Doctrines that creep in: Jehovah Witness and the date of the fall of Jerusalem

Jun 29, 2014 | Posted by: roboblogger | Full story: Examiner.com

I don't slam the door on Jehovah Witnesses when they visit. They have been taught some very wrong things and they use an untrustworthy translation of the Bible, but they are people whom God loves and for whom Christ died.

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UNchained

Loudon, TN

#1 Jun 30, 2014
That article TOTALLY DESTROYS & EXPOSES the Jehovah's Witnesses 607 B.C. and 1914 false doctrines.

The author uses astronomical charts which are precise and extremely accurate and which can be easily verified.
little lamb

Camperdown, Australia

#2 Jun 30, 2014
Jehovah God tells us " To test the spirits and see if they come from God."

But Jehovah says in Isaiah 55 [3]

" Incline your ear and come to me . Listen , and your soul will keep alive , and I will readily conclude with you people an indefinitely lasting covenant respecting the loving kindnesses of David that are faithful."

So we have always been told from the scripture , that its about loving Jehovah with our whole heart soul and mind...and not to be putting our trust in men..but to trust him

So men can point out the errors of men...but the goodness of God is what we should be looking for,

Hallelujah.
True Christian witness

Bartlesville, OK

#3 Jun 30, 2014
Anyone who believes the witnesses are programmed to learn, does not know how Jesus is leading his earthly subjects today, they can only speculate on what they think is true about Jehovah's witnesses.

The true followers of Jesus are thinking and reasoning people who can see the Bible truth, when they are being taught the Bible, that's different than believing what you think is true by what someone teaches you.

People must be educated and learn to become Jehovah's witnesses, no one can be a witness unless they are directed and led to the King Jesus and his visible earthly subjects by Jehovah God first. This one fact is being proved true today, as it was for the Jews who heard Jesus speak, before the end of this world gets here.

John 6:44

No matter how much you try to prove the witnesses are wrong, the truth is evident, Jesus is the head of the world wide congregation of his earthly subjects, Jehovah's witnesses. These faithful and obedient witnesses will preach and teach the Bible to the entire earth, but only the humble and meek sheep will obey and follow the true shepherd our reigning King
Jesus.
Psalms 37:11

Since: Jan 12

Location hidden

#4 Jun 30, 2014
UNchained wrote:
That article TOTALLY DESTROYS & EXPOSES the Jehovah's Witnesses 607 B.C. and 1914 false doctrines.
The author uses astronomical charts which are precise and extremely accurate and which can be easily verified.
Good article. It's very apparent to everyone except JWs that without the 607 year their eschatology falls apart. With so much vested in this year, you wont find JWs willing to reason on facts. They just repeat the same tired arguments which time and time again have been refuted.
UNchained

Loudon, TN

#5 Jun 30, 2014
Arkham Bravo wrote:
<quoted text>
Good article. It's very apparent to everyone except JWs that without the 607 year their eschatology falls apart. With so much vested in this year, you wont find JWs willing to reason on facts. They just repeat the same tired arguments which time and time again have been refuted.
Jehovah's Witnesses claim that they believe galaxies travel through space in an orderly way, and so do the individual stars and planets within these galaxies and also believe that the earth makes a trip around the sun, which is our nearest star, in exactly 365 days, 5 hours, 48 minutes and 45.51 seconds which proves the material universe is highly organized, the two Jehovah's Witnesses who have commented on this thread DENY REALITY.

The precise orbits of the planets can be accurately calculated millions of years in advance and their path thousands of years in the past.

Jehovah's Witnesses who are honestly seeking truth can verify for themselves that Jehovah's Witness doctrines regarding 607 B.C. and 1914 A.D. are wrong.

Jehovah's Witnesses who honestly seek God need to keep in mind that God is not limited to a group's theology, but rather those that seek Him shall find Him (Proverbs 8:17, Acts 17:27, Romans 10:13).
little lamb

Camperdown, Australia

#6 Jun 30, 2014
Some of the advantages that Jesus mediates with us in the new covenant arrangement

Is Jehovah says " he will be our God and we his people'

and that " he will write his Laws in our heart and in our minds."

So ones can go on all day about error of men,

But Jesus himself mediates something better...and to have Jehovah himself promise to be our God ..well wow!

" For if God is for us who can be against us?"

hallelujah,

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#7 Jun 30, 2014
Arkham Bravo wrote:
<quoted text>
Good article. It's very apparent to everyone except JWs that without the 607 year their eschatology falls apart. With so much vested in this year, you wont find JWs willing to reason on facts. They just repeat the same tired arguments which time and time again have been refuted.
.
. Question..when was a Calendar created.. one could put a number 1 on the year Christ was born.. but the projection backward.as to when things did or didn't happen would be an interesting endeavor.. As who was the keeper of the diary of when things took place?? A lot of by guess and by goshes I expect.. as the bible pretty much leaves out dates..
BUDGIE

UK

#8 Jun 30, 2014
little lamb wrote:
Some of the advantages that Jesus mediates with us in the new covenant arrangement
Is Jehovah says " he will be our God and we his people'
and that " he will write his Laws in our heart and in our minds."
So ones can go on all day about error of men,
But Jesus himself mediates something better...and to have Jehovah himself promise to be our God ..well wow!
" For if God is for us who can be against us?"
hallelujah,
That does not mean to say that we ignore the errors of men. On the contrary we are told ..

