Don't dictate beliefs

Sep 5, 2012 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: The Star Press

No one else can say otherwise? That is basically saying those who do "believe in God" are better? Hardly.

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#6258
Nov 19, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
"We find God to be sadistic, brutal and a representation of hatred."
Your god is a mythological creature, like a Cyclops. People that choose to express their hatred through that avatar are the problem.

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#6259
Nov 19, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Atheists have shorter life span.
“The oldest group of people in the country is a community of Seventh Day Adventists residing in Loma Linda, California.
This community of Christians - the Branch Davidians - didn't live very long. Here's an interview with Davis Koresh just before he, his minions, and their children went up in flames:
https://www.youtube.com/watch...

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#6260
Nov 20, 2012
 
Khatru wrote:
Sometimes I read a scripture that describes Jehovah's murderous actions. The myth of the flood is a classic example. Satan himself wouldn't commit such an evil act.
Satan is a piker compared to Jehovah.

Have you seen this one?:

“According to Samuel, David took a census of the people. This excited the wrath of Jehovah, and as a punishment he allowed David to choose seven years of famine, a flight of three months from pursuing enemies, or three days of pestilence. David, having confidence in God, chose the three days of pestilence; and thereupon, God, the compassionate, on account of the sin of David, killed seventy thousand innocent men. Under the same circumstances, what would a devil have done?”- Robert Green Ingersoll

Jehovah is the most monstrous creature in all of fiction. As far as I know, no other character sterilized the earth twice and then destroyed the planet.

According to legend, how many of us has Jehovah killed by his own hand? It's in the millions - two-and-a-half million that are enumerated, plus untold numbers of others in the flood and other disasters without death counts. And he ordered dozens of genocides. Just ask the Hittites, the Hivites, the Perizzites, the Girgashites, the Amorites, the Ammonites, the Moabites, the Girgashites, the Canaanites, and the Jebusites.

Satan's death count is ten. Not ten thousand. Ten.
Reference: "Who has killed more, Satan or God?" http://dwindlinginunbelief.blogspot.mx/2009/0...

And Lord Jehovah has promised to kill billions more in a fiery apocalypse. And that's just human beings. How many puppies and kittens died slow, agonizing, terrifying deaths during that flood, as the water levels crept up, stealing their breath? What kind of a monster does that to innocents that he could have magically poofed away instead?

That by itself would qualify Jehovah for that title - worst monster in all of fiction. But wait - there's more, much more. Throw this in: this creature also built a torture chamber, and will preserve the souls of those humans beings that didn't grovel before it and praise its massive ego so that they can suffer agonizingly forever, and to no apparent benefit to anybody. This creature is way over the top as the worst monster in all of fiction, wouldn't you agree?

But I'm not done. Throw in that he created another god - an evil god - and set it loose on mankind beginning with the very first pair - innocent babes, to whom he gave a sin nature, free will, and desire. This lieutenant of Jehovah's, who was allowed to deceive man and steal his paradise has allegedly been stealing souls ever since, blinding people to their salvation, which increases the hell-bound fraction considerably. Satan is nothing without Jehovah.

There's more. To help Satan and his deception, Jehovah apparently filled the earth with deceptions like fossils and ERVs to trip man up, and reason, and left behind an utterly unbelievable book.

This god is the most sadistic, ferocious, and unjust creature in all of fiction by several orders of magnitude. And Christians describe him as perfect love.

