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TEF

“Non credo quia absurdum est”

Since: Feb 09

Location hidden

#1 Jul 15, 2009
So today on my drive home from work, I was listening to Christian talk radio, as I sometimes do (to better understand the "other side"). Normally, there is nothing to terribly interesting, mostly just asking for "donations" for continuted ministry or some other unintelligent drivel.

Today was different, today I got really pissed off. The host was talking something about God's "ultimate plan". Normal mumbo jumbo. But then a caller came on, and asked "If a person commits suicide, do they go to hell?" The host went into a long winded explanation about how a true christian "would never" consider commiting suicide, as they are God's property. A "true christian" would never commit self-murder.

As if that wasn't bad enough, the host asked the caller if he lost someone to suicide. The caller said no, the host then asked if the caller was suicidal, and after a pause, he admitted yes. The tone of the caller and his general attitude gave the impression that he was very serious. Instead of the host advising the caller to immediately call someone for help, the host berated the caller more or less and insinuated that the caller was just acting selfish. That the caller needed to just trust that God would never give him more than he could handle. He basically treated the caller as if he was a crying child.

The hosts general attitude toward the caller was appalling. He never once suggested that the caller get proffesional help. He never once tried to get to any of the reasons why this person might feel this way. Instead, the host acted morally superior and simply berated the caller. I only hope that the caller did not go thru with his intentions.

It didn't suprise me that this great "Christian" radio host was an ignorant imbecile, but the fact that he potentially had another man's life in his hands and that he handled that reponsibility with absolutely no compassion and with no class floored me for some reason. I tried to call into the show but never got through. The next time someone asks me why I care about what people believe, or why I am not a Christian, this is going to be at the forefront of my reasons.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#2 Jul 28, 2009
Just another fine example of the hate-cult that is Christianity.

They are like piranha fish: most of the time piranhas do not eat each other.

But, if they sense a weakness, or an injury? They will devour that fish in seconds.

Just as christians will turn their rabid eyes on anyone they deem inferior or weak, and go on the attack.

Sick.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Charleston, SC

#3 Jul 29, 2009
Christianity is much larger than the tiny group of fundies that are likely to be heard on talk radio. I believe that most mainstream Christians would have reacted with more compassionate.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#4 Jul 29, 2009
NightSerf wrote:
Christianity is much larger than the tiny group of fundies that are likely to be heard on talk radio. I believe that most mainstream Christians would have reacted with more compassionate.
Not *because* they are christian, but because they are genuinely nice people.

Just as most non-christians are genuinely nice people.

Christianity does not foster nice attitude in folk; just the opposite: look at history for evidence.

“It's just a box of rain...”

Since: May 07

Charleston, SC

#5 Jul 29, 2009
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Not *because* they are christian, but because they are genuinely nice people.
Just as most non-christians are genuinely nice people.
Christianity does not foster nice attitude in folk; just the opposite: look at history for evidence.
Agreed.

“Jesus forgives..... ”

Since: May 08

Location hidden

#6 Aug 27, 2009
WTF mentality you have here huh!
nina

Ottawa, Canada

#7 Aug 28, 2009
TEF wrote:
.... The next time someone asks me why I care about what people believe, or why I am not a Christian, this is going to be at the forefront of my reasons.
truthfully, I wouldn't be surpised to hear that the radio guy was murdered by a "fan" who's then gunned down by police

suicide by cop is a loophole in that no suicide rule

so, by extention, would be engaging in risky behavior or extreme sports

it's not really surprising that people who are selling jesus as a snake oil solution to all life's problems do not refer people to therapy

since, if they went to therapy themselves, this imaginary friend fixation would be resolved for them
nina

Ottawa, Canada

#8 Aug 28, 2009
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Not *because* they are christian, but because they are genuinely nice people.
....
many years ago in my province, we had a Catholic Premier (equivalent to your state governors)

he was on vaction and some vote came up around stand alone abortion clinics

he came back from Hawaii and cut his vaction short to vote against whatever the issue was - I think it was a 6 block radius bubble zone where protestors weren't allowed to be

anyway, I was in college, polysci class

and we were generally pasting the Premiere over his cutting his vacation

one gal stood up and said "If he wasn't Catholic, none of you would think twice about his abortion stance"

so I reponded, "if he wasn't Catholic, niether would he"

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#9 Aug 30, 2009
nina wrote:
one gal stood up and said "If he wasn't Catholic, none of you would think twice about his abortion stance"
so I reponded, "if he wasn't Catholic, niether would he"
Excellent rebuttal, Nina.

