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#103
May 8, 2013
 

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Reason Personified wrote:
<quoted text>It was the man who first imagined the god he would use as a tool. Other men have followed suit creating and recreating the myth-god tools by which they held onto both power and riches.
Haven't you read the buybull? There is one incredibly telling scripture in Genesis. Man was created for one sole purpose, and that was to till the earth. The only summation possible is that some fat lazy guy needed others to get out in the fields, while he lay about sucking down the groceries.
And so a god was born, from the mind of man.
The point is, indoctrination is not required.
It does not really matter where you stand on the issue, indoctrination is not required.
Athiesm is not the default position, as evidenced by the multitudes who all came up with their own religion, separate from most of the others.
If you want to say at birth.......may be t4rue, maybe not, doesn't matter.
By the time a human comes to the age of reason, interaction with others results in religion, een if none existed before.

"a god was born from the mind of man'- is not indoctrination.
Atheism is not the default position of the human mind.

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#104
May 8, 2013
 

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Bob of Quantum-Faith wrote:
<quoted text>
A lazy man who was incapable of hunting for food, and thus proving himself useful.
This very-very lazy fool was also a pretty slick talker, and was able to fabricate wild and crazy stories.
The combination proved useful for this lazy azz-- he would listen to the noises in the night, and then invented stories to "explain" these noises.
Sadly, gullible fools believed this lazy azz....
... and?
Within a generation? The mental disease of religion had taken hold...
As I replied to another, all this does is argue that atheism is not the default position, religion is.
It has been stated that atheism is default, religion requires indoctrination.
This is not true.
Religion sprouts up on it's own, that is to say, without indoctrination. In a society of no-god, god will emerge, no indoctrination required.
Religion is default, not atheism.
You want to argue the relative merits of atheism compared to religion, would be a different thread.
Red herrings not replied to by this poster.

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#105
May 8, 2013
 

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Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
You are an idiot.
An "atheist" believes there are no gods.
It's not just a disagreement with one conception of god.
Atheism: a + theos, denying god" (Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology).
"Atheism, from the Greek a-theos ("no-god"), is the philosophical position that God doesn't exist. It is distinguished from agnosticism, the argument that it is impossible to know whether God exists or not" (Academic American Encyclopedia).
"Atheism, system of thought developed around the denial of God's existence. Atheism, so defined, first appeared during the Enlightenment, the age of reason" (Random House Encyclopedia).
"Atheism (from the Greek a-, not, and theos, god) is the view that there are no gods. A widely used sense denotes merely not believing in God and is consistent with agnosticism. A stricter sense denotes a belief that there is no God, the use has become the standard one" (Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy).
"Atheism is the doctrine that there is no God. Some atheists support this claim by arguments, but these arguments are usually directed against the Christian concept of God, and are largely irrelevant to other possible gods" (Oxford Companion to Philosophy).
"Atheism is disbelief in God" (Introduction to Philosophy, Perry and Bratman, Oxford University Press).
"Atheism from the Greek a (not) plus theos (god). The doctrine of disbelief in a supreme being" (Dictionary of Philosophy and Religion, William Reese, HumanitiesPress).
"Atheism (Greek, a-[private prefix]+ theos, god) is the view that there is no divine being, no God" (Dictionary of Philosophy, Thomas Mautner, Editor).
"Atheism is the belief that God doesn't exist" (The World Book Encyclopedia).
"Atheism, Greek atheos-Disbelief in, or denial of, the existence of God" (Oxford English Dictionary)
"Atheism, the critique and denial of metaphysical beliefs in God or spiritual beings. Atheism is to be distinguished from agnosticism, which leaves open whether there is a god or not, professing to find the question unanswerable, for the atheist, the non-existence of god is a certainty" (The New Encyclopedia Britannia).
"According to the most usual definition, an atheist is a person who maintains that there is no godů(rejects eccentric definitions of the word)" (The Encyclopedia of Philosophy).
"Atheism is the doctrine that God does not exist, that belief in the existence of God is a false belief. The word God here refers to a divine being regarded as the independent creator of the world, a being superlatively powerful, wise and good" (Encyclopedia of Religion).
"Atheism (Greek and Roman): Atheism is a dogmatic creed, consisting in the denial of every kind of supernatural power"(Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics-Vol II).
"Atheism denies the existence of deity" (Funk and Wagnall's New Encyclopedia-Vol I).
I was explaining Einstein's comment and viewpoint, not yours.

If a man worships the Devil, is he a Theist?
Is the Devil a Theist?
Some say 'Of course.", some say "Of course not."
I let that for others to decide.