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#6261
Nov 20, 2012
 
Khatru wrote:
<quoted text>
Christians lie when they say they get their morals from the their god or the Bible.
Ask a Christian to share some biblical ethics and they will always opt for what they think are nice ethics while ignoring the less savoury ones.
Pat Condell says it best:
"Religious people often say that atheists have no morals because they have no moral guide. If you believe this, let me ask you something.
If you're a Christian, chances are the Bible is your moral guide, but is that all the Bible, or just some of it? It's just the good bits, isn't it? The bits you've cherrypicked because obviously if you wanted to live in a Leviticus-style society where people are stoned or mutilated for insane and trivial reasons, you could simply move to Iran.
But how do you decide which are the good bits and which are the bad in the Bible? What do you use as a moral guide? The Bible? Well, surely not. If so, you would simply accept the bad along with the good, which is clearly what the Bible wants you to do, otherwise the bad wouldn't be in there in the first place, would it? But no, you don't do that. You defy the Bible. You sift out the bad and discard it for the ignorant primitive barbarism it is. In short, you edit the Bible to suit your own sensibilities.
So where do you get the moral guidance to impose your authority on the word of the Bible? It has to come from a higher source, doesn't it?(These things usually do.) And it does, of course. It comes from you. You are a higher source than the Bible, a much higher source. The criminals who run religion don't want you to know or to act upon this because then their influence over you would be zero. Yet the evidence is clear. You sifted the good from the bad in the Bible without the Bible's help. You did it against the Bible's will, and you did it all on your own because, whether you like it or not, you have a conscience, which means that you are capable of distinguishing good from evil without the help of scripture, and you have just proven it beyond any shadow of doubt. So, in fact, the Bible is not your moral guide. You are. It doesn't provide you with a moral compass. You do. And the only faith you need is faith in yourself.
O happy day."
That's a very helpful passage. Thanks. Saved.

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#6262
Nov 20, 2012
 
Nikki wrote:
I'd rather forgotten how angry and spiteful these christians are. I don't get why though, I mean they believe they are the special, chosen people, shouldn't that make them happy?
Derek is not happy. His posting reflects his frustration at his impotence to help save his church, which influence is melting away before his eyes despite his tireless effort to spam message boards in its defense.

Derek himself appears to no longer be one of us. He has been skillfully hollowed out and refitted to serve as their vector. Now he serves his priests and their agenda, railing against whomever might disagree. There doesn't appear to be a whole person in there any more.

I should feel empathy for him,but I don't. I don't know why I can't. He's a victim, isn't he? Despising him is like despising a dog that has become vicious from beatings. Dogs like that get my pity. Shouldn't Derek, too?

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#6263
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Are biblical prophecies intended to give clues to future events?
No biblical prophecy has ever allowed man to anticipate any event in history in any useful way. None of it qualifies as quality prophecy, which must meet the following criteria :

[1] It needs to be specific - that is, detailed and unambiguous. The highest quality prophecy specifies the time and place.

[2] It needs to prophesy something surprising, something unlikely or unique, something that could not have been contrived, and that was not self-fulfilling.

[3] The prophecies need to be verified, fulfilled completely, predict something that definitely occurred subsequently, and waere unaccompanied by failed prophecies.

[4] As is true for the scientists, high quality scientific knowledge in holy books that was not available at the time the books were written would count as prophecy. The knowledge must be detailed and be about something counterintuitive like relativity or quantum mechanics - not merely mentioning in the broad, vague strokes things that can in retrospect be imagined to hint at atoms, a big bang, heliocentrism or evolution. And example would be,“My disciples, I say unto thee that energy is mass times the speed of light multiplied unto itself.”

You have nothing like that.
derek4 wrote:
An Iranian nuclear attack on Israel would set the world on a course closely related to biblical descriptions of the events of the end times.
Nonsense.

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#6264
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
The Hebrew Prophet Ezekiel describes a dictator called Gog (often associated with Russia) who will form a military coalition with Iran, Sudan, Libya, Middle Eastern, and Central Asian countries in “the last days”(Ezekiel 38:16).
I looked at that scripture. You're lying. There is no mention of those countries there:

"You will advance against my people Israel like a cloud that covers the land. In days to come, O Gog, I will bring you against my land, so that the nations may know me when I show myself holy through you before their eyes."
derek4 wrote:
Could this be a reference to modern day events in the Middle East?
It could be a reference to the World Cup games.

Scientific prophecy is quality prophecy. This was written before the Higgs boson was found:

"Several physicists, including Peter Higgs, discovered a mechanism that, if added to the equations, would allow particles to have masses. This is now known as the Higgs mechanism. Integrating it into the Standard Model allowed scientists to make predictions of various quantities, including the mass of the heaviest known particle, the top quark. Experimentalists found this particle just where equations using the Higgs mechanism predicted it should be."