What was the general response from the rest of the class, to your reply?

Oh, and Penn and Teller have a nice rant against the fallacy* of the pope, here:

" http://scienceblogs.com/pharyngula/2009/08/pe... ;

_________

* double meaning intentional...
:)
nina

Canada

#10 Aug 30, 2009
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Excellent rebuttal, Nina.
What was the general response from the rest of the class, to your reply?...
:)
they laughed her into her seat

she was really quite the flake and it surprised me that as a rather leftie-touchy feely gal that she'd be defensive about a conservative politician
nina

Canada

#11 Aug 30, 2009
oooo the outspoken part of the class was actually right wing

I was the only outspoke left wing person

but like any class, most kept their mouths shut and their pens in their hands
Alissa

Chesapeake, VA

#12 Jul 26, 2012
I am a Christian, I accidentally found this blog. Interesting why you are "gathering here" and wasting your time on criticizing something you have no clue about... It is interesting how people passionately are trying to put someone down. People who chose to be called Christians have as much right to chose to what they want to believe as you are. You think atheism makes it for you, be happy. Who doesn't make mistakes? Christians do. Most of us happy to be redeemed from sins, enjoy the fellowship with our Lord, find peace in Him, answer to our questions. Why should you be bothered by other peopleís choices if we live in a free country. Your hatred of Christians is not going to make you right on any level, or reduce the amount of people becoming Christians.

Was the talk- show person mentioned in the first post right in his actions? Probably not. However, his wrongness does not originate in being a Christian, but probably is due to his ignorance. Folks here who are mentioning Christianity historically should make a better research and realize that unfortunately in charge of Christianity were people who were politicians and who cared very little about following Christ. If you do want to speak intelligently about Christianity, challenge its originator, Christ, and His word, the Bible. Do not challenge people who are just learning the principles of Christianity and many time fail in putting these principles into practice.

Since: Dec 10

Orefield, PA

#13 Jul 26, 2012
Alissa wrote:
I am a Christian, I accidentally found this blog. Interesting why you are "gathering here" and wasting your time on criticizing something you have no clue about... It is interesting how people passionately are trying to put someone down. People who chose to be called Christians have as much right to chose to what they want to believe as you are. You think atheism makes it for you, be happy. Who doesn't make mistakes? Christians do. Most of us happy to be redeemed from sins, enjoy the fellowship with our Lord, find peace in Him, answer to our questions. Why should you be bothered by other peopleís choices if we live in a free country. Your hatred of Christians is not going to make you right on any level, or reduce the amount of people becoming Christians.
Was the talk- show person mentioned in the first post right in his actions? Probably not. However, his wrongness does not originate in being a Christian, but probably is due to his ignorance. Folks here who are mentioning Christianity historically should make a better research and realize that unfortunately in charge of Christianity were people who were politicians and who cared very little about following Christ. If you do want to speak intelligently about Christianity, challenge its originator, Christ, and His word, the Bible. Do not challenge people who are just learning the principles of Christianity and many time fail in putting these principles into practice.
There are a few things you should be aware of...
Most atheists were believers at one time, and have much more than a "clue".

No one said christians do not have a right to believe as they want.

It isn't the choice of someone to be a christian that bothers me, it is the fact that that choice often compels them to do harm to others.

The radio host was wrong for many reasons, but not necessarrily in his interpetation of christs teachings. The bible, the basis for your belief, is so poorly written, that a person could(and do) justify just about any position, including slavery, rape, war, murder, etc.... If your god is real, you would think that he would correct some of the aberrations committed in his name. As it is, he reacts exactly like every other myth thoughout history.
Alissa

Chesapeake, VA

#14 Jul 26, 2012
The serpent was right wrote:
<quoted text>
There are a few things you should be aware of...
Most atheists were believers at one time, and have much more than a "clue".
No one said christians do not have a right to believe as they want.
It isn't the choice of someone to be a christian that bothers me, it is the fact that that choice often compels them to do harm to others.
The radio host was wrong for many reasons, but not necessarrily in his interpetation of christs teachings. The bible, the basis for your belief, is so poorly written, that a person could(and do) justify just about any position, including slavery, rape, war, murder, etc.... If your god is real, you would think that he would correct some of the aberrations committed in his name. As it is, he reacts exactly like every other myth thoughout history.
My God is real. And why donít you think He has already corrected all the suffering in the world? He has! Through Jesus Christ. However, most of the atheists would accept and believe things only when THEY see or experience them, therefore it will be unacceptable for you what I just said. There is a day when everything will pass away, all the suffering, and the new life will start. The people who suffer will find their consolation at Godís presence. You live in todayís world, we live in our future kingdom.

