Are There Atheists in Foxholes?

Are There Atheists in Foxholes?

Posted in the Atheism Forum

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Mr Smartypants

Minneapolis, MN

#1 Dec 12, 2011
I've only had a couple of close calls with death over the years, but during those events, I was too busy saving my butt to think about theology. I can think of several reasons to doubt this bit of conventional wisdom which has been attributed to journalist Ernie Pyle.

1. If people become True Believers when they're in combat, what about the soldiers fighting for the Soviet Union or the Peoples' Republic of China?

2. What good is belief in a god if he still lets troops get injured or killed in combat?

3. What sort of a sick, twisted god needs to terrorize soldiers to promote himself?

4. Since war is basically institutionalized murder, doesn't that mean that all combat murders, even those done by communist troops, are ultimately the product of theists?

I can't find a linkable picture, but there's a monument out there specifically dedicated to atheists in combat. If somebody could provide a link, I'd appreciate that...
Mr Smartypants

Minneapolis, MN

#2 Dec 12, 2011
And, because I like to type, here's an imaginary dialogue about my contention that war is just institutionalized murder.

Me: Isn't war just killing people in the name of some government? Doesn't that go against the commandment 'Thou shalt not kill'?

Anti: No, because war is legitimate murder for such-and-such a reason, St. Augustine's Five Criteria for a Just War, blah, blah, blah, etc.

Me: So, if I hate my next-door neighbor, all I have to do is declare war on him before shooting him, and that makes everything all right?

Anti: No, because you wouldn't be a legitimate power, Divine Right of Kings, blah, blah, blah.

Me: From what I know of history, if I proclaimed myself the King of Smartypantsland, I'd have as much legitimacy as most of the governments out there.

Anti: No, because the only legitimate governments are the ones who support MY particular flavor of Christianity (Hinduism, Islam, etc.)

Me: So, basically murder isn't really murder if it's done in the name of your religion, right?

Anti: Ugggh! You made me think! I shall burn you at the stake, heretic! And burning heretics isn't really murder according to my religion, so that's OK, blah, blah, blah, ad infinitum.

“Legen...wait for it...DARY!”

Since: Dec 11

New York City

#3 Dec 13, 2011
So everyone who's ever brutally killed another human being in war was a theist? Alright. I'm good with that.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#4 Dec 13, 2011
Mr Smartypants wrote:
And, because I like to type, here's an imaginary dialogue about my contention that war is just institutionalized murder.
An interesting fact about afghanistan is out of a population of 28M, 15M are children.

So "we" are actually fighting a war against largely children.

Which before ppl protest I bet a lot of the Taliban we are fighting / killing are under 18. And none of the deaths of them are counted, only our war dead.

The reality of what we are doing out there we are unable to stomach, that is why the media doesnt report it. Or only reports one side.
Christopher Hitchens

Roslyn, NY

#5 Dec 13, 2011
Believers in atheism pin their faith on unscientific theories of how all things began. They generally worship their false science. A lot seem to also worship themselves considering themselves as God's. In actual fact though if you are not worshiping the one true God, then you are giving your allegiance to Satan. They also believe in evolution which is nothing more than an unproven , unprovable theory. You really have to envy there faith though, for it takes much more faith to believe in the evolutionary lie than it does to believe in God and His Creation.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#6 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
Believers in atheism pin their faith on unscientific theories of how all things began.
What a load of bull. You are clearly brainwashed and delusional.
Christopher Hitchens

Roslyn, NY

#7 Dec 13, 2011
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
What a load of bull. You are clearly brainwashed and delusional.
And you are clearly blinded.

Get saved

http://www.wayoflife.org/

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#8 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
<quoted text>And you are clearly blinded.Get saved
LOL. I AM saved. Saved from religious bull crap. I have been there and know all to well the pagan/satanic cult of christinsanity. What a load of lies. No thank you.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#9 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
<quoted text>
And I clicked on the link. Fundie baptist. What a suprise. You fundies are completely NUTS cause you take the buybull far too literally IMO.
Mr Smartypants

United States

#10 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
Believers in atheism pin their faith on unscientific theories of how all things began. They generally worship their false science. A lot seem to also worship themselves considering themselves as God's. In actual fact though if you are not worshiping the one true God, then you are giving your allegiance to Satan. They also believe in evolution which is nothing more than an unproven , unprovable theory. You really have to envy there faith though, for it takes much more faith to believe in the evolutionary lie than it does to believe in God and His Creation.
This is an exact copy of a post he did to another Topix forum. This intellectually-dishonest creep is just spamming, and besides, I and several others made mincemeat of this stupid post on the other forum.
Mr Smartypants

United States

#11 Dec 13, 2011
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
And I clicked on the link. Fundie baptist. What a suprise. You fundies are completely NUTS cause you take the buybull far too literally IMO.
What's funny is they assume that atheists are going to hear their trite message, knock themselves in the head, and say to themselves, "Gee, I never really thought that this Jesus character could save my soul!"

