<quoted text>
Christians typically shift the blame for failures and shortcomings in the world to man and devils. If possibilities for man are limited in any sense, you need to blame the omnipotent and omniscient one that chose to make him that way, not man himself.
<quoted text>
Why would that be necessary for an omnipotent god?
<quoted text>
Then you are in a small minority of Christians.
<quoted text>
How is that worship? I have tried to emulate a variety of role models in my lifetime, but worship none of them.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7732 Dec 6, 2012
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
God isn't "everywhere" in a physical sense. His influence can be felt everywhere, but HE himself is not everywhere.
One fascinating revelation of the Internet experience is seeing how you Christians each seem to have your own private version of your religion.

With all due respect, it is of little interest to secularists exactly what doctrine each individual Christian ascribes to. We are mostly concerned with the public face that the collective presents. Mormons are only a small part of that, and any one Mormon alone is an even smaller part.

You seem like a cut above most of the rest, for which I commend you. But you must realize that that doesn't mitigate the problem at all.

When I discuss the public face of Christian doctrine, I am referring to the antisemitism, homophobia, atheophobia, misogyny, misanthropy, pathological prudery, continual lying, and the hatred for science.

You might actually object to all of it, which would be to your credit, wouldn't mitigate the problem at all.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
The events the earth has gone through and are prophesied to go through are representative of the changes that need to take place in us. The flood was more than a just a way to "start over", it was symbolic of the baptism by immersion we all must have, just as the prophesied cleansing by fire is symbolic of receiving the holy ghost after baptism and how it purifies our hearts.
Like I said, you each seem to have your own religion.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
God is just
Not the god of the Christian bible.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7733 Dec 6, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
LOL! That's as funny as when I was asked what percentage of the human population did I think Noah and his family was. I responded 100%. LOL
I don't get why you think that that is funny.

The question doesn't specify whether it refers to before or after the flood. And apparently, some Christians think that there were humans that didn't perish in the flood apart from the crew of the ark.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7734 Dec 6, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
The path that you're on may seem enlighten but that's just distant flames.
Are you shaking the Scary Chicken On A Stick at us now, too?

"Oogah boogah. Abracadabra, please and thank you. Shlemiel, shlemazel, hasenpfeffer incorporated. Eenie meenie, chili beanie, the spirits are about to speak."

Since: Mar 11

Portage, MI

#7735 Dec 6, 2012
Oh Jesus eats many brains look no further than your and Derek's posts for proof of that :)

Jesus and Zombies both rise from the grave.
They both still have wounds inflicted upon them when they were killed.
They both scare people when they first see them.
They both go walking into town with other zombies/ dead saints.
They both threaten people but at least zombies don't have you tortured forever for not worshipping the dark ancient Palestine God of war who approved of rape, murdering children and slavery.
Zombies by comparison aren't so evil.

I guess the zombies are the more moral of the two.
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Zombie go around eating brains not ascending into heaven and is seated at the right hand of God. Oh and Zombies are make believe. Time to put down the Comice books.
Thinking

Farnham, UK

#7736 Dec 6, 2012
The bible says jesus endorses slavery.
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Where did you get that idea?
Thinking

Farnham, UK

#7737 Dec 6, 2012
Yes.
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Was Hitler a Christian?
Thinking

Farnham, UK

#7738 Dec 6, 2012
I have no wish to be your slave master.
You're morally f**ked.
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Nothing wrong with it! LOL
It would be a perfect career for the likes of you.
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7739 Dec 6, 2012
Givemeliberty wrote:
Oh Jesus eats many brains look no further than your and Derek's posts for proof of that :)
Jesus and Zombies both rise from the grave.<quoted text>
It gets even more bizarre than that!

According to the gospel of Matthew, following the resurrection of Jesus, the deceased saints rose from their graves and wandered through the streets of Jerusalem.

Later gospel writers knew this was a fiction, so conveniently left it out. This event in itself is enough to convincingly disprove Christianity.

Unless zombies wandering around Jerusalem was an everyday occurance. In that case maybe historians didnt think it was worth a mention :) lmao
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7740 Dec 6, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
One fascinating revelation of the Internet experience is seeing how you Christians each seem to have your own private version of your religion.
True. Especially it seems amongst American Protestants. Each one cherry picks their own beliefs. New sects spring up all the time.
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7741 Dec 6, 2012
Just returning to the subject of zombies. We know from our everyday experience people do not raise from the dead. The idea that hundreds or thousands of people can raise from the dead and wander around the place, without causing a stir, is totally absurd. We can conclude the contradictory gospel accounts are ficticious and christianity an unreliable and false belief system. Whether a God exists or not is another question. But without a religion, this hypothetical question is unimportant.

Since: Mar 11

Portage, MI

#7742 Dec 6, 2012
Yes several dead Jews get up and walk into jeruselum and nobody thought a thing about it. Lmfao!

