Economist on bailouts: 'This is socialism' for the rich

[Pugsley]

hmmm wrote:

Corporate welfare is socialism, pure and simple.

All welfare is socialism. So what’s your point?

[Pugsley]

Cannonball wrote:

<quoted text>
You are not watching the news very close, if you think you still have free speech. Take a look at this:
http://www.reason.com/news/show/34642.html

What part of “in a free society” did you not understand? Just because a corrupt, immoral government makes laws usurping God given rights, doesn’t mean those laws are moral or serve justice. Once upon a time,“the law” said slavery and slaughtering Armenians and Jews was a fine, legal thing to do. So what?

[WhatAreTheyServi ng2Day]

Pugsley wrote:

<quoted text>
I have expressed outrage aplenty regarding unconstitutional spending on so called “entitlements.” Evidently, you have missed those posts. Our nation is freaking bankrupt. How dare any of us demand even more spending when we have already burdened children yet unborn with more debt than they will ever be able to pay.

Well, you had better get busy writing letters to your government 'cause they just don't see it the same way you do considering they've been spending like drunken sailors for the past seven and a half years only, it aint on YOU or this country. So, how DARE YOU complain about the want for additional *domestic* spending when billions are just being p#ssed away.

Someone asked once before on another topix board if there was a kind way to ask someone to pull their head out of their assss. Noone ever replied so I guess the answer is NO.

[SongBookz]

win wrote:

Taxing the upper class is fine, at least closing off some loopholes in high income brackets. Corporate and business taxes are what I am referring to, whether that be excess profit taxes as it is called, or higher corporate taxes in general.
<quoted text>

They can start by taxing cigars and liquor at the same rate as beer and cigarettes are taxed.

[BlackHeart]

SP Thinker wrote:

Oh yeah right! Like every welfare recipient discloses all of their assets!?! Are you kidding?
Have you been to a social office? Women and children wearing gold chains, driving SUV's. They say "daddy" left when really, he's living right there in the house. My neighbor is on welfare and has a big screen t.v. and between her and her kids, they have four cell phones!!
But you know....like don't be a hater - I'm just looking out for "me and mine", ya know! Cuz like, it's my right.... I'm entitled to welfare dammit....and my check better not be late, actually, direct deposit would be like so much better. In fact, I think some states do offer direct deposit - yeah, like save me a trip to the bank so I can watch t.v. Who wants to put any effort into it?
Yeah so, like...with my welfare check, and Section 8 Housing, and Medi-cal, and the free lunch and breakfast the schools give my kids, I barely like, only need to worry about dinner....and my food stamp card will take care of that.
Oh, and like, my children's schools also give out uniforms when families don't work, so he11, I don't even have to buy my kids clothes.
Man - America is GREAT! Wish I had done all of this earlier, instead of actually working...DUH!
And by the way, who said anything about a savings account?
<quoted text>

Are you a mexican by any chance? you sound like one.
I know, you're just pulling his chain because it's so easy, but remember when prop 187 was passed in '94, and then shot down by the ninth circuit court as 'unconstitutional'? why didn't anyone challenge them on it? the eleventh amendment specifically protects American Citizens from being abused by our own judicial system. the ninth circuit violated the rights of Every Californian by shooting down '187'.
you watch the pundits on tv and all they rail on about is how the illegals 'do the jobs americans won't do' not anymore my friend. 20% and more of the apple crops in washington state rotted on the trees last year becuase the illegals who do those jobs are all collecting welfare now. maybe you've noticed and maybe you haven't but the potatoes are staying in the ground too long these days. they all have black bruises on them from exposure. again because the 'hard-working illegals' are sitting at home watching the price is right rather than doing the job.
\Yes, americans can do these jobs as well, but they are sitting next to pancho because they would rather get the free money too!
I started working when I was nine, and would still be at it if arthritis hadn't destroyed my joints ten years ago. used to type ninety words per minute when I was writing bids as a contractor, but now I use two fingers and am lucky to get ten words per these days.
I still lok at dilapidated buildings and figure in my head how many men, gallons of paint and how much time I'd need to finish the job. old habits die hard.

[SP Thinker]

I'm glad you realized I was yanking his chain - and that you can recognize sarcasm. No, I'm not Mexican, but I've heard many a people, of all races, sound like and or live, like my prior posts.

It makes some people "feel good" to offer health care to everyone, but when you hear it the way it really is, it's not pleasant, is it?

With that said, you and I agree on everything (I think).

Prop 187 being shot down was a disaster. Wish we had a backbone in a conservative leadership.

