The power of Tim Tebow has little to do with football

Jan 16, 2012 Full story: The Orlando Sentinel 170

And so the nation's most contentious morality play is finally over, buried in the deep freeze of Foxboro, Mass.

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TEBOW SUCKS

Hartford, CT

#22 Jan 18, 2012
Laughing Bear Fan wrote:
<quoted text>Its almost as if you are saying Tebow is White?
He was born in Bethlehem...is that white? Beige-ish at least.

“Timshel”

Since: Jan 12

Tulsa, OK

#23 Jan 18, 2012
Laughing Bear Fan wrote:
<quoted text>Its almost as if you are saying Tebow is White?
Could it be?

TMD

“Look! Up in the sky!”

Since: Dec 06

Columbus, Ohio

#24 Jan 18, 2012
_Jusayin_ wrote:
<quoted text>
You mistake objectivity and telling it like it is for nastiness. I thought I was being realistic especially seeing as that no other athlete in history has been given the same concessions right off the bat as Tim Tebow has. Everyone else has had to prove their worth and Tebow's position was given to him, NOT earned. Hell, even after this season, most realistic people STILL don't think Tebow is good enough or has earned the right to start in the NFL as a QB!
I'm not quite sure what you're basing this on.

Tebow was drafted 25th in the first round and wasn't named the starter until the 5th game of his second year. Some experts believed his draft position was a little high for someone with his skill sets, but others thought he should have been drafted in the top ten, primarily because he was considered one of the greatest college players, ever. Regardless, there have been other running QBs that have been drafted even higher, and given the starting position much sooner than Tebow with nothing but their college careers to base this decision on:

Randall Cunningham - 1985 Drafted R2/37th overall - Started first year
Donovan McNabb - 1999 Drafted R1/2nd overall - Started first year
Michael Vick - 2001 Drafted R1/1st overall - Started first year
Vince Young - 2005 Drafted R1/3rd overall - Started first year
Cam Newton - 2011 Drafted R1/1st overall - Started first year

Tebow became the starter only after Orton, whose QBR was in the 30s, had lead the Broncos to a 1-4 start to the 2011 season. The Broncos were forced into doing SOMETHING or the entire season would have been lost. It doesn't look to me like Tebow was prematurely given anything...

.
Just listen to what former NFL black, running QB's had to say about Tebow and what they had to EARN and what has been GIFTED to Tebow and then listen to what the other great black, college QB's that didn't get drafted into the NFL had to say about Tebow getting opportunities never afforded them.
Yes, there have been many great running college QBs, black and white, who were denied entrance to the NFL because of their style of play. However, most of those players refused to even CONSIDER changing positions. And before you go and get your panties all in a bunch - it's not just black QBs who have been asked to change positions as a condition to being drafted. Many WHITE college QBs have been converted to RBs, WRs, and TEs in the NFL.

Of the five QBs I mentioned earlier, only McNabb had anything negative to say about Tebow's treatment versus his own. Randall Cunningham and Jim Brown have nothing but praise for Tebow:

Randall Cunningham:
http://www.kdvr.com/news/kdvr-randall-cunning...

Jim Brown:
http://m.espn.go.com/wireless/story...

I am, by no means, a Tebow or Denver fan. However, two things are abundantly clear. Whether you like him or hate him, Tebow knows how to inspire his teammates (on both sides of the ball), and win.

Since: Apr 08

Akron, Ohio

#25 Jan 18, 2012
Very well said.

“Timshel”

Since: Jan 12

Tulsa, OK

#26 Jan 19, 2012
TMD wrote:
<quoted text>
Randall Cunningham - 1985 Drafted R2/37th overall - Started first year
Donovan McNabb - 1999 Drafted R1/2nd overall - Started first year
Michael Vick - 2001 Drafted R1/1st overall - Started first year
Vince Young - 2005 Drafted R1/3rd overall - Started first year
Cam Newton - 2011 Drafted R1/1st overall - Started first year
The difference between the 5 you named and Tebow is they can actually throw the football. I know people over look that little fact when Tebow is concerned but 99.9% of the NFL requires a QB to be able to throw it accurately on a consistent basis.

Any body can just list what they think like you've done and then there's actual fact. Tebow was actually predicted to be a 2nd round pick and maybe fall to 3rd or 4th. Why in the hell do you think Josh Mc Daniels got fired from Denver? Because he drafted Tebow in the first round. that's why there's evident animosity towards Tebow from Elway. He inherited what they believe to be Mc Daniels screw up.

Tebow also started the last 3 games of 2010 and he's started 16 games overall.

I was also just using black running QB's as examples. I know there have been numerous white running QB's not considered too. And it still goes to my point: Tebow was NEVER asked to play in a different position. Never once even though many experts believe he should have. He was gifted the starting QB position because he's a popular Christian. If he could actually throw it well I'd say there's merit to the contrary, but he's made it obvious all on his own he needs tons of work!

