Don't dictate beliefs

Sep 5, 2012 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Star Press

No one else can say otherwise? That is basically saying those who do "believe in God" are better? Hardly.

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#7685
Dec 5, 2012
 
Khatru wrote:
<quoted text>
- build a sense of community
- make our relationships last
- overcome feelings of envy and inadequacy
- escape the twenty-four hour media
- go travelling
- get more out of art, architecture and music
- and create new businesses designed to address our emotional needs.
Strange how none of this guy's suggestions include believing in magic and worshipping imaginary cosmic mega beings.
So you're telling us you agree with Alain de Botton (but only the part he wrote that YOU like, lol.

You better get your godless rump into his church, lol.

He has the same atheist religion you do, so if you are going to defend him, you get in there and worship with him like you're supposed to, you hypocrite.

LMAO

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#7686
Dec 5, 2012
 
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Clearly you have nothing to say that refutes my argument. I'm not at all unhappy.
You are a very interesting, colorful person - you just made no points worthy of mention. Sorry you're unhappy you lost the argument, but I don't readdress closed issues.

Unlike you, I move on.

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#7688
Dec 5, 2012
 
[Let's take a look at some of our states' constitutions today:]

Constitution of the Commonwealth of Massachusetts
From:
Chapter VI.
OATHS AND SUBSCRIPTIONS:

“Article I.[Any person chosen governor, lieutenant governor, councillor, senator or representative, and accepting the trust, shall before he proceed to execute the duties of his place or office, make and subscribe the following declaration, viz.--

"I, A. B., do declare, that I believe the Christian religion, and have a firm persuasion of its truth; and that I am seised and possessed, in my own right, of the property required by the constitution as one qualification for the office or place to which I am elected."
http://www.malegislature.gov/Laws/Constitutio...

[“I believe the Christian religion, and have a firm persuasion of its truth.”]

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#7689
Dec 5, 2012
 
CONSTITUTION OF MARYLAND
DECLARATION OF RIGHTS
“Art. 36.10 That as it is the duty of every man to worship God in such manner as he thinks most acceptable to Him, all persons are equally entitled to protection in their religious liberty; wherefore, no person ought by any law to be molested in his person or estate, on account of
his religious persuasion, or profession, or for his religious practice, unless, under the color of religion, he shall disturb the good order, peace or safety of the State ...“
http://www.mdarchives.state.md.us/msa/mdmanua...

[“it is the duty of every man to worship God”]

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#7690
Dec 5, 2012
 
HERE ARE SOME OTHER STATES:

Mississippi State Constitution. Article 14 ("General Provisions"), Section 265
"No person who denies the existence of a Supreme Being shall hold any office in this state."

North Carolina's State Constitution, Article 6 Section 8
"Disqualifications of office. The following persons shall be disqualified for office: First, any person who shall deny the being of Almighty God."

South Carolina's State Constitution, Article VI
Section 2:
"No person who denies the existence of the Supreme Being shall hold any office under this Constitution."
Section 5: The oath of office ends in,
"So help me God."

Tennessee's State Constitution, Article 9 Section 2
"No person who denies the being of God, or a future state of rewards and punishments, shall hold any office in the civil department of this state."

[Just a few states who have it right]

“Think&Care”

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#7691
Dec 5, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
You are a very interesting, colorful person - you just made no points worthy of mention. Sorry you're unhappy you lost the argument, but I don't readdress closed issues.
Unlike you, I move on.
You claimed that living matter cannot come from non-living matter and I pointed out that *all* living matter is built from non-living matter, that the only difference between living and non-living matter is organization. You have offered no refutation of this point.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

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#7692
Dec 5, 2012
 
Dim wrote:
CONSTITUTION OF MARYLAND
DECLARATION OF RIGHTS
“Art. 36.10 That as it is the duty of every man to worship God in such manner as he thinks most acceptable to Him, all persons are equally entitled to protection in their religious liberty; wherefore, no person ought by any law to be molested in his person or estate, on account of
his religious persuasion, or profession, or for his religious practice, unless, under the color of religion, he shall disturb the good order, peace or safety of the State ...“
http://www.mdarchives.state.md.us/msa/mdmanua...
[“it is the duty of every man to worship God”]
In 1961, the United States Supreme Court explicitly overturned the Maryland provision in the Torcaso v. Watkins decision, holding that laws requiring "a belief in the existence of God" in order to hold public office violated freedom of religion provided for by the First Amendment to the United States Constitution.

