Science Proves God

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#41 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Polymath: Actually, we know of events in this universe that are uncaused. For example, the decay of a muon. Or the timing of the decay of any radioactive particle.
Pahu: Why do you believe those things are uncaused?
Polymath: Most quantum events are uncaused with standard definitions of the word 'cause'.
Now, macroscopic causality generally works because the way that the laws of probability and quantum mechanics interact, but at the basic level, the universe is NOT causal.
Pahu: My dictionary says a cause is a person or thing that acts, happens, or exists in such a way that some specific thing happens as a result; the producer of an effect.
In the real world, every effect has a cause, including the universe, which did not exist before it existed, and therefore there was nothing, from which the universe appeared. Something does not come from nothing by any natural cause, therefore the cause of the universe was supernatural.
And you know this because god speaks directly to you and tells you this. Does he speak to you through your hairbrush?

(Your dictionary does not address the modern understanding of quantum level physics.)

I noticed you ignored all of your Bible's scientific mistakes and fallacies I pointed out in my last post. Could you at least explain how a star can direct someone (anyone) to a particular house (any house) on the surface of this planet? How about how floating slivers of tree bark can affect the color of your goats?

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#42 Aug 22, 2012
Hedonist: Isn't there a passage that talks about being able to see the entire Earth from on top of a mountain?

Pahu: Yes, it is when Satan was tempting Jesus. I believe Satan is not a person, but a word describing our rebellion against God. The temptations were the story of Jesus being tempted by His own desires since He had taken on human flesh, which He had to overcome before beginning His ministry.

Hedonist: Seems there also at least one passage that talks of the four corners of Earth, another that describs the pillars of Earth, I think someone supposedly traveled to the North gate at the end of the world and say where the wind came from.
What you've got is a poorly written Aesop's fairytail book. It was even written about the same time as Aesop's fables.

Not really. The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables. But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology.

Hedonist: Look you believe in a book that has talking animals, wizards, witches, demons, sticks turning into snakes, food falling from the sky, people walking on water, and all sorts of magical, absurd and primitive stories, and you say that we are the ones who are unreasonable?

I don’t remember saying you are unreasonable. The Bible is also a book of miracles. A miracle is an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause.

Also, the Bible is filled with hundreds of fulfilled prophecies such as:

Bible Prophecies 1
http://www.aboutbibleprophecy.com/

Bible Prophecies 2
http://www.100prophecies.org/

Bible Prophecies 3
http://www.allaboutthejourney.org/bible-proph...

Bible Prophecies 4
http://www.reasons.org/fulfilled-prophecy-evi...

Bible Prophecies 5
http://www.allabouttruth.org/Bible-Prophecy.h...

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#43 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
...
I don’t remember saying you are unreasonable....
You're responding to post #30, which wasn't addressed to you. The post addressed to you was #37. You really aren't too bright are you?
Pahu wrote:
Hedonist: Isn't there a passage that talks about being able to see the entire Earth from on top of a mountain?
Pahu: Yes, it is when Satan was tempting Jesus. I believe Satan is not a person, but a word describing our rebellion against God. The temptations were the story of Jesus being tempted by His own desires since He had taken on human flesh, which He had to overcome before beginning His ministry.
...
Fallacy of deflection. So, the Earth is flat.
Pahu wrote:
... The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables....
Once you admit that part of the book is not factual, you get into who gets to decide which part is which and your entire book becomes unreliable as anything more than a waste of paper.
Pahu wrote:
... But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology....
No, actually it isn't and archaeology hasn't.

Just because I've been to Kings Cross station and it's also mentioned in Harry Potter doesn't make Harry Potter real. I know that's difficult for you to understand, sorry.
Pahu wrote:
...The Bible is also a book of miracles. A miracle is an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause.
...
Isn't it amazing how the number of miracles occurring in a culture is inversely proportional to the number of camera phones available.
Pahu wrote:
...
Also, the Bible is filled with hundreds of fulfilled prophecies such as:
Prophecies don't count if they are written after the event they reference or are so vague as to be applicable to more than one event.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#44 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
Review my original post.
Look, let's make this easy for you.