Don’t participate in the fruitless works of darkness, but instead, expose them.
Ephesians 5:6-11 ..

As christians we have a duty , not only to spread the gospel and the truth but also to warn others of the decietful lies the cults made by men sread to ensnare the unwary.
Andy

Pinellas Park, FL

#9 Jul 1, 2014
Maravilla, The ancients used the moon for their monthly calendar and they had 12 months in a year. They also did leap years, but it varied how they did leap year by civilization. So, as the article states, they tracked time by their king's regnal year and the month and the day. As an example, the Bile records,“And in the fifth month, on the seventh day of the month, which is the nineteenth year of king Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, came Nebuzaradan, captain of the guard, a servant of the king of Babylon, unto Jerusalem.” Just as in our day, they had legal documents that tracked purchases and they were dated.

The ancient Jews had a formal system by which they identified the first day of each month. So, there was no guessing involved when they wrote a date on a document.

As far as projecting backwards, it is not complicated at all as the article demonstrates with the Washington example. And since the Babylonians double date stamped many items with astronomical readings, it simplifies determining the year the document was written even more as the article demonstrates.
little angel

Greenville, GA

#10 Jul 1, 2014
little lamb wrote:
Some of the advantages that Jesus mediates with us in the new covenant arrangement
Is Jehovah says " he will be our God and we his people'
and that " he will write his Laws in our heart and in our minds."
So ones can go on all day about error of men,
But Jesus himself mediates something better...and to have Jehovah himself promise to be our God ..well wow!
" For if God is for us who can be against us?"
hallelujah,
How can God be for people who continually admit that the "Spirit-led" leaders, who determine the interpretations of the Bible, are in error, teach those errors as the only truth, punish anyone who disagrees with those errors, twist those errors when a large group of people shows a major flaw in the errors, and replace the errors with either the exact opposite belief or with a different interpretation which changes other interpretations related to the necessary change?

From the time of Deuteronomy we have been told that a false teacher/prophet is not to be feared, but is one who speaks words from his own imagination, not from the influence of the Spirit.

This shows that such people are clearly not Spirit-led. This definitely does describe JWs, as many of them have shown to us.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#12 Jul 1, 2014
Andy wrote:
Maravilla, The ancients used the moon for their monthly calendar and they had 12 months in a year. They also did leap years, but it varied how they did leap year by civilization. So, as the article states, they tracked time by their king's regnal year and the month and the day. As an example, the Bile records,“And in the fifth month, on the seventh day of the month, which is the nineteenth year of king Nebuchadnezzar king of Babylon, came Nebuzaradan, captain of the guard, a servant of the king of Babylon, unto Jerusalem.” Just as in our day, they had legal documents that tracked purchases and they were dated.
The ancient Jews had a formal system by which they identified the first day of each month. So, there was no guessing involved when they wrote a date on a document.
As far as projecting backwards, it is not complicated at all as the article demonstrates with the Washington example. And since the Babylonians double date stamped many items with astronomical readings, it simplifies determining the year the document was written even more as the article demonstrates.
.
. I found it interesting that some tracked time by the moon..and others by the sun.. And that for some a year was 10 months and for others it was 12.. Those that discounted the 61 days.. One wonders how far that would throw things off over time???
Andy

Pinellas Park, FL

#13 Jul 1, 2014
Maravilla wrote:
<quoted text>
.
. I found it interesting that some tracked time by the moon..and others by the sun.. And that for some a year was 10 months and for others it was 12.. Those that discounted the 61 days.. One wonders how far that would throw things off over time???
Ultimately, regardless of which system they used, they knew that their version of March had to be in the beginning of spring, and they would make adjustments to prevent "calendar drift" as it related to the seasons of the year, marked not just by the weather but by the night sky's constellations. We make adjustments today by adding 1 day every four years except century years not divisible by 400

The nations around which this article is based had precise ways of maintaining their calendars. The ancient Hebrews examined the stage of their barley crops. If it didn't appear they would ripen by the end of a certain month, they would add a "leap month." The Babylonians used a mathematical system to add days in order to ensure their calendar didn't drift. Even though there may be a question as to the precise Gregorian Calendar version of a Biblical date or the date recorded on an ancient document, it appears to me that for the purposes of the article on this thread, being off by as much as a month is moot. The point is that ancient documents have been discovered with data on them that verify what historians claim - namely the years of Nebuchadnezzar's reign and the fall of Jerusalem. As the article reveals, the known, fixed; planetary orbit of Saturn confirms mountains of historical evidence and disproves the 607 BC date.