You have nothing to compete with that.

"According to theory, the Higgs mechanism works as a medium that exists everywhere in space. Particles gain mass by interacting with this medium. Peter Higgs pointed out that the mechanism required the existence of an unseen particle, which we now call the Higgs boson. The Higgs boson is the fundamental component of the Higgs medium, much as the photon is the fundamental component of light. The Higgs boson is the only particle predicted by the Standard Model that has not yet been seen by experiments." http://press.web.cern.ch/backgrounders/higgs-...

You know how this story ends. The scientists' prophecies were confirmed. Again.

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#6265
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Faith is a kind of cognitive disease.
Faith is to reason what intentionally blinding yourself is to vision. You heir to various gifts that helped your forbears outcompete those without them, like your vision and your reason. Faith is a logical error. It effectively gives any idea the status of truth. That can't be smart.

Is that a disease? I don't think so. But it's a terrible mistake.
derek4 wrote:
believers are delusional.


Does that sound exaggerated to you? Through faith, you've taken an unproven idea - and an extreme one at that - and elevated it to the status of an axiom, an atomic, self-evident truth.

One dictionary defined delusion as, "An idiosyncratic belief or impression that is firmly maintained despite being contradicted by what is generally accepted as reality."

Most people in the world consider your doctrine of sin and of salvation through Christ, for example, nonsense. And they are correct. Your bible refutes itself. But your belief in it is firmly maintained in the face of contradictory evidence such as bible errors and contradictions. So, you've got all that going.

But you are spared total inclusion by virtue of the fact that your belief is not idiosyncratic - billions of you have been inculcated with it. And that makes it a social illness, not a mental illness.

And I don't know if reality contradicts you, but it certainly doesn't support you, which is a big factor when it comes to deciding about mental illness: what good evidence justifies a belief, especially an extraordinary belief, without which it may be a delusion?

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#6266
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
they are doing all they can to rid the world of all religious belief and practice.
Very few of us consider that important or possible. Personally, I want your church out of my life completely. I don't care what Jesus thinks about anything - not gay marriage, not abortion, not sex, not evolution - nothing.

And I don't want any comments about smurfs, gods, or any other nonsense on the money, or in the Pledge.

Once we have that, I doubt we'll ever think about you again. Please feel free to shake your scary chicken on a stick at the sky every Sunday morning if you believe that the chicken centers you and provides you with a moral basis for living.

Just don't bother me with what the chicken wants.
derek4 wrote:
the evidence for God is overwhelming, confirming the Apostle Paul’s point in Romans 1 that the reality of God is “clearly seen, being understood from what has been made so that men are without excuse”(Rom. 1:20, NIV).
We're back to delusion now, aren't we?

Science does not support your religion. It debunks much of it - one of several ways science implies atheism. Cosmologists, geologists, biologists, and archeologists in particular have disproven most of Genesis and Exodus. And you have as much access to that information as the rest of us.

Yet you cling resolutely to an extraordinary belief against evidence.

That's delusion, dude, even if its on a mass scale.
Adam

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#6267
Nov 20, 2012
 
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
No biblical prophecy has ever allowed man to anticipate any event in history in any useful way. None of it qualifies as quality prophecy, which must meet the following criteria :
[1] It needs to be specific - that is, detailed and unambiguous. The highest quality prophecy specifies the time and place.
[2] It needs to prophesy something surprising, something unlikely or unique, something that could not have been contrived, and that was not self-fulfilling.
[3] The prophecies need to be verified, fulfilled completely, predict something that definitely occurred subsequently, and waere unaccompanied by failed prophecies.
[4] As is true for the scientists, high quality scientific knowledge in holy books that was not available at the time the books were written would count as prophecy. The knowledge must be detailed and be about something counterintuitive like relativity or quantum mechanics - not merely mentioning in the broad, vague strokes things that can in retrospect be imagined to hint at atoms, a big bang, heliocentrism or evolution. And example would be,“My disciples, I say unto thee that energy is mass times the speed of light multiplied unto itself.”
<quoted text>
Yes prophecies in the bible are very vague, and notably do not deal with the world of the very small (atoms) or the very big (universe). As they are limited to the understanding of science and the world of when they were written.

