Thinking

York, UK

#511 Jul 17, 2013
All this BS you prattle, yet Evolution carries on unabated...
Pahu wrote:
Fossil Gaps 6
“... there are about 25 major living subdivisions (phyla) of the animal kingdom alone, all with gaps between them that are not bridged by known intermediates.” Francisco J. Ayala and James W. Valentine, Evolving, The Theory and Processes of Organic Evolution (Menlo Park, California: The Benjamin Cummings Publishing Co., 1979), p. 258.
“Most orders, classes, and phyla appear abruptly, and commonly have already acquired all the characters that distinguish them.” Ibid., p. 266.
“All paleontologists know that the fossil record contains precious little in the way of intermediate forms; transitions between major groups are characteristically abrupt.” Gould,“The Return of Hopeful Monsters,” p. 23.
“The extreme rarity of transitional forms in the fossil record persists as the trade secret of paleontology. The evolutionary trees that adorn our textbooks have data only at the tips and nodes of their branches; the rest is inference, however reasonable, not the evidence of fossils.... We fancy ourselves as the only true students of life’s history, yet to preserve our favored account of evolution by natural selection we view our data as so bad that we never see the very process we profess to study.” Stephen Jay Gould,“Evolution’s Erratic Pace,” Natural History, Vol. 86, May 1977, p. 14.
“New species almost always appeared suddenly in the fossil record with no intermediate links to ancestors in older rocks of the same region.” Ibid., p. 12.
“The absence of fossil evidence for intermediary stages between major transitions in organic design, indeed our inability, even in our imagination, to construct functional intermediates in many cases, has been a persistent and nagging problem for gradualistic accounts of evolution.” Stephen Jay Gould,“Is a New and General Theory of Evolution Emerging?” Paleobiology, Vol. 6, No. 1, 1980, p. 127.
[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]

“Right click Left click Yay!”

Since: Dec 10

Nehwon

#512 Jul 17, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Indeed-- in Texas, the Texas Senate now believes that tampons are more dangerous than live ammunition contained in actual firearms.
Tampons are banned from their Senate, but not guns...
...!!!
Well, the Bibble does have rules about menstruating women.

But since there's no divine rules written about firearms, God has no opinion about them?

Strange how God hasn't sent forth a prophet to guide us since prevalence gunpowder or nuclear weapons for war. All part of the "plan", I guess.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

#513 Jul 18, 2013
greymouser wrote:
<quoted text>
Well, the Bibble does have rules about menstruating women.
But since there's no divine rules written about firearms, God has no opinion about them?

Strange how God hasn't sent forth a prophet to guide us since prevalence gunpowder or nuclear weapons for war. All part of the "plan", I guess.
Indeed. In the Revelations, god supposedly foresaw B17's bombing Germany-- or so I heard in a sermon once.

But apparently, god was too dimwitted to foresee the invention of guns, and how they would **literally** change civilization forever.

Or the invention of ... pretty much anything modern.

Not much of a god, is it?

“Right click Left click Yay!”

Since: Dec 10

Nehwon

#514 Jul 22, 2013
Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
Indeed. In the Revelations, god supposedly foresaw B17's bombing Germany-- or so I heard in a sermon once.
But apparently, god was too dimwitted to foresee the invention of guns, and how they would **literally** change civilization forever.
Or the invention of ... pretty much anything modern.
Not much of a god, is it?
Well, the thumpers do have their back against the wall. They have to retcon everything to fit.

It's kinda like the Batman or Star Trek universe trying to keep continuity...

With the latter, it's only decades and imagination with lots of heated arguments.

With the former, it's couple of thousand years and wishful thinking and lots of hot wars.

Since: Dec 08

Palm Harbor, FL

#515 Jul 24, 2013
Fossil Gaps 7

In a published interview, Dr. Niles Eldredge, an invertebrate paleontologist at the American Museum of Natural History, stated:

“But the smooth transition from one form of life to another which is implied in the theory is...not borne out by the facts. The search for “missing links” between various living creatures, like humans and apes, is probably fruitless...because they probably never existed as distinct transitional types...But no one has yet found any evidence of such transitional creatures. This oddity has been attributed to gaps in the fossil record which gradualists expected to fill when rock strata of the proper age had been found. In the last decade, however, geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them. If it is not the fossil record which is incomplete then it must be the theory.”“Missing, Believed Nonexistent,” Manchester Guardian (The Washington Post Weekly), Vol. 119, No. 22, 26 November 1978, p. 1.