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#14 Jul 1, 2014
Andy wrote:
<quoted text>
Ultimately, regardless of which system they used, they knew that their version of March had to be in the beginning of spring, and they would make adjustments to prevent "calendar drift" as it related to the seasons of the year, marked not just by the weather but by the night sky's constellations. We make adjustments today by adding 1 day every four years except century years not divisible by 400
The nations around which this article is based had precise ways of maintaining their calendars. The ancient Hebrews examined the stage of their barley crops. If it didn't appear they would ripen by the end of a certain month, they would add a "leap month." The Babylonians used a mathematical system to add days in order to ensure their calendar didn't drift. Even though there may be a question as to the precise Gregorian Calendar version of a Biblical date or the date recorded on an ancient document, it appears to me that for the purposes of the article on this thread, being off by as much as a month is moot. The point is that ancient documents have been discovered with data on them that verify what historians claim - namely the years of Nebuchadnezzar's reign and the fall of Jerusalem. As the article reveals, the known, fixed; planetary orbit of Saturn confirms mountains of historical evidence and disproves the 607 BC date.
.
. not having a personal visual on Jerusalem ... But I do suspect that the sky .. in a desert region..would be a whole lot easier to read then the mountainous region I live in with all the trees obstructing ones view.. More so back in the day before street lamps and such..
Andy

Pinellas Park, FL

#15 Jul 1, 2014
Maravilla wrote:
<quoted text>
.
. not having a personal visual on Jerusalem ... But I do suspect that the sky .. in a desert region..would be a whole lot easier to read then the mountainous region I live in with all the trees obstructing ones view.. More so back in the day before street lamps and such..
These are all interesting observations. I can't give you a definite answer, but in Jerusalem they had people that identified the moon's phases and then notified the High Priest. He would then officially declare a new month had begun for the whole country. If I had to guess, these sentinels had official observation posts from where they had a clear view of the sky

The ancients didn't have a lot to do at night (no TV, etc) so they spent a lot of time watching the day and night skies. Many of them were excellent mathematicians. Here's an interesting article about one guy in Egypt and his studies:
http://www.windows2universe.org/citizen_scien...

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#16 Jul 1, 2014
the accuracy is a bit iffy but close enough as not many ..regular people are going to challenge it.. There appears to be about 3 feet difference in the redition of a Stadia,and the Furlong .. hmm! and I expect that tends to fluctuate .. over the century's Interesting read..thank you..

Since: Jul 10

Location hidden

#17 Jul 1, 2014
I do recall reading that they did that ..so that the full moon was accurate in the observance of the Passover.. I wonder if these celebrations ..were specifically on dates. or if decisions were made to observe them on the date that the FULL moon would create a yearly commemoration.. jist thinking out load.
Andy

Pinellas Park, FL

#18 Jul 1, 2014
Maravilla wrote:
I do recall reading that they did that ..so that the full moon was accurate in the observance of the Passover.. I wonder if these celebrations ..were specifically on dates. or if decisions were made to observe them on the date that the FULL moon would create a yearly commemoration.. jist thinking out load.
Ever since the Exodus, Passover was and still is on the 15th day of the Jewish month of Nisan. The 15th day of Nisan will always fall on a full moon. This fact, though not mentioned by the author of the article about which this thread is written, is a tangent that could support his position about the constants of the universe, the accuracy of dating ancient events that are tied to astronomical sightings, and the error of the 607 BC date for the fall of Jerusalem.
little lamb

Camperdown, Australia

#19 Jul 1, 2014
little angel wrote:
<quoted text>
How can God be for people who continually admit that the "Spirit-led" leaders, who determine the interpretations of the Bible, are in error, teach those errors as the only truth, punish anyone who disagrees with those errors, twist those errors when a large group of people shows a major flaw in the errors, and replace the errors with either the exact opposite belief or with a different interpretation which changes other interpretations related to the necessary change?
From the time of Deuteronomy we have been told that a false teacher/prophet is not to be feared, but is one who speaks words from his own imagination, not from the influence of the Spirit.
This shows that such people are clearly not Spirit-led. This definitely does describe JWs, as many of them have shown to us.
Jehovah knows what he is doing ..

He is aware of everything

And Jesus is the model.

Now did Jesus reject his Father because of what the Jewish Leadership was doing ?

did Jesus keep his Father before his eyes in everything he did?

Look at Jesus !
little lamb

Camperdown, Australia

#20 Jul 1, 2014
Jesus is an amazing model

There he was praising God in song with his Apostles , the night of the passover.

There he is praying to his Father in agony , just before he was taken to be killed.

There he is preaching to people about the things of god to others , whilst in the midst of Jehovah Gods people.

amazing ...and he told his Apostles that he was in a covenant with his Father as well ...and that is where his relationship and confidence came from.. his Father , not in the approval or disapproval of the Leadership.

Isn't he a wonderful example how to keep loving and worshiping Jehovah through all circumstances ..and never denying his Father because of what men were doing to his Fathers name.

Hallelujah

“God Saves, Watchtower Lies”

Since: Nov 12

Location hidden

#21 Jul 1, 2014
There are only three kinds of people who support the 607bc nonsense:

(1) people who know it's a lie but are attempting to bolster the power structure of the watchtower and its clergymen

(2) people who are scared to admit that the 607bc doctrine is false because of what it means about their religion, so they prefer the lie over the truth

(3) people who are too lazy to do the research to find out the 607bc doctrine is a lie

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