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#106
May 8, 2013
 

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Reason Personified wrote:
<quoted text>You know that is bull shit. The letter "a" preceding the word theist makes the word mean "not a theist". It has nothing to do with beleif, it is the default. Every human is atheist, until and unless they become indoctrinated.
Even your definition only says "no gods", it does not say "no beliefs". And until there is indoctrination, the only person with a god is the one who created it
Wrong, ReasonPetrified.

"a" + the greek "theos" means "no god".

"Atheism" is the belief or viewpoint that no god exists.

That is NOT neutral, and NOT a default.

Having "no belief" on the subject would be agnosticism, verificationism, or incapacity.

Words mean things.

If your view doesn't fit the term "atheist", adopt a different one.

If you adopt the term "atheism", you are saying you believe there is no god.

Obviously, that is exactly what you believe, but you are simply lying about it.
Libertarian

London, UK

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#107
May 8, 2013
 

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Get it right. Atheism is not the belief that your god doesn't exist. It is the lack of belief in a god.

A christian is an atheist regarding all the other religions.

A dog has not been taught this made up rubbish so I doubt he would believe in one of the human based gods.

He may have his own little doggy god.

Those who believe in these made up things are the ones accepting the crap AND being grateful for it from their god.

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#108
May 8, 2013
 

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Reason Personified wrote:
<quoted text>Whether one is ignorant of others imaginings or not, it is still very possible for that one to be an atheist. "Not a theist", do you know what the meaning of that phrase is? That would be an "atheist".
Are your dog or newborn to toddler age children theist? The correct answer is neither is. For either to become a theist, that one would need be indoctrinated. Until then both are atheist. Atheist = not theist.
If you disagree with this definition, maybe you should try to disprove the significance of the letter "a" in the word atheist.
"Atheist DOES NOT MEAN "not a theist".

Check the etymology of the word, you blathering moron.

Hope you know what "blathering moron" means. Or do I have to explain that to you?
----------

"Atheism: a + theos, denying god" (Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology).

"Atheism, from the Greek a-theos ("no-god"), is the philosophical position that God doesn't exist. It is distinguished from agnosticism, the argument that it is impossible to know whether God exists or not" (Academic American Encyclopedia).

"Atheism, system of thought developed around the denial of God's existence. Atheism, so defined, first appeared during the Enlightenment, the age of reason" (Random House Encyclopedia).

"Atheism (from the Greek a-, not, and theos, god) is the view that there are no gods. A widely used sense denotes merely not believing in God and is consistent with agnosticism. A stricter sense denotes a belief that there is no God, the use has become the standard one" (Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy).

"Atheism is the doctrine that there is no God. Some atheists support this claim by arguments, but these arguments are usually directed against the Christian concept of God, and are largely irrelevant to other possible gods" (Oxford Companion to Philosophy).

"Atheism is disbelief in God" (Introduction to Philosophy, Perry and Bratman, Oxford University Press).

"Atheism from the Greek a (not) plus theos (god). The doctrine of disbelief in a supreme being" (Dictionary of Philosophy and Religion, William Reese, HumanitiesPress).

"Atheism (Greek, a-[private prefix]+ theos, god) is the view that there is no divine being, no God" (Dictionary of Philosophy, Thomas Mautner, Editor).

"Atheism is the belief that God doesn't exist" (The World Book Encyclopedia).

"Atheism, Greek atheos-Disbelief in, or denial of, the existence of God" (Oxford English Dictionary)

"Atheism, the critique and denial of metaphysical beliefs in God or spiritual beings. Atheism is to be distinguished from agnosticism, which leaves open whether there is a god or not, professing to find the question unanswerable, for the atheist, the non-existence of god is a certainty" (The New Encyclopedia Britannia).

"According to the most usual definition, an atheist is a person who maintains that there is no godů(rejects eccentric definitions of the word)" (The Encyclopedia of Philosophy).

"Atheism is the doctrine that God does not exist, that belief in the existence of God is a false belief. The word God here refers to a divine being regarded as the independent creator of the world, a being superlatively powerful, wise and good" (Encyclopedia of Religion).

"Atheism (Greek and Roman): Atheism is a dogmatic creed, consisting in the denial of every kind of supernatural power"(Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics-Vol II).

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#109
May 8, 2013
 

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EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>

It was one thing to believe in gods and fairies when people thought the Earth was flat. They're in the 21st century.
Religion = superstition
Religion is not equivalent to belief in a god, you idiot.

Someone with your shortcomings of comprehension should never converse in a public forum.

You just end up looking stupid - like right now.

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#110
May 8, 2013
 

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Libertarian wrote:
Get it right. Atheism is not the belief that your god doesn't exist. It is the lack of belief in a god.
A christian is an atheist regarding all the other religions.

