Don't dictate beliefs

Sep 5, 2012 Full story: The Star Press 11,175

No one else can say otherwise? That is basically saying those who do "believe in God" are better? Hardly.

Full Story

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#7417 Dec 2, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>I don't need to go "out there" for the answer concerning Jehovah. Your bible refutes that hypothesis right here on earth.

KJV wrote, "We know so little and we don't know so much only true arrogance would allow anyone to cement in on one possibility of how life or the universe started well know knowing 99.9% of what's out there. "

That's odd coming from somebody who makes decisions based on faith.
And one who is cemented in on one possibility.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#7418 Dec 2, 2012
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>This episode was actually a very good example of how the scientific method works in practice. The people at CERN got some results that they could not explain and that would contradict a central notion of modern physics. So they published their results, asking for the comments of the rest of the physics community. In the process, it was discovered that the cables they were using affected their timing measurements in such a way that their conclusions would be negated. Subsequent testing by those at CERN and those at other locations showed their original data was flawed.

As Einstein once said 'nature is subtle, but not malicious'. It is important to be very careful about all aspects of collecting and analyzing data. But, instead of the community ostracizing those at CERN, they rolled up their sleeves and attempted to understand what was going on. In this case, the data was flawed. It is possible that in the future Einstein will be shown wrong. That is how science works. Unlike religion, science actually questions the fundamentals of its subject and is willing to change beliefs based on evidence.
Religion does that.

It's just much slower about it.

It only took religion 300 years to admit Galileo was right. In another 150, maybe all of religion will admit Darwin was right.

Religion is the retarded stepchild of science.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7419 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
Ho, ho, ho -
“Why Atheists Celebrate Christmas”
It's become a pagan holiday again. Christ has disappeared from it. To many, it's Xmas now.

Yes, Christmas has become a celebration of the winter solstice again. The entire house is decorated in honor of the Viking ice gods, including flocking, tinsel, Yule logs, Yule wreathes, mistletoe, poinsettias and Christmas lights, just like in Bethlehem.

And on the lawn we have sleighs, Rudolph the red nosed reindeer, Frosty the Snowman and the elves gathering around Santa’s workshop under the North Star. Incidentally, Rudolph is a Viking name just like Santa Klaus, and just like Donner and Blitzen, which mean thunder and lightning in German.

Even the carols about Jesus have been replaced by "Jingle Bells" and "Grandma Got Run Over By A Reindeer."

It's no longer the desert holiday about baby Jesus, who seems to have been removed from it altogether, along with camels, sand, deserts, Joseph and Mary, the manger, and the Magi.

This could be the last time Jesus was seen. Perhaps this guy took him: http://3.bp.blogspot.com/_RwdH5DTKRas/SzTsWlN...

Anyway, out of my deep respect for the Christians who resent the phrase "Happy Holidays" because they don't want to be included with other traditions, I wish you all a Happy Winter Solstice, HumanLight, Festivus, Saturnalia, Zagmuk, Hanukkah, Kwanzaa, Soyal, Yalda, Korochun, Modresnach, Yule, or whatever else it is that you celebrate.

And yes, our appropriation of the holiday is complete. We will gather with friends on the twenty-fifth for turkey and wassail, and not think even once about your Jesus.

“I see quantum effects”

Since: Jan 11

In the macro world.

#7420 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>You're as easy to skip as a bad breath rotten mouth rodent lilke little Kitten, lol.

BUT, lol - when you brainless ones write a shortie, sometimes I'll be kind enough to stoop and answer you. LMAO.

Now, get up off your lazy rump and research something so you'll be informed, and I'll allow you to try to post something worthwhile if you can find it. You're just a big zero so far.