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#7693
Dec 5, 2012
 
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
<quoted text>
Then you don't accept the doctrine that man us endowed with free will? How does that comment relate to mine? If you reject free will, and accept a doctrine of absolute determinism, then there is no contradiction there.
<quoted text>
It's your god that we are told is unable to abide sin. I can, and so can you. Why is your god less capable than we are? And if he is, that contradicts the assertion that he is omnipotent.
<quoted text>
Then why create our world and us? Aren't we here for an audition for a part in heaven to worship the god? And if he doesn't need our worship, why reject us for failing to worship him?
God gave man will, but it isn't "free." There are consequences for our actions.

It believe that it is not that God is not able to be in the presence of a sinful man as it is that a sinful man would not be able to abide with God.

God created this word as a place for us, His children, to learn, grow, have experiences, and strive to become more like him. I do not subscribe to the notion that this life is an audition process for an angelical choir. Rather, we are here to learn how to become like him, to continue a process that neither started nor will end here. God is our Father and we have the potential to be as he is.

By doing our best to become more like him and learn about him we are worshiping him. The best compliment you can give some one is to strive to emulate them. We worship God by trying to seek out his will and trying to do as he would have us do.

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#7695
Dec 5, 2012
 
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
How can you be everywhere yet not in space? The rest of that seems unrelated to the cited contradiction.
<quoted text>
The bible god allows needless suffering and causes more. There was no reason to drown every terrestrial animal in a flood intended to eliminate sin from the earth. Imagine how many creatures would have suffered prolonged, agonizing, terrifying deaths as the water levels rose? I would not forgive your god for that if I believed in it.
<quoted text>
I believe that you're wrong, and that you're evading the central point, which relates to innocents killed by your god, not just newborns. Nevertheless, newborns were victimizes by your god, such as all of the newborns on the earth at the time of the flood were drowned. Any if an Egyptian family had had their first child around the time of the plagues of pharaoh,that infant died.
You've only rebutted one contradiction so far, and that was at the expense of the doctrine of free will, which is used to justify the punishment of those that don't choose the god.
<quoted text>
There went hell theology. A lot of Christians make that claim.
<quoted text>
Most of your fellow Christians do. You seem to have a few fewer contradictions to contend with.
God isn't "everywhere" in a physical sense. His influence can be felt everywhere, but HE himself is not everywhere.

The events the earth has gone through and are prophesied to go through are representative of the changes that need to take place in us. The flood was more than a just a way to "start over", it was symbolic of the baptism by immersion we all must have, just as the prophesied cleansing by fire is symbolic of receiving the holy ghost after baptism and how it purifies our hearts.

God is just, I do not subscribe to the notion that God sends infants to hell. The Book of Mormon, which I believe to be scripture, declares that "all little children are alive in Christ, and also all they that are without the law. For the power of redemption cometh on all them that have no law." (Moroni 8:22) In other words, little children can not sin because they don't know what the rules are that dictate what a sin is. The same applies to everyone who doesn't know.

"You seem to have fewer contradictions to contend with." - I'll take that as a compliment.

“I Am No One Else”

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#7696
Dec 5, 2012
 

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derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
It's always your choice to go to hell.
Total Christians in this forum converted to atheism: ZERO
Total number of Derek4's that are idiots: All.

You don't convert to atheism, atheist is just a label for those of us who don't buy into the scam and delusion that is called god. You are an atheist to a lot of religions, we just don't buy into your notions either.

“I Am No One Else”

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#7697
Dec 5, 2012
 
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
God gave man will, but it isn't "free." There are consequences for our actions.
It believe that it is not that God is not able to be in the presence of a sinful man as it is that a sinful man would not be able to abide with God.
God created this word as a place for us, His children, to learn, grow, have experiences, and strive to become more like him. I do not subscribe to the notion that this life is an audition process for an angelical choir. Rather, we are here to learn how to become like him, to continue a process that neither started nor will end here. God is our Father and we have the potential to be as he is.
By doing our best to become more like him and learn about him we are worshiping him. The best compliment you can give some one is to strive to emulate them. We worship God by trying to seek out his will and trying to do as he would have us do.
So you think becoming a tyrannical and blood thirsty dictator is a good thing.