Also, Randall Cunningham is a Pastor so he's automatically biased and probably hoping to cash in on Tebow-mania somehow. They all have to stick together right?

You used Jim Brown? LOL! Ok, he says about Tebow:
"Considering Tebow's limited skills throwing the football"
"I agree that Vick could learn some things from watching Tebow, especially since he is such a far superior athlete when compared to Denver's quarterback."
"When things aren't there, Tebow has tucked the ball and run, or just thrown the ball out of bounds."
- http://bleacherreport.com/articles/983178-why...

The last quote there was as much praise as Jim Brown gave Tebow! Stop traffic, Tebow can sure throw the ball in the dirt or out of bounds real well even if he's got an open receiver! But it's just him being "cautious" when the other 99% of the NFL qb's could make that completion.

By the way, it'll take a whole lot more than you just jotting things down in a forum with no facts to back you up to get my "panties all in a bunch".

I'll give you a little on Tebow's inspiration factor but where was that the last 3 games of the season when the whole Denver organization was turning on him? Elway can't even 100% fully support Tebow now. But everybody else is wrong or ignorant who doesn't support Tebow...Ridiculous.

Since: Jan 08

Pleasantville, NJ

#27 Jan 19, 2012
_Jusayin_ wrote:
<quoted text>
You mistake objectivity and telling it like it is for nastiness. I thought I was being realistic especially seeing as that no other athlete in history has been given the same concessions right off the bat as Tim Tebow has. Everyone else has had to prove their worth and Tebow's position was given to him, NOT earned. Hell, even after this season, most realistic people STILL don't think Tebow is good enough or has earned the right to start in the NFL as a QB!
Just listen to what former NFL black, running QB's had to say about Tebow and what they had to EARN and what has been GIFTED to Tebow and then listen to what the other great black, college QB's that didn't get drafted into the NFL had to say about Tebow getting opportunities never afforded them.
GO PATRIOTS!!!!
No Inspiration

United States

#28 Jan 19, 2012
Tebow forgot to inspire his teamates vs the Patriots....
Laughing Bear Fan

Littleton, CO

#29 Jan 19, 2012
No Inspiration wrote:
Tebow forgot to inspire his teamates vs the Patriots....
Tebow played hurt, had fluid in some sort of double membrane that was removed with a tampon

TMD

“Look! Up in the sky!”

Since: Dec 06

Columbus, Ohio

#31 Jan 20, 2012
_Jusayin_ wrote:
<quoted text>
I was also just using black running QB's as examples. I know there have been numerous white running QB's not considered too. And it still goes to my point: Tebow was NEVER asked to play in a different position. Never once even though many experts believe he should have. He was gifted the starting QB position because he's a popular Christian.
No, the point you were trying to make was that other BLACK quaterbacks were not given the same opportunities as Tebow because he is white, not because he is a christian. Regardless, Tebow WAS asked about playing a position other than QB. He has lined up as a WR for the Broncos several times. However, you're right. He has never seriously been asked to permanently change positions. And he shouldn't be. He has been voted, by several expert panels to be one of the top 3-5 best college players ever. He should be given the chance to play the position that made him such a success.

.
If he could actually throw it well I'd say there's merit to the contrary, but he's made it obvious all on his own he needs tons of work!
Yes, yes, we've all seen the numbers. He's 16 games into his pro career, has snatched victory from the jaws of defeat 7-8 times, and won a playoff game against the 2nd best defense in the NFL while passing for 316 yards, and that's not good enough for you. How many playoff games has Orton won? What about Quinn?

Give Tebow enough time to learn to read pro defenses and he will be as good, or better than, most of the other QBs in the league. Hell, he's already better than Ponder, Grossman, V. Young, Hasselbeck, Campbell, and a whole host of others.

.
Also, Randall Cunningham is a Pastor so he's automatically biased and probably hoping to cash in on Tebow-mania somehow. They all have to stick together right?
I don't know about the cashing in, but, yes, he probably is a bit biased. It doesn't make him wrong. Just because you're paranoid it doesn't mean somebody's not out to get you...

.
You used Jim Brown? LOL! Ok, he says about Tebow:
"Considering Tebow's limited skills throwing the football"
"I agree that Vick could learn some things from watching Tebow, especially since he is such a far superior athlete when compared to Denver's quarterback."
"When things aren't there, Tebow has tucked the ball and run, or just thrown the ball out of bounds."
The last quote there was as much praise as Jim Brown gave Tebow! Stop traffic, Tebow can sure throw the ball in the dirt or out of bounds real well even if he's got an open receiver! But it's just him being "cautious" when the other 99% of the NFL qb's could make that completion.
The point I was making was that the great Jim Brown supports Tebow, warts and all, and thinks Vick should play more like him. He doesn't believe, as you do, that Tebow is in over his head. Now who should I believe - the greatest football player of all time, or you?