Oh yes, and to save my time, I'll use this post as a reminder to all the atheist and their religious atheist followers / adherents / cohorts: To whomever is giving me the “bad” judge marks (which are good to me)– keep up the great work, it reminds me you don't like my views, and that's just where I want to be with you, LMAO. I love it.
See above.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7421 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
Who was worse, Hitler or Stalin?
Cults of personality are just secular religions with mortal gods. It's otherwise the same thing: authoritarian, terrorist, genocidal, and demands blind trust and obedience of its "indoctrinees."

From the Affirmations of Humanism:

"We affirm humanism as a realistic alternative to theologies of despair and ideologies of violence and as a source of rich personal significance and genuine satisfaction in the service to others."

==========

Yo, Dim - have you detected a trend in these last several posts? 7415 was taking spirituality from you. 7419 was retaking the winter celebration from you. And this one is returning Hitler and Stalin to you.

O hell, I'll say it anyway: Merry Xmas, Dim!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7423 Dec 2, 2012
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
This episode was actually a very good example of how the scientific method works in practice. The people at CERN got some results that they could not explain and that would contradict a central notion of modern physics. So they published their results, asking for the comments of the rest of the physics community. In the process, it was discovered that the cables they were using affected their timing measurements in such a way that their conclusions would be negated. Subsequent testing by those at CERN and those at other locations showed their original data was flawed.
As Einstein once said 'nature is subtle, but not malicious'. It is important to be very careful about all aspects of collecting and analyzing data. But, instead of the community ostracizing those at CERN, they rolled up their sleeves and attempted to understand what was going on. In this case, the data was flawed. It is possible that in the future Einstein will be shown wrong. That is how science works. Unlike religion, science actually questions the fundamentals of its subject and is willing to change beliefs based on evidence.
And even though it was an honest mistake made in good faith, the leaders apparently felt that they had to fall on their swords:

"Faster-Than-Light' Neutrino Team Leaders Resign"
http://news.discovery.com/space/opera-leaders...

If only the religious had the same culture of truth.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7424 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
To whomever is giving me the “bad” judge marks (which are good to me)– keep up the great work, it reminds me you don't like my views, and that's just where I want to be with you, LMAO. I love it.
No problem. I can do that for you until I get bored doing it.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#7425 Dec 2, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Why are you still posting this misinformation? Polymath debunked it for you.
I think it goes to the root of the creationists mindset and that is:

Deny the evidence in favour of whatever myth you would like reality to conform to.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7426 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
I do not read the red devil's posts for reasons that are known to him
The red devil, huh?[makes horns on his head with his index fingers and wags tongue a la
at 00:54]

And you're going to hell too, for lying about not reading my posts. I believed you until you referred to the content of one recently. As you know, my posts are pretty unflattering to you and your church, so I wouldn't continue to read them if I were you, given that you have strategically rendered yourself helpless to defend yourself now.

Well played, Dim.

So how do you think you're doing here? What do you think your net effect has been? You don't seem to have convinced anybody of anything, but you have provoked a flurry of responses that a dozen or more atheists have posted and shared among themselves, possibly teaching one another in the process, and reinforcing previously held opinions.

Did you realize that atheists like me never had a way to commune with other freethinkers until recently, and are just now forming associations and communities? How do you think your posting affects that? Do you think we feel more connected to one another or less because of you?

Do you think that after seeing your posts and our replies to them that we feel more comfortable with our choice to shun the religious life that you chose, or less?

Your presence here is a catalyst. And I can discuss it openly without fear of alerting you or chasing you off. Why? Because you're Dim. You don't read most of what is written, and you don't understand most of the rest.

Plus, you have no tactical sense, and no view of the big picture. You're a mindless vector of Christian apologia that wound up in an Internet message board where he is now being batted about like a robotic insect by a litter of kittens, who are learning to be cats at your expense.

But you're too buried in the matrix to see that even when told, aren't you, Dim?

“Citizen_Patriot_ Voter_Atheist!”