BlackHeart wrote:

<quoted text>
Are you a mexican by any chance? you sound like one.
I know, you're just pulling his chain because it's so easy, but remember when prop 187 was passed in '94, and then shot down by the ninth circuit court as 'unconstitutional'? why didn't anyone challenge them on it? the eleventh amendment specifically protects American Citizens from being abused by our own judicial system. the ninth circuit violated the rights of Every Californian by shooting down '187'.
you watch the pundits on tv and all they rail on about is how the illegals 'do the jobs americans won't do' not anymore my friend. 20% and more of the apple crops in washington state rotted on the trees last year becuase the illegals who do those jobs are all collecting welfare now. maybe you've noticed and maybe you haven't but the potatoes are staying in the ground too long these days. they all have black bruises on them from exposure. again because the 'hard-working illegals' are sitting at home watching the price is right rather than doing the job.
\Yes, americans can do these jobs as well, but they are sitting next to pancho because they would rather get the free money too!
I started working when I was nine, and would still be at it if arthritis hadn't destroyed my joints ten years ago. used to type ninety words per minute when I was writing bids as a contractor, but now I use two fingers and am lucky to get ten words per these days.
I still lok at dilapidated buildings and figure in my head how many men, gallons of paint and how much time I'd need to finish the job. old habits die hard.

[Dem]

Pugsley wrote:

<quoted text>
I have expressed outrage aplenty regarding unconstitutional spending on so called “entitlements.” Evidently, you have missed those posts. Our nation is freaking bankrupt. How dare any of us demand even more spending when we have already burdened children yet unborn with more debt than they will ever be able to pay.

Typical insane Republican! You are all so worried about unborn children, but you don't give a krap about people who are alive now, hungry, and about to become homeless! Where the hell are your damn priorities?

[Pugsley]

Dem wrote:

<quoted text> Typical insane Republican! You are all so worried about unborn children, but you don't give a krap about people who are alive now, hungry, and about to become homeless! Where the hell are your damn priorities?

Typical selfish left-wing nut job. Grab what you feel you are entitled to and demand that others, even your grandchildren, pay for it. Try doing without your cable TV, internet connection and other useless goodies you obviously can’t afford, and use the money to pay for your own damn medical costs for a change.

[Pugsley]

WhatAreTheyServing2Day wrote:

<quoted text>
Well, you had better get busy writing letters to your government 'cause they just don't see it the same way you do considering they've been spending like drunken sailors for the past seven and a half years only, it aint on YOU or this country. So, how DARE YOU complain about the want for additional *domestic* spending when billions are just being p#ssed away.
Someone asked once before on another topix board if there was a kind way to ask someone to pull their head out of their assss. Noone ever replied so I guess the answer is NO.

Hey crybaby, see advise in above post. If you can’t afford your own insurance you are an irresponsible loser for indulging in internet connection to spew your ignorance.

[Cue]

SongBookz wrote:

<quoted text>
They can start by taxing cigars and liquor at the same rate as beer and cigarettes are taxed.

Can you at least wait till I restock -- this is the start of a week end.

[oye]

if they just stop taxing and stop giving easy credit to wall street,enforce the laws on the books,get out of iraq,drill a lil here 4 oil...things will even out duh!

[win]

After thinking a bit on this, there is one other consideration. I recall an article I read a year or so ago, many of those in the top brackets are there because of a one time event. They get a big spike and then fall back to a much lower income. The article mentioned several of the events cause this, and at the time it didn't seem right, though I do not recall the whole thing.

The tax code should take this into account of it allow them to equalize at least some of their income over years. Especially in cases where people with low or medium income have a one time taxable event, this could help their situation in future years.

One case was jury awards, in some cases the entire amount is taxable including the amount you pay to the lawyers, etc. That seems wrong.

win wrote:

Taxing the upper class is fine, at least closing off some loopholes in high income brackets. Corporate and business taxes are what I am referring to, whether that be excess profit taxes as it is called, or higher corporate taxes in general.
<quoted text>

[WhatAreTheyServi ng2Day]

Pugsley wrote:

<quoted text>
Hey crybaby, see advise in above post. If you can’t afford your own insurance you are an irresponsible loser for indulging in internet connection to spew your ignorance.

Sounds like you're the whiny little beeeyatch who doesn't understand what it is to be a human, let alone an American. Not to worry though - when you die, you'll get to take ALL your money and ALL those material things you've collected over your lifetime with you. Stupid @$$.

Sounds like you had no issue when I pointed out that YOUR gubment took 950-million dollars (that's 950 with SIX ZEROS) and used it to set up Universal Healthcare for Iraqi's and instead, continued your whining about how Americans - your FELLOW Americans should go screw themselves if they can't afford it.

You should meet up with a fate that puts you in a position of need. Then everyone can tell you to go f##k yourself - kinda like how your $h!tty attitude is. Only, people with some sense of compassion, HUMANS, will help your sorry @$$. And they won't complain about it like whiney little beeeyatches like you.