Actually, by the time an American atheist turns 18, they've probably heard that stupid come-to-Jesus message about seventy billion times already. And yet simpletons like this Hitchens wannabe think that if they just push their brainless message for the seventy-billion-and-first time, it's somehow going to work.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#12 Dec 13, 2011
Mr Smartypants wrote:
<quoted text>Actually, by the time an American atheist turns 18, they've probably heard that stupid come-to-Jesus message about seventy billion times already.
Agreed. These theists fail to understand that the come-to-jesus message is just one flavour of the god programme. there are thousands of sects of xianity, and lots of other religions. Mr Chang and Mr Mohammed will not be subject to the xian message cause of where they live. The theist message is only valid in their own bubble of delusion.
Mr Smartypants

United States

#13 Dec 13, 2011
spudgun wrote:
<quoted text>
Agreed. These theists fail to understand that the come-to-jesus message is just one flavour of the god programme. there are thousands of sects of xianity, and lots of other religions. Mr Chang and Mr Mohammed will not be subject to the xian message cause of where they live. The theist message is only valid in their own bubble of delusion.
What they don't understand is that the more in-your-face they get, the more they drive people AWAY from religion. They think that building a tacky 900-foot Jesus will make atheists suddenly 'git religion' but they really only succeed in driving people away. And the old 'Turn or Burn' argument (actually it's more of a threat than an argument) is probably one of the best recruitment tools the non-believers have...

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#14 Dec 13, 2011
Mr Smartypants wrote:
<quoted text>And the old 'Turn or Burn' argument (actually it's more of a threat than an argument) is probably one of the best recruitment tools the non-believers have...
I think turn or burn is on the wane. The fires of hell are diminishing in more enlightened times. Its only the wackjob fundies that seem to revel in hellfire preaching these days.
Christopher Hitchens

Roslyn, NY

#15 Dec 13, 2011
The statement, "There are no atheists in foxholes," is used to claim that in times of extreme stress or fear, such as when participating in warfare, even committed atheists will reach out to a higher power. Even atheists will realize GOD IS REAL.

ROMANS 14:11
For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.

Since: Jun 10

Location hidden

#16 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
Why does god need us to grovel before him? Does he have an ego problem or something? What benefit is their to him her

“Cave ab homine unius libri”

Since: Feb 07

Cape Town

#17 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
The statement, "There are no atheists in foxholes," is used to claim that in times of extreme stress or fear, such as when participating in warfare, even committed atheists will reach out to a higher power. Even atheists will realize GOD IS REAL.
ROMANS 14:11
For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
I have faith in the Dragon Reborn, because as it has been written....

"Yet one shall be born to face the Shadow,
born once more as he was born before,
and shall be born again, time without end.
The Dragon shall be Reborn,
and there will be wailing and gnashing of teeth at his rebirth.
In sackcloth and ashes shall he clothe the people,
and he shall break the world again by his coming,
tearing apart all ties that bind.
Like the unfettered dawn shall he blind us, and burn us,
yet shall the Dragon Reborn confront the Shadow at the Last Battle,
and his blood shall give us the Light.
Let tears flow, O ye people of the world.
Weep for your salvation."

“Legen...wait for it...DARY!”

Since: Dec 11

New York City

#18 Dec 13, 2011
There is in fact an organization CALLED 'Atheists in foxholes' because they got sick and tired of that claim.

http://www.militaryatheists.org/expaif.h …

“Legen...wait for it...DARY!”

Since: Dec 11

New York City

#19 Dec 13, 2011
Maybe this link will work better-

http://militaryatheists.org/
Mr Smartypants

United States

#20 Dec 13, 2011
Christopher Hitchens wrote:
The statement, "There are no atheists in foxholes," is used to claim that in times of extreme stress or fear, such as when participating in warfare, even committed atheists will reach out to a higher power. Even atheists will realize GOD IS REAL.
ROMANS 14:11
For it is written, As I live, saith the Lord, every knee shall bow to me, and every tongue shall confess to God.
So, are you implying that all the Soviets and Chinese Communists who fought in war returned home True Believers? That's pretty silly. Besides, what sort of cosmic monster uses fear to promote faith in him? Did you bother to read my first post, or are you just another thick-headed fundie?

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