Since: May 09

Earth,TX

#7427 Dec 2, 2012
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes but remember my last world wide survey show 2.04% are atheist that's down from the 2.3% from the year before. LOL
Ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, your world wide survey? Oh my, that has to be a bona fide as it gets. LOL! Do you think that even one actual atheist was enlisted to answer your survey questions? I didn't think so ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha, ha!

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7428 Dec 2, 2012
Edited from http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T... :
derek4 wrote:
"Bruce Sheiman's "An Atheist Defends Religion: Why Humanity is Better Off with Religion than without It" offers a distinctive response to the numerous books by unbelievers -- from the perspective of an unbeliever. But unlike other atheists who embrace their rejection of God as an intellectual triumph, Sheiman asserts that religion provides a combination of psychological, moral, communal, existential, aesthetic, and even physical-health benefits that no other institution can replicate."
Strongly disagree.

Religion is damaging to the religious. Look at the guilt and fear in them. Look at how scientifically illiterate many are. How do you compete in a technological society like that?

Look at how badly damaged Dim is. Did his religion not do that to him, or contribute significantly to that outcome?

And above a critical density, religiosity damages the culture and the rest of society as well. Look at the damage it does to America's scientific competitiveness. Look at the scapegoating of gays and atheists, both driven into closets, both having more difficult and dangerous lives because of it.

What does religion offer to offset that burden that can't be gotten without it? Nothing:

“There’s no good thing that a church or religion does that cannot be achieved by a purely secular means. And there is no positive benefit of churches and religions that necessarily demonstrates the truth of their supernatural claims.”– Matt Dillahunty.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#7429 Dec 2, 2012
It aint necessarily so wrote:
Edited from http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T... :
<quoted text>
Strongly disagree.
Religion is damaging to the religious. Look at the guilt and fear in them. Look at how scientifically illiterate many are. How do you compete in a technological society like that?
Look at how badly damaged Dim is. Did his religion not do that to him, or contribute significantly to that outcome?
And above a critical density, religiosity damages the culture and the rest of society as well. Look at the damage it does to America's scientific competitiveness. Look at the scapegoating of gays and atheists, both driven into closets, both having more difficult and dangerous lives because of it.
What does religion offer to offset that burden that can't be gotten without it? Nothing:
“There’s no good thing that a church or religion does that cannot be achieved by a purely secular means. And there is no positive benefit of churches and religions that necessarily demonstrates the truth of their supernatural claims.”– Matt Dillahunty.
All religions are cults and all cults thrive on misinformation and fear. If an honest believer were to look outside of their religious teachings and learn about the real world, they would become what they were born in the first place - atheist again.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7430 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
Sheiman coined a term to differentiate himself as an atheist (one who doesn’t believe in God personally) to Richard Dawkins and his fan club as antitheists, meaning people with a militant atheistic agenda.
This guy is one of yours in sheep's clothing. His use of the pejorative "militant" is his theist shibboleth. "Militant" is a word used to marginalize and demonize a group. It's used to delegitimize them, to make them the out-group, to depict them as dangerous, unpredictable and anti-social.

Militant is flying airplanes into buildings for Allah or bombing abortion clinics and assassinating physicians for Jesus.
https://images.nonexiste.net/popular/wp-conte... [image]
derek4 wrote:
"In the traditional evolutionary view, there is no difference between humans and animals ... this can lead to species relativism: the idea that humans are not the pinnacles of creation; we are no different from other creatures."
Another shibboleth: "pinnacle of creation."

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7431 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
Antitheists not only reject God for themselves but actively campaign to eradicate faith in others.
We don't really care what you believe. Feel free to shake your scary chicken on a stick at the full moon if that's what gives your life purpose and a moral foundation.

But most of us don't care what the chicken thinks about gay marriage, sex education, stem cell research, school prayer, free sex between consenting adults, abortion, or anything else. We don't want your church determining any aspect of our lives.

So, we want to disempower your church. We understand that to do that means to reducing your numbers, so we do question faith.

But once that is accomplished, we probably won't think about you or the scary chicken again, and you will be free to wallow in your faith unmolested.

