Fired nurses accuse Fairview Southdale Hospital of age discrimi...

Fairview Southdale Hospital in Edina is facing a federal age-discrimination complaint because it is firing 25 nurses - and 23 of them are older veteran nurses. Full Story
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Mr D

Maple Grove, MN

#1 Jul 31, 2008
With a shortage of nurses. its surprising that LPN''s are not needed by the medical community and have become outdated. It would be interesting to know if the program is being offered by our local schools and what the placement rate is.
In my opinion the group is being discriminated against.
William Mitchell Grad

Saint Paul, MN

#2 Jul 31, 2008
It would have been nice if the article gave more detail regarding the ages of the plaintiffs (not to necessarily fault the reporter...this information may not have been available to Mr. Olson). The article mentions "older veteran nurses", but how many of the nurses are 40+ years of age? Fyi, the federal Age Discrimination in Employment Act only covers employees who are 40+(the state Human Rights Act had broader coverage). What is the average age or median age of the 25 unfortunate LPN's? What is the average age or median age of the fortunate RN's?
newmom

Minneapolis, MN

#3 Jul 31, 2008
our population is getting older, and that means more sick people in need of hospital care... personally I would rather know that I am being cared for by people who have the higher level of training that an RN has... if you look at what it takes to get your LPN versus your RN...they should have put that in the article... I sympathsize with losing a job, but claiming age discrimination when it is community practice at other hospitals seems a little out there... doesn't the article say that Fairview is helping them find new jobs... I can tell you most corporations would not even think of doing that - it would be pink slip and out the door..
Ryan

Minneapolis, MN

#4 Jul 31, 2008
Response to William Mitchell Grad:

23 of the 25 nurses are 40+ years of age
Avg age of age-protected nurses is 57
Avg years of service of 22
frde

United States

#5 Jul 31, 2008
I do not see Age as being a factor here,I see a company that is trying to find placement for these displaced workers. The artical states that Fairview Southdale is going with the RNs to fill a need of the Patients that require more specialized care. If the LPN's want to, they can get more education and become RNs.
With the way Insurence Comp. are mandating shorter stays and being more ill to even qualify for hospial admission,RNs are needed to do more for the patients in a shorter time period. LPN's are just not qualifed to give that standard of care.
I wish all of the LPN's good luck in being placed in a decent job with fair wages,you all are a credit to your profession.
mary

Duluth, MN

#6 Jul 31, 2008
Not so easy frde.......... the RN programs all have a wait list, and only take about 10 students, what we need are more instructors to teach the RN's. I'm an LPN who has been working on my RN for three years, only to be placed on a "wait list" for two years in a row. I think Fairview is only saying they are trying to place the LPN's = damage control.
MONEY

Madison, WI

#7 Jul 31, 2008
Its happening everywhere, companies are pushing out the older (HIGHER PAID)employees and hiring new people who are at the bottom of the pay scale. Get rid of 1 LPN who makes 80,000 and hire a RN who makes 50,000 and is higher educated more proficient with technology and more eager and hungry to learn and move up. Sounds like they just saved 30,000 on just one employee imagine how much they saved on 25. why should nurses feel any more wronged than the the rest of us in Corporate America. Oh I forgot Hospitals like Fairview especially in EDINA are businesses they dont take patients with no insurance. That hospital is reserved for the investor class of Americans of course they are going to run it in a corporate manner, those LPN's shouldve seen this coming
Stop Making things up

Saint Paul, MN

#8 Jul 31, 2008
MONEY wrote:
Its happening everywhere, companies are pushing out the older (HIGHER PAID)employees and hiring new people who are at the bottom of the pay scale. Get rid of 1 LPN who makes 80,000 and hire a RN who makes 50,000 and is higher educated more proficient with technology and more eager and hungry to learn and move up. Sounds like they just saved 30,000 on just one employee imagine how much they saved on 25. why should nurses feel any more wronged than the the rest of us in Corporate America. Oh I forgot Hospitals like Fairview especially in EDINA are businesses they dont take patients with no insurance. That hospital is reserved for the investor class of Americans of course they are going to run it in a corporate manner, those LPN's shouldve seen this coming
What LPN makes $80k a year, you dope?
James

