Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#1 Nov 17, 2012
THE FORBIDDEN GOSPEL

Ladies and Gentlemen, listen to this conversation and tell me, at the end, if it makes any sense to you. It's about the forbidden Gospel.

One day, Jesus summoned his disciples, the Twelve, and asked them to sit down for he had a very impotant message to convey to them. Some thing new they needed to learn.

Colloquially, the conversation went thus:

Jesus: Beloved, the time has come to send you on a mission with the gospel about the Kingdom of God. I am giving you authority to expell evil spirits, and to cure sickness, and disease of every kind.(Mat. 10:1)

Thomas: Wow! That will be cool! We will actually be able to cure people of their diseases as well as to exorcize evil spirits? That will be the day!

Jesus: Don't be too excited Thomas, there is a catch to it. You cannot take this gospel to the Gentiles, and I forbid you even to enter a Samaritan town; to the Jews only, if you understand what I mean.(Mat. 10:5,6)

Thomas: I knew it! No wonder I was smelling the rat here somewhere. How can we do this among people who don't even believe in demons?

Jesus: I know it. That's why I am sending you out as sheep among wolves. Just be clever.(Mat. 10:16)

Peter: Master, there is something I do not understand here. What's the reason for the prohibition to take the gospel of the salvation to the Gentiles if we have all been assigned as light unto the Gentiles, according to
Isaiah 42:6?

Jesus: Peter, you are still too stuck to the old Law. That was in the old dispensation. With the change of the Priesthood, it has become necessary a change also of the Law.(Heb. 7:12)

Matthew: But Master, didn't you confirm the Law even down to the letter?(Mat. 5:17-19)

Jesus: Well, I'll send Saul, aka Paul, and he will explain how it all happened with my soon-to-come crucifixion.(Ephe. 2:15; Heb. 7:12)

Matthew: Whatever, but really, why forbid the Gentiles a share of your gospel? I still do not understand!

Jesus: Just let it be for now, Matthew. When the church of Paul is well established, hordes of evangelists will be sent by the Church to spread the gospel throughout the world.(This started in the 4th Century soon after Christianity was adopted as the official religion of the Roman Empire by Constantine in 310 ACE.)

The bottom line, ladies and gentlemen, is that the gospel of Jesus was, originally, forbidden to be taken to the Gentiles, and, unbelievably, by Jesus himself. Even Paul,albeit a self-proclaimed apostle to the Gentiles, never, actually, stood by his own claim. His whole life was to take the gospel to the Jews, as he would preach only in the synagogues of the Jews.

Believe it or not, were not for the Catholic Church, Christianity would still be no more than a simple hellenistic cult.

Now, if this does not make sense to you, let us talk about it.

Ben
Jehovah is God

Muskogee, OK

#2 Nov 18, 2012
You forgot one thing, Ben Masada, it is Almighty God Jehovah that is calling the moves, not you or your made up fables about Christianity.

Jesus Christ proved he was the promised Messiah to the Jews, and the apostles proved Jesus was the Messiah by the Scripture prophecies that Jesus fulfilled, and all the Jews were suppose to have known.

The few Jews who accepted Jesus as their Messiah would make up that rootstock needed for Jehovah God to build his new spiritual nation of Israel on, making a new covenant with a people for His name, to represent Him on this Earth, and Jesus being the mediator between them as high priest for the new spiritual Israel of God or true Christians.

Jehovah's witnesses today are numbered in that spiritual Israel making up the 12 tribes of Israel that will live in God's new world of righteousness.
For you know perfectly well the 12 tribes of
Revelation 7:5-8 are not the twelve tribes of Abraham.
QUITTNER