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#6268
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Category Archives: Fake Science Century of Slander
You have no vote in the scientific conversation. Only the scientists do, and they tell us that you and your bible are wrong. It's settled science. Move on.

And the slander has been ongoing for over a century and a half already, but I am encouraged to be able to report to you that your voices get a few percent fainter every year.

Toodle-oo.

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#6270
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Judging by analyses showing that the number of retractions during the past ten years has skyrocketed, it is reasonable to conclude that the self-regulating peer review system suffers from serious underlying defects.
http://www.ahrp.org/cms/content/view/846/94/
That makes no sense at all. It is reasonable to conclude from that data that the process of peer review is more effective than ever.

The scientific vetting process is 100% impartial and 100% effective. No false or erroneous claim survives the test of time. How is it possible that any meaningful statement that is wrong won't eventually be shown to be wrong? It's not.

Science says your bible is wrong, and that is the final word on that matter. Man is but a naked, bipedal ape that evolved from now extinct ancestral apes. Life evolved on earth over deep time without the help of gods.

Your bible got that wrong. Errors in an allegedly divinely authored holy book certify it as inauthentic, its contents mythology, the god it describes as much a mythological creature as a Griffin, the religion based on it false, and the church and clergy that exploits it all fraudulent.
Adam

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#6271
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Sometimes, at the end of the day, in irreverance to atheists, I feel it only fitting to re-post the "Atheist Prayer"
I dont see the reason why anyone would pray. Reflective meditation I guess may give some people comfort. But praying in the usual sense of the word is nonsensical.

The fact that God fails to answer prayers is proof that God is imaginary.

Praying usually takes two forms.

1) to grovel before God, heaping endless thanks and praises on him. God must surely have a weak ego to need such self indulgent toadying.

2) people asking God for stuff, blessing, healing, miracles, etc. This is basically saying God is wrong. And God should be doing something he currently is not doing. It basically saying that god is not loving or perfect. And the petitioner wants god to act in a way contrary to his supposed perfect will.
Adam

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#6272
Nov 20, 2012
 
It aint necessarily so wrote:
<quoted text>
Errors in an allegedly divinely authored holy book certify it as inauthentic, its contents mythology, the god it describes as much a mythological creature as a Griffin, the religion based on it false, and the church and clergy that exploits it all fraudulent.
I think many of the clergy today know that a fraud is being perpetrated. But that they stay within the church because they have invested too much emotionally in it, and are reliant on it financially. They may try to justify this by saying that they act in a caring way in the community, gicing people counselling and so on. But to live a lie.. not worth it, imo.

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#6273
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
The earth's shape is a spheroid
Although the earth's shape is technically an ellipsoid, its major and minor axes do not vary greatly. In fact, its shape is so close to a sphere that it is often called a spheroid rather than an ellipsoid.
This is a horrible mess of misinformation. For starters, a spheroid is an ellipsoid.

"To simplify the model, various spheroids or ellipsoids have been devised. These terms are used interchangeably. For the remainder of this article, the term spheroid will be used."
http://support.esri.com/en/knowledgebase/tech...

"A spheroid, or ellipsoid of revolution is a quadric surface obtained by rotating an ellipse about one of its principal axes; in other words, an ellipsoid with two equal semi-diameters. If the ellipse is rotated about its major axis, the result is a prolate (elongated) spheroid, like an American football or rugby ball. If the ellipse is rotated about its minor axis, the result is an oblate (flattened) spheroid, like a lentil. If the generating ellipse is a circle, the result is a sphere."
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Spheroid

Next, as you can see from the above, as the lengths of major and minor axes of the ellipse of revolution defining the resulting spheroid converge toward equal lengths, and the foci approach one another and overlap, the ellipse degenerates into a circle. The resulting three dimensional spheroid generated becomes more spherical, the limit of which is a perfect sphere. Now, let's look at your comment again:

"In fact, its shape is so close to a sphere that it is often called a spheroid rather than an ellipsoid."

