'Good without a god': Faces of atheism in Oklahoma

Jul 5, 2013 Full story: NewsOK.com 7,541

Rebecca Vitsmun is shown during an interview with a CNN reporter shortly after the May 20 tornado that destroyed her Moore home.

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Bud

United States

#2820 Oct 24, 2013
AngelAngle wrote:
<quoted text>
Wouldn't that just allow a lot of terriable people in?
You could be the worst person on the planet but accept Jesus and get in.
What kind of a paridise is that?
Dennis Raider was a devout Lutheran,yet killed 10 people.Your rules say that he is going to Heaven.
Going to church doesn't make you a Christian anymore than parking your azz in the garage makes your a car!

Since: Aug 13

Dallas, TX

#2821 Oct 24, 2013
Faith means not wanting to know what is true.
—Friedrich Nietzsche
Amused

Lowell, MA

#2822 Oct 24, 2013
Bud wrote:
<quoted text>
The discovery channel said there is evidence of a flood in the area the Bible says was flooded.
The bible says the *entire earth* was flooded. There is zero evidence of a global flood. There certainly have been extensive local floods. No sensible person would argue against that.

A global flood, however, as claimed in the bible, would be impossible. Just do the math.

The mean radius of the earth is 6371 Km.(The earth is not perfectly spherical. Using the mean should give us a good average.

There were mountains mentioned in the old testament, so we have to account for the height of the mountains in figuring how deep the flood would have to be to cover the entire earth. Just for the sake of argument, we will ignore the Himalayas and the Rockies, where many peaks are well over 10,000 feet. Let's assume no mountain over 1Km in height. That's a very generous assumption in your favor.

The volume of a sphere is 4/3*pi*(radius cubed).

That makes the volume of the earth approximately 1,082,657,777,102.05 cubic kilometers.

Adding the one extra kilometer to the earth's radius gives a volume of 1,083,167,663,016.96 cubic km.

The difference between those values is the volume of water you would need to cover the earth to a depth of 1 kilometer. The difference is 509,885,914.96 cubic kilometers. One cubic kilometer is 1,000,000,000,000 liters. So, the quantity of water needed to cover the earth to a depth of 1 Km is 50,988,591,496,000,000,000,000 liters OVER AND ABOVE the quantity of water already in all the oceans, lakes, ponds, rivers, brooks, ponds and puddles on earth.

If you don't have an explanation other than 'goddidit' for where all that water came from and then went, you have to concede that the entire notion is preposterous. Change the depth of the water to reflect the actual height of mountains, and the absurdity just compounds.

In addition, an influx of rain water (fresh water) of that volume would alter the salinity of the ocean, killing off most marine plant and animal life in the oceans.
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#2823 Oct 24, 2013
AngelAngle wrote:
<quoted text>
Wouldn't that just allow a lot of terriable people in?
You could be the worst person on the planet but accept Jesus and get in.
What kind of a paridise is that?
Dennis Raider was a devout Lutheran,yet killed 10 people.Your rules say that he is going to Heaven.
Christians believe Satans lie in the garden of Eden. You can disobey God and not keep his commandments and you won't die. Genesis 3:4. "Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life" Ezekiel 13:22. Only the righteous go to heaven and they come in all races, creeds, and colors.

Since: Aug 13

Dallas, TX

#2824 Oct 24, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>Christians believe Satans lie in the garden of Eden. You can disobey God and not keep his commandments and you won't die. Genesis 3:4. "Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life" Ezekiel 13:22. Only the righteous go to heaven and they come in all races, creeds, and colors.
I have missed your comments. They are AMAZING!

I do have to point out however, that Satan was no where in the garden. Even the Bible says it was a snake.
So What

Mcloud, OK

#2825 Oct 24, 2013
susanblange wrote:
<quoted text>Christians believe Satans lie in the garden of Eden. You can disobey God and not keep his commandments and you won't die. Genesis 3:4. "Because with lies ye have made the heart of the righteous sad, whom I have not made sad; and strengthened the hands of the wicked, that he should not return from his wicked way, by promising him life" Ezekiel 13:22. Only the righteous go to heaven and they come in all races, creeds, and colors.
Christians didn't exist before Christ. Even Christ and his people weren't Christians, they were Jews.
Smell the Coffee

Twinsburg, OH

#2826 Oct 24, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
If god sits by, eating popcorn, while satan has free reign over earth?
Then-- god is **responsible** for each and every thing satan does.
There is no getting around that one--
-- such a god would be pure evil.
Exactly! When there's human genocide somewhere around the world, then the UN does try, not always, to negotiate, place sanctions, send troops, etc.......... Sky daddy should put the popcorn down and get off his royal fat ass and intervene when there are acts of human atrocities. After all, devils are his phuque up.
Bud

