Atheists can't have it both ways

Atheists can't have it both ways

There are 2136 comments on the Examiner.com story from Nov 13, 2011, titled Atheists can't have it both ways. In it, Examiner.com reports that:

Captain Ryan Jean of the US Army wants recognition of himself as a humanist lay leader.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Examiner.com.

“There is no such thing”

Since: May 08

as a reasonable person

#43 Nov 20, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
only imaginary for those who can't believe.
Superman isn't real.

“The King of R&R”

Since: Dec 07

Location hidden

#44 Nov 20, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
Thats not what these people are pushing for, even the Supreme Court of Wisconson, or Minisota that has declared that Athiesm is a religion as far as law is concerned. What I refer to is teaching children there is no God, that teaching would now be a religious teaching.
Here, read this:

"The saying is "if atheism is a religion then not playing baseball is a sport"

A religion has two components which must both be present. It is a formalized system of ritual and belief. It is focussed on a supernatural being or beings.

Speaking to "formalized system of ritual and belief", atheists are not an organization, just a number of folks that have independently, through thought and study, come to the conclusion that there is no supernatural force in the universe. There is no credo, instruction manual, or anything."

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#45 Nov 21, 2011
Redoran wrote:
<quoted text>
Here, read this:
"The saying is "if atheism is a religion then not playing baseball is a sport"
A religion has two components which must both be present. It is a formalized system of ritual and belief. It is focussed on a supernatural being or beings.
Speaking to "formalized system of ritual and belief", atheists are not an organization, just a number of folks that have independently, through thought and study, come to the conclusion that there is no supernatural force in the universe. There is no credo, instruction manual, or anything."
Nevertheless, the chief is correct in one respect: it would violate the law to teach that god does not exist in a public school.
Please

El Paso, TX

#46 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
only imaginary for those who can't believe.
Yes, Shiva is real, and only imaginary to those who can't believe.

“What, me worry?”

Since: Mar 09

I'm a racist caricature!

#47 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
except Christianity and Judaism expressely condems murder and islam exhaults it.
The Abrahamic God of the Bible and Torah specifically calls for the killing of various (presumably unarmed) people, cities, and civilizations. In fact, that God even calls for the murder of pregnant women by cutting their bellies open to ensure their unborn children will also die. This is expressly commanded by your God in your holy book. Please explain how that is not murder, and how this is condemnation of such an act.

Did your God command and/or accept human sacrifices?

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#48 Nov 21, 2011
LowellGuy wrote:
<quoted text>
The Abrahamic God of the Bible and Torah specifically calls for the killing of various (presumably unarmed) people, cities, and civilizations. In fact, that God even calls for the murder of pregnant women by cutting their bellies open to ensure their unborn children will also die. This is expressly commanded by your God in your holy book. Please explain how that is not murder, and how this is condemnation of such an act.
Did your God command and/or accept human sacrifices?
But there's one sneaky little proviso: If the scriptures say it's okay by god to slaughter the innocent, killing them is not murder according to those same scriptures. And of course, the same is true of the Koran: it's okie dokie to kill innocents who can be thought of as infidels with as much cruelty as is desired. Neat trick, eh?
Subsistence

El Paso, TX

#49 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
It was given to the Jews by God then taken away from them. People scatteren the Jews around the world and all they want to do is get their homeland back, the people that God eliminated from the land no longer exist today or 60 years ago.
By that rationale, we should give most of Arizona and New Mexico back to the Navajo. This land was given to them by God then taken away from them. The US government scattered the Navajo across a few reservations and all they want to do is get their homeland back, the people that God eliminated from that land no longer exist today.
Subsistence

El Paso, TX

#50 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
It can't be, athiest don't believe that religion had anything to do with the development of this nation.
That's not true. Most athiests know that this nation was developed in order to get away from people trying to impose their religion on others.
redneck

Glendale, OR

#51 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
It can't be, athiest don't believe that religion had anything to do with the development of this nation.
Escape from religion was in our foundation. Europe was xtian against xtian. Catholic vs. Protestant. It was religious persicution at its best. Seperation means god can stay the [email protected]@# out of politics. DO YOU GET IT?

“Jeezuz in the Potty”

Since: May 10

Location hidden

#52 Nov 21, 2011
Subsistence wrote:
<quoted text>
That's not true. Most athiests know that this nation was developed in order to get away from people trying to impose their religion on others.
Yes it was!

And it was also populated by religious nuts trying to get away from other religious nuts.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#53 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
not by teachers in public schools because that would be religious teachings now, Remember it is the Parents job to conduct thier religious teachings,
yes... so?

That is beside the question...

... the question/point being that unless kids are heavily brainwashed with the god-virus?

They are born atheist, grow up atheist and remain atheist as adults.

Atheism is the default position unless a person is infected/brainwashed with "god"

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#54 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
It was given to the Jews by God then taken away from them. People scatteren the Jews around the world and all they want to do is get their homeland back, the people that God eliminated from the land no longer exist today or 60 years ago.
False--false and... false.

The people living there are the direct descendants of those who lived there long before the world saw "Israelites".

You forget: Israelites are relative newcomers on the million-year old history of humans on earth.

And your "god" is myth, silly-- there was no "given by god" here.

Unless you can produce a document? Signed by this "god" character?(and you'll need some real proof of identity, too)

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#55 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
It can't be, athiest don't believe that religion had anything to do with the development of this nation.
<rolls eyes in disgust>

False once again.

Some poor deluded folk at the beginning of the US's history were indeed brainwashed into the cult known as "christianity".

And some of these had strong influence in the directions the US took, based on that same cult.

Manifest Destiny was one such-- Xianists utilized the BuyBull as a tool of oppression, to justify killing and/or oppressing the natives already living on the lands they wanted for themselves.

Another example is here in Oklahomer: "Sooners". These law-breakers jumped the gun when much of Oklahomer was stolen (again) from the native peoples living on it. Again, these criminals used the BuyBull to "justify" their behavior.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#56 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
how do you have a religious teacher when by its very name essentially without religion??
Non-sequitur... meaningless therefore.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#57 Nov 21, 2011
chief22 wrote:
<quoted text>
only imaginary for those who can't believe.
'Believe' IS 'imaginary', silly boy!

They are one and the same thing.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#58 Nov 21, 2011
Lil Ticked wrote:
<quoted text>Superman isn't real.
Exactly!

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#59 Nov 21, 2011
NightSerf wrote:
<quoted text>
Nevertheless, the chief is correct in one respect: it would violate the law to teach that god does not exist in a public school.
But.

There is no need for such teaching, if the god-virus is never brainwashed into the impressionable little minds in the first place.

It would be automatic-- the default state of being, is atheism.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Knoxville, TN

#60 Nov 22, 2011
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
But.
There is no need for such teaching, if the god-virus is never brainwashed into the impressionable little minds in the first place.
It would be automatic-- the default state of being, is atheism.
Quite true, but if there is a "need" for such teaching, public schools are not a place where it can be done. Kids who come to school brainwashed will simply have to suffer until the virus either burns itself out or is purged elsewhere.

“There is no such thing”

Since: May 08

as a reasonable person

#61 Nov 22, 2011
At first I was wondering if this thread was saying that Atheists can't be Bi.

“What, me worry?”

Since: Mar 09

I'm a racist caricature!

#62 Nov 22, 2011
Ozada wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes it was!
And it was also populated by religious nuts trying to get away from other religious nuts.
Yep. They wanted religious freedom, but only for THEIR religion. Look at how people of other faiths were treated for the first 200 years of this country's existence, from English colony to independent nation.

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