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7432 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
"Although a conclusive case for atheism can still be made ... this doesn't mean religious believers are irrational in affirming their faith."
Of course faith is irrational. By definition.
derek4 wrote:
[RIGHT!!!!- NOR DO ATHEISTS HAVE THAT RIGHT, LOL.]
Atheists have whatever rights the law allows.

We have the legal and moral right to fight back against a church that strives to marginalize and dehumanize us.

We have the legal and moral right to fight back against a church that defines us as corrupt, vile, abominable, no good, the moral equivalent of liars, murderers and whoremongers, and fit for eternal torture. Obviously.

We have the legal and moral right to work to shrink your church down to a size small enough to drown in a bathtub if that's what it takes to neutralize you.

It's your own fault. You won't share or cooperate, so you need to be defeated.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#7433 Dec 2, 2012
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
"Darwin himself confessed that it was "absurd" to propose that the human eye evolved through spontaneous mutation and natural selection. "
Or
"It is rather hard to reply to a third objection. How was it possible for a complicated organ to come about suddenly even though it brought benefits with it? For instance, how did the lens, retina, optic nerve, and all the other parts in vertebrates that play a role in seeing suddenly come about? Because natural selection cannot choose separately between the visual nerve and the retina. The emergence of the lens has no meaning in the absence of a retina. The simultaneous development of all the structures for sight is unavoidable. Since parts that develop separately cannot be used, they will both be meaningless, and also perhaps disappear with time. At the same time, their development all together requires the coming together of unimaginably small probabilities."
Neither of which is in the earlier cited reference (" http://www.ncbi.nlm.nih.gov/pubmed/14756332&q... ;).

“Life may be sweeter for this”

Since: Nov 08

Fennario

#7434 Dec 2, 2012
derek4 wrote:
"I am as disturbed and frightened by the rampant spread of this “anti-theism” or “New Atheism” as most religious people are. To me it is more than just a sign of a lack of faith in God – as this would not disturb me – it is a lack of morality, ethical behavior, rational thought and, generally, saneness."
Here's another stealth Christian from Dim.
derek4 wrote:
“I am not the type of atheist who feels the need to denigrate another man’s religion, or who feels the need to try to “prove” that God does not exist."
What need? It's a service. Religion needs denigrating. And to you religious folks, denigrating means "putting down."
derek4 wrote:
"These people are not simply atheist, they are “anti-theists,” and I hate those people."
Sorry, Dim, but what you have here is a stealth Christian. Hate is a Christian value. You people come by it honestly.

THE HATREDS OF JEHOVAH

[1] Deuteronomy 12:31 - "... they do all kinds of detestable things the LORD hates."

[2] Deuteronomy 16:22 - "and do not erect a sacred stone, for these the LORD your God hates."

[3] Psalm 11:5 - "The LORD examines the righteous, but the wicked, those who love violence, he hates with a passion."

[4] Proverbs 6:16 - "There are six things the Lord hates, seven that are detestable to him"

[5] Ecclesiastes 3:8 - "a time to love and a time to hate, a time for war and a time for peace."

[6] Amos 5:21 -“I hate, I despise your religious festivals; your assemblies are a stench to me."

[7] Zechariah 8:17 - "do not plot evil against each other, and do not love to swear falsely. I hate all this,” declares the LORD."

[8] Luke 14:26 -“If anyone comes to me and does not hate father and mother, wife and children, brothers and sisters—yes, even their own life—such a person cannot be my disciple.

[9] Romans 9:13 - "Just as it is written:“Jacob I loved, but Esau I hated.”

