Roman Catholic church only true churc...

Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican

There are 685736 comments on the CBC News story from Jul 10, 2007, titled Roman Catholic church only true church, says Vatican. In it, CBC News reports that:

The VaticanA issued a document Tuesday restatingA its belief that the Roman Catholic Church is the only true church of Jesus Christ.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at CBC News.

Dust Storm

Minneapolis, MN

#407780 Dec 8, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Its fair to point out that all of Christianity had the same number of books since the Church compiled a bible. That is, until Luther removed some.
Did a rogue Priest have the authority to remove any books from the Bible and still claim he's a Christian? I don't think so.
Btw, these are wonderful scripture to read.
It is Clay, but to say that the NT books were never in question is a patent denial of the facts. Luther called James and epistle of straw. Revelation he railed against. He removed them. Furthermore anyone who knows anything about the early councils would know that virtually every book was argued. The criteria used in deciding which books were scripture and which were not is most important. We see that in play with those like Irenaeus whose argument was simple yet brilliant. Show us anyone who can be traced to those appointed by the Apostles who taught or believed as you.

The fact is many considered Clement,, Didache, Hermas and others as scripture. The councils narrowed the criteria of what would be included. It did not exclude them as something not worthy of being read. For intance Athanasius is thrown out by Protestant apoglogists, but he in fact considered the deuterocanons as scripture. It is important to distinguish what protestants refer to as Apocrypha and the Church does. Other arguments which prove empty are use of Josephus and Jerome using deceitful proof texts. The fact is Jerome did vigorously defend them.

Its hard to answer all of the many empty arguments in a little box especially with people who wont bother to read links while hurling multitudes of distortions. Some questions cannot be answered in a sentence or paragraph.

"Though an interesting attempt, the fact of the matter is that there was no notion of a closed canon of scripture at the time of Jesus. Not even among Jews was there complete agreement on the canon at this time, which is highlighted by the fact that the Sadducees only accepted the Torah (the Five Books of Moses), and in fact were in constant conflict with other Jewish sects such as the Pharisees over various issues due to this. As Mark Shea says: "This was precisely why the Sadducees argued with Jesus against the reality of the resurrection in Matthew 22:23-33: they couldn't see it in the five books of Moses and they did not regard the later books of Scripture which spoke of it explicitly (such as Isaiah and 2 Maccabees) to be inspired and canonical."[1] Thus, it can be safely said (as a side-note) that Jesus himself experienced problems communicating the truth to those who adhered to Sola Scriptura.
https://sites.google.com/site/apostolicapolog...

Since: Dec 12

New Port Richey, FL

#407781 Dec 8, 2012
A careful and objective study of Mt. 16:18-19 will immediately end the argument about whether or not Catholicism has any foundation in Christianity. Unfortunately the matter is most visible in the Greek text. Most Bible translators erroneously change the past participle to future tense in v.19 to accommodate modern syntax at the cost of critical theology.

But even if this proof of the great Catholic error were to be offered, I doubt anyone in the Babylonian-based organization would recognize that Mt. 7:21-23 is chiefly directed at them. The blasphemy of the Pope is just another sign of the end times in which we live. I too was a Catholic until becoming a Bible translator. I'm living proof that Catholicism is not hereditary. Selah.
LTM