Minneapolis, MN

#9 Jul 31, 2008
MONEY wrote:
Its happening everywhere, companies are pushing out the older (HIGHER PAID)employees and hiring new people who are at the bottom of the pay scale. Get rid of 1 LPN who makes 80,000 and hire a RN who makes 50,000 and is higher educated more proficient with technology and more eager and hungry to learn and move up. Sounds like they just saved 30,000 on just one employee imagine how much they saved on 25. why should nurses feel any more wronged than the the rest of us in Corporate America. Oh I forgot Hospitals like Fairview especially in EDINA are businesses they dont take patients with no insurance. That hospital is reserved for the investor class of Americans of course they are going to run it in a corporate manner, those LPN's shouldve seen this coming
Where do you get your information from on the wages? More importantly, your information on Fairview not taking patients that don't have insurance is absolutely false. All hospitals take patients with no insurance. In the emergency rooms it is state (and maybe Federal) law that you cannot turn people away due to not having insurance. I've never seen Fairview's books but I do work there and they take tons of people with no insurance. They lose millions of dollars every years (all large hospitals do) due to this. And they have great programs to help those with no insurance. So saying that they don't take people with no insurance is just false. A question for everyone. Who would you rather have treating you? A registered nurse that is more recently out of school that had been trained more and more recently in medical technology and education or an LPN that has been an LPN for years and years (I know many that have there for 45 years). Not 45 years old. Been there working as an LPN for 45 years. LPNs simply are not educated to the level of the RNs. I'd want the person that is up to date and better educated.
Bubbles

Saint Paul, MN

#10 Jul 31, 2008
The workforce is continually evolving. It clearly stated in the article that the LPN role was in higher demand in the past because these employees were an important part of the charting and planning process. Now that new technology has made these tasks unnessicary, there is not as high of a need for this job description. Should the hospital keep these people on for nostalgic reasons? I guess we could all decide to pay even more for our healthcare. If one were to ask me, I would say that we should look to maximize efficiency in the healthcare system. Every worker out there today should take a good hard look at their daily tasks and see if they are being automated or replaced by some technology. If this is the case, retrain yourself. This is not easy, cheap or fair. Fairness aside, it is reality. The days of sitting in the same cube for 20 years, not improving your skills and expecting to have a continuous job are over. They have been for long time.
Sure whatever

Saint Paul, MN

#11 Jul 31, 2008
mary wrote:
Not so easy frde.......... the RN programs all have a wait list, and only take about 10 students, what we need are more instructors to teach the RN's. I'm an LPN who has been working on my RN for three years, only to be placed on a "wait list" for two years in a row. I think Fairview is only saying they are trying to place the LPN's = damage control.
Actually, I am in my last semester of RN classes right now at a well-known nursing school and we started with over 60 students in my class. Yes, I had to wait on a waiting list for a couple years, but it will be totally worth it when I finish.

I also had an opportunity to do a clinical rotation at Fairview-Riverside. One of the nurses that I was paired with happened to be an LPN. She was really good and knew what she was doing. But I was a little uncomfortable knowing that I was being supervised by an LPN. Only because BY LAW as an LPN, there are certain skills/procedures she was unable to do. Administering blood transfusions or blood products is one of them. Fairview is actually the only hospital (that I know of) that still employs LPN's as floor nurses. I don't think this is discrimination. I agree with other posters in saying that patients that are in the hospital are a lot sicker than they used to be. They are requiring a higher level of care than they used to be and LPN's can't provide that.
Outraged in Victoria

Minneapolis, MN

#12 Jul 31, 2008
I am outraged that the management of Fairview Southdale Hospital wouldn't allow the LPN's to naturally weed themselves out over time and discontinue hiring any new LPNs going forward. With the average age being 57 years old means the LPN's would eleminate themselves rather quickly. It appears Fairview Southdale got a bug up their butt and wanted to start this all new 100% RN facility NOW without any concern for the LPN's that have committed an average of 22 years of service to this Hospital and community. If the Hospital has no compassion for their loyal employees, how sincere is their compassion for their patients? Fairview Southdale Hospital is wrong!
Seriously