It is impossible to be "an atheist regarding all other religions".

"Atheism" and "theism" do not involve any religion.

You can't be an atheist regarding any religion.

"Atheism" refers to "gods" or "deities".

You have not the slightest clue of what you are talking about.

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#111
May 8, 2013
 

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BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>I was explaining Einstein's comment and viewpoint, not yours.
If a man worships the Devil, is he a Theist?
Is the Devil a Theist?
Some say 'Of course.", some say "Of course not."
I let that for others to decide.
That's a stupid question.

If one views the devil as a deity, he is a theist.

If one does not believe a devil exists, he could be a theist or an atheist.

Your question is off-point and irrelevant.

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#113
May 8, 2013
 

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Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
That's a stupid question.
If one views the devil as a deity, he is a theist.
If one does not believe a devil exists, he could be a theist or an atheist.
Your question is off-point and irrelevant.
What is the Devil himself?
Theist, Atheist, or god?
It it is off point, just wondering what you thought.

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#114
May 8, 2013
 

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Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
"Atheist DOES NOT MEAN "not a theist".
Check the etymology of the word, you blathering moron.
Hope you know what "blathering moron" means. Or do I have to explain that to you?
----------
"Atheism: a + theos, denying god" (Oxford Dictionary of English Etymology).
"Atheism, from the Greek a-theos ("no-god"), is the philosophical position that God doesn't exist. It is distinguished from agnosticism, the argument that it is impossible to know whether God exists or not" (Academic American Encyclopedia).
"Atheism, system of thought developed around the denial of God's existence. Atheism, so defined, first appeared during the Enlightenment, the age of reason" (Random House Encyclopedia).
"Atheism (from the Greek a-, not, and theos, god) is the view that there are no gods. A widely used sense denotes merely not believing in God and is consistent with agnosticism. A stricter sense denotes a belief that there is no God, the use has become the standard one" (Cambridge Dictionary of Philosophy).
"Atheism is the doctrine that there is no God. Some atheists support this claim by arguments, but these arguments are usually directed against the Christian concept of God, and are largely irrelevant to other possible gods" (Oxford Companion to Philosophy).
"Atheism is disbelief in God" (Introduction to Philosophy, Perry and Bratman, Oxford University Press).
"Atheism from the Greek a (not) plus theos (god). The doctrine of disbelief in a supreme being" (Dictionary of Philosophy and Religion, William Reese, HumanitiesPress).
"Atheism (Greek, a-[private prefix]+ theos, god) is the view that there is no divine being, no God" (Dictionary of Philosophy, Thomas Mautner, Editor).
"Atheism is the belief that God doesn't exist" (The World Book Encyclopedia).
"Atheism, Greek atheos-Disbelief in, or denial of, the existence of God" (Oxford English Dictionary)
"Atheism, the critique and denial of metaphysical beliefs in God or spiritual beings. Atheism is to be distinguished from agnosticism, which leaves open whether there is a god or not, professing to find the question unanswerable, for the atheist, the non-existence of god is a certainty" (The New Encyclopedia Britannia).
"According to the most usual definition, an atheist is a person who maintains that there is no godů(rejects eccentric definitions of the word)" (The Encyclopedia of Philosophy).
"Atheism is the doctrine that God does not exist, that belief in the existence of God is a false belief. The word God here refers to a divine being regarded as the independent creator of the world, a being superlatively powerful, wise and good" (Encyclopedia of Religion).
"Atheism (Greek and Roman): Atheism is a dogmatic creed, consisting in the denial of every kind of supernatural power"(Encyclopedia of Religion and Ethics-Vol II).
Atheism is a lack of belief in god.

Even after being told by atheists, this creationist piece of sh*t insists on trying (and failing) to redefine it.

Buck Crick believes that jesus rode on the backs of dinosaurs and that fossils aren't "really there".

And Idiot Theist in every sense.

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#115
May 8, 2013
 

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BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>As I replied to another, all this does is argue that atheism is not the default position, religion is.
It has been stated that atheism is default, religion requires indoctrination.
This is not true.
Religion sprouts up on it's own, that is to say, without indoctrination. In a society of no-god, god will emerge, no indoctrination required.
Religion is default, not atheism.
You want to argue the relative merits of atheism compared to religion, would be a different thread.
Red herrings not replied to by this poster.
Wrong, the whole point is not what sprouts up, but what you are born with before the bullsh*t virus called religion has had time to infect.

There are many many cases of atheist tribes in existence with no gods,so you are chatting sh*t.