Toronto, Canada

#3 Nov 18, 2012
6:30 pm, Sunday, November 18, 2012:
RE: The Forbidden Gospel
..... Ben, I haven't seen any of your posts for a long time; were you sick?
..... All sorts of writings have been censored or even forbidden according to history - perhaps only for a short time. And everybody is free to invent a belief system with its supporting literature; the problem is to get enough support for such writings, and make them credible enough. Then some of these writings can perhaps entice very many people to pay a lot of money to clergy for centuries.
..... Many gospels exist, but only 4 of them are now officially recognized by the many variations of what is called "Christianity". Only one of these is valid, the one by Jesus, a Jew, who apparently was a member of the Essenes variation
of Judaism as described by Philo.
..... Compare also with the writings found more recently, and with the contents of copies of even older writings which they include.
..... As for Paul of Tarsus, I think of him as only a temporary Apostle, only while he represented the Jerusalem Church to non-Jews as the Jewish Christians' ambassador. As soon as he started out on his own, apparently guided by some visions, he no longer was an Apostle. He may have tried to invent a new UNIVERSAL (="catholic") religion similarly as there is now Esperanto, intended to be a universal language. Have you read "Paul and Hellenism" by Hyam Maccoby, and other books by him?
Jehovah is God

Muskogee, OK

#4 Nov 19, 2012
You two deserve each other, you both refuse to accept the truth as it is written in the Bible.

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#5 Nov 21, 2012
Jehovah is God wrote:
You forgot one thing, Ben Masada, it is Almighty God Jehovah that is calling the moves, not you or your made up fables about Christianity.
Jesus Christ proved he was the promised Messiah to the Jews, and the apostles proved Jesus was the Messiah by the Scripture prophecies that Jesus fulfilled, and all the Jews were suppose to have known.
The few Jews who accepted Jesus as their Messiah would make up that rootstock needed for Jehovah God to build his new spiritual nation of Israel on, making a new covenant with a people for His name, to represent Him on this Earth, and Jesus being the mediator between them as high priest for the new spiritual Israel of God or true Christians.
Jehovah's witnesses today are numbered in that spiritual Israel making up the 12 tribes of Israel that will live in God's new world of righteousness.
For you know perfectly well the 12 tribes of Revelation 7:5-8 are not the twelve tribes of Abraham.
----------

Everyone has the paranoia to claim to belong to this or that Tribe of Israel. We all know that this in mere verbal juggling that can never be proved. If you are sincere enough to be part of Israel, the instructions are in Isaiah 56:1-8. Just join God's Covenant with His People and you will have a name better than sons and daughters. To apply to the Pauline policy of Replacement Theology won't help.

Now, with regards to evidences that Jesus was the Messiah, I am all ears. Go right ahead and mention them to me. Just don't write a list of quotes. One at a time, as I have many other posts to reply. I promise to refute you with the proper quotations. Thanks.

Ben

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#7 Nov 21, 2012
QUITTNER wrote:
6:30 pm, Sunday, November 18, 2012:
RE: The Forbidden Gospel
..... Ben, I haven't seen any of your posts for a long time; were you sick?
..... All sorts of writings have been censored or even forbidden according to history - perhaps only for a short time. And everybody is free to invent a belief system with its supporting literature; the problem is to get enough support for such writings, and make them credible enough. Then some of these writings can perhaps entice very many people to pay a lot of money to clergy for centuries.
..... Many gospels exist, but only 4 of them are now officially recognized by the many variations of what is called "Christianity". Only one of these is valid, the one by Jesus, a Jew, who apparently was a member of the Essenes variation
of Judaism as described by Philo.
..... Compare also with the writings found more recently, and with the contents of copies of even older writings which they include.
..... As for Paul of Tarsus, I think of him as only a temporary Apostle, only while he represented the Jerusalem Church to non-Jews as the Jewish Christians' ambassador. As soon as he started out on his own, apparently guided by some visions, he no longer was an Apostle. He may have tried to invent a new UNIVERSAL (="catholic") religion similarly as there is now Esperanto, intended to be a universal language. Have you read "Paul and Hellenism" by Hyam Maccoby, and other books by him?
---------

No, I have not read "Paul and Hellenism." It must be of the kind I like to read. I'll try to google it.

Now, with regards to Paul as a temporary apostle, I don't know what you are talking about. What apostle was he, the 13th? To replace Judas, one of the 12, the apostles elected Matthias who was added to the eleven apostles.(Acts 1:26) No chance for Paul.