There must have been a chariot race that day. I can hear Moses now... Oy vey I rise from the dead an walk up in here and nobody pays me any attention anymore! Aaron will hear about this I tell you! Aw where is some locusts when you really need them?
Adam wrote:
<quoted text>
It gets even more bizarre than that!
According to the gospel of Matthew, following the resurrection of Jesus, the deceased saints rose from their graves and wandered through the streets of Jerusalem.
Later gospel writers knew this was a fiction, so conveniently left it out. This event in itself is enough to convincingly disprove Christianity.
Unless zombies wandering around Jerusalem was an everyday occurance. In that case maybe historians didnt think it was worth a mention :) lmao

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#7743 Dec 6, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Becsuse he said he was And you believe him? LOL
Dolt!
Do you believe this?
What a sucker! You would believe anything Hitler said! Yes Hitler called himself a Christian. You believe him!
Why would he lie? You need to learn what a Christian is. Hitler was no Christian.
"Hitler was not a Christain or a Christian. I have zero interest in your spelling problems or your other problems, but as for Hitler, you will get the same answer any and every time in one form or another any time you want to say Hitler was a Christian. This is not open to dispute, since Hitler was not a Christian.
Was Hitler a Christian?
October 30, 1999
Dear Straight Dope:
In my numerous online debates in various chatrooms, I have learned the following: many Christians seem to think that Adolf Hitler was an atheist (or at least wasn't "Christian"). Of course I and my fellow atheists know better, as Hitler mentions his devotion to Christianity numerous times in his writings. Can you clear this up for me? Was Hitler an "honest to God" Christian, or was he simply using religion as a means of control?- Carl Stieger
The short answer is a definite "maybe" or, more precisely, "probably neither." The looooong answer is somewhat more complicated.
You are right that Hitler did mention Christianity many times in his writings. He paid Christianity a lot of lip service in Mein Kampf, and he claimed to be a Christian. But Hitler's secretary, Martin Bormann, also declared that "National Socialism [Nazism] and Christianity are irreconcilable" and Hitler didn't squawk too much about it. Similarly, Hermann Rauschning, a Hitler associate, said, "One is either a Christian or a German. You can't be both." In addition, Hitler declared Nazism the state religion and the Bible was replaced by Mein Kampf in the schools.
First, let's look at what he said that seems to put him on the anti-Christian side:
According to a press release from Catholic League President, William A. Donohue (2/4/99): "Hitler was a neo-pagan terrorist whose conscience was not informed by Christianity, but by pseudo-scientific racist philosophies. Hitler hated the Catholic Church, made plans to kill the Pope, authorized the murder of thousands of priests and nuns, and did everything he could to suppress the influence of the Church. In 1933, Hitler said,'It is through the peasantry that we shall really be able to destroy Christianity because there is in them a true religion rooted in nature and blood.'"
[further down, within the text:]
“... atheists looking for a quick cheap-shot may claim Hitler was a Christian; similarly, Christians looking for a quick shot may claim he was an atheist. Know what? Hitler was a vegetarian! Oooh, those evil vegetarians! He also recommended that parents give their children milk to drink instead of beer and started the first anti-smoking campaign.(So by the "reasoning" used in these types of arguments, if you are truly anti-Hitler, you should smoke heavily and only give your baby beer!) Better watch out, though he was an oxygen-breather, too! In other words, does it really matter whether Hitler was an atheist or a Christian or whatever? Just because somebody may hold a particular worldview (along with other views) doesn't make him a spokesman for that view, or even remotely representative of others who hold that view.”"
continued:
http://www.straightdope.com/columns/read/1699...
Hitler was catholic, it said "in god we trust" on every single nazi belt. Not saying that all catholics are nazis.

Just saying that hitler was a catholic and that he wasn't an atheist like you creationist like to lie about all the time to further your foolish agenda.
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7744 Dec 6, 2012
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
Hitler was catholic
Really? I'm not sure I get this. Maybe in a cultural, general sense.

But christianity has at its core belief the worship of a Jew as God. So Hitler hated Jews, but worshiped one as god? Doesnt seem to add up to me. Agree?
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7745 Dec 6, 2012
Derek wrote:
<quoted text>
Couple of straight forward questions from today. Yes or no answers ok..

1. Did zombies roam through the streets of Jerusalem?

2. Do you worship a Jew as God?

3. Do you think Jesus was a zombie?
Thinking

Farnham, UK

#7746 Dec 6, 2012
Hitler was an Austrian catholic leader of a majority lutheran Germany. Luther was very anti semitic.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/On_the_Jews_and_Their_L...
Adam wrote:
<quoted text>
Really? I'm not sure I get this. Maybe in a cultural, general sense.
But christianity has at its core belief the worship of a Jew as God. So Hitler hated Jews, but worshiped one as god? Doesnt seem to add up to me. Agree?
Adam

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#7747 Dec 6, 2012
Thinking wrote:
Hitler was an Austrian catholic leader of a majority lutheran Germany. Luther was very anti semitic.
<quoted text>
Point taken. These anti semitic christians must have been very conflicted. Following a jewish religion, and worshiping a jew, but hating jews at the same time.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#7748 Dec 6, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Dude Christianity only came about after Christ. Before that the faith was called Jewish. Come on you know that.
You really don't understand your own religion, do you? The Christ myth only came about because of "original sin". So, if there was no original sin, there was no need for the blood sacrifice of a redeemer on a cross. Without a literally true Garden of Eden, there is no foundation for any part of your mythology.

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