Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#267 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
No, my logic is, I fail to see why I should have a lower standard of healthcare just so someone can have better healthcare. My logic is that my healthcare is not less important than someone elseís healthcare and they have a lot of nerve if they want me to be worse off, just so they can be better off, without lifting a finger.
I also think the government should focus on making healthcare more affordable, rather than simply taking money from some and giving it to others to buy it for them, which is nothing more than cost shifting. If the government took all your assets and gave them to me so that I could buy a Ferrari, that still doesnít make the Ferrari and affordable car or as affordable as say a Ford. Calling that act the ďAffordable Care ActĒ is actually a misnomer. It does almost nothing to make healthcare more affordable at a national level. It simply shifts costs. If they put 10% of the effort into fixing a system that has us pay way more for pharmaceutical drugs than folks do in other nations for the same drugs, as they did into enacting that the ACA, that alone would have saved everyone a ton of money and everyone would have been commending Obama and the democrats.
My logic is also if you set yourself up to be a walmart greeter or a cashier and expect to be paid like a highly skilled worker and expect to receive benefits commensurate with a highly skilled worker, such as an engineer, tradesman, or college graduate, you are quite foolish and you really only have yourself to blame when you find out that walmart greeters and cashiers donít command that level of salary and benefits. Iíd also ask what rock you had been living under for the 18 years before you became an adult, when you should have been thinking about your future. If you thought you could raise a family in that line of work, Iíd say you are downright delusional, should not have had any children, and were irresponsible if you did. Why do folks feel they can have kids they canít afford and expect society to pay for what is really their responsibility? Isnít that irresponsible? Am I missing something?
I also think there are two types of people Ö those who look within when they want to improve their life and those who look at others and expect others to give them stuff when they want to improve their life. While there are no hard and fast rules (hence Iím not talking about ďanyoneĒ or ďeveryoneĒ as you understood) and sometimes bad things happen to good people (thatís the minority, however Ö the vast minority Ö the vast majority who find themselves in need of continuous need of government support mindlessly go through life not thinking about their future or putting in the effort to set themselves up for a good future Ö theyíve abrogated that responsibility), itís this dichotomy of thought process that largely explains why some people achieve and others do not.
We need more achievers in our society and less takers. By rewarding takers with an ever increasing level of handouts, demanding less and less accountability, cost shifting the consequences of poor decision making, punishing achievers by making them pay for more and more handouts for the takers, you incentivize being a taker and disincentivize being an achiever. <<<< This is a fact Ö itís basic human nature Ö itís basic animal nature. Leave dog good out for a coyote and see how much it puts in the effort to go hunt game on its own? A lot of folks are no different. You need to be mindful of this aspect wh
I think you're logic is so flawed I don't know where to start.

I'm not going to argue on the "afordable care act" b/c I
think it's so flawed it does little to help the ppl that really
need the help.

It is Immoral no to care about others.

It doesn't matter what argument you use to justify it.
B/c it still boils down to this: I want to be well cared
for and I don't give a rats ass about anyone else.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#268 Jun 27, 2013
*******affordable care act"*******

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#270 Jun 27, 2013
And your thinking throws ppl like me under
the bus. I did the right things in life.
Got a good education, worked a career, bought
a home, paid into the system.

Through no fault of my own I inherited an
illness that prevents me from working my
chosen career.

Not just me. Vets also get thrown under the
bus. So do the elderly.

I guess you could argue that soldiers should
expect to be seriously injured...thus they
shouldn't have enlisted.

The elderly should have planned better, saved
better, although if you've been living in
the same economy that I've grown up in you
have to realize how far out that sounds.

“I know where you are,”

Level 8

Since: Jun 08

Right here under my thumb

#271 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>Also, you are flat out wrong that whites begrudge civil rights. I don't know any white folks who think folks of other skin colors should be treated other than equally.
You should venture more than 2.5 miles from your house every now and then. Pay a visit to Georgia, Mississippi, Louisiana, North Carolina and Texas. There is no such thing as civil rights in the SE. I've been there, I know - I've seen it firsthand. Better yet, ask one of our fine Offbeat members that live in the SE like Bex - she's seen it - she knows.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#272 Jun 27, 2013
arctic wrote:
And as for women....?
We still make less money, on average,
for the same work.
So the statistics say.
There are all kinds of reasons that have nothing to do with discrimination in terms of why women make less than men. I can't stress this enough:

http://online.wsj.com/article/SB1000142405270...

Even in Sweden and Iceland, women make less then men and they are very pro-family and progressive. I think a lot of it has to do with the rolls men and women take on at the family level.