In the argument between religion and science, you lost any claim of validity as soon as you started putting lightening rods on church steeples.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#45 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Polymath: Actually, we know of events in this universe that are uncaused. For example, the decay of a muon. Or the timing of the decay of any radioactive particle.
Pahu: Why do you believe those things are uncaused?
Because the assumption of causality leads to predictions that have been shown wrong by actual observation. Look up Bell's inequalities sometime.
Polymath: Most quantum events are uncaused with standard definitions of the word 'cause'.
Now, macroscopic causality generally works because the way that the laws of probability and quantum mechanics interact, but at the basic level, the universe is NOT causal.
Pahu: My dictionary says a cause is a person or thing that acts, happens, or exists in such a way that some specific thing happens as a result; the producer of an effect.
A rather poor definition, actually, but one we can work with.
In the real world, every effect has a cause,
Well, by definition of the word 'effect', every 'effect' has a 'cause', but there are events that are not effects. In other words, there are events that are not caused.
including the universe,
Please support the claim that the universe is an effect.
which did not exist before it existed, and therefore there was nothing, from which the universe appeared. Something does not come from nothing by any natural cause, therefore the cause of the universe was supernatural.
One fallacy after another.

At the quantum level, the universe is inherently probabilistic. It is not causal. There are many situations where more than one possibility exists for a given situation. In other words, there is no *specific* effect from a given event. An example can be found in any number of decay events where more than one decay is possible. There is NOTHING that causes one decay to happen instead of another. it is simply a probability that one or the other will happen.

Furthermore, the probabilistic nature of reality at the quantum level can be demonstrated. Causality cannot explain what is actually seen in experiments because a causal connection necessarily leads to regularities that are not seen in practice.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#46 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Hedonist: Isn't there a passage that talks about being able to see the entire Earth from on top of a mountain?
Pahu: Yes, it is when Satan was tempting Jesus. I believe Satan is not a person, but a word describing our rebellion against God. The temptations were the story of Jesus being tempted by His own desires since He had taken on human flesh, which He had to overcome before beginning His ministry.
So? Since the earth is round, there is no way to show all of it from a mountain top.
Hedonist: Seems there also at least one passage that talks of the four corners of Earth, another that describs the pillars of Earth, I think someone supposedly traveled to the North gate at the end of the world and say where the wind came from.
What you've got is a poorly written Aesop's fairytail book. It was even written about the same time as Aesop's fables.
Not really. The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables. But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology.
No more than the Illiad and the Odyessy have been shown accurate by the discovery of Troy. Yes, city names have been verified and some personal names have been also, but the overall history before about 900BC is shown by archaeology to be wrong. More accurately, it was propaganda-made up stuff to make the populace feel good.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#47 Aug 22, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Also, the Bible is filled with hundreds of fulfilled prophecies such as:
Bible Prophecies 1
http://www.aboutbibleprophecy.com/
Bible Prophecies 2
http://www.100prophecies.org/
Bible Prophecies 3
http://www.allaboutthejourney.org/bible-proph...
Bible Prophecies 4
http://www.reasons.org/fulfilled-prophecy-evi...
Bible Prophecies 5
http://www.allabouttruth.org/Bible-Prophecy.h...
Show *one* prophesy that was clearly stated (not something like a statue with ahead of gold, etc), made before the events in question (with dated for the earliest sources), and was not self-fullfilling (where someone who knew of the 'prophesy' consciously decided to make it happen.

Most of your claimed 'prophesies' are so vague as to be meaningless. Others were written down first *after* the events as a propaganda tool. Still others were because someone who *knew* the prophesy decided to act so as to fullfill it. Still others, of course, are mere stories where the claim is made that the prophesy was fullfilled but no evidence is given to support the claim.