I pointed out how your gubment p!$$e$ away BILLIONS on some third-world sh!thole halfway across the globe, whose people, many dumb@$$e$ like yourself could give 2-kraps about yet you keep resorting to your self-centered SELF by continuing to whine like a little beeeeyatch about how you CAN'T STAND your gubment using the money for domestic issues and concerns.

You provide uncharted definitions for the term, dooooshbag.

Oh, and you're the most hypocritical being I've ever encountered.

Out one side of your @$$, essentially, you're saying, "F##K your fellow American," and out the other you're not at odds with the p!$$ing away of $BILLIONS$ elsewhere.

Make the connection, idiot. It's been laid out right in front of your dumb @$$.

[Pugsley]

WhatAreTheyServing2Day wrote:

<quoted text>
Sounds like you're the whiny little beeeyatch who doesn't understand what it is to be a human, let alone an American. Not to worry though - when you die, you'll get to take ALL your money and ALL those material things you've collected over your lifetime with you. Stupid @$$.
Sounds like you had no issue when I pointed out that YOUR gubment took 950-million dollars (that's 950 with SIX ZEROS) and used it to set up Universal Healthcare for Iraqi's and instead, continued your whining about how Americans - your FELLOW Americans should go screw themselves if they can't afford it.
You should meet up with a fate that puts you in a position of need. Then everyone can tell you to go f##k yourself - kinda like how your $h!tty attitude is. Only, people with some sense of compassion, HUMANS, will help your sorry @$$. And they won't complain about it like whiney little beeeyatches like you.
I pointed out how your gubment p!$$e$ away BILLIONS on some third-world sh!thole halfway across the globe, whose people, many dumb@$$e$ like yourself could give 2-kraps about yet you keep resorting to your self-centered SELF by continuing to whine like a little beeeeyatch about how you CAN'T STAND your gubment using the money for domestic issues and concerns.
You provide uncharted definitions for the term, dooooshbag.
Oh, and you're the most hypocritical being I've ever encountered.
Out one side of your @$$, essentially, you're saying, "F##K your fellow American," and out the other you're not at odds with the p!$$ing away of $BILLIONS$ elsewhere.
Make the connection, idiot. It's been laid out right in front of your dumb @$$.

Wow. LOL! Hit a nerve, huh? Try reading the constitution just once before you die. Military spending is constitutional. Entitlement spending is not. And as for compassion, I guarantee I put in more time and money serving others in a year than you have in your entire life. People who are always bitching that others need to do more for them are seldom generous with their own time and money when it comes to helping others. I’ve met your kind thousands of times. Always expecting a hand out but never willing to give back because it interferes with their leisure time. Loser.

[Cannonball]

SP Thinker wrote:

As far as increasing contributions - do you think the only the super rich should be able to run for President, or political offices?
<quoted text>

I don't understand what you are trying to say. I think the costs of running for political office are reaching absurdity.

My objection to the McCain-Feingold bill centers around the corporation contribution ban, because nearly all grass roots political action groups are incorporated, so the ban is really on independent political opinions. The corporations mentioned to the Supreme Court to be gaged, were the NRA, the NAACP, and labor unions. As enforced, the ban has fined the Viet Nam River Boat group, and went after Right to life groups, and others. Ne major corporations have been hit. We now have a costly government enforcement agency to say who can speak out at election time. I don't like this.

As I see

[WhatAreTheyServi ng2Day]

Pugsley wrote:

<quoted text>
Wow. LOL! Hit a nerve, huh? Try reading the constitution just once before you die. Military spending is constitutional. Entitlement spending is not. And as for compassion, I guarantee I put in more time and money serving others in a year than you have in your entire life. People who are always bitching that others need to do more for them are seldom generous with their own time and money when it comes to helping others. I’ve met your kind thousands of times. Always expecting a hand out but never willing to give back because it interferes with their leisure time. Loser.

My kind?... Looking for a handout?...

Are you retarded?

Why read the Constitution when the current President crumples it up and wipes his @$$ with it?

In Pugsley's world

Military spending =$950,000,000.00 to establish Universal Health Care for Iraqi's. Pugsley and Tommy Thompson agree it was right.

In Pugsley's world

Military spending =$9,000,000,000.00 that, through no accounting processes, mysteriously disappears. POOF! VANISHES!

In Pugsley's world

Military spending = proposing cuts in benefits to disabled veterans

In Pugsley's world

Military spending = no bid contracts handed out to a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend who knows a friend with a friend in some high-ranking position in U.S. Government in order to reap the most profit

In Pugsley's world

Military spending might also include multi-million, even multi-billion dollar bailouts of failed U.S. companies.