.
By the way, it'll take a whole lot more than you just jotting things down in a forum with no facts to back you up to get my "panties all in a bunch".
The only one of us "jotting things down" is you. I have presented fact after fact, and all you've given is a lot of very narrow-minded opinion.

.
I'll give you a little on Tebow's inspiration factor but where was that the last 3 games of the season when the whole Denver organization was turning on him? Elway can't even 100% fully support Tebow now. But everybody else is wrong or ignorant who doesn't support Tebow...Ridiculous.
You're dead wrong again. Nobody wins ALL of their games, and the Denver organization is fully behind Tebow now. He's already been named the starting QB for the 2012 season by Elway and Fox.

Since: Apr 08

Akron, Ohio

#32 Jan 20, 2012
I was just going to remind you all that Tebow's got the QB job for next season. TMD beat me to it! lol

Why shouldn't they give the kid time to grow in the NFL? He had a lot of "come from behind" wins this season, and that shows me that he just doesn't give up.

Colt McCoy is catching a lot of flack also. Despite being thrown unexpectedly into his first season last season, and a concussion this season that kept him out of the last 3 games, ESPN is predicting his replacement in the next draft. WTH? Seems kind of premature to me.
Laughing Bear Fan

Littleton, CO

#33 Jan 20, 2012
Bewitched wrote:
I was just going to remind you all that Tebow's got the QB job for next season. TMD beat me to it! lol
Why shouldn't they give the kid time to grow in the NFL? He had a lot of "come from behind" wins this season, and that shows me that he just doesn't give up.
Colt McCoy is catching a lot of flack also. Despite being thrown unexpectedly into his first season last season, and a concussion this season that kept him out of the last 3 games, ESPN is predicting his replacement in the next draft. WTH? Seems kind of premature to me.
Next season? I live here in Denver and all Elway said was he has the job going into training camp. He had a lot of pick-6's that helped him and a lot of 50+ yard field goals to get the game into overtime where either a turnover benefitted him or another field goal sealed the deal. So what he needs to win is:
1) luck
2) strong defense
3) excellent punter so field position doesn't kill him on one of his many 3 and outs
4) an accurate field goal kicker beyond 50 yards.

Hmmm.... most Qb's in the NFL would win with that. Not 38 passing yards in a half in a pass-happy league,

I still think he's trade bait for the Jags

TMD

“Look! Up in the sky!”

Since: Dec 06

Columbus, Ohio

#34 Jan 20, 2012
Laughing Bear Fan wrote:
<quoted text>Next season? I live here in Denver and all Elway said was he has the job going into training camp. He had a lot of pick-6's that helped him and a lot of 50+ yard field goals to get the game into overtime where either a turnover benefitted him or another field goal sealed the deal. So what he needs to win is:
1) luck
2) strong defense
3) excellent punter so field position doesn't kill him on one of his many 3 and outs
4) an accurate field goal kicker beyond 50 yards.
Hmmm.... most Qb's in the NFL would win with that. Not 38 passing yards in a half in a pass-happy league,
I still think he's trade bait for the Jags
Surprisingly, I agree with almost all of this.

Tebow has benefited from timely interceptions, fumble recoveries, breakdowns in coverage, etc. However, most people who are Tebow critics ignore the fact that Orton played with the same guys and did MUCH worse. Obviously, there's some major difference between the two, and it's not just that Tebow can run effectively.

Tebow seems to truly inspire the players around him. I know how corny that sounds, but that's what seems to be happening. That, and a lot of looks at crappy prevent defenses. Why do teams even use it?

If Elway tried to part ways with Tebow now there would be riots in the street. For whatever reason, Brady Quinn has just not worked out in the NFL. Tebow is the best option the Broncos have. Give him a little time. He IS going to get better.

TMD

“Look! Up in the sky!”

Since: Dec 06

Columbus, Ohio

#35 Jan 20, 2012
Bewitched wrote:
I was just going to remind you all that Tebow's got the QB job for next season. TMD beat me to it! lol
Why shouldn't they give the kid time to grow in the NFL? He had a lot of "come from behind" wins this season, and that shows me that he just doesn't give up.
Colt McCoy is catching a lot of flack also. Despite being thrown unexpectedly into his first season last season, and a concussion this season that kept him out of the last 3 games, ESPN is predicting his replacement in the next draft. WTH? Seems kind of premature to me.
I'm with you, Sam. I think the Browns will regret letting McCoy go if that's what happens. He's going to make an excellent starting QB for someone.