Since: Dec 10

Fogelsville, PA

#48 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
Review my original post.
I did, it is fatally flawed, and can not be taken seriously.

It is completely conditional, and those conditions are based on gross speculation, flawed understanding of science, misinterpetation of the Bible, and the supernatural.

It is an epic failure, even at a fifth grade level. When faced with your contradictions and flaws, you fail to respond intelligently, but rather with a request that I review those things I have already quoted and disproved in my post.

If this is the best you have, you fail. Don't feel bad though, you theists always do when trying to prove the existance of god.

Since: Dec 10

Fogelsville, PA

#49 Aug 23, 2012
AussiPino wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you explain people seeing ghosts around? There are people who claim that they can feel and see them. What scientific explanations are there for ghosts to be lingering around?
"What scientific explanations are there for ghosts to be lingering around"

There isn't, but agian, there is no proof that they are real either.

Since: Dec 10

Fogelsville, PA

#50 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Serpent: As soon as you mention the Serpent: Since he breaks his own laws, he is contradictory, and cannot be a god, but rather the product of men.
Pahu: When did God break His own laws.
Serpent: There is not a single prophesy in the bible that was not self-fulfilling, and therefore void, or false.
Pahu: For example?
Serpent: The bible does not correctly foretell of ANY scientific developments that were not already known by the people of the period when it was written.
Pahu: In fact, it does. See: The Bible is scientifically accurate.
Serpent: In short, the Bible is not only grossly human, but an example of the thinking of primative man. The worst thing you can do is try to use the bible to prove the existance of a god.
Pahu: The Bible consists of 66 books: 39 in the OT and 27 in the new. The Bible took about 1600 years to write. It was written in three languages (Hebrew, Aramaic, and Greek) by about 40 authors and is internally consistent throughout.
The Bible is 98½ percent textually pure. Through all the copying of the Biblical manuscripts of the entire Bible, only 1½% has any question about it. Nothing in all of the ancient writings of the entire world approaches the accuracy of the biblical documents.
The 1½ percent that is in question does not affect doctrine. The areas of interest are called variants and they consist mainly in variations of wording and spelling.
The NT has over 5000 supporting Greek manuscripts existing today with another 20,000 manuscripts in other languages. Some of the manuscript evidence dates to within 100 years of the original writing. There is less than a 1% textual variation in the NT manuscripts.
Some of the supporting manuscripts of the NT are:
John Rylands MS written around A.D. 130, the oldest existing fragment of the gospel of John.
Bodmer Papyrus II (A.D. 150-200).
Chester Beatty Papyri (A.D. 200), contains major portions of the NT .
Codex Vaticanus (A.D. 325-350), contains nearly all the Bible.
Codex Sinaiticus (A.D. 350), contains almost all the NT and over half of the OT .
[Bible Accuracy]
"Pahu: It is true that science limits itself the a study of God’s creation, but we can use logic, based on the facts of science, to conclude a supernatural cause of the universe appearing from nothing."
Incorrect, Your first statement is dishonest, in that science does not recognize "god", so to say that it is the study of gods' creation is wrong. Since science does not recognize the supernatural, no conclusion of the supernatural may be derived. At one time, lightning was thought to come from god. Science did not accept this, and discovered the cause of lightning. Because we have not yet discovered the circumstance for the primordial soup, does not mean that there is a god.
"Pahu: The Bible is scientifically accurate."
Incorrect..... There is not enough water in the whole of the earth to cover the world, it is impossible for a human to survive in the digestive track of a fish for three days, the sun cannot stop in the sky for a battle to proceed, donkeys and serpents do not have the ability to speak, nor is there any fossil evidence that they ever could, mankind is more than 6000 years old.... I could go on if you would like.
"Serpent: If god crated man in his own image, than he is subject to his own moral laws.
Pahu: A logical error."
Not at all.
"When did God break His own laws."
When he murdered.
"Serpent: There is not a single prophesy in the bible that was not self-fulfilling, and therefore void, or false.
Pahu: For example?"
It is easier for you to give an example of a prophesy that was fullfilled.
As far as the accuracy of the bible and it's texual purity..... So? It is still flawed and tells a story of a monster god. It contains such gross logical fallacy that one should be embarrassed to claim to believe any of it.