Even an extremely elongated, cigar-shaped ellipse generates a spheroid, which as noted, is a synonym for ellipsoid.

You Christians should read a book besides your bibles.

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#6274
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
[The Bible teaches the earth is a sphere too, but the Bible doesn't waste as much time babbling on and on about it as scientists do. The Bible keeps things direct and to the point, not wasting time with endless chatter about these small matters.]
Your bible had to exclude technical data. It's authors had none. Their few stabs at the technical are absurd. Bats are not birds, insects do not have four legs, hares don't chew cud, and pi is not three. Your god is as unsophisticated as ancient goatherds.

And oh but no! Your bible teaches that the earth is flat, not a sphere. It is replete with references to a flat earth with edges immovably fixed by pillars below, alternately described as circular and as having four corners. The single reference to the earth not being fixed from below has it dangling. The Hebrew word for sphere, globe, or ball - "dur" - is never used in your bible to describe the earth.

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#6276
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
Being as they don't like my posts, why do they read them and spend hours typing all kinds of comments about them?
I love what you post. I wouldn't call them yours, however. You just copy-and-paste them. You're merely the vector used by the authors of the canned apologetics you fetch here for them.

But I love them. Each one is another opportunity to deconstruct Christianity. By parsing them, we can emphasize how dishonest and hypocritical Christianity is.

What people don't like is you and your church, not your cut-and-pastes.
derek4 wrote:
Do they think I care? Apparently they think I read all that crap they post, lol.
I don't. I assume that you read at most 10% of what I write, and understand even less. You only read that either because your eye falls on some of my words - maybe these - and you have read them before you realize it, not out of choice. Maybe every now and again, a little curiosity returns to you and you read a large part of a post. But when you do, you curse yourself for it, and don't do so again for quite a while.

That's how it should be. If you read what I wrote about you, faith, your godlet, your bible, your religion, and your church, you'd be horrified at the parts that you could understand.

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#6277
Nov 20, 2012
 
derek4 wrote:
I pick 2 or 3 of their short posts, reply to them, and ignore the others.
I doubt that anybody cares about your replies. They're always the same, and always free of content, like the one above. Your words are useless. Go fetch another cut-and-paste.

How do you suppose other posters would feel if you promised them what you promised me - carte blanche to verbally kick you in the nuts without any blow back? Ask them.
derek4 wrote:
I don't plan to waste my time "ploughing through"
You would get as little out of it if you did as you would plowing through Chinese posts.

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#6278
Nov 20, 2012
 
KJV wrote:
<quoted text>
You atheist do this all the time it's expected! Nothing new. You're all to dense to try and come up with a be ploy
So you just use the same old tired one!
I wonder do you actually retype these messages or cut and past from old post?
I cut and past the same responses to your same stupid questions. I have them all set aside because you're all so predictable and have nothing new!
That's the best way – atheists present nothing new to the forum. Funny how much work they spend on posts that go nowhere – if I'm not too busy once a week or so, I read some of their longer posts, but invariably, I see nothing worthwhile, and I wonder why I wasted my time – so I then go back to my usual skim & skip, lol.--- I sometimes just click “go to last page”, but I really don't like to do that unless I'm in a big hurry, because I don't want to miss your posts or posts of other Christians. Keep up your good work against the atheist minorities.

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#6279
Nov 20, 2012
 
Reason Personified wrote:
<quoted text>I just love it when you idiots haul out the poster board, colored streamers and spotlights, and start making up signs to point out, that there is a big empty spot between your ears.
Ladies and gentlemen, KJV would like you to all acknowledge his total absence of a point. Please join me in applauding his attempt to construct a religion out of nothing. Damn what a fail. Hey KJV, at least start with a concept. You know like Christainity did, copy some Pagan stuff. But be warned we may not be as easy bent as you lot were.
Well hellllloooooo – you've been away awhile – I thought we lost you to the worms...... lol.

Even though you never post anything worthwhile, I always enjoy seeing those beautiful flowers in your avatar.

Oh, I've been wondering - have you learned who Darwin is yet?

(Hint: A fraudulent scientist who died in 1882)

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