Now that Paul ever represented the Jerusalem branch of the Nazarenes - there was never a church in Jerusalem - there is nowhere in the NT to read as an evidence of the fact. He did try to join the Nazarenes in Jerusalem, but he was rejected based on his persecutions of the Jews in Damascus.{Acts 9:26)

Ben

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#8 Nov 21, 2012
Jehovah is God wrote:
You two deserve each other, you both refuse to accept the truth as it is written in the Bible.
-----

You don't know what the Truth is, my friend. Even in Jesus, you do not believe. He said that the Truth is the Word of Jehovah.(John 17:17) Then the Psalmist said that the Word of Jehovah was given to Israel only and to no other people on earth.(Psalm 147:19,20) It means, you don't have the Truth. According to this Psalm above, the Truth is with the Jewish People, whether you like it or not. To try to replace the real Jehovah's Witnesses with Christians is simply vandalism of Judaism by the Watchtower.

Ben

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#9 Nov 21, 2012
Ben_Masada wrote:
THE FORBIDDEN GOSPEL
Ladies and Gentlemen, listen to this conversation and tell me, at the end, if it makes any sense to you. It's about the forbidden Gospel.
One day, Jesus summoned his disciples, the Twelve, and asked them to sit down for he had a very impotant message to convey to them. Some thing new they needed to learn.
Colloquially, the conversation went thus:
Jesus: Beloved, the time has come to send you on a mission with the gospel about the Kingdom of God. I am giving you authority to expell evil spirits, and to cure sickness, and disease of every kind.(Mat. 10:1)
Thomas: Wow! That will be cool! We will actually be able to cure people of their diseases as well as to exorcize evil spirits? That will be the day!
Jesus: Don't be too excited Thomas, there is a catch to it. You cannot take this gospel to the Gentiles, and I forbid you even to enter a Samaritan town; to the Jews only, if you understand what I mean.(Mat. 10:5,6)
Thomas: I knew it! No wonder I was smelling the rat here somewhere. How can we do this among people who don't even believe in demons?
Jesus: I know it. That's why I am sending you out as sheep among wolves. Just be clever.(Mat. 10:16)
Peter: Master, there is something I do not understand here. What's the reason for the prohibition to take the gospel of the salvation to the Gentiles if we have all been assigned as light unto the Gentiles, according to
Isaiah 42:6?
Jesus: Peter, you are still too stuck to the old Law. That was in the old dispensation. With the change of the Priesthood, it has become necessary a change also of the Law.(Heb. 7:12)
Matthew: But Master, didn't you confirm the Law even down to the letter?(Mat. 5:17-19)
Jesus: Well, I'll send Saul, aka Paul, and he will explain how it all happened with my soon-to-come crucifixion.(Ephe. 2:15; Heb. 7:12)
Matthew: Whatever, but really, why forbid the Gentiles a share of your gospel? I still do not understand!
Jesus: Just let it be for now, Matthew. When the church of Paul is well established, hordes of evangelists will be sent by the Church to spread the gospel throughout the world.(This started in the 4th Century soon after Christianity was adopted as the official religion of the Roman Empire by Constantine in 310 ACE.)
The bottom line, ladies and gentlemen, is that the gospel of Jesus was, originally, forbidden to be taken to the Gentiles, and, unbelievably, by Jesus himself. Even Paul,albeit a self-proclaimed apostle to the Gentiles, never, actually, stood by his own claim. His whole life was to take the gospel to the Jews, as he would preach only in the synagogues of the Jews.
Believe it or not, were not for the Catholic Church, Christianity would still be no more than a simple hellenistic cult.
Now, if this does not make sense to you, let us talk about it.
Ben
Except being given power to heal and cast out demons, nice story. The casting out of demons and healing people is something they were already doing.
Jesus fulfilled a prophecy by bringing his gospel to the chosen people of God first, than the rest of the world. Do you remember it?
The prophecy aligned itself with another stated for the future, the last would be first and the first would be last.
Never the less, it was prophesied that a messiah would come to the Jews/chosen people of God, not the world. In order for the prophecy to be fulfilled, Jesus had to fulfil it by bringing his gospel to the Jews first. That is why after bringing it to the Jews, he taught non-Jews and I believe he began with the Samaritan woman by visiting her village and her people after their conversation.