Geraldton, Canada

#407782 Dec 8, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
who="LTM"
KM, do you believe this is really?? I am a sceptic.
The bible warns us of this sort of thing.
I also don't believe it is real because Jesus hair would have been short would it of not.
*********
Why would His hair have been short?
Yes, I believe it. He was larger than the congregation, and He was standing over a group who were praying for a blind woman...who was healed. I know the girl who did the video, and I know the preacher who preached.
The singers there were from our church college.
KayMarie
We talked about this before on here I believe, appearantly. from what I understand . the time, culture, and the area from which Jesus came from would mean His hair would have been short .
Paul’s point in 1 Corinthians 11:3-15. A man’s hair should look masculine.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#407783 Dec 8, 2012
Djard wrote:
A careful and objective study of Mt. 16:18-19 will immediately end the argument about whether or not Catholicism has any foundation in Christianity. Unfortunately the matter is most visible in the Greek text. Most Bible translators erroneously change the past participle to future tense in v.19 to accommodate modern syntax at the cost of critical theology.
But even if this proof of the great Catholic error were to be offered, I doubt anyone in the Babylonian-based organization would recognize that Mt. 7:21-23 is chiefly directed at them. The blasphemy of the Pope is just another sign of the end times in which we live. I too was a Catholic until becoming a Bible translator. I'm living proof that Catholicism is not hereditary. Selah.
~~~

You wrote...

But even if this proof of the great Catholic error were to be offered, I doubt anyone in the Babylonian-based organization would recognize that Mt. 7:21-23 is chiefly directed at them.

___

Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.

Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?

Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Clay

Saint Paul, MN

#407784 Dec 8, 2012
7th Day Catholics Rock wrote:
Question: "Should we give gifts at Christmas?"
Answer: Many people take the idea of gift giving at Christmas back to the scripture in Matthew 2:10-11 which talks about the Magi (wise men) giving gifts to Jesus at his home: "When they saw the star, they were overjoyed. On coming to the house, they saw the child with his mother Mary, and they bowed down and worshiped him. Then they opened their treasures and presented him with gifts of gold and of incense and of myrrh."
The Bible gives a wonderful story about the gift God gave us—Jesus Christ—and we can use it as an opportunity to present the gospel and to show love. Giving and receiving gifts can be part of fulfilling what Paul says about giving in 2 Corinthians 8:7-8, "But just as you excel in everything—in faith, in speech, in knowledge, in complete earnestness and in your love for us—see that you also excel in this grace of giving. I am not commanding you, but I want to test the sincerity of your love by comparing it with the earnestness of others." Paul was talking to the churches who were giving him gifts (financial) so that he could keep on in the ministry. We can apply this same lesson to our own lives by giving to others, not just at Christmas, but year round!
So, can gift giving become the focus of Christmas instead of thanking the Lord for the gift of His Son (John 3:16)? Absolutely! Does giving gifts have to take away from the true meaning of Christmas? No, it does not. If we focus on the wonderful gift of salvation the Lord has given us (Isaiah 9:6), giving to others is a natural expression of that gratitude. The key is our focus. Is your focus on the gift, or on the ultimate gift-giver, our gracious Heavenly Father? "Every good and perfect gift is from above, coming down from the Father of the heavenly lights..." (James 1:17).
QOTW
Oh yeah with the economy the way it is if anyone wants to send me a gift for Christmas or my Birthday of Gold or Silver contact me and we will set up UPS account or something and I will go pick it up they don't even have to deliver it ........lol
Actually 7th, the purpose of Christmas is to celebrate Mass and receive the Holy Eucharist.(Christ's Mass = Christmas)

The Eucharist is receiving a gift from Our Lord.
Its ironic that all these anti Catholics don't really celebrate Christmas because they don't recognize the Eucharist. I've heard them make fun of our Mass (calling it a 'Mess"). I've heard them mock the Eucharist too.
yet, they'll boast about being Christians this season and display 'Merry Christmas' in their windows....while never even participating in Christ's Mass.
Christmas is a Catholic Holiday period. Normally, I would welcome any non Catholic to join us in celebrating Our Lords birth with a Mass. But why should I? You all make a career out of spreading propaganda about us; you condemn us to hell for being Catholic.....well, then stop celebrating Christ's Mass and get your own holiday.:)
Dust Storm

Minneapolis, MN

#407785 Dec 8, 2012
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
KM, do you believe this is really?? I am a sceptic.
The bible warns us of this sort of thing.
I also don't believe it is real because Jesus hair would have been short would it of not.
First this does not mean that I believe the video, but because you say Jesus hair would have been short.

Just for the record what some of you Protestants may regard as short hair was not a military haircut as one would have today. It was quite normal for a man to have hair below the shoulder. Hair by women was worn extremely long going sometimes down to the floor. An analogy by Paul is only being applied to effiminate men who were mimicking the women. Sampson who had taken the Nazarene vow and a scissor never touched his hair would not qualify as effeminate. This is yet another example of personal interpreation applying modern understanding not the time it was written or to whom it was written in context. The lack of knowledge distorting the scripture.
LTM

Geraldton, Canada

#407786 Dec 8, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
who="LTM"
KM, do you believe this is really?? I am a sceptic.
The bible warns us of this sort of thing.
I also don't believe it is real because Jesus hair would have been short would it of not.
*********
Why would His hair have been short?
Yes, I believe it. He was larger than the congregation, and He was standing over a group who were praying for a blind woman...who was healed. I know the girl who did the video, and I know the preacher who preached.
The singers there were from our church college.
KayMarie
Matthew 24 also
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.

24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.

25 Behold, I have told you before.

26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.

27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
Clay

Saint Paul, MN

#407787 Dec 8, 2012
Djard wrote:
A careful and objective study of Mt. 16:18-19 will immediately end the argument about whether or not Catholicism has any foundation in Christianity. Unfortunately the matter is most visible in the Greek text. Most Bible translators erroneously change the past participle to future tense in v.19 to accommodate modern syntax at the cost of critical theology.
But even if this proof of the great Catholic error were to be offered, I doubt anyone in the Babylonian-based organization would recognize that Mt. 7:21-23 is chiefly directed at them. The blasphemy of the Pope is just another sign of the end times in which we live. I too was a Catholic until becoming a Bible translator. I'm living proof that Catholicism is not hereditary. Selah.