United States

#2827 Oct 24, 2013
Amused wrote:
<quoted text>
The bible says the *entire earth* was flooded. There is zero evidence of a global flood. There certainly have been extensive local floods. No sensible person would argue against that.
A global flood, however, as claimed in the bible, would be impossible. Just do the math.
The mean radius of the earth is 6371 Km.(The earth is not perfectly spherical. Using the mean should give us a good average.
There were mountains mentioned in the old testament, so we have to account for the height of the mountains in figuring how deep the flood would have to be to cover the entire earth. Just for the sake of argument, we will ignore the Himalayas and the Rockies, where many peaks are well over 10,000 feet. Let's assume no mountain over 1Km in height. That's a very generous assumption in your favor.
The volume of a sphere is 4/3*pi*(radius cubed).
That makes the volume of the earth approximately 1,082,657,777,102.05 cubic kilometers.
Adding the one extra kilometer to the earth's radius gives a volume of 1,083,167,663,016.96 cubic km.
The difference between those values is the volume of water you would need to cover the earth to a depth of 1 kilometer. The difference is 509,885,914.96 cubic kilometers. One cubic kilometer is 1,000,000,000,000 liters. So, the quantity of water needed to cover the earth to a depth of 1 Km is 50,988,591,496,000,000,000,000 liters OVER AND ABOVE the quantity of water already in all the oceans, lakes, ponds, rivers, brooks, ponds and puddles on earth.
If you don't have an explanation other than 'goddidit' for where all that water came from and then went, you have to concede that the entire notion is preposterous. Change the depth of the water to reflect the actual height of mountains, and the absurdity just compounds.
In addition, an influx of rain water (fresh water) of that volume would alter the salinity of the ocean, killing off most marine plant and animal life in the oceans.
Question: Has there ever been a time other than the 'tale' in the Bible that says the entire earth received rain non-stop for 40 days and 40 nights?

How much rain would that be?

There is no way to know since we don't know the volume of rain that fell during the 40 days and 40 nights mentioned in the Bible.
Amused

Lowell, MA

#2828 Oct 24, 2013
So What wrote:
<quoted text>Christians didn't exist before Christ. Even Christ and his people weren't Christians, they were Jews.
You mean jesus didn't believe in himself? LOL.

Since: Jun 13

Location hidden

#2829 Oct 24, 2013
antiatheist wrote:
"And I believe there is a place in Heaven for you, because of the person you are, but most people on this forum can't respect that."

So what, where are you getting this from? You don't go to heaven because of the "person you are". Thats total nonsense. You go to heaven by accepting Christ, period. There is no other way.
Now anti---you are not being very tolerant of someone else's beliefs. That's not very nice
Thinking

UK

#2830 Oct 24, 2013
Goddamn pinko leftie commie speak. Whatever happened to freedom of choice for Americans?
antiatheist wrote:
You go to heaven by accepting Christ, period. There is no other way.
Amused

Lowell, MA

#2831 Oct 24, 2013
Bud wrote:
<quoted text>
Question: Has there ever been a time other than the 'tale' in the Bible that says the entire earth received rain non-stop for 40 days and 40 nights?
How much rain would that be?
There is no way to know since we don't know the volume of rain that fell during the 40 days and 40 nights mentioned in the Bible.
You miss the point. The rain has to come from somewhere. The water supply on earth is essentially a closed system. There is no source for spontaneously generated water made from other elements. Water from the various bodies of water evaporates and forms clouds. When the clouds become saturated, it rains.(That's why hurricanes and tropical storms strengthen over the ocean and weaken over land. When they are over the ocean, the evaporation from the water feeds more moisture into the clouds.) The cycle repeats over and over again. A global flood would require the introduction into the closed system of billions of cubic kilometers of water *over and above* the amounts already circulating in the closed system. Where does it come from? Just as importantly, where did it go? The closed system means the additional water would stay in the system. If it evaporated, it would form clouds, which would become saturated, and then all the additional water would rain down again. The global floods would become a perpetual cycle.