You are saying that ďno one said Christians do not have a right to believe as they want,Ē but why so much verbal abuse and criticism if we all have the same right to chose? Also, saying that choosing being a Christian often compels them to do harm to others is absolutely wrong. I agree that there are a lot of evil people who are hiding behind Christianity. In order for us to keep this conversation intelligently, we have to settle a lot of things such as the presence of Satan in the world, our sinful nature that we are born into, and many others. I donít think you are up to that at this point.

And how do you know that the radio host was not wrong in his interpretation of Christís teachings? Do you know these teachings closely? I have not listened to the radio talk show that was mentioned in this blog, I just know that we Christians can misunderstand such complicated concepts as suicide. I am sure that radio host had some thinking to do after the show. It was a very challenging situation and perhaps he didnít handle it in the best way. To be a Christian is actually to follow Christ. It is a challenge for many of us since we still struggle with our sinful selves. It is a life-long learning journey.

Finally, just because someone called himself/herself a Christian at some point and then chose to turn to atheism does not mean that person had a clue. I am surrounded by people who call themselves Christians just because their families consider themselves Christians. These people never read the Bible, do not go to church, never pray or see Godís ways and wisdom. If they commit some evil act then everybody would refer this act to their Christian background. If you really want to speak of Christian acts, please read about Augustine, Mother Theresa, and people like them. These people had a clue, and I highly doubt that they would ever turn away from God.

Since: Dec 10

Orefield, PA

#15 Jul 26, 2012
Alissa wrote:
<quoted text>
You are saying that ďno one said Christians do not have a right to believe as they want,Ē but why so much verbal abuse and criticism if we all have the same right to chose? Also, saying that choosing being a Christian often compels them to do harm to others is absolutely wrong. I agree that there are a lot of evil people who are hiding behind Christianity. In order for us to keep this conversation intelligently, we have to settle a lot of things such as the presence of Satan in the world, our sinful nature that we are born into, and many others. I donít think you are up to that at this point.
And how do you know that the radio host was not wrong in his interpretation of Christís teachings? Do you know these teachings closely? I have not listened to the radio talk show that was mentioned in this blog, I just know that we Christians can misunderstand such complicated concepts as suicide. I am sure that radio host had some thinking to do after the show. It was a very challenging situation and perhaps he didnít handle it in the best way. To be a Christian is actually to follow Christ. It is a challenge for many of us since we still struggle with our sinful selves. It is a life-long learning journey.
Finally, just because someone called himself/herself a Christian at some point and then chose to turn to atheism does not mean that person had a clue. I am surrounded by people who call themselves Christians just because their families consider themselves Christians. These people never read the Bible, do not go to church, never pray or see Godís ways and wisdom. If they commit some evil act then everybody would refer this act to their Christian background. If you really want to speak of Christian acts, please read about Augustine, Mother Theresa, and people like them. These people had a clue, and I highly doubt that they would ever turn away from God.
First, Your god is not real, and you only believe because you were taught to believe. You have no more proof that your god is rwal than someone who believes zeus is real.
17 children age 5 and under die every minute. Most from starvation. Most in third world countries, and most do not believe in your god. According to your religion, these children are going to hell. Lovely. Please don't tell me about your compassionate and loving god.
Your future kingdom is a fable. There is absolutly no reason to believe otherwise.
As far as the critisism of christianity... Do you critisize cults that do harm? Probably. Just because you are a member of the cult we are critisizing, doesn't mean it gets a pass.
Satan? LOL!! Really? Another unprovable myth. Born into sin, another flawed belief of your religion. I have read the bible, front to back, no less than five times. I not only know what's in it, I have forgotten more than you will ever know about it.
do a google search for "No true scotsman fallacy"
Mother Theresa was a low-life hag. She did not help the poor, she simply gave them a place to die without pain killers, without compassion, and she did NOTHING to ease their suffering. She also didn't belive in god. Again, google "Mother theresa diaries", You have alot to learn.
Augustine was a pretty bright guy, but was indoctrinated into a cult. That doesn't mean he was correct. Like you, he never offered a single bit of prove that your god is real.
Would you like to talk about the almost painful flaws in your bible? how about if we go over the fact that Jesus lied? I would be glad to review some with you.
Alissa