Ah yes.....another 'former' Catholic.

Get in line with the rest of them on here..

they know nothing about Catholicism - yet they were once Catholics.
Yikes
Clay

Saint Paul, MN

#407788 Dec 8, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
You wrote...
But even if this proof of the great Catholic error were to be offered, I doubt anyone in the Babylonian-based organization would recognize that Mt. 7:21-23 is chiefly directed at them.
___
Mat 7:21 Not every one that saith unto me, Lord, Lord, shall enter into the kingdom of heaven; but he that doeth the will of my Father which is in heaven.
Mat 7:22 Many will say to me in that day, Lord, Lord, have we not prophesied in thy name? and in thy name have cast out devils? and in thy name done many wonderful works?
Mat 7:23 And then will I profess unto them, I never knew you: depart from me, ye that work iniquity.
Since the Catholic teachings were first. These verses would have to be applied to you and the 41,000 that came later...much later.

Or do you believe Our Lord didn't really guide the early Church to truth? He let everyone run off with His wrong teachings!!

He waited a thousand yrs until a bible could be printed and handed out to families. THEN, he finally could steer people to truth!

Do you believe this Confrint?
Clay

Saint Paul, MN

#407789 Dec 8, 2012
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Matthew 24 also
23 Then if any man shall say unto you, Lo, here is Christ, or there; believe it not.
24 For there shall arise false Christs, and false prophets, and shall shew great signs and wonders; insomuch that, if it were possible, they shall deceive the very elect.
25 Behold, I have told you before.
26 Wherefore if they shall say unto you, Behold, he is in the desert; go not forth: behold, he is in the secret chambers; believe it not.
27 For as the lightning cometh out of the east, and shineth even unto the west; so shall also the coming of the Son of man be.
LTM, its oddly ironic everyone uses those verses against the Church. Don't you think?
We clearly have the same interpretations since the first century.
You guys do not.

I've asked this before: In your opinion, at what point did Christianity go AWOL?
And at what point did Christianity finally 'get it right'?

The Catholic Church can't trace themselves to any person other than Jesus Christ.
So if we're wrong, then which one of you 40,000 are right?
LTM

Geraldton, Canada

#407790 Dec 8, 2012
Dust Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
First this does not mean that I believe the video, but because you say Jesus hair would have been short.
Just for the record what some of you Protestants may regard as short hair was not a military haircut as one would have today. It was quite normal for a man to have hair below the shoulder. Hair by women was worn extremely long going sometimes down to the floor. An analogy by Paul is only being applied to effiminate men who were mimicking the women. Sampson who had taken the Nazarene vow and a scissor never touched his hair would not qualify as effeminate. This is yet another example of personal interpreation applying modern understanding not the time it was written or to whom it was written in context. The lack of knowledge distorting the scripture.
Well His hair might have been shoulder length, I don't think it was a brush cut D.S.
But 1 Cor 11:15 says!! a man should look like a man, and a woman a woman.
Jesus was a Jew, and he would have follow the Jewish laws, His culture and area would have played a big part in His hair length too.
Either way Jesus is Jesus and I love Him it doesn't matter His hair length does it.
4GVN

Saint Louis, MO

#407791 Dec 8, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
Its fair to point out that all of Christianity had the same number of books since the Church compiled a bible. That is, until Luther removed some.
Did a rogue Priest have the authority to remove any books from the Bible and still claim he's a Christian? I don't think so.
Btw, these are wonderful scripture to read.
It is fair to say that it took Martin Luther and his stand against their unbiblical teachings to get them to 'finally' canonizee the partial list of Apocryphal books. Why do you suppose they did not do so 1500 yrs. earlier? Hmmm. We all know, don't we Clay?
4GVN

Saint Louis, MO

#407792 Dec 8, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
who="preston "NOPE, BUT LIKE I SAID YOU REAP WHAT YOU SOW.
Ditto (ME, TOO)
KM
You knew that LTM was talking about me, just as I knew.
when you,Saphrira, put on the gloves against me, expect the same from me.
**********
LTM did not mention you...and I did not think of you while reading it. However, you and everyone else knows that you (and a lot more) needed that word.
I didn't put any gloves on preston...you were not provoked. YOU returned to your 'fraud' lie without any provocation from me...you were mad with LTM.
That is why I said you 'fell off of the wagon'.:)
The war goes on in your head.
KayMarie (Sapphira :)
Do you think there is really 'anything' going on in that head'? The man is a nut job! When will you people get it? Why would you KEEP posting to him and subjecting yourselves to his issues?
Dust Storm

Minneapolis, MN

#407793 Dec 8, 2012
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
Well His hair might have been shoulder length, I don't think it was a brush cut D.S.
But 1 Cor 11:15 says!! a man should look like a man, and a woman a woman.
Jesus was a Jew, and he would have follow the Jewish laws, His culture and area would have played a big part in His hair length too.
Either way Jesus is Jesus and I love Him it doesn't matter His hair length does it.
If you were capapable of being honest, which you are not then you would not be trying to avoid the truth in what I said. You are bringing up hair length as per your own perception as an argument then you say it doesn't matter, nor do you understand nor want to the message being conveyed. It is more important to try to save face in your pride. So be it. Want of truth or any understanding is not your forte, you have made that clear many times.
LTM

Geraldton, Canada

#407794 Dec 8, 2012
Clay wrote:
<quoted text>
LTM, its oddly ironic everyone uses those verses against the Church. Don't you think?
We clearly have the same interpretations since the first century.
You guys do not.
I've asked this before: In your opinion, at what point did Christianity go AWOL?
And at what point did Christianity finally 'get it right'?
The Catholic Church can't trace themselves to any person other than Jesus Christ.
So if we're wrong, then which one of you 40,000 are right?
Clay, I just posted Matthew 24 to KM. not to discredit the catholic church .
I don't believe to a relgious denomination because I don't beleive any of them have it absolutely right.
God alone has it right and everyone else a lair .
When they started removing prayer and the Bible from schools the Ten Commandments from government buildings, and we Christians didn't say a word, is when Christianity went AWOL Clay.

“" THE WORD WAS MADE FLESH!"”

Since: Jun 10

"ISA 53:1.--6 "MATT 10:27"

#407795 Dec 8, 2012
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
We talked about this before on here I believe, appearantly. from what I understand . the time, culture, and the area from which Jesus came from would mean His hair would have been short .
Paul’s point in 1 Corinthians 11:3-15. A man’s hair should look masculine.
~~~~