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#10 Dec 3, 2012
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Except being given power to heal and cast out demons, nice story. The casting out of demons and healing people is something they were already doing.
Jesus fulfilled a prophecy by bringing his gospel to the chosen people of God first, than the rest of the world. Do you remember it?
The prophecy aligned itself with another stated for the future, the last would be first and the first would be last.
Never the less, it was prophesied that a messiah would come to the Jews/chosen people of God, not the world. In order for the prophecy to be fulfilled, Jesus had to fulfil it by bringing his gospel to the Jews first. That is why after bringing it to the Jews, he taught non-Jews and I believe he began with the Samaritan woman by visiting her village and her people after their conversation.
-------

Who decided that the gospel of Jesus was for the Jews FIRST and to include the Gentiles later? If you had quoted your assertions, I would not have to ask this question. The text in Mat. 10:5,6 does not imply at all that FIRST was for the Jews; but rather to the Jews only. BTW, if you read Mat. 15:24, Jesus himself declared that his mission was ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel. Does ONLY mean FIRST to you?

That conversation of Jesus' with the Samaritan woman at the Well of
Jacob, implies that it was a parable. Jesus didn't like Samaritans.
In his instructions to the disciples he told them NOT EVEN to enter
a Samaritan town.(Mat. 10:5) Besides, if after warning his disciples about not going to the Samaritans, he takes advantage of their absence and goes to have a chat with a Samaritan woman! It only shows assimilation with the behavior of some preachers of today: "Do what I say but not what I do, because I am a sinner too." Is it the case?

Ben
JEHOVAH IS GOD

Tulsa, OK

#11 Dec 3, 2012
You do not know Almighty God Jehovah, and you do not know or understand God's word the Bible.

You only know what you understand or what you have been taught to understand in your Cabala school.

You have no share today with Almighty God Jehovah's people, unless you take in accurate knowledge of God and life according to the book of Revelation, taught by Jehovah's witnesses in these final last days of this unrighteous world. Matthew 28:19,20

It is only true Christian Jehovah's witnesses that will recieve angelic protection at Armageddon, everyone else will be removed off this Earth. Now is the time to start your personal Bible study with Jehovah's witnesses, so you can be educated in God's word of Truth.

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#12 Dec 5, 2012
Ben_Masada wrote:
<quoted text>
-------
Who decided that the gospel of Jesus was for the Jews FIRST and to include the Gentiles later? If you had quoted your assertions, I would not have to ask this question. The text in Mat. 10:5,6 does not imply at all that FIRST was for the Jews; but rather to the Jews only. BTW, if you read Mat. 15:24, Jesus himself declared that his mission was ONLY to the lost sheep of Israel. Does ONLY mean FIRST to you?
That conversation of Jesus' with the Samaritan woman at the Well of
Jacob, implies that it was a parable. Jesus didn't like Samaritans.
In his instructions to the disciples he told them NOT EVEN to enter
a Samaritan town.(Mat. 10:5) Besides, if after warning his disciples about not going to the Samaritans, he takes advantage of their absence and goes to have a chat with a Samaritan woman! It only shows assimilation with the behavior of some preachers of today: "Do what I say but not what I do, because I am a sinner too." Is it the case?
Ben
If Jesus truly had not taught the Samaritan woman and her village you're point would hold factually true. If Jesus's message had ONLY been for the Jews and no one else, your point would be factually true. If Jesus had taught his apostles not to take his gospel to any other people, your point would be factually true. If the gospel Jesus brought had ONLY remained a Jewish gospel, not a Christian gospel your point would be factually true.
Unfortunately for you, none of the above happened as you wish to state they did.
Of your question, according to Jewish writings on the matter a messiah was to come to the Jews, the chosen people of God. And as it happened after the flood, the words of God given to one people soon spread to all other people. That shows it was never God's intent to give his words to one specific people and none else. But it was his intent to fulfil prophecies. And the prophecy according to Christians(not Jews)was fulfilled when Jesus took his message to the Jews first and then later allowed it to be taught to other people.
If the gospel of Jesus was ONLY meant for the Jews as you interpret it, God would have caused a "safe guard" of some sort to be in place that would have prohibited the gospel from reaching anyone but the Jews. But he didn't do that. He allowed his words to be given to the world after a prophecy had been fulfilled.