Since: Apr 08

Akron, Ohio

#36 Jan 20, 2012
Both teams should give these young QBs more time. IMO

On another subject, who do you think is going to end up with Luck?
Laughing Bear Fan

Littleton, CO

#37 Jan 20, 2012
TMD wrote:
<quoted text>
Surprisingly, I agree with almost all of this.
Tebow has benefited from timely interceptions, fumble recoveries, breakdowns in coverage, etc. However, most people who are Tebow critics ignore the fact that Orton played with the same guys and did MUCH worse. Obviously, there's some major difference between the two, and it's not just that Tebow can run effectively.
Tebow seems to truly inspire the players around him. I know how corny that sounds, but that's what seems to be happening. That, and a lot of looks at crappy prevent defenses. Why do teams even use it?
If Elway tried to part ways with Tebow now there would be riots in the street. For whatever reason, Brady Quinn has just not worked out in the NFL. Tebow is the best option the Broncos have. Give him a little time. He IS going to get better.
If Quinn, Orton or Tebow are the answer, I'd hate to know the question. Those were Josh McHoodie's picks/trades. I don't think the QB for the future of the Bronco's is on the roster. I can't see Elway staking his cred on any of them. Orton's gone already, Quinn should go, they should keep Tebow but use him where he's most dangerous, in the red-zone. He has a nose for the end-zone. What about creating a package where a pocket QB moves the team down the field with the understanding once they get inside the red-zone and diffent attack takes the field. Football has remained fairly static, basketball has evolved with a small quick lineup to take the place of the starters when they rest the starters, baseball has evolved with the closer role, football should learn from them because the closer in football is really the red-zone offense. Take advantage of the bend but don't break defenses buy making them bend until they get in the red-zone, then change it up on them. Might work, might not. Thoughts?
Unbelievable

United States

#38 Jan 20, 2012
Bewitched wrote:
Both teams should give these young QBs more time. IMO
On another subject, who do you think is going to end up with Luck?
Colts.
Laughing Bear Fan

Littleton, CO

#39 Jan 20, 2012
Bewitched wrote:
Both teams should give these young QBs more time. IMO
On another subject, who do you think is going to end up with Luck?
Watch Luck turn out to be this century's Ryan Leaf

“Your Own Peace Prize Inside”

Since: Mar 07

Hyannis, Mass

#40 Jan 20, 2012
Laughing Bear Fan wrote:
<quoted text>Watch Luck turn out to be this century's Ryan Leaf
Do you really understand why Leaf turned into a "bust"? or are you just repeating all those "radio call in guys" you listen to?
Laughing Bear Fan

Littleton, CO

#41 Jan 20, 2012
WeElectedABunchOfIdiots wrote:
<quoted text>
Do you really understand why Leaf turned into a "bust"? or are you just repeating all those "radio call in guys" you listen to?
Of course, He was physically capable but Mentally incapable and most inportantly did not have a dad named Archie so he was doomed. Luck will not be able to run PM's offense, simply won't be ready for that for 5-6 years so a new one will have to be tailored for him AND in the meantime RG3 will be spinning it for a slightly more talented team....So YES Luck will be a bust relative to RG3

TMD

“Look! Up in the sky!”

Since: Dec 06

Columbus, Ohio

#42 Jan 20, 2012
Bewitched wrote:
Both teams should give these young QBs more time. IMO
On another subject, who do you think is going to end up with Luck?
I don't think there's much doubt that Irsay wants to draft Luck AND keep Manning around. It's doable IF you jettison some other pricey players:

1. Reggie Wayne (WR)- His attitude and production have been questionable that last 2-3 years, and his best days are behind him. I thought the Colts should have traded Wayne to get Nicks, Cruz, or Heyward. Or, at the least, cut him to pick up Vince Jackson. The Colts are overloaded with receivers. He's expendable.

2. Robert Mathis (DE)- One of the best DEs in the league, but the Colts already have Freeney and Hughes as DEs nad DT Nevis out of LSU is just getting better and better. The Colts could probably trade Mathis for a first and second round pick where they could draft a CB and SS.

3. Dallas Clark (TE)- He's been nagged with little injuries the last two seasons and replaced quite well by Tamme and Eldridge. He's no longer indespensable and could be worth a first and/or second round pick. Let him go.

What most people don't realize is that the Colts are going to HAVE to acquire at least 2 more QBs. Everyone knows Painter is not the answer, and Manning, if he's healthy, will only be around another couple of years. Even if the Colts take Luck they're still going to need a viable backup. Orlovsky may stay, but not for long. The Colts have a history of spending very little on backups. Some other team will come along and offer him much more money. He'll be gone in a year or two. The Colts will be right back in the same situation they're in now.

So, instead of trading Luck, or the first pick in the draft, for a bunch of picks, I think the Colts should draft Luck, and then start letting go of the guys who they have workable replacements for, and start building up a warchest of draft picks ala the Patriots.

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