Don't dictate beliefs

Sep 5, 2012 Full story: The Star Press 11,175

No one else can say otherwise? That is basically saying those who do "believe in God" are better? Hardly.

Full Story

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#2699 Oct 9, 2012
Khatru wrote:
Fairs fair, I'll give this particular Christian his due...

http://www.youtube.com/watch?v =T5qP1N85PZcXX
That your definition of entertainment?

What a complete nut job.

Since: Apr 12

Location hidden

#2700 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>Wrong. I don't agree to your paraphrasing of anything I write,.

I decide what words I use.

For you to change what I write is dishonesty.

To repeat:

I have no interest in the fraud of evolution, nor your support of fraudulent scientists.
He is fulfilling yet another prophecy!

Then, Jesus warns believing Christians will be hated by the world ...

"If the world hates you,
you know that it hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you."
(John 15:18-19)

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2701 Oct 9, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
He is fulfilling yet another prophecy!
Then, Jesus warns believing Christians will be hated by the world ...
"If the world hates you,
you know that it hated Me before it hated you. If you were of the world, the world would love its own Yet because you are not of the world, but I chose you out of the world, therefore the world hates you."
(John 15:18-19)
Right. I welcome the hatred of atheists.

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2702 Oct 9, 2012
Just Think wrote:
<quoted text>
Actually, atheists don't believe in a god.
As for scientific accuracy, I'm sure there are as many different viewpoints as there are atheists.
We applaud you for your valuable contribution to the forum, and your enlightening observation informing us that “atheists don't believe in a god.” We had never heard that before.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#2703 Oct 9, 2012
As Protestants decline, those with no religion gain --

For decades, if not centuries, America's top religious brand has been "Protestant." No more.

In the 1960s, two in three Americans called themselves Protestant. Now the Protestant group -- both evangelical and mainline -- has slid below the statistical waters, down to 48%, from 53% in 2007

Where did they go? Nowhere, actually. They didn't switch to a new religious brand, they just let go of any faith affiliation or label.

" http://m.usatoday.com/article/news/1618445... ;

OR

" http://www.topix.com/religion/atheism/2012/10... ;

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2704 Oct 9, 2012
This is a re-post from some days ago that bears repeating:

From WebMD:

Spirituality May Help People Live Longer
Discover why some believe that older people who regularly attend religious services appear to have better health.

Why do older people who regularly attend religious services appear to live longer and have better health? Is it something about the type of people they are? Or is it something related to their visits to churches or synagogues -- perhaps increased contact with other people?

A growing body of research is beginning to define the complex connections between religious and spiritual beliefs and practices and an individual's physical and psychological health. No one says it's as simple as going to services or "finding religion" later in life. It may be that people who are more involved in religious activities or are personally more spiritual are doing something that makes them feel better emotionally and helps them live longer and more healthily. The question, researchers say, is what exactly are they doing?

... continued:

Go to Church, Live Longer

Among the most recent findings in this area: People who attend religious services at least once a week are less likely to die in a given period of time than people who attend services less often.

continued:

http://www.webmd.com/balance/features/spiritu...

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2705 Oct 9, 2012
Another re-post:

From: The University of California

Churchgoers may have an extra reason besides Easter to don their Sunday best. A new study by researchers in California provides more evidence that regular church attendance is linked to a longer, healthier life.

In the study, researchers from the Human Population Laboratories of the Public Health Institute and the California Department of Health Services, and from the University of California, Berkeley, found that people who attended religious services once a week had significantly lower risks of death compared with those who attended less frequently or never, even after adjusting for age, health behaviors and other risk factors. The study will be published April 4 in the International Journal of Psychiatry in Medicine.

"We found this difference even after adjusting for factors such as social connections and health behaviors, including smoking and exercising," said Doug Oman, lead author of the study and a lecturer at UC Berkeley's School of Public Health. "The fact that the risk of death by several different causes is lower for those who attend religious services every week suggests that we should look to some psychological factor for answers. Maybe frequent attendees experience a greater sense of inner peace, perhaps because they can draw upon religious coping practices to help them deal with stressful events."

continued:
http://www.universityofcalifornia.edu/news/ar...

The study was supported by grants from the National Institute of Aging, the National Heart, Lung, and Blood Institute, and the California Department of Health Services.