[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#516 Jul 24, 2013
Pahu wrote:
Fossil Gaps 7
In a published interview, Dr. Niles Eldredge, an invertebrate paleontologist at the American Museum of Natural History, stated:
“But the smooth transition from one form of life to another which is implied in the theory is...not borne out by the facts. The search for “missing links” between various living creatures, like humans and apes, is probably fruitless...because they probably never existed as distinct transitional types...But no one has yet found any evidence of such transitional creatures. This oddity has been attributed to gaps in the fossil record which gradualists expected to fill when rock strata of the proper age had been found. In the last decade, however, geologists have found rock layers of all divisions of the last 500 million years and no transitional forms were contained in them. If it is not the fossil record which is incomplete then it must be the theory.”“Missing, Believed Nonexistent,” Manchester Guardian (The Washington Post Weekly), Vol. 119, No. 22, 26 November 1978, p. 1.
[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]
Yes, Eldredge was one of the proponents of 'Punctuated Equilibria', an alternative view *of evolution* to that of Darwin's gradualism. But Eldredge did acknowledge the truth of evolution. His only objection was in whether changes in species are 'fast' or 'slow' on the geological time scale. But, even then, fast on a geological time scale may very well take tens of thousands of years.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#517 Jul 24, 2013
Pahu wrote:
Fossil Gaps 6
“... there are about 25 major living subdivisions (phyla) of the animal kingdom alone, all with gaps between them that are not bridged by known intermediates.” Francisco J. Ayala and James W. Valentine, Evolving, The Theory and Processes of Organic Evolution (Menlo Park, California: The Benjamin Cummings Publishing Co., 1979), p. 258.
“Most orders, classes, and phyla appear abruptly, and commonly have already acquired all the characters that distinguish them.” Ibid., p. 266.
“All paleontologists know that the fossil record contains precious little in the way of intermediate forms; transitions between major groups are characteristically abrupt.” Gould,“The Return of Hopeful Monsters,” p. 23.
“The extreme rarity of transitional forms in the fossil record persists as the trade secret of paleontology. The evolutionary trees that adorn our textbooks have data only at the tips and nodes of their branches; the rest is inference, however reasonable, not the evidence of fossils.... We fancy ourselves as the only true students of life’s history, yet to preserve our favored account of evolution by natural selection we view our data as so bad that we never see the very process we profess to study.” Stephen Jay Gould,“Evolution’s Erratic Pace,” Natural History, Vol. 86, May 1977, p. 14.
“New species almost always appeared suddenly in the fossil record with no intermediate links to ancestors in older rocks of the same region.” Ibid., p. 12.
“The absence of fossil evidence for intermediary stages between major transitions in organic design, indeed our inability, even in our imagination, to construct functional intermediates in many cases, has been a persistent and nagging problem for gradualistic accounts of evolution.” Stephen Jay Gould,“Is a New and General Theory of Evolution Emerging?” Paleobiology, Vol. 6, No. 1, 1980, p. 127.
[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]
Yes, Gould was also a proponent of 'Punctuated Equilibia'. He also acknowledged the fact of evolution (that species change over time), but thought that major changes can happen 'quickly' on the geological time scale. If you knew anything at all about Gould, you would know that he was very clear about evolution being correct. His question concerned the mechanisms, not the fact.
spudgun

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#518 Jul 24, 2013
Pahu wrote:
Fossil Gaps 7..
How do you explain whales with pelvic bones like land mammals, and other vestigial organs. If a designer was involved he must have put evidence in his creation to mimic evolution :D alternatively no designer was involved.

Since: Dec 08

Oldsmar, FL

#519 Jul 31, 2013
Fossil Gaps 8

Gould and Eldredge claimed transitional fossils are missing because relatively rapid evolutionary jumps (which they called punctuated equilibria) occurred over these gaps. They did not explain how this could happen.

Many geneticists are shocked by the proposal of Gould and Eldredge. Why would they propose something so contradictory to genetics? Gould and Eldredge were forced to say that evolution must proceed in jumps. Never explained, in genetic and mathematical terms, is how such large jumps could occur. To some, this desperation is justified.

“...the gradual morphological transitions between presumed ancestors and descendants, anticipated by most biologists, are missing.” David E. Schindel (Curator of Invertebrate Fossils, Peabody Museum of Natural History),“The Gaps in the Fossil Record,” Nature, Vol. 297, 27 May 1982, p. 282.