Religion appeals to stupidity and ignorance for which there is no shortage on this planet which is why there are so many.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

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#116
May 8, 2013
 
Buck Crick wrote:
<quoted text>
Religion is not equivalent to belief in a god, you idiot.
Someone with your shortcomings of comprehension should never converse in a public forum.
You just end up looking stupid - like right now.
You apparently have a need to assert that disbelief in gods and pixies is as reasonable as belief in them. I don't.

Try to concenrtate...
http://www.thefreedictionary.com/atheist
(Perhaps if you read more slowly?:-)

I notice that it's you that regularly inhabits the Atheism Forum. I'm a rare sight on the Religious one. This might suggest you're a closet atheist. You clearly have some kind of need to believe we're mistaken.

Since: Nov 08

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#117
May 8, 2013
 
-Skeptic- wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong, the whole point is not what sprouts up, but what you are born with before the bullsh*t virus called religion has had time to infect.
There are many many cases of atheist tribes in existence with no gods,so you are chatting sh*t.
Religion appeals to stupidity and ignorance for which there is no shortage on this planet which is why there are so many.
So what, 90%- 95% of all cultures are theists.

But that other 5%-10%, they are the default position?
The 'normal' society is no god, the exception is 'god'?
Bizarre.
Indoctrination is not required, and the vast majority of societies are theist.
That is what logic and reason says, as well as the evidence.
EdSed

Hamilton, UK

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#118
May 8, 2013
 
BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>So what, 90%- 95% of all cultures are theists.
But that other 5%-10%, they are the default position?
The 'normal' society is no god, the exception is 'god'?
Bizarre.
Indoctrination is not required, and the vast majority of societies are theist.
That is what logic and reason says, as well as the evidence.
Not at all. The UK seems typical in that most people don't take religion and belief in gods seriously at all. And religion is clearly retreating in the face of education and science. Most European populations aren't generally superstitious at all.

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#119
May 8, 2013
 
EdSed wrote:
<quoted text>Not at all. The UK seems typical in that most people don't take religion and belief in gods seriously at all. And religion is clearly retreating in the face of education and science. Most European populations aren't generally superstitious at all.
Nor do they consider themselves atheist, as I previously referenced ( http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T... )

So I suppose we will call them non-superstitions theists, as superstition is not a requirement for theists, according to rational people, but not fanatics.
EdSed

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#120
May 8, 2013
 
BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>Nor do they consider themselves atheist, as I previously referenced ( http://www.topix.com/forum/religion/atheism/T... )
So I suppose we will call them non-superstitions theists, as superstition is not a requirement for theists, according to rational people, but not fanatics.
I'm glad you are happy with the stats..
http://humanism.org.uk/2013/05/07/church-stat...

http://humanism.org.uk/campaigns/religion-and...

Don't trust the BHA?...
http://www.whychurch.org.uk/trends.php

I and others have referenced them before too.

(And there are still no gods or pixies :-)

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#121
May 8, 2013
 

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And dogs cannot be atheists, since in the conventional, historical, Einsteinium usage, it requires denial, although many Fanatical Atheists (Einstein's words which I will recognize) would say ignorance is sufficient, and denial would not be required.

We might well suppose that if such a Fanatic owned a dog, that person may well refer to his dog as an atheist, regardless of what 90%(or so) of the world believes.
Such usage could be proper in a friendly discussion, but certainly fallacious is any debate type conversation.

Special usage of words commonly accepted to mean one thing, and then changed to a meaning accepted by a small minority merely to 'win a point', is not kosher.
It is a fallacious argument.
That is what has been attempted here.

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#122
May 8, 2013
 

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BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>The point is, indoctrination is not required.
Bullshyt.

FULL-ON BULLSH&T.

Show me a person who was NEVER exposed to RELIGION or even the idea of religion?

And I WILL show you an atheist.

There is NEVER-EVER religion without some azzhole FIRST shoving some old mouldy book at people.

It is ALWAYS that way-- even the ONE OFF religions which start and end with a single azzhole?

The azzhole ALWAYS has some "magical book" or "magic seeds" or other garbage, that gullible and STUPID people (like you) swallow whole...

“Quantum Junctn: Use Both Lanes”

Since: Dec 06

Tulsa, Oklahoma USofA

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#123
May 8, 2013
 
BeHereNow wrote:
<quoted text>As I replied to another, all this does is argue that atheism is not the default position, religion is.
Bullsh7t. Show me a NEW BORN INFANT WHO IS PRAYING IN MAGICAL RELIGOUS LANGUAGE?

And I >>might<< believe your claim.

But you and I both KNOW that NEVER HAPPENS--EVER.

Babies are born atheists-- they have NO KNOWLEDGE OR FAITH OF RELIGION.

That makes atheism the default state: REMOVE RELIGION? You get atheism.

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