You are so clueless!

[win]

As far as contributions, I think it is good corporations and other organizations cannot contribute. They can have PAC's and individual contributers can contribute.

Are you sure that wasn't before McCain-Feingold? The union ban on contributions was fairly old as I recall.

Cannonball wrote:

<quoted text>
I don't understand what you are trying to say. I think the costs of running for political office are reaching absurdity.
My objection to the McCain-Feingold bill centers around the corporation contribution ban, because nearly all grass roots political action groups are incorporated, so the ban is really on independent political opinions. The corporations mentioned to the Supreme Court to be gaged, were the NRA, the NAACP, and labor unions. As enforced, the ban has fined the Viet Nam River Boat group, and went after Right to life groups, and others. Ne major corporations have been hit. We now have a costly government enforcement agency to say who can speak out at election time. I don't like this.
As I see

[win]

There has long been arguments for and against Executive powers and Congressional powers. Quite a few of these items, if not all, Congress has a right to not oversight but also to change according to the way the Constitution has been interpreted, the Judicial branch.

Has Bush stepped outside the powers that he has on these? Is it the same powers other Administrations have taken advantage of? Very probably. Some of it may be fixed, some won't. Congress seldom brings up these things at all, except to complain in front of Cameras, they don't want to have to deal with the restrictions when their party has the executive branch.

WhatAreTheyServing2Day wrote:

<quoted text>
My kind?... Looking for a handout?...
Are you retarded?
Why read the Constitution when the current President crumples it up and wipes his @$$ with it?
In Pugsley's world
Military spending =$950,000,000.00 to establish Universal Health Care for Iraqi's. Pugsley and Tommy Thompson agree it was right.
In Pugsley's world
Military spending =$9,000,000,000.00 that, through no accounting processes, mysteriously disappears. POOF! VANISHES!
In Pugsley's world
Military spending = proposing cuts in benefits to disabled veterans
In Pugsley's world
Military spending = no bid contracts handed out to a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend who knows a friend with a friend in some high-ranking position in U.S. Government in order to reap the most profit
In Pugsley's world
Military spending might also include multi-million, even multi-billion dollar bailouts of failed U.S. companies.
You are so clueless!

[BlackHeart]

SP Thinker wrote:

I'm glad you realized I was yanking his chain - and that you can recognize sarcasm. No, I'm not Mexican, but I've heard many a people, of all races, sound like and or live, like my prior posts.
It makes some people "feel good" to offer health care to everyone, but when you hear it the way it really is, it's not pleasant, is it?
With that said, you and I agree on everything (I think).
Prop 187 being shot down was a disaster. Wish we had a backbone in a conservative leadership.
<quoted text>

It seems that nobody has any backbone anymore.watched part of 'all the presidents men'this morning as I was peparing for my day. thought about it during the busride into twnand realized just how LITTLE tricky dick dd to get impeached! Man, compared to jeedub, Nixon looks like a frckin Boy Scout!
anyway, I eft out one very important part in my last post. what I meant to say about the eleventh amendment was that it protects us from being abused by our judicial system by Foreign Natonals. it makes more sense when thatis included, hey?

[Pugsley]

WhatAreTheyServing2Day wrote:

<quoted text>
My kind?... Looking for a handout?...
Are you retarded?
Why read the Constitution when the current President crumples it up and wipes his @$$ with it?
In Pugsley's world
Military spending =$950,000,000.00 to establish Universal Health Care for Iraqi's. Pugsley and Tommy Thompson agree it was right.
In Pugsley's world
Military spending =$9,000,000,000.00 that, through no accounting processes, mysteriously disappears. POOF! VANISHES!
In Pugsley's world
Military spending = proposing cuts in benefits to disabled veterans
In Pugsley's world
Military spending = no bid contracts handed out to a friend of a friend of a friend of a friend who knows a friend with a friend in some high-ranking position in U.S. Government in order to reap the most profit
In Pugsley's world
Military spending might also include multi-million, even multi-billion dollar bailouts of failed U.S. companies.
You are so clueless!

There are BETRAYALS GALORE to outrage anyone who knows what they are talking about. It is you who are clueless or you would not be so singularly obsessed with money spent in Iraq. I am just as disgusted and outraged over governments wasteful spending as anyone else, but I guarantee that the Iraq debacle and universal health care will be at the bottom of your list of priorities one year from now. Take your blinders off and you will see that we have a systemic failure in progress. The US is in a march to Third World status. Do Third World nations have universal health care? A puppet government head and compromised Congress enabled the devastation. Obama or McCain, it matters not. Whoever wins in November will have a single agenda: to manage crisis, not to enact new policy.