“Despite the bright promise that paleontology provides a means of ‘seeing’ evolution, it has presented some nasty difficulties for evolutionists the most notorious of which is the presence of ‘gaps’ in the fossil record. Evolution requires intermediate forms between species and paleontology does not provide them.” David B. Kitts (School of Geology and Geophysics, University of Oklahoma),“Paleontology and Evolutionary Theory,” Evolution, Vol. 28, September 1974, p. 467.

“In spite of the immense amount of the paleontological material and the existence of long series of intact stratigraphic sequences with perfect records for the lower categories, transitions between the higher categories are missing.” Goldschmidt, p. 98.

“When a new phylum, class, or order appears, there follows a quick, explosive (in terms of geological time) diversification so that practically all orders or families known appear suddenly and without any apparent transitions.” Ibid., p. 97.

“There is no fossil record establishing historical continuity of structure for most characters that might be used to assess relationships among phyla.” Katherine G. Field et al.,“Molecular Phylogeny of the Animal Kingdom,” Science, Vol. 239, 12 February 1988, p. 748.

[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]

Since: Dec 08

Oldsmar, FL

#520 Jul 31, 2013
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you explain whales with pelvic bones like land mammals, and other vestigial organs. If a designer was involved he must have put evidence in his creation to mimic evolution :D alternatively no designer was involved.
The answers to your questions can be found here:

http://www.trueorigin.org/whales.asp

http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...

“Right click Left click Yay!”

Since: Dec 10

Nehwon

#521 Jul 31, 2013
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
The answers to your questions can be found here:
http://www.trueorigin.org/whales.asp
http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...
First link - session failed.

Second link - angelfire?!? perhaps a link to geocities or myspace.

All you've done there is shown that your ideas are far behind the times.

But please, proceed, Self appointed apostle.
Cling to your past.
Yell at the clouds.
Authoritatively command the neighborhood kids to get off your lawn.

Meanwhile, the rest of us will silently shake our heads and wonder just how much of our limited time should be spent refuting your willful ignorance.
Thinking

UK

#522 Aug 1, 2013
Incompetent.
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
The answers to your questions can be found here:
http://www.trueorigin.org/whales.asp
http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...

Since: Dec 08

Tarpon Springs, FL

#523 Aug 8, 2013
Fossil Gaps 9

At the most fundamental level, a big gap exists between forms of life whose cells have nuclei (eukaryotes, such as plants, animals, and fungi) and those that don’t (prokaryotes such as bacteria and blue-green algae)(b).

b.“The prokaryotes came first; eukaryotes (all plants, animals, fungi and protists) evolved from them, and to this day biologists hotly debate how this transition took place, with about 20 different theories on the go....[What was thought to be an intermediate between prokaryotes and eukaryotes] is no longer tenable.” Katrin Henze and William Martin,“Essence of Mitochondria,” Nature, Vol. 426, 13 November 2003, p. 127.

[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]
spudgun

Stoke-on-trent, UK

#524 Aug 8, 2013
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
The answers to your questions can be found here:
The answers are not found on batshit crazy fundie websites. The evidence for evolution is presented in a readable manner in a number of books including "The Greatest Show on Earth" by Richard Dawkins (my favourite) and "Why Evolution is True" by Jerry Coyne (also very good).

Since: Aug 12

Location hidden

#525 Aug 8, 2013
My daughter showed me her Farmville on Facebook.
She had 2 cows, 2 sheep, 2 chickens, 2 ducks, 2 goats and 2 rabbits.
I told her, "This is like a story from the Bible."
She asked why.
"Well," I said, "it's a load of old crap that's followed by sad weirdos who want to believe in a made up fantasy land because they can't face living in the real world."
She wouldn't show me her Café
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
The answers to your questions can be found here:
http://www.trueorigin.org/whales.asp
http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...

“Right click Left click Yay!”

Since: Dec 10

Nehwon

#526 Aug 9, 2013
Pahu wrote:
Fossil Gaps 9
At the most fundamental level, a big gap exists between forms of life whose cells have nuclei (eukaryotes, such as plants, animals, and fungi) and those that don’t (prokaryotes such as bacteria and blue-green algae)(b).
b.“The prokaryotes came first; eukaryotes (all plants, animals, fungi and protists) evolved from them, and to this day biologists hotly debate how this transition took place, with about 20 different theories on the go....[What was thought to be an intermediate between prokaryotes and eukaryotes] is no longer tenable.” Katrin Henze and William Martin,“Essence of Mitochondria,” Nature, Vol. 426, 13 November 2003, p. 127.
[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]
Okay, Walt.