As that article says, even womens lib activists acknowledge it. Their solution is:

ďFirst is that fathers should take equal responsibility for child care. After all, while men have tripled the number of hours they're in charge of the kids since 1970, women still put in more hours on the domestic front.Ē

They can go fí themselves. My wife and I will decide OURSELVES how we allocate our responsibilities when it comes to kids, family and working, not some feminazi who only cares about money and pay disparity. Our children, their wellbeing, and what arrangement we feel is best for them and us as a whole is far more important to us than societal issues like pay disparity and whether our decisions contribute to it.

To some women, making money isnít their primary goal in life. My wife is very much interested in being a mom, not blazing a trail when it comes to her career. Me, Iím very much interested in being a dad, but Iím the primary bread winner and advancing in my career is very important to me, my wife, and my family. I would say this dichotomy is not uncommon and it alone largely explains pay much of the disparity in pay. Another example is that we would be more likely to move across the country for a better paying job for me, than we would if my wife could get a better paying job across the country.

There is no doubt that there is still discrimination AND THAT IS WRONG and should not be tolerated, but itís not the huge problem folks make it out to be, IMO.

“I know where you are,”

Level 8

Since: Jun 08

Right here under my thumb

#273 Jun 27, 2013
And speaking of civil rights...

The US Supreme Court struck down a key part of the Voting Rights Act on Tuesday in a ruling denounced as a setback for civil rights.

Wow!!!

Go figure - 8 white people and one token black guy.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#274 Jun 27, 2013
arctic wrote:
<quoted text>
I think you're logic is so flawed I don't know where to start.
I'm not going to argue on the "afordable care act" b/c I
think it's so flawed it does little to help the ppl that really
need the help.
It is Immoral no to care about others.
It doesn't matter what argument you use to justify it.
B/c it still boils down to this: I want to be well cared
for and I don't give a rats ass about anyone else.
I didnít say I donít give a rats ass about anyone else. I think we need to do more to make it more affordable and I think we need to do more to address the root causes of poverty. Giving folks money and caring for them like they are children does nothing to address the root causes of poverty. If the past 50 years have shown, itís only made it worse. Itís not an easy problem to solve, since it is largely influenced by values on a cultural level and a family level.

Iíd also say those who want handouts from others are the ones who have the ďI donít give a rats ass about anyone Ö just give me my free shyte Ö Iím entitled to itĒ attitude. I guess you are okay with this attitude when someone wants free stuff.

I also do believe in charity, but I think largely, the only innocent victims are children. I also think only by focusing on them and whatís best for them will you ever stop the cycle of poverty. The rest of these social programs donít do much to fix the causes of poverty. They just mask it. Donít you see that? We should strive to do better and actually focus our efforts on the root causes of poverty.

I liken your solutions as focusing too much on giving food to folks in Africa who are starving, rather than teaching family planning, sustainable farming, and the need for environmental protection. Giving food is easy, but it doesn't solve the problem and the things that actually would solve the problem are much more difficult to do, but they are doable if we try. We don't try that here, because in this context it would require effort on everyone's part, and let's be honest, a lot of folks don't want to put in the effort. They just want their shyte.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#275 Jun 27, 2013
milwaukee69 wrote:
And speaking of civil rights...
The US Supreme Court struck down a key part of the Voting Rights Act on Tuesday in a ruling denounced as a setback for civil rights.
Wow!!!
Go figure - 8 white people and one token black guy.
Sure they did.

B/c they say it's not needed anymore.

Go figure.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#276 Jun 27, 2013
milwaukee69 wrote:
And speaking of civil rights...
The US Supreme Court struck down a key part of the Voting Rights Act on Tuesday in a ruling denounced as a setback for civil rights.
Wow!!!
Go figure - 8 white people and one token black guy.
The most important aspect of the decision it that it will allows southern states to jerrymander, just like northern states jerrymander. It happens everywhere. Northern states controlled by dems, jerrymander to split up republican constituencies and make it harder for districts to elect republicans because they redraw the lines as much as possible to prevent districts from having a majority of republican constituents.

The law prevented southerns from doing the same thing when it came to blacks, which is kind of unfair. Seeing as how they vote 90% democrat ... their districts were largely immune from being jerrymandered, which is b.s. If I'm white, my district can be jerrymandered, but if I'm a black democrat in the south in a district that is majority black, it can't! It's not even about discrimination because they are black ... it's about weakening the democrat party and this stuff happens to both republicans and democrats in every state.

I fail to see how treating blacks in the south as some special class that this can't happen to is some how fair and equal?

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#277 Jun 27, 2013
milwaukee69 wrote:
<quoted text>
You should venture more than 2.5 miles from your house every now and then. Pay a visit to Georgia, Mississippi, Louisiana, North Carolina and Texas. There is no such thing as civil rights in the SE. I've been there, I know - I've seen it firsthand. Better yet, ask one of our fine Offbeat members that live in the SE like Bex - she's seen it - she knows.
You think I would be loved in the ghetto?