What the Apostle Paul wrote in 1Cor 11:13-16 was not under the Law.

He wrote..

1Co 11:13 Judge in yourselves: is it comely that a woman pray unto God uncovered?

1Co 11:14 Doth not even nature itself teach you, that, if a man have long hair, it is a shame unto him?

1Co 11:15 But if a woman have long hair, it is a glory to her: for her hair is given her for a covering.

but He also said....

1Co 11:16 But if any man seem to be contentious, we have no such custom, neither the churches of God.

QUESTION

WHY SHOULD JESUS HAVE SHORT HAIR?

Jesus lived and died under the Law...The Law was fulfilled at His death.

THE PRIEST UNDER THE lEVITICAL LAW WERE TOLD..

Eze 44:20 Neither shall they shave their heads, nor suffer their locks to grow long; they shall only poll their heads.

JUST HOW LONG ....IS LONG HAIR...and how short is considered short?

Can you define it with scripture?

To me it is a hair splitting argument...
Dust Storm

Minneapolis, MN

#407796 Dec 8, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>It is fair to say that it took Martin Luther and his stand against their unbiblical teachings to get them to 'finally' canonizee the partial list of Apocryphal books. Why do you suppose they did not do so 1500 yrs. earlier? Hmmm. We all know, don't we Clay?
ZZZZZ...No we don't.

This is pretty much the stock false attack on the Catholic Church's inclusion of the deuterocanonical books.