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#51 Aug 23, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
<quoted text>
And you know this because god speaks directly to you and tells you this. Does he speak to you through your hairbrush?
(Your dictionary does not address the modern understanding of quantum level physics.)
I noticed you ignored all of your Bible's scientific mistakes and fallacies I pointed out in my last post. Could you at least explain how a star can direct someone (anyone) to a particular house (any house) on the surface of this planet? How about how floating slivers of tree bark can affect the color of your goats?
The Bible records many miracles, which is an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause. The Star of Bethlehem was a miracle.

Slivers of tree bark cannot affect the color of goats. To understand how God worked this miracle one needs to know that just as blue eyes are recessive in humans, so spotting is recessive in goats. This means that under normal conditions of complete mixing, 25% of the goats would be homozygous (have two similar genes) for the dominant solid color; 25% would be homozygous for recessive spotting and be spotted; while 50% would be heterozygous with one gene for solid color and one gene for spotting. This 50% would also be solid colored because the gene for solid color is dominant and controls the color, leaving the gene for spotting hidden. Ordinary mating, which happens by chance with a normal (25%-50%-25%) mix of rams and ewes, continues to result in 25% spotted kids.

When Laban removed the spotted 25%, this left a herd made up of 33% pure solid goats, and 67% mixed or heterozygous goats. This would have worked against Jacob resulting in only 16.75% of spotted goats. But then God stepped in and caused all the mating to be done by spotted (homozygous-recessive) rams.

The first year result would be that 50% of kids born to the 67% heterozygous females would be spotted resulting in 33% of the total number of kids being spotted and belonging to Jacob.

An additional long-term result would be that all of the solid colored kids would be heterozygous with a recessive gene from the spotted rams, which had fathered them. This would increase the percentage of heterozygous ewes to 75% the following year, and eventually almost half of the kids would be spotted, resulting in a doubling of Jacob's wages.

Thus the Biblical account from 1700 BC, while acknowledging Jacob's wrong ideas, is consistent with modern genetic understanding.

The Bible is scientifically accurate: http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science...

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#52 Aug 23, 2012
Hedonist wrote:
<quoted text>
And you know this because god speaks directly to you and tells you this. Does he speak to you through your hairbrush?
(Your dictionary does not address the modern understanding of quantum level physics.)
I noticed you ignored all of your Bible's scientific mistakes and fallacies I pointed out in my last post. Could you at least explain how a star can direct someone (anyone) to a particular house (any house) on the surface of this planet? How about how floating slivers of tree bark can affect the color of your goats?
The Bible contains many miracles, which is an effect or extraordinary event in the physical world that surpasses all known human or natural powers and is ascribed to a supernatural cause. The Star of Bethlehem was a miracle.

Floating slivers of tree bark cannot affect the color of goats. To understand how God worked this miracle one needs to know that just as blue eyes are recessive in humans, so spotting is recessive in goats. This means that under normal conditions of complete mixing, 25% of the goats would be homozygous (have two similar genes) for the dominant solid color; 25% would be homozygous for recessive spotting and be spotted; while 50% would be heterozygous with one gene for solid color and one gene for spotting. This 50% would also be solid colored because the gene for solid color is dominant and controls the color, leaving the gene for spotting hidden. Ordinary mating, which happens by chance with a normal (25%-50%-25%) mix of rams and ewes, continues to result in 25% spotted kids.

When Laban removed the spotted 25%, this left a herd made up of 33% pure solid goats, and 67% mixed or heterozygous goats. This would have worked against Jacob resulting in only 16.75% of spotted goats. But then God stepped in and caused all the mating to be done by spotted (homozygous-recessive) rams.

The first year result would be that 50% of kids born to the 67% heterozygous females would be spotted resulting in 33% of the total number of kids being spotted and belonging to Jacob.