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#278 Jun 27, 2013
arctic wrote:
And your thinking throws ppl like me under
the bus. I did the right things in life.
Got a good education, worked a career, bought
a home, paid into the system.
Through no fault of my own I inherited an
illness that prevents me from working my
chosen career.
Not just me. Vets also get thrown under the
bus. So do the elderly.
I guess you could argue that soldiers should
expect to be seriously injured...thus they
shouldn't have enlisted.
The elderly should have planned better, saved
better, although if you've been living in
the same economy that I've grown up in you
have to realize how far out that sounds.
There is already SSI disability for those who cannot work because they are disabled and if you qualify for that, you most likely qualify for Medicaid.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#279 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I didnít say I donít give a rats ass about anyone else. I think we need to do more to make it more affordable and I think we need to do more to address the root causes of poverty. Giving folks money and caring for them like they are children does nothing to address the root causes of poverty. If the past 50 years have shown, itís only made it worse. Itís not an easy problem to solve, since it is largely influenced by values on a cultural level and a family level.
Iíd also say those who want handouts from others are the ones who have the ďI donít give a rats ass about anyone Ö just give me my free shyte Ö Iím entitled to itĒ attitude. I guess you are okay with this attitude when someone wants free stuff.
I also do believe in charity, but I think largely, the only innocent victims are children. I also think only by focusing on them and whatís best for them will you ever stop the cycle of poverty. The rest of these social programs donít do much to fix the causes of poverty. They just mask it. Donít you see that? We should strive to do better and actually focus our efforts on the root causes of poverty.
I liken your solutions as focusing too much on giving food to folks in Africa who are starving, rather than teaching family planning, sustainable farming, and the need for environmental protection. Giving food is easy, but it doesn't solve the problem and the things that actually would solve the problem are much more difficult to do, but they are doable if we try. We don't try that here, because in this context it would require effort on everyone's part, and let's be honest, a lot of folks don't want to put in the effort. They just want their shyte.
You completely misunderstand me.
When I talk about caring for the sick why
does that equate to a "hand out" to you?

"Hand out" is just one of the new catch
phrases.

I don't believe in hand outs. I believe
in giving a hand up. Pull ppl out of the
hole they are in. However, oft times the
"hole they are in" is directly caused by
this system of government.

Allowing the filthy rich to hold the reins
on this country is, and always has been, wrong.

You can't complain about giving "hand outs"
when you're only focusing on ppl in poverty.
The government gives more "hand outs" to companies
like GE and Exxon.
I'd rather my hard earned tax dollars go to poor
ppl than billion dollar companies. Making the rich
yet richer and leaving the poor to languish in
squalor.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#280 Jun 27, 2013
milwaukee69 wrote:
<quoted text>
You should venture more than 2.5 miles from your house every now and then. Pay a visit to Georgia, Mississippi, Louisiana, North Carolina and Texas. There is no such thing as civil rights in the SE. I've been there, I know - I've seen it firsthand. Better yet, ask one of our fine Offbeat members that live in the SE like Bex - she's seen it - she knows.
I live in NC, too. There are a lot more black folks down here than up north too. Their numbers alone assure them more political power.

It's a lot more multi-cultural down here, than up north. My kids go to school with far more black kids than if they were up north. My good friend lives in a mixed neighborhood and his neighbor who he is good friends and who we ride with sometimes is black and his wife was raised as redneck as they come (when I first met her ... she pulled out her picture book and said this is a photo of my first squirrel). I've been to more parties with black folks than ever up north. Not everyone down here is racist.

Also not everything is racism. We were down in Myrtle talking during bike week and they were telling me "black bike week" is really bad and some of the hotels even shut down. I thought to myself that seems rather racist that hotels would shut down and said as much. They said, no, it's bad ... even their neighbors (the black couple) won't go to it and the wife said it's too thuggish. If a white person said that, they'd be racist.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#281 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
The most important aspect of the decision it that it will allows southern states to jerrymander, just like northern states jerrymander. It happens everywhere. Northern states controlled by dems, jerrymander to split up republican constituencies and make it harder for districts to elect republicans because they redraw the lines as much as possible to prevent districts from having a majority of republican constituents.
The law prevented southerns from doing the same thing when it came to blacks, which is kind of unfair. Seeing as how they vote 90% democrat ... their districts were largely immune from being jerrymandered, which is b.s. If I'm white, my district can be jerrymandered, but if I'm a black democrat in the south in a district that is majority black, it can't! It's not even about discrimination because they are black ... it's about weakening the democrat party and this stuff happens to both republicans and democrats in every state.
I fail to see how treating blacks in the south as some special class that this can't happen to is some how fair and equal?
gerrymander, not jerrymander <face palm>