Clouds could not hold enough water to rain for 40 days and nights, even locally, and certainly not globally. They would be saturated and rain long before they reached the point of holding that much water.
Bud

United States

#2832 Oct 24, 2013
Amused wrote:
<quoted text>
You miss the point. The rain has to come from somewhere. The water supply on earth is essentially a closed system. There is no source for spontaneously generated water made from other elements. Water from the various bodies of water evaporates and forms clouds. When the clouds become saturated, it rains.(That's why hurricanes and tropical storms strengthen over the ocean and weaken over land. When they are over the ocean, the evaporation from the water feeds more moisture into the clouds.) The cycle repeats over and over again. A global flood would require the introduction into the closed system of billions of cubic kilometers of water *over and above* the amounts already circulating in the closed system. Where does it come from? Just as importantly, where did it go? The closed system means the additional water would stay in the system. If it evaporated, it would form clouds, which would become saturated, and then all the additional water would rain down again. The global floods would become a perpetual cycle.
Clouds could not hold enough water to rain for 40 days and nights, even locally, and certainly not globally. They would be saturated and rain long before they reached the point of holding that much water.
Does that include all the water contained in the glaciers/north and sole poles etc?
Bud

United States

#2833 Oct 24, 2013
I mean south pole?
Amused

Lowell, MA

#2834 Oct 24, 2013
Bud wrote:
<quoted text>
Does that include all the water contained in the glaciers/north and sole poles etc?
Yes. The amount of water over and above *all* the water in every form currently on earth needed to produce global flooding to a depth of one kilometer is 50,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 ,000,000liters. If all the polar ice caps and the ice in Greenland melted, it is estimated the oceans would rise about 220 feet.A kilometer is 3,280, so even if you hypothesized that a startling rise in global temperature accompanied the rain, melting all the ice, you would still be short enough water to make up the other 3,060 feet of flood water. That's a shortfall of over 46,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 ,000,000 liters. That's a lot of water.

You are grasping at straws here.
Bud

United States

#2835 Oct 24, 2013
Amused wrote:
<quoted text>
Yes. The amount of water over and above *all* the water in every form currently on earth needed to produce global flooding to a depth of one kilometer is 50,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 ,000,000liters. If all the polar ice caps and the ice in Greenland melted, it is estimated the oceans would rise about 220 feet.A kilometer is 3,280, so even if you hypothesized that a startling rise in global temperature accompanied the rain, melting all the ice, you would still be short enough water to make up the other 3,060 feet of flood water. That's a shortfall of over 46,000,000,000,000,000,000,000 ,000,000 liters. That's a lot of water.
You are grasping at straws here.
Hardly. If Noah floated on water, created during the flood on his self styled yacht mentioned in the Bible isn't something I worry over, lol.
Gillette

Fairfield, IA

#2836 Oct 24, 2013
antiatheist wrote:
So what, where are you getting this from? You don't go to heaven because of the "person you are". Thats total nonsense. You go to heaven by accepting Christ, period. There is no other way.
It;s not total nonsense according to the actual words of jesus:

Apparently you haven't read Matthew 25:31-46

According to the ACTUAL WORDS OF JESUS, those who will be lead off into eternal reward will be those who performed SELFLESS GOOD WORKS, while those who will be lead off into eternal punishment will be those who FAILED to do such good deeds.

Again, ACTUAL WORDS OF JESUS!
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#2837 Oct 24, 2013
AngelAngle wrote:
<quoted text>
I have missed your comments. They are AMAZING!
I do have to point out however, that Satan was no where in the garden. Even the Bible says it was a snake.
Hi AA, I'm glad you enjoy the posts. The snake was a part of Adams anatomy, Satan is Adam. The creation of Satan was a side effect of the creation of man. He wasn't a deliberately created spirit being, he is the antithesis of God. He is the only literal son of God and will be executed with a sword. Isaiah 27:1. He has been reincarnated and in this present life is the father of God. He is responsible for the "crucifixion" which happened in the Messiahs childhood and is called "leviathan the piercing serpent".
antiatheist

Seminole, OK

#2838 Oct 24, 2013
so what I'm still waiting for your answer. Angel is going to heaven because of the "person she is"? Where are you getting this garbage. You are just totally making things up
susanblange

Norfolk, VA

#2839 Oct 24, 2013
So What wrote:
<quoted text>Christians didn't exist before Christ. Even Christ and his people weren't Christians, they were Jews.
Christianity did start out as a sect of Judaism. Jesus was a false prophet who lead a lot of the Jewish people astray into idolatry. He said that everything in the OT would come to pass within a generation (forty years). This probably came from Psalm 22:30. Christianity and Judaism are mutually exclusive. You cannot be both at the same time. It says in the NT they will be made "the synagogue of Satan". Rev. 3:9. Do you know Satan/Adam new name is "Christian" (Kringle)?

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