An additional long-term result would be that all of the solid colored kids would be heterozygous with a recessive gene from the spotted rams, which had fathered them. This would increase the percentage of heterozygous ewes to 75% the following year, and eventually almost half of the kids would be spotted, resulting in a doubling of Jacob's wages.

Thus the Biblical account from 1700 BC, while acknowledging Jacob's wrong ideas, is consistent with modern genetic understanding.

The Bible is scientifically accurate: http://www.clarifyingchristianity.com/science...

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#53 Aug 23, 2012
Hedonist: You really aren't too bright are you?

Pahu: Right!

Hedonist: So, the Earth is flat.

Pahu: Why do you believe that?

Pahu:... The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables....

Hedonist: Once you admit that part of the book is not factual, you get into who gets to decide which part is which and your entire book becomes unreliable as anything more than a waste of paper.

Pahu: Usually it is clear which is which.

Pahu:... But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology....

Hedonist: No, actually it isn't and archaeology hasn't.

Pahu: Yes it has: http://www.campuslight.org/wvu/EvidencesCFait...

Pahu: Also, the Bible is filled with hundreds of fulfilled prophecies such as:

Hedonist: Prophecies don't count if they are written after the event they reference or are so vague as to be applicable to more than one event.

Pahu: That may be true, which is why Bible prophecies are accurately fulfilled. They were all written before the events, sometimes hundreds of years, and they are quite specific:

Bible Prophecies 1
http://www.aboutbibleprophecy.com/

Bible Prophecies 2
http://www.100prophecies.org/

Bible Prophecies 3
http://www.allaboutthejourney.org/bible-proph...

Bible Prophecies 4
http://www.reasons.org/fulfilled-prophecy-evi...

Bible Prophecies 5
http://www.allabouttruth.org/Bible-Prophecy.h...

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#54 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu: In the real world, every effect has a cause,

Polymath: Well, by definition of the word 'effect', every 'effect' has a 'cause', but there are events that are not effects. In other words, there are events that are not caused.

Pahu: Such as?

Pahu:…including the universe…

Polymath: Please support the claim that the universe is an effect.

Pahu:…which did not exist before it existed, and therefore there was nothing, from which the universe appeared. Something does not come from nothing by any natural cause, therefore the cause of the universe was supernatural.

Polymath: One fallacy after another.

Pahu: What’s false about it?

Polymath: At the quantum level, the universe is inherently probabilistic. It is not causal. There are many situations where more than one possibility exists for a given situation. In other words, there is no *specific* effect from a given event. An example can be found in any number of decay events where more than one decay is possible. There is NOTHING that causes one decay to happen instead of another. it is simply a probability that one or the other will happen.

Furthermore, the probabilistic nature of reality at the quantum level can be demonstrated. Causality cannot explain what is actually seen in experiments because a causal connection necessarily leads to regularities that are not seen in practice.

Pahu: Some physicists assert that quantum mechanics violates the cause/effect principle and can produce something from nothing. But this is a gross misapplication of quantum mechanics. Quantum mechanics never produces something out of nothing.

Theories that the universe is a quantum fluctuation must presuppose that there was something to fluctuate—their ‘quantum vacuum’ is a lot of matter-antimatter potential—not ‘nothing’.

http://christiananswers.net/q-aig/aig-c039.ht...

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#55 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
The Bible records many miracles
You're a liar lying about miracles that have been categorically proven false.

Why do you lie to people about established facts? Do you think atheists won't question your lies? Are you that naive?

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#56 Aug 23, 2012
Hedonist: Isn't there a passage that talks about being able to see the entire Earth from on top of a mountain?

Pahu: Yes, it is when Satan was tempting Jesus. I believe Satan is not a person, but a word describing our rebellion against God. The temptations were the story of Jesus being tempted by His own desires since He had taken on human flesh, which He had to overcome before beginning His ministry.