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#13 Dec 5, 2012
JEHOVAH IS GOD wrote:
You do not know Almighty God Jehovah, and you do not know or understand God's word the Bible.
You only know what you understand or what you have been taught to understand in your Cabala school.
You have no share today with Almighty God Jehovah's people, unless you take in accurate knowledge of God and life according to the book of Revelation, taught by Jehovah's witnesses in these final last days of this unrighteous world. Matthew 28:19,20
It is only true Christian Jehovah's witnesses that will recieve angelic protection at Armageddon, everyone else will be removed off this Earth. Now is the time to start your personal Bible study with Jehovah's witnesses, so you can be educated in God's word of Truth.
----------

Don't worry about Armageddon, there will be no Armageddon, as long as there are at least a Minyan of Jews on earth. If you don't know what is a Minyan, it is a number of ten male Jews. Do you remember the angels who appeared to Abraham in a dream about the destruction
of Sodom? The Lord told Abraham if there was at least ten just men in Sodom, the destruction could be avoided. He meant ten just Jews.
There were not. So, Sodom had to go.(Gen. 18:32)

Oh! I would like to tell you that you should stop identifying yourselves with Isaiah 43:10. Plagiarism is a dishonest embarrassment. Isaiah 43:10 is a reference to Israel, the Jewish People. The Prophet himself made it very clear since the very first verse of the chapter.

Ben

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#14 Dec 5, 2012
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
If Jesus truly had not taught the Samaritan woman and her village you're point would hold factually true. If Jesus's message had ONLY been for the Jews and no one else, your point would be factually true. If Jesus had taught his apostles not to take his gospel to any other people, your point would be factually true. If the gospel Jesus brought had ONLY remained a Jewish gospel, not a Christian gospel your point would be factually true.
Unfortunately for you, none of the above happened as you wish to state they did.
Of your question, according to Jewish writings on the matter a messiah was to come to the Jews, the chosen people of God. And as it happened after the flood, the words of God given to one people soon spread to all other people. That shows it was never God's intent to give his words to one specific people and none else. But it was his intent to fulfil prophecies. And the prophecy according to Christians(not Jews)was fulfilled when Jesus took his message to the Jews first and then later allowed it to be taught to other people.
If the gospel of Jesus was ONLY meant for the Jews as you interpret it, God would have caused a "safe guard" of some sort to be in place that would have prohibited the gospel from reaching anyone but the Jews. But he didn't do that. He allowed his words to be given to the world after a prophecy had been fulfilled.
-------

Now, why should I have to take your word for it? You don't have a single quote to document what you say. If you cannot use the Hebrew Scriptures to evidence your assertions, do it with the NT. If it makes sense, I will consider what you say. If it doesn't, I will tell you why.

Ben

“Good day to you!”

Since: Oct 08

Earth

#15 Dec 5, 2012
Ben_Masada wrote:
<quoted text>
-------
Now, why should I have to take your word for it? You don't have a single quote to document what you say. If you cannot use the Hebrew Scriptures to evidence your assertions, do it with the NT. If it makes sense, I will consider what you say. If it doesn't, I will tell you why.
Ben
Who said you had to? If you know anything about Jewish history, you should know that they have been awaiting the fulfilment of a prophecy that Christians say took place 2000 years ago dealing with the return of a messiah to his people.
The Jews believe he is coming only for them as you stated and then and only then to those that convert to their religion.
Christians having writings the Jews don't accept, they teach this messiah already came to his people who rejected him. their writings state after bring his message first to the chosen people, he taught it to others. It teaches after he told his apostles to bring his message to just the Jews, he told his apostles later to take his gospel to other people.
Thus the prophecy fulfilled that you should know of that I shouldn't have to make any references to of any documents.
JEHOVAH IS GOD