Saint Paul, MN

#13 Jul 31, 2008
MONEY wrote:
Its happening everywhere, companies are pushing out the older (HIGHER PAID)employees and hiring new people who are at the bottom of the pay scale. Get rid of 1 LPN who makes 80,000 and hire a RN who makes 50,000 and is higher educated more proficient with technology and more eager and hungry to learn and move up. Sounds like they just saved 30,000 on just one employee imagine how much they saved on 25. why should nurses feel any more wronged than the the rest of us in Corporate America. Oh I forgot Hospitals like Fairview especially in EDINA are businesses they dont take patients with no insurance. That hospital is reserved for the investor class of Americans of course they are going to run it in a corporate manner, those LPN's shouldve seen this coming
Wow, I would like to know where LPN's are making $80K. If that's what the LPN's make, the RN's must be raking it in!
Sarah D

Minneapolis, MN

#14 Jul 31, 2008
Seriously wrote:
<quoted text>
Wow, I would like to know where LPN's are making $80K. If that's what the LPN's make, the RN's must be raking it in!
Obviously you don't know what it takes to be an RN and how hard they work as well as the fact that there's a shortage of them.

Supply and demand you know.
Seriously

Saint Paul, MN

#15 Jul 31, 2008
Sarah D wrote:
<quoted text>
Obviously you don't know what it takes to be an RN and how hard they work as well as the fact that there's a shortage of them.
Supply and demand you know.
Your comment makes no sense what-so-ever.

And as a matter of fact, I happen to be an RN so I do know how hard I work and what it takes.
newmom

Minneapolis, MN

#16 Jul 31, 2008
outraged in Victoria... I have gotten care at Fairview Southdale and they have WONDERFULLY COMPASSIONATE people working there... I think your generalization is COMPLETELY UNFAIR...
merk Burnsville MN

Miami, FL

#17 Jul 31, 2008
I would like to hear from one person that has a stake in all of this. The LPN's we are talking about here are all highly skilled employees. I read one guy who "works" at Fairview says the Hospital loses millions a year on uninsured patients. Does your work involve scrubbing floors or preparing meals? Newmom wants to ask; who would you rather take care of you, an LPN or RN? Better question, who does the RN want working next to her, an LPN or a nursing assistant? Well newmom, guess who cared for your newborn like it was her very own? Probably an LPN with 20 to 40 years behind them. Instead of putting down the job they do maybe you should thank them. And frde, what in Gods name do you know about these displaced workers. These LPN's were FIRED for no probable cause. The last thing they want is some backhanded praise from you. And do not kid yourself, Fairview is not finding positions of value for the LPNs.
Now for you "sure whatever" and "totally worth it". Did you spit out the gum before you said it? Can you say Community College? An LPN holds your hand and attempts to share her hands on expearience and you have the nerve to state she is not qualified to provide a higher level of care.
What I am saying is this. Your opinions mean nothing to these very real people. Few if any of you know the workings of this Hospital. Fewer yet know what contributions the LPNs have made. And not one of you know the impact of Fairview's hatchet job on these long time and dedicated employees or their families.
Sarah D

Minneapolis, MN

#18 Jul 31, 2008
Seriously wrote:
<quoted text>
Your comment makes no sense what-so-ever.
And as a matter of fact, I happen to be an RN so I do know how hard I work and what it takes.
MY comment makes no sense? You're an RN and state that RNs must be "raking it in"? That implied that you don't know how much RNs make. Don't you know how much you make?

If it was meant as sarcasm then you have to take care because sarcasm often doesn't come across well on the Internet. I've taken to adding </sarcasm> at the end of sarcastic posts just so people don't misunderstand.
dmf

Duluth, MN

#20 Jul 31, 2008
I think that the hospital made a mistake here, especially if they employ nursing assistants to help the RN's. I wonder if management checked with the RN's who work with these LPN's to see how they feel about this. They would have probably heard stories of how valuable these LPN's have been. They could have kept the LPN's and just changed their roles from being assigned patients to working more as a nursing assistant with a bonus. The bonus would be that they have the ability to do more things, plus the medical training to know when things don"t seem right with a patient. These LPN's have a lot of experience having functioned much like a RN for years. They would be able to be a good resource to the RN when she is busy. These LPN's would be more trusted as they do have -I believe just one year less training than most of the RN"s. I think some of the LPN's would have stayed on rather than be fired and have to look elsewhere for work.
what

Maple Grove, MN

#21 Jul 31, 2008
The bottom line is that LPN's have been phased out in just about every other health care system hospital in MN. It was only a matter of time before Fairview joined them. I feel bad for the LPN's that have been let go, but they had to see it coming.

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