Chesapeake, VA

#16 Jul 26, 2012
The serpent was right wrote:
<quoted text>
First, Your god is not real, and you only believe because you were taught to believe. You have no more proof that your god is rwal than someone who believes zeus is real.
17 children age 5 and under die every minute. Most from starvation. Most in third world countries, and most do not believe in your god. According to your religion, these children are going to hell. Lovely. Please don't tell me about your compassionate and loving god.
Your future kingdom is a fable. There is absolutly no reason to believe otherwise.
As far as the critisism of christianity... Do you critisize cults that do harm? Probably. Just because you are a member of the cult we are critisizing, doesn't mean it gets a pass.
Satan? LOL!! Really? Another unprovable myth. Born into sin, another flawed belief of your religion. I have read the bible, front to back, no less than five times. I not only know what's in it, I have forgotten more than you will ever know about it.
do a google search for "No true scotsman fallacy"
Mother Theresa was a low-life hag. She did not help the poor, she simply gave them a place to die without pain killers, without compassion, and she did NOTHING to ease their suffering. She also didn't belive in god. Again, google "Mother theresa diaries", You have alot to learn.
Augustine was a pretty bright guy, but was indoctrinated into a cult. That doesn't mean he was correct. Like you, he never offered a single bit of prove that your god is real.
Would you like to talk about the almost painful flaws in your bible? how about if we go over the fact that Jesus lied? I would be glad to review some with you.
The only reason I attempted to make a post in this blog, thinking that someone is there not just to spit their anger and hatred, but really is up for an adult argument. Your words are full of anger and do not make any difference for you or for me. I am sorry that you are feeling the way you do. I just hope that one day you will realize that it is you who are indoctrinated. I was not raised as a Christian, but rather was taught to be an atheist, that is what communist system in which I grew up does. You read the Bible five times? Reading of the Bible alone is not going to make you a believer. It is faith in God that reveals the Bible. But please, letís stop this conversation since it just aggravates you and makes you want to offend others. I could have told you more about the experiences and Godís love, but that wouldnít do any good to you at your state of mind at this time.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#17 Jul 26, 2012
Alissa wrote:
<quoted text>
... I was not raised as a Christian, but rather was taught to be an atheist, that is what communist system in which I grew up does....
Interesting,(although I don't know how or why one is 'taught' to be atheist).
Where did you grow up, may I ask?(Not precisely, but I mean which country, Russia? Which culture, soviet?
Virginia

Wylie, TX

#18 Jul 26, 2012
The serpent was right wrote:
<quoted text>
Mother Theresa was a low-life hag. She did not help the poor, she simply gave them a place to die without pain killers, without compassion, and she did NOTHING to ease their suffering. She also didn't belive in god. Again, google "Mother theresa diaries", You have alot to learn.
Thank you for pointing this out...In Catholic school, I got in trouble for referring to Mother T as the "Hag O'Christ"...She was in love with POVERTY and cared nothing for the poor...It was all a stage show, twisted theatrics, for Vatican fundraising. Poor people were moveable props in the staging of Mother Teresa's grotesque piety. A brilliant essayist called Mother T a fraud, a fundamentalist and a fanatic...I just added and defended a fourth "F" word, FUNDRAISER.

Mother T. opposed the only known method to treat poverty: WOMEN'S control over their own bodies. I got into serious trouble in Catholic high school for writing about this on a paper.:)
Alissa

Chesapeake, VA

#19 Jul 26, 2012
EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>Interesting,(although I don't know how or why one is 'taught' to be atheist).
Where did you grow up, may I ask?(Not precisely, but I mean which country, Russia? Which culture, soviet?
Yes, Soviet.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

#20 Jul 26, 2012
Virginia wrote:
<quoted text>
Thank you for pointing this out...In Catholic school, I got in trouble for referring to Mother T as the "Hag O'Christ"...She was in love with POVERTY and cared nothing for the poor...It was all a stage show, twisted theatrics, for Vatican fundraising. Poor people were moveable props in the staging of Mother Teresa's grotesque piety. A brilliant essayist called Mother T a fraud, a fundamentalist and a fanatic...I just added and defended a fourth "F" word, FUNDRAISER.
Mother T. opposed the only known method to treat poverty: WOMEN'S control over their own bodies. I got into serious trouble in Catholic high school for writing about this on a paper.:)
You (and others might) know much more about Mother Teresa than I, but from what I have read she was a fairly typical woman of her generation,(born 1910). I think she was a fine person, but a woman of her time. She was religious and make (it seems) many mistakes.

Personally, I wouldn't take any notice of people like Christopher Hitchens though. A few more like him and I'd be an ardent religious supporter myself!

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