Muskogee, OK

#16 Dec 6, 2012
Ben_Masada wrote:
<quoted text>
----------
Don't worry about Armageddon, there will be no Armageddon, as long as there are at least a Minyan of Jews on earth. If you don't know what is a Minyan, it is a number of ten male Jews. Do you remember the angels who appeared to Abraham in a dream about the destruction
of Sodom? The Lord told Abraham if there was at least ten just men in Sodom, the destruction could be avoided. He meant ten just Jews.
There were not. So, Sodom had to go.(Gen. 18:32)
Oh! I would like to tell you that you should stop identifying yourselves with Isaiah 43:10. Plagiarism is a dishonest embarrassment. Isaiah 43:10 is a reference to Israel, the Jewish People. The Prophet himself made it very clear since the very first verse of the chapter.
Ben
You should be worried about Armageddon, the final spiritual war that will be fought by Jesus and the Angels against Satan the Devil and his ungodly children on this Earth. 2Peter 3:7

Then ten Jews that the people attach themselves to is not literal Jews, but spiritual Jews, Jehovah's witnesses today, for these are the only people Jehovah God and Jesus our King is backing to accomplish God's will on Earth today. Matthew 24:14

Jehovah's witnesses are the only people Almighty God Jehovah is using today to do this preaching work, it is the self righteous fake Christian who already believes he is saved from the fires of hell and the Jew that need to readjust his thinking, according to the truth of Almighty God Jehovah's book of Revelation.
Revelation 22:15

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#17 Dec 11, 2012
No Surprise wrote:
<quoted text>
Who said you had to? If you know anything about Jewish history, you should know that they have been awaiting the fulfilment of a prophecy that Christians say took place 2000 years ago dealing with the return of a messiah to his people.
The Jews believe he is coming only for them as you stated and then and only then to those that convert to their religion.
Christians having writings the Jews don't accept, they teach this messiah already came to his people who rejected him. their writings state after bring his message first to the chosen people, he taught it to others. It teaches after he told his apostles to bring his message to just the Jews, he told his apostles later to take his gospel to other people.
Thus the prophecy fulfilled that you should know of that I shouldn't have to make any references to of any documents.
------

First and foremost, you are totally wrong to say that I have stated
that the Messiah will come only to us. You can never produce that post because I have never stated such a thing. And then, I do not believe in an individual Messiah. The Messiah I believe in is collective in the People of Israel aka the Jewish People. Therefore, the Messiah has already come. The concept of a coming Messiah is translated by the return of the Jews from exile in the Diaspora. Read Ezekiel 37:12. And before I let you go, Messiah means "The anointed one of the Lord." Now, if you read Habakkuk 3:13, "The Lord comes forth to save His People; to save His anointed one." This is just to identify who the Messiah is.

Ben

Since: Nov 09

Location hidden

#18 Dec 11, 2012
JEHOVAH IS GOD wrote:
<quoted text>
You should be worried about Armageddon, the final spiritual war that will be fought by Jesus and the Angels against Satan the Devil and his ungodly children on this Earth. 2Peter 3:7
Then ten Jews that the people attach themselves to is not literal Jews, but spiritual Jews, Jehovah's witnesses today, for these are the only people Jehovah God and Jesus our King is backing to accomplish God's will on Earth today. Matthew 24:14
Jehovah's witnesses are the only people Almighty God Jehovah is using today to do this preaching work, it is the self righteous fake Christian who already believes he is saved from the fires of hell and the Jew that need to readjust his thinking, according to the truth of Almighty God Jehovah's book of Revelation.
Revelation 22:15
-------

The dead cannot fight anything or anyone. According to Ecclesiastes
9:6, "They will never again have part in anything that's done under
the sun." Jesus has been dead for two thousand years already. Now, for Angels, satan and devils, these are all emanations that exist only in the imagination of superstitious people.

Regarding your insistence on claiming the replacement of the Jews with yourselves, that's okay. Everybody needs an illusion to season his life with. After all, life without illusions is not worthy living. Therefore, you live in a world of illusions. Just try not to fall from the tree when you suddenly wake up.

Ben

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