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#7698
Dec 5, 2012
 
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
So you think becoming a tyrannical and blood thirsty dictator is a good thing.
No, I don't.
“A Reflection On The Prophet Joseph Smith”
Throughout my life, I have had several experiences which have led me to believe that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God. Although some may question the validity of the claim that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God, I know that he is. The faith and knowledge we acquire in our lifetime is the result of experiences that have been placed upon us by wise teachers and the Lord, or experiences that we have sought out ourselves. By seeking experiences that provide evidence that support the validity of Joseph Smith, I have received an endowment of faith from God and a blessing of knowledge that Joseph Smith is a prophet and that the gospel that was revealed through Joseph Smith is God’s truth.
In my youth, I was blessed with the opportunity to mature in a very diverse area of the country and subsequently found myself with friends from Korea, Iran, France, India, Germany, China, Israel, and other countries. It was mainly during my high school years that I surrounded myself with a variety of friends from various backgrounds. Having friends from different ethnic and cultural backgrounds helped me to appreciate all kinds of diversity, different traditions, varying religious convictions, and a wide range of attitudes towards organized religion. I had friends who ranged from the very devout Catholic, to the cultural Hindu, and all the way to the ex-Muslim turned atheist. Given our wide diversity, it was quite frequent that we would engage in discussions regarding our cultural and theological backgrounds. I love my friends and I often struggled with reconciling my religious convictions with theirs. One day, I was talking with a friend who is an adamant atheist. We talked about God and I began asking why it was that he did not believe in God. At the conclusion of our discussion, I realized that the only reason why my friends had different convictions than me was because they had different experiences than I had. Or in other words, they lacked many of the religious experiences which led me to believe the way I do. From that time on, I determined to identify why I believed what I believed and to seek additional experiences to fortify my belief in God and his restored gospel on the earth.

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#7699
Dec 5, 2012
 
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
So you think becoming a tyrannical and blood thirsty dictator is a good thing.
One of the most significant personal evidences I have that Joseph Smith is a prophet is regarding the knowledge he revealed on the nature of God. The nature of God is significant to me for several reasons. First, if there is a God in the biblical sense, shouldn’t we know much about him because he is our creator? Second, the Bible stresses the significance of knowing the nature of God in John 17:3 which reads,“And this is life eternal, that they might know thee the only true God, and Jesus Christ, who thou has sent.” Third, if there is a God we should want to know Him and emulate him, for He is perfect.
Much of what I have learned about the nature of God is found in the Bible and does not align with post Nicene Creed Christianity which proclaims that God is without body, parts or passions, and that God is incomprehensible. If it is eternal life to know God, how can we have eternal life from an incomprehensible God? The creeds of men seem to define God in such a manner as to declare him nonexistent and without the capability to grant eternal life according to his own word.
The testimony of Joseph Smith rings true in the ears of those who hear, especially as the listener focuses on what the testimony reveals about the nature of God. From Joseph Smith’s first vision alone we learn that: God the Father and His Son, Jesus Christ, are two separate and distinct beings, God the Father and Jesus Christ have physical bodies, God speaks in our time, and God knows us individually. As I have read the first vision, I have felt the spirit testify that this is the true nature of God. These truths paint the picture of a loving Heavenly Father who cares about us, who is actively trying to reach out to us, who wants us to know Him, and who is working hard to bring us back into his presence. Being able to comprehend this much about God allows me to put my faith in Him and brings peace to my soul knowing that an all-knowing, all-powerful physical being with passions… passions of love for his children, is on my side and wants me to succeed in this life and the next.
As I have shared Joseph Smith’s first vision with those of other faiths, I have had the experience of feeling the spirit again testify to me as well as to those I share it with. I have seen the light in people’s eyes sparkle as a true comprehension of God emerges from the darkness of misunderstanding and doubt. I have seen those who have subscribed to other beliefs which did not teach the true nature of God exclaim “That is what I always believed!” Our divine heritage revealed to us by Joseph Smith, who taught that we are literally the children of God, empowers us with the knowledge of our true identity, history, capability, and potential. The Spirit of God has testified of the truth of this knowledge to me as well as many others I have met.
The experiences I have shared and the harmony produced by the alignment of knowledge revealed by the prophet Joseph Smith convince me that Joseph Smith is a prophet of God. He was called to restore Christ’s church on the earth again. I am eternally thankful that Joseph Smith sacrificed his time, talents, and life to bring the true knowledge of God to this earth again. It is my hope that all those who share my same convictions will engage themselves in helping others to have faith promoting experiences which will bring them to Christ.

“I Am No One Else”

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#7700
Dec 5, 2012
 

Judged:

1

Multi-posts like that will not be read, I see no reason to waste that much time on nonsense, I was raised Mormon, you moron. You presume, a habit with religious people, that I don't know about the religion, stop presuming.