Polymath: So? Since the earth is round, there is no way to show all of it from a mountain top.

Pahu: Right, but the story is allegory.

Hedonist: Seems there also at least one passage that talks of the four corners of Earth, another that describs the pillars of Earth, I think someone supposedly traveled to the North gate at the end of the world and say where the wind came from.
What you've got is a poorly written Aesop's fairytail book. It was even written about the same time as Aesop's fables.

Pahu: Not really. The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables. But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology.

Polymath: No more than the Illiad and the Odyessy have been shown accurate by the discovery of Troy. Yes, city names have been verified and some personal names have been also, but the overall history before about 900BC is shown by archaeology to be wrong. More accurately, it was propaganda-made up stuff to make the populace feel good.

Pahu: But archaeology has yet to show the Bible to be historically inaccurate.

Since: Jun 07

Location hidden

#57 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology.
F*ck off liar.

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#58 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
Also, the Bible is filled with hundreds of fulfilled prophecies such as:

Bible Prophecies 1
http://www.aboutbibleprophecy.com/

Bible Prophecies 2
http://www.100prophecies.org/

Bible Prophecies 3
http://www.allaboutthejourney.org/bible-proph...

Bible Prophecies 4
http://www.reasons.org/fulfilled-prophecy-evi...

Bible Prophecies 5
http://www.allabouttruth.org/Bible-Prophecy.h...

Polymath: Show *one* prophesy that was clearly stated (not something like a statue with ahead of gold, etc), made before the events in question (with dated for the earliest sources), and was not self-fullfilling (where someone who knew of the 'prophesy' consciously decided to make it happen.

Pahu: You will find them in the above list I provided.

Polymath: Most of your claimed 'prophesies' are so vague as to be meaningless.

Pahu: They are quite specific.

Polymath: Others were written down first *after* the events as a propaganda tool. Still others were because someone who *knew* the prophesy decided to act so as to fullfill it. Still others, of course, are mere stories where the claim is made that the prophesy was fullfilled but no evidence is given to support the claim.

Pahu: All Bible prophecies were written before the events:

http://www.neverthirsty.org/pp/corner/read1/r...

http://craigwbooth.xanga.com/716320510/are-th...

Since: Dec 08

Madison, AL

#59 Aug 23, 2012
The serpent was right wrote:
<quoted text>
I did, it is fatally flawed, and can not be taken seriously.
It is completely conditional, and those conditions are based on gross speculation, flawed understanding of science, misinterpetation of the Bible, and the supernatural.
It is an epic failure, even at a fifth grade level. When faced with your contradictions and flaws, you fail to respond intelligently, but rather with a request that I review those things I have already quoted and disproved in my post.
If this is the best you have, you fail. Don't feel bad though, you theists always do when trying to prove the existance of god.
Your denial of the facts presented does not alter them. Your denial of the logic based on scientific facts is probably because they threaten your erroneous preconceptions.

“ecrasez l'infame”

Since: May 08

Atlanta, Georgia

#60 Aug 23, 2012
Pahu wrote:
...
Pahu: The Bible describes the history of the world in general and the history of Israel in particular. The fairytale like stories are mostly allegories. Also there are some parables.
Hedonist: Once you admit that part of the book is not factual, you get into who gets to decide which part is which and your entire book becomes unreliable as anything more than a waste of paper.
Pahu: Usually it is clear which is which...
If it was clear which is which there would not be thousands of different sects of Christianity each with their own interpretations.(There is even a small number of fundamentalists idiots that really believe the Eden and Flood myths, go figure.)

So, based on results, the Bible is worthless as a reference for anything.
Pahu wrote:
...
Pahu:... But most of the Bible is factual and has been found to be historically accurate by the science of archaeology....
Hedonist: No, actually it isn't and archaeology hasn't.
Pahu: Yes it has: http://www.campuslight.org/wvu/EvidencesCFait...
You would have to cite a secular reference to have any argument. An apologetic website is NOT endorsement by the science of archaeology.

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