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2706 Oct 9, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
As Protestants decline, those with no religion gain --
For decades, if not centuries, America's top religious brand has been "Protestant." No more.
In the 1960s, two in three Americans called themselves Protestant. Now the Protestant group -- both evangelical and mainline -- has slid below the statistical waters, down to 48%, from 53% in 2007
Where did they go? Nowhere, actually. They didn't switch to a new religious brand, they just let go of any faith affiliation or label.
" http://m.usatoday.com/article/news/1618445... ;
OR
" http://www.topix.com/religion/atheism/2012/10... ;
Thanks for this input, Hedonist. It's good to know you're still visiting the forum.

You know, I'm glad I still hold to my faith.

It was interesting in 2001, how many folks who had sort of "let go" of their faith suddenly called on God after the twin towers fell. That was 11 years ago - and in the years that followed, they have gotten complacent again, letting go of their faith.

Unfortunately, there are many examples in the Bible where God's people did the same thing. They would be devout to God when they needed him, then when things went well, they got away from God. They went back and forth all the time. This isn't surprising to believers, but we're glad you have also noticed those trends.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#2708 Oct 9, 2012
Faith may not move mountains, but we have all seen what it can do to skyscrapers.

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2709 Oct 9, 2012
This opinion from an atheist is a re-post from awhile back which bears repeating.

From: The Washington Post

An Atheist Defends the Value of Religion

By Bruce Sheiman
author

As an atheist, I approach religion much like an economist. I believe religion persists in our market-based culture, despite the prevalence of secularism, because it provides net value over and above its required investment, and because it beats competing belief systems in the same value proposition. I evaluate religion in terms of its pragmatic usefulness to humankind and seek to answer the question posed by William James: "Grant an idea or belief to be true, what concrete difference will its being true make in anyone's actual life?"
Atheism is a bankrupt ideology on empirical grounds: Its benefits simply do not come close to covering its opportunity costs. Religion, by contrast, offers the vast majority of people a high-value transaction: Its enduring benefits far outweigh its costs. Religion persists, in short, for the reason that it provides the greatest good for the greatest number of people. Thus, by book "An Atheist Defends Religion" is not mainly a critical examination of the New Atheism. Rather, I am making a broad statement about the affirmative role of religion in the contemporary world and what is lost in a purely secular conception of the world.

... continued:

Faith is one of the most powerful forces in human development and a strong impetus to personal transformation and collective progress. Religion's misdeeds may make for provocative headlines, but the everyday good works of billions of pious people is the real history of religion, one that parallels the growth and prosperity of humankind. There are countless examples of individuals lifting themselves out of personal misery through faith. In the lives of these people, God is not a delusion, God is not a spell that must be broken - God is indeed great.

The debate about the existence of God is never ending. What is not in dispute is that God exists in people's hearts, minds and spirits. What is not in dispute is that religion is adaptive, constructive and healthful - and thereby makes a positive difference in people's lives. Reflecting James' pragmatic conception of belief: When we act as if religion is true, we act with greater optimism, hope and benevolence.

... continued:

Bruce Sheiman is the author of the new book "An Atheist Defends Religion: Why Humanity is Better Off With Religion than Without It."
http://onfaith.washingtonpost.com/onfaith/gue...

This portion was espcially inspiring:

"What is not in dispute is that God exists in people's hearts, minds and spirits. What is not in dispute is that religion is adaptive, constructive and healthful - and thereby makes a positive difference in people's lives."

Since: Nov 11

Location hidden

#2710 Oct 9, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
Faith may not move mountains, but we have all seen what it can do to skyscrapers.
yawn (unimpressed)

Not very original. To avoid plagiarism, give credit to the author when you post.

“I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers.”
William H. Gascoyne

http://stupidevilbastard.com/2009/09/ive_neve...

here's another:
http://godsnotwheregodsnot.blogspot.com/2007/...

And thank you, Hedonist, for demonstrating your sad irreverent disrespect to all the Americans who died at the hands of godless terrorists. You're a real patriot.

Since: Apr 09

Location hidden

#2711 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
We applaud you for your valuable contribution to the forum, and your enlightening observation informing us that “atheists don't believe in a god.” We had never heard that before.
And yet you obviously don't understand it. How sad for you.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2712 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong. I don't agree to your paraphrasing of anything I write,.
I decide what words I use.
For you to change what I write is dishonesty.
To repeat:
I have no interest in the fraud of evolution, nor your support of fraudulent scientists.
Saying evolution is a fraud is the best you people can do.

Unfortunately for you, there is no scientific evidence you have for your abracadbra alternative. Contrast that with the wealth of evidence that exists for evolution.

This leaves you in the sad and unenviable position of trying to cheapen science by attempting to get it down to the gutter-level of your religion.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2713 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
Don't study your Bible, then, if you see no point. Why should I care what you do? The message is clear. The problem is with your comprehension.
Nope

The problem is that the god of the Bible is a terrible communicator.