Your marketing sucks as bad as your science. People in this thread won't buy your book.

We may check out the donated book to highlight and add notes like "WTF?", "LOL!", and "Bearing False Witness for Jesus does break a Commandment."

Since: Dec 08

Tarpon Springs, FL

#527 Aug 14, 2013
Fossil Gaps 10

Fossil links are also missing between large groupings of plants (c), between single-celled forms of life and invertebrates (animals without backbones), among insects (d), between invertebrates and vertebrates (animals with backbones)(e), between fish and amphibians (f), between amphibians and reptiles (g), between reptiles and mammals (h), between reptiles and birds (i), between primates and other mammals (j), and between apes and other primates (k).

c. If evolution happened, nonvascular plants should have preceded vascular plants. However, fossils of nonvascular plants are not found in strata evolutionists believe were deposited before the earliest vascular plants appeared.

“The bryophytes [nonvascular plants] are presumed to have evolved before the appearance and stabilization of vascular tissue—that is, before the appearance of these tracheophytes [vascular plants]—although there is no early bryophyte [nonvascular plant] fossil record.” Lynn Margulis and Karlene V. Schwartz, p. 250.

“The actual steps that led to the origin of seeds and fruits are not known...” Ibid.

[From "In the Beginning" by Walt Brown]

Since: Dec 08

Tarpon Springs, FL

#528 Aug 14, 2013
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
How do you explain whales with pelvic bones like land mammals, and other vestigial organs. If a designer was involved he must have put evidence in his creation to mimic evolution :D alternatively no designer was involved.
Some people ask: Do whales have vestigial legs? Doesn't that prove they once walked on land? No. Whales never had legs. The structures that were once claimed to be vestigial legs, are now known to actually be necessary for reproduction. They anchor these muscles. This structure is only found in the male, and anchor the muscles attached to the penis.

http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...
Thinking

UK

#529 Aug 14, 2013
These religitards have to pull their content all the time.

I remember an answers in genesis page that said the Moon couldn't be older than a few thousands years otherwise the Lunar Lander would've sunk under miles of dust.

Hilarious. But the bastards pulled it.
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
The answers are not found on batshit crazy fundie websites. The evidence for evolution is presented in a readable manner in a number of books including "The Greatest Show on Earth" by Richard Dawkins (my favourite) and "Why Evolution is True" by Jerry Coyne (also very good).

“Right click Left click Yay!”

Since: Dec 10

Nehwon

#530 Aug 15, 2013
Pahu wrote:
<quoted text>
Some people ask: Do whales have vestigial legs? Doesn't that prove they once walked on land? No. Whales never had legs. The structures that were once claimed to be vestigial legs, are now known to actually be necessary for reproduction. They anchor these muscles. This structure is only found in the male, and anchor the muscles attached to the penis.
http://www.angelfire.com/mi/dinosaurs/vestigi...
Wow! A link to angelfire! I didn't think that even existed anymore.

Out of curiosity, I clicked on it and it's pretty much what I expected.

A format that was awesome in the 1990's when it was cutting edge. Now it looks like what a toddler could do.

Like your website link, your ideas on God are outdated.

Unless, you think the Bible is the end all, be all of human knowledge.

Or you think Walt Brown's childish attempts with reconciling the Bible with today's technology counts for something.

Tell me when this thread is updated:

Subscribe Now Add to my Tracker

Add your comments below

Characters left: 4000

Please note by submitting this form you acknowledge that you have read the Terms of Service and the comment you are posting is in compliance with such terms. Be polite. Inappropriate posts may be removed by the moderator. Send us your feedback.

Atheism Discussions

Title Updated Last By Comments
Atheism requires as much faith as religion? (Jul '09) 5 min Eagle 12 230,166
Atheism to Defeat Religion by 2038 (Apr '12) 2 hr I can read 23,006
Evidence for God! 3 hr Uncle Sam 3
Does Being 'Spiritual But Not Religious' Really... 7 hr Thinking 8
Atheist because of art class 11 hr AtheistBodybuilde... 1
Islam for peace, or violence? 15 hr Thinking 54
Adam Atheoi - the god of 'humanity' 15 hr Thinking 92
Our world came from nothing? 22 hr Thinking 1,061

Atheism People Search

Addresses and phone numbers for FREE