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#7701
Dec 5, 2012
 
KittenKoder wrote:
Multi-posts like that will not be read, I see no reason to waste that much time on nonsense, I was raised Mormon, you moron. You presume, a habit with religious people, that I don't know about the religion, stop presuming.
Oh, I felt that you spend a lot of time making wrong assumptions about what I believe, so I thought it would be nice of me to provide you with some actual information about what I do believe.

I know that you do not subscribe to the teaching of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but do you believe in any God now?

“I Am No One Else”

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#7702
Dec 5, 2012
 
Sambrotherofnephi wrote:
<quoted text>
Oh, I felt that you spend a lot of time making wrong assumptions about what I believe, so I thought it would be nice of me to provide you with some actual information about what I do believe.
I know that you do not subscribe to the teaching of the Church of Jesus Christ of Latter-day Saints, but do you believe in any God now?
I never believed in a god, nor any of that religious crap, it's all crap. I saw through the scam at an early age but played nice until I was old enough to finally tell my mother no. I wanted to believe, I really did, but I'm not insane enough to ignore reality. There is no evidence, zero, none at all, for any of the gods, none of them. You have discarded all but one god, but your god has just as much evidence as the others. Also don't try to feed me that "they're all the same god" nonsense the leaders of the church tried to feed me, it's a lame excuse to ignore the hard questions and nothing more.

The irony is that the LDS church was of no consequence to me, once they had accepted black people I simply lost any care of them, but then you all forgot the one lesson your prophet taught you, that the smallest and more persecuted of the people are often the right people, and then started going anti-equality, hating gay people, and despising transgendered people. If your prophet was alive, he'd hate you as much as your Jesus would if he was real. That is why I shall not even give you the decency of mockery, I regard Mormons as nothing more than shallow hypocrites who take what was actually a smart idea and corrupting it into something more twisted and illogical than even Catholicism or Scientology.

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#7703
Dec 5, 2012
 
KittenKoder wrote:
<quoted text>
I never believed in a god, nor any of that religious crap, it's all crap. I saw through the scam at an early age but played nice until I was old enough to finally tell my mother no. I wanted to believe, I really did, but I'm not insane enough to ignore reality. There is no evidence, zero, none at all, for any of the gods, none of them. You have discarded all but one god, but your god has just as much evidence as the others. Also don't try to feed me that "they're all the same god" nonsense the leaders of the church tried to feed me, it's a lame excuse to ignore the hard questions and nothing more.
The irony is that the LDS church was of no consequence to me, once they had accepted black people I simply lost any care of them, but then you all forgot the one lesson your prophet taught you, that the smallest and more persecuted of the people are often the right people, and then started going anti-equality, hating gay people, and despising transgendered people. If your prophet was alive, he'd hate you as much as your Jesus would if he was real. That is why I shall not even give you the decency of mockery, I regard Mormons as nothing more than shallow hypocrites who take what was actually a smart idea and corrupting it into something more twisted and illogical than even Catholicism or Scientology.
What do you think was the smart idea?

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#7704
Dec 5, 2012
 
Adam wrote:
<quoted text>In Paul's letters he teaches that since the "fall of man" in the garden of Eden, we are all tainted with original sin, and are all guilty before God and in need of redemption. Therefore God sent his Son Jesus as the second Adam to pay for our sins, and make us good again with God, according to the christian storybook.

Now as we know that the stories of Genesis are MYTH, contradicting archeology and science, then there is no need for redemption from original sin, cause "the fall" never happened. Jesus was not paying for anything by being crucified, and the mythology built up around these stories is false. Do you agree?
No I do not agree. I commend you for your respect to our religion even though you don't understand it or agree with it.

If you're interested in learning how it all comes to getter a great DVD to watch would be "The Star of Bethlehem"

Great DVD!

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#7705
Dec 5, 2012
 
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>Paul's letters are not in Genesis or Exodus.

There are no christian ideas in Genesis or Exodus.
LOL!

That's as funny as when I was asked what percentage of the human population did I think Noah and his family was. I responded 100%.

LOL

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#7706
Dec 5, 2012
 
Adam wrote:
<quoted text>Maybe I'm misunderstanding here. Are you a christian?

If so, you have to believe the Genesis and the rest of the OT, at least to accept it in a limited sense.

Now if you have come to the conclusion that the OT is BS, and resembles sharia law, well done, you are on the path to enlightment.
The path that you're on may seem enlighten but that's just distant flames.

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