1. There's no such thing as a "Universal Council". The Council of Trent was an Ecumenical Council, but it wasn't the first Ecumenical Council to list the books of Sacred Scripture exactly as Trent does, including the deuterocanonical books. That includes the Council of Florence (Session 11, February 4, 1442) which took place over 100 years before Trent. You can read more about that, including the decree on my deuterocanon page.

2. Even if the Catholic Church hadn't included the books until Trent, that does not account for their inclusion in the Canon of Scripture adhered to by various Orthodox Churches that do not accept Trent (and most generally any council after 1054 AD).

3. There is NO COUNCIL that gives the Canon of Sacred Scripture as modern Jews or Protestants have it. None.

4. If the council of Trent added the deuterocanon, how did Martin Luther move them to an index called "Apocrypha" 20 years earlier?

5. If the Council of Trent added the books to the Bible, how did the Gutenberg Bible, the first Bible Published via Printing Press, printed 100 years before Trent, include the deutercanonical books?

6. If the Catholic Church added the deuterocanonical books to the Bible at Trent, how did the Latin Vulgate (from the 4th Century AD) include them? How did the Vetus Latina (even earlier Latin Bibles), the Major Codices, the Dead Sea Scrolls, etc include them?

The fact of the matter is, that while an old, and common heard argument, the notion that the Catholic Church added books to the Bible at the Council of Trent is quite simply false. Historical evidence is quite clearly to the contrary, and anyone inclined to look at old Bibles (either on line, or in museums) can verify it to be so. Again, my deuterocanon page, linked above, and also at the bottom of this document, goes into these issues in some depth not done here.

Given the facts, it's quite obvious that in the case of the alleged "Council of Jamnia", and in the case of protestantism, the attempts to remove the deuterocanonical books were based on hatred for the Church, and indeed an attempt for Jewish "authorities" to make pronouncements on books they knew Christians considered Sacred Scripture, and that contained prophecies predicting Christ and support for other Christian doctrine.
https://sites.google.com/site/apostolicapolog...
Clay

Melrose Park, IL

#407797 Dec 8, 2012
4GVN wrote:
<quoted text>It is fair to say that it took Martin Luther and his stand against their unbiblical teachings to get them to 'finally' canonizee the partial list of Apocryphal books. Why do you suppose they did not do so 1500 yrs. earlier? Hmmm. We all know, don't we Clay?
Hmmm, no we don't all know.

Its not good to be Biblically ignorant just so you think you're justified in teaching as you do.

Its clear you and the other products of Luther and Calvin changed Scripture meaning AND scripture itself by removing books from the Bible.
Its not too late to repent and come back. You, Confrint and others would have been better off never to venture into this arena. You could have read your bible, prayed and believed as you do without being held responsible.
But what do you do now? Its been proven too many times to count, that your theology is not what was taught. Therefore is not the will of Christ.
Many Evangelical Preachers were at this same crossroad and chose to cease preaching things they now knew to be un biblical. I know you're not a preacher, but you're still on here spreading your version of the faith.

“cdesign proponentsists”

Since: Jul 09

Pittsburgh, PA

#407798 Dec 8, 2012
confrinting with the word wrote:
<quoted text>
~~~
Christian is as Christian does...
WOW! All that just to avoid saying that you didn't do what you could to get the video out.

You story is a lie. Now, are you lying to bring people closer to god? Naw, few are stupid enough to believe your story.

Are you lying to show christians how stupid they sound when they lie for god? Naw, I don't think so.

Are you lying to get attention? Bingo! That gets my vote.
preston

Athens, OH

#407799 Dec 8, 2012
Dust Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
First this does not mean that I believe the video, but because you say Jesus hair would have been short.
Just for the record what some of you Protestants may regard as short hair was not a military haircut as one would have today. It was quite normal for a man to have hair below the shoulder. Hair by women was worn extremely long going sometimes down to the floor. An analogy by Paul is only being applied to effiminate men who were mimicking the women. Sampson who had taken the Nazarene vow and a scissor never touched his hair would not qualify as effeminate. This is yet another example of personal interpreation applying modern understanding not the time it was written or to whom it was written in context. The lack of knowledge distorting the scripture.
LTM wrote:
<quoted text>
KM, do you believe this is really?? I am a sceptic.
The bible warns us of this sort of thing.
I also don't believe it is real because Jesus hair would have been short would it of not.

be careful or she will have her buddy Orville,issue a fatwa against you.

she says that she has an anointing, but it doesnt show, she is as dumb as a dodo,

and it is her own Personal intrepretation, no other person agrees with her, well maybe marge might

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