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#7435 Dec 2, 2012
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
You mean stop quoting people you make statements against atheist?
Like the father if your believe. "Darwin"
"Incontrovertible Proof Against Evolution
By David J. Stewart
Are you ready for the incontrovertible proof that Evolution is a big hoax? The fact of the matter is that evolutionists don't have as much as one single shred of evidence to support their bizarre claims. This fact alone is incontrovertible PROOF that evolution is the biggest educational big fraud ever fabricated.
Even Charles Darwin himself, unquestionably the father of Evolution, admitted that they had NO PROOF of the origin of the Species...
"A fair result can be obtained only by fully stating and balancing the facts and arguments on both sides of each question..." -SOURCE: "My Life and Letters", Volume 1.
This is not done. Darwin and his Darwinist followers down to the present day, far from allowing a "fair result" to be "obtained" by "fully stating and balancing the facts and arguments on both sides of each question," have in fact done their best (or worst!) to prevent "the facts and arguments on" the other side (i.e. creation/design) "of each question" from being fully stated"!
THE REASON WHY MOST PEOPLE BELIEVE IN EVOLUTION IS BECAUSE THEY HAVE BEEN TOLD IT ALL HAPPENED THAT WAY! In school it is presented as the only way.
Later in life Charles Darwin had grave doubts about his theory. Near the end of his life he said...
"Not one change of species into another is on record... we cannot prove that a single species has been changed."
SOURCE: "My Life and Letters", Volume 1.
Now 150 years later the situation is still the same! Think about it - despite 150 years of frantic searching, that missing link is still missing! Darwin is saying that there was no proof of his theory and there is none today.
What more proof do you need that Evolution is a BIG MYTH than the mere fact that there is NO EVIDENCE? I didn't say "proof," I said "evidence." Let alone trying to prove the theory of evolution, scientists cannot even bring forth any evidence to support their bogus theories. Oh, how foolish are darkened hearts of men. Does not Romans 1:21-22 perfectly describe evolutionists?... "Because that, when they knew God, they glorified him not as God, neither were thankful; but became vain in their imaginations, and their foolish heart was darkened. Professing themselves to be wise, they became fools." They became fools! There is no more brilliant a group of idiots in the world today than the evolutionists.
Very good, thanks for posting this, and the continuations.

Skimmed and skipped 90% of the atheist posts. Don't want; don't need – better things to do with time, lol.

Just think, they spend all that time composing, and they're the only ones reading it. Kind of like writing a letter to someone but forgetting to mail it, LMAO

But they do need to console and affirm each other since no one in the real world wants anything to do with them. Must be lonely out there for them, lol.

Have a good Sunday.

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#7436 Dec 2, 2012
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes but remember my last world wide survey show 2.04% are atheist that's down from the 2.3% from the year before. LOL
No wonder they make up such a small percent – what do they offer the world? Every time they open their mouth, all that erupts is halitosis and intestinal gasses.

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#7437 Dec 2, 2012
Evil and Moral Law

“When someone states that they do not believe in God because a good God would not allow evil, they make a fatal error in logic. First, the recognition of evil is the recognition that certain actions are "right" and certain actions are "wrong." But how do we determine what actions are morally right and morally wrong? We discern this on the basis of a moral law: a universal sense that certain states of affairs are right and others are wrong. Even most atheists will admit that certain actions are universally wrong and, conversely, universally right.

For example, no one could seriously argue with the statement that it is better to love a child than to torture it. The point is that there is an innate, universal sense of right and wrong within all of us. What is the basis of this moral sense? Some would argue that it is based on cultural customs or traditions. But can this be so?

The famous atheist Bertrand Russell once debated a Christian who asked him if he believed in right and wrong. Russell replied "of course." Then he asked him how he determined what is right and wrong. Russell replied that he determined right and wrong on the basis of his feelings. His opponent replied, "Well, in some cultures they feel it is okay to eat you, and in others they don't. Which do you prefer." The point is that social customs, attitudes, traditions or feelings cannot determine a universal sense of right and wrong.

A universal sense of moral right and wrong can only come from a source outside of ourselves: a transcendent source, a moral Lawgiver.”

continued:
http://www.fillthevoid.org/Apologetics/Eastma...

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