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#282 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I live in NC, too. There are a lot more black folks down here than up north too. Their numbers alone assure them more political power.
It's a lot more multi-cultural down here, than up north. My kids go to school with far more black kids than if they were up north. My good friend lives in a mixed neighborhood and his neighbor who he is good friends and who we ride with sometimes is black and his wife was raised as redneck as they come (when I first met her ... she pulled out her picture book and said this is a photo of my first squirrel). I've been to more parties with black folks than ever up north. Not everyone down here is racist.
Also not everything is racism. We were down in Myrtle talking during bike week and they were telling me "black bike week" is really bad and some of the hotels even shut down. I thought to myself that seems rather racist that hotels would shut down and said as much. They said, no, it's bad ... even their neighbors (the black couple) won't go to it and the wife said it's too thuggish. If a white person said that, they'd be racist.
You don't think that the Adamant refusal of
congress to do Anything while Obama is president
has nothing to do w/racism?

I've heard that argument from many ppl but I
don't believe it. By going against the very ppl
that voted them into office they are committing
political suicide.

I'm just trying to figure out if they are punishing
Obama for getting in or the American public for
voting him in.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#283 Jun 27, 2013
I grew up not realizing what a real
problem racism is in the world.

I was literally shocked to find out,
in my teens, that Jews were still
discriminated against....anywhere in
the world.

It just wasn't part of our world.

I can remember going home from school
(middle school) crying b/c I had witnessed
a "white" boy attacking a boy of mixed
race. The bully was yelling your dad
is a n*****. I was shocked, horrified.

If That incident shocked me think how
I felt when I got out into the world
myself and started seeing it over and over.

And the "white" ppl going around saying
"We aren't the only ones that are bigots"

Well....nah, "whites" are not the only
ones who are bigots but African/Americans
never enslaved the white race, they never
stopped "whites" from voting, marrying
who they chose, ect....
Look at the case of ....was it Love vs
Virginia..or Loven?
"White" guy and "black" woman.
It was Still illegal for them to marry
right into the late '60.
They were jailed for it.

How long did it take Mississippi to get
that retarded law off the books?
If I remember correctly it was in the
'80s.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#284 Jun 27, 2013
I hate using the words "black" and
"white" b/c of the connotations that
go w/those words.

“I know where you are,”

Level 8

Since: Jun 08

Right here under my thumb

#285 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I live in NC, too. There are a lot more black folks down here than up north too. Their numbers alone assure them more political power.
It's a lot more multi-cultural down here, than up north. My kids go to school with far more black kids than if they were up north. My good friend lives in a mixed neighborhood and his neighbor who he is good friends and who we ride with sometimes is black and his wife was raised as redneck as they come (when I first met her ... she pulled out her picture book and said this is a photo of my first squirrel). I've been to more parties with black folks than ever up north. Not everyone down here is racist.
Also not everything is racism. We were down in Myrtle talking during bike week and they were telling me "black bike week" is really bad and some of the hotels even shut down. I thought to myself that seems rather racist that hotels would shut down and said as much. They said, no, it's bad ... even their neighbors (the black couple) won't go to it and the wife said it's too thuggish. If a white person said that, they'd be racist.
I'm talking about a Confederate flag decal on a school bus in Georgia. I'm talking about the University of the South. I'm talking about establishments that still don't allow blacks to frequent them in Mississippi. I'm talking about the SB's in Lousisiana that still display their KKK decals in their car window. I'm talking about racism - it is still alive and well in the Southeast. Just not blacks - the holier-than-thou, almighty SB's have now included Hispanics and Muslims on their hate map.

Make no bones about it - racism exists exclusively in every corner of the United States.

Level 8

Since: Aug 08

Location hidden

#286 Jun 27, 2013
arctic wrote:
<quoted text>
You don't think that the Adamant refusal of
congress to do Anything while Obama is president
has nothing to do w/racism?
I've heard that argument from many ppl but I
don't believe it. By going against the very ppl
that voted them into office they are committing
political suicide.
I'm just trying to figure out if they are punishing
Obama for getting in or the American public for
voting him in.
I don't think it has anything to do with racism.

I think they don't like his policies. I think he also set the tone with how he handled Obamacare and said it's their turn to ride in the back [of the bus]. You can't kick sand in someone's face and then claim they don't like you cause they are racist.

Level 9

Since: Nov 10

Powellton WV

#287 Jun 27, 2013
Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think it has anything to do with racism.
I think they don't like his policies. I think he also set the tone with how he handled Obamacare and said it's their turn to ride in the back [of the bus]. You can't kick sand in someone's face and then claim they don't like you cause they are racist.
How is Obama, in any way, worse than Bush?

They went along w/him even when they knew
he was dead wrong.

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