The CEO of any company needs to communicate effectively with his people. If a company is in a mess and people aren't getting the message then the buck stops with the CEO.

Why should an omniscient god be wholly exonerated of blame when he fails to ensure that his message is clearly understood? You've only got to look at the numerous different bibles that are out there to see that whatever the god of the Christians thinks, he doesn't seem too perturbed about the confused message he's sending out. Factor that in with thousands of different Christian denominations, sects and cults, all sure that their particular interpretation of whatever bible they choose to read is the true belief and you have a recipe for confusion.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2714 Oct 9, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
"So when I quote the Bible word-for-word, I'm lying?"
When you leave out the lines prior to and after, to take the words out of context, then yes you do lie.
No news flash there.
Pssss. Puppet boy, I've got some Raid I can sell you cheap to help out with the termites on the brain.
Have you calmed down a little from yesterday?

I think you have.

I guess those telepathic conflabs with your imaginary zombie have helped you after all.

Now then, wetpants:

I quoted 1 Kings, 7:23

"And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about."

----------

Now we'll do it your way:

Here's 1 Kings 7:22-24

"22 And upon the top of the pillars was lily work: so was the work of the pillars finished.

23 And he made a molten sea, ten cubits from the one brim to the other: it was round all about, and his height was five cubits: and a line of thirty cubits did compass it round about.

24 And under the brim of it round about there were knops compassing it, ten in a cubit, compassing the sea round about: the knops were cast in two rows, when it was cast."

Go on then.

What's the difference?

Even doing it your way doesn't change the fact that the Bible gives a ratio of 3 for Pi.

Give it up, wetpants - the Bible says Pi = 3 and no amount of screaming and false claims from you can change that fact.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2715 Oct 9, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
Nope doesn't look correct at all.
Lunacy: intermittent insanity once believed to be related to phases of the moon
Religion: the state of a religious <a nun in her 20th year of religion> b (1): the service and worship of God or the supernatural (2): commitment or devotion to religious faith or observance
In other words there's nothing between religions:

Whether you're a naked Papua New Guinea tribesman worshipping a wooden fetish doll or a priest kneeling before a cross - it's all superstitious mumbo jumbo and it belongs in the minds of the ignorant and the gullible.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2716 Oct 9, 2012
Langoliers wrote:
<quoted text>
That your definition of entertainment?
What a complete nut job.
Absolutely - it's hilarious.

Actually, it has a dual purpose.

You already know about its comedy aspect but the other point is that it's there to wind you up.

Looks like it did just that.

Since: Apr 08

Nottingham, UK

#2717 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
yawn (unimpressed)
Not very original. To avoid plagiarism, give credit to the author when you post.
“I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers.”
William H. Gascoyne
http://stupidevilbastard.com/2009/09/ive_neve...
here's another:
http://godsnotwheregodsnot.blogspot.com/2007/...
And thank you, Hedonist, for demonstrating your sad irreverent disrespect to all the Americans who died at the hands of godless terrorists. You're a real patriot.
Those terrorists where anything but godless.

No doubt they prayed to Allah to ensure the success of their mission and secure their martyrdom.

Looks like Allah answered their prayers.

Perhaps you people are right - maybe prayer does work after all.

Since: Mar 11

Chicago, IL

#2718 Oct 9, 2012
Indeed belief in the Abrahamic God lead those believers to their act of terror. Same God Christians and Jews pray to.

Well said as usual and thanks for your contributions to the forum.:)
Hedonist wrote:
Faith may not move mountains, but we have all seen what it can do to skyscrapers.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#2719 Oct 9, 2012
derek4 wrote:
<quoted text>
yawn (unimpressed)
Not very original. To avoid plagiarism, give credit to the author when you post.
“I'm not convinced that faith can move mountains, but I've seen what it can do to skyscrapers.”
William H. Gascoyne
http://stupidevilbastard.com/2009/09/ive_neve...
here's another:
http://godsnotwheregodsnot.blogspot.com/2007/...
And thank you, Hedonist, for demonstrating your sad irreverent disrespect to all the Americans who died at the hands of godless terrorists. You're a real patriot.
Actually the origin is from Dr. Richard Dawkins -- "Science flies you to the moon. Religion flies you into buildings" But I was just working on the idea and not on a specific quote, I did not know about others who have also paraphrased this idea.

And I do NOT disrespect any Americans. I served my country in the USAF during Nam. But I do disrespect religious faith. It is far too often used to incite people to violence that they would not otherwise do.

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