NO DEAL! Who's to Fault

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“A *wink* and a smile!!”

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#185
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Rider on the Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
Everyone is going to be audited, and then based on those findings they are going to tell you what you should purchase.
Remember Obamacare is suppose to create thousands of jobs, IRS jobs.
Lets also remember that government sets povety levels very low. But in any case if they say you cant afford it the government pays for it. If they say you can afford it you pay for it or you pay the fine. From what I understand is the fine is typically lower then the insurance costs.
In fact I heard the fine is ridiculously low. But it can increase based on your income. I may be wrong here but I believe its based on 2% of your income.
If you make 35 large your fine is $700.00
Again like I said I think there will be many changes to Obamacare..

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#186
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Rider on the Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
That was the selling point.........It was suppose to bring costs down. When it didnt it was changed to: It will contain increases and slow them down. Well it hasnt and the reason it hasnt is because preexisting conditions is going to cost Insurers big dollars. I have to assume these 25% increases per year are for that reason. I think the BIG jump is up ahead probably in 2014..........Then it may start to level off.
I didnt mention the decrease in coverage and the changes in deductibles..........
There's also the fact that people under the age of 30 rarely use their health care coverage plans, even though they religeously pay the premiums every month.

I think the main scare for everyone is that the system forces them to get healthcare insurance. That in itself is a Catch-22 since not having health insurance is risky and dangerous. But your freedom of choice is paramount. Ask anybody in the hospital business - they'll tell you that most cities are even lucky to have a hospital nowadays. If it weren't for private donations, most hospitals would'nt be able to stay open. Obamacare is a gamble, for sure - but without that gamblewe'd have a hard time keeping pace with medical costs.

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#187
Jan 4, 2013
 

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milwaukee69 wrote:
<quoted text>
Supplying those under the poverty level government-paid health care will actually save everybody money. It'll insure that medical bills are (finally) paid off, hospitals will start operating in the black and it'll be a much more fluid system, IMHO.
It would only work (IMO) if insurance paid 100 percent of the medical bill. I know of no insurance that pays 100 percent. Thus, John Q. Taxpayer will be stuck paying premiums, and the tab that insurance doesn't pay.

“So it's not you, It's them?”

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#188
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Since when is using official statistics from the Congressional Budget Office, which is a non-partisan federal agency, nothing more than ďinsight[ing]Ē[sic] panic? Really, thatís your rebuttal? Are they lying? Do you know better than they? Did they teach you all about the federal budget in your Iím sure very rigorous weekend class to become a real estate agent, such that you know more than they know, lol? You obviously canít rebut what I have said. So you just say Iím ďinsight[ing]Ē[sic] panic.
Those of us without their head in the clouds would call it using official government statistics and facts.
What about this Ö this is a clip of Geithner from CSPAN using Obamaís own numbers and it unequivocally shows starting in 2021 we are fíd big time:
http://www.youtube.com/watch...
Youíd earn more credibility I think with the group if you acknowledged that we have serious debt problems and need to do something about them instead of just shrugging them off as if what I am saying has no merit. I can even get on board with folks saying that right now, we need to hold off on drastic spending cuts because of the state of the economy, but need to get on them very soon. I canít get on board with someone such as you pretending there is no problem and pretending Iím just making stuff up....EDITED FOR LENGTH
You okay, dude? I've read some of your priors and you didn't seem to be quite this bummed before and I'd also not seen a lot of personal attacks from you on posters with different POVs on other issues.

What's changed, bud? You voted for Obama and he hasn't managed to contain the overspending, the inefficiency, the ineffectiveness and expansion that's been baked into the U. S. budget since Reagan.

So where have you been the last 40+ years? I applaud your recent awakening / realization that our government and representatives are not necessarily trying much to represent any of us. Shame on them!

I've also noticed you seem unaware of the impact that the decisions to carry 2 wars off-book, while passing Medicare Part D and cutting everyone's taxes, while pandering to the DOD has had on our deficit.

I've always thought it ironic that the guy who used the term "fuzzy math", made the intellectually and morally dishonest decision to use what can only be called "fuzzy math" by carrying 2 wars off-book.

How could we expect a good result after using questionable accounting practices and our refusal, for the first time in our history, to not raise taxes at a time of war, as a "shared sacrifice" for all of us?

The ensuing backlash, had President McCain immediately bailed on Iraq and Afghanistan and cancelled Part D would have been interesting to observe. Do you actually think he would would have done that? LOL

If you believe President Romney would have made these bold political moves, you have a much higher opinion of him than I do. Is he a bad guy? No, but he doesn't strike me as being a political free-thinker.

I'm always entertained by folks who must blame the POTUS for all the dysfunction, all the out-of-control spending and all the current deficits, without blaming the prior POTUS and prior representatives.

By all appearances, you seem to be a guy with buyer's remorse (since, after all, you voted for Obama at least once) and seem to now be bordering on clinical depression. There's help for that out there!

The answer to the thread topic is everybody's to blame! The DEMS, REPs, INDIEs, the POTUS and every prior POTUS. Am I comfortable with the political system? NO! Do I just blame BO? Are you kidding me?

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#189
Jan 4, 2013
 
65007noogard wrote:
<quoted text>
It would only work (IMO) if insurance paid 100 percent of the medical bill. I know of no insurance that pays 100 percent. Thus, John Q. Taxpayer will be stuck paying premiums, and the tab that insurance doesn't pay.
They're called deductables - been around for what? 200 years?

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#190
Jan 4, 2013
 
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>
You okay, dude? I've read some of your priors and you didn't seem to be quite this bummed before and I'd also not seen a lot of personal attacks from you on posters with different POVs on other issues.
What's changed, bud? You voted for Obama and he hasn't managed to contain the overspending, the inefficiency, the ineffectiveness and expansion that's been baked into the U. S. budget since Reagan.
So where have you been the last 40+ years? I applaud your recent awakening / realization that our government and representatives are not necessarily trying much to represent any of us. Shame on them!
I've also noticed you seem unaware of the impact that the decisions to carry 2 wars off-book, while passing Medicare Part D and cutting everyone's taxes, while pandering to the DOD has had on our deficit.
I've always thought it ironic that the guy who used the term "fuzzy math", made the intellectually and morally dishonest decision to use what can only be called "fuzzy math" by carrying 2 wars off-book.
How could we expect a good result after using questionable accounting practices and our refusal, for the first time in our history, to not raise taxes at a time of war, as a "shared sacrifice" for all of us?
The ensuing backlash, had President McCain immediately bailed on Iraq and Afghanistan and cancelled Part D would have been interesting to observe. Do you actually think he would would have done that? LOL
If you believe President Romney would have made these bold political moves, you have a much higher opinion of him than I do. Is he a bad guy? No, but he doesn't strike me as being a political free-thinker.
I'm always entertained by folks who must blame the POTUS for all the dysfunction, all the out-of-control spending and all the current deficits, without blaming the prior POTUS and prior representatives.
By all appearances, you seem to be a guy with buyer's remorse (since, after all, you voted for Obama at least once) and seem to now be bordering on clinical depression. There's help for that out there!
The answer to the thread topic is everybody's to blame! The DEMS, REPs, INDIEs, the POTUS and every prior POTUS. Am I comfortable with the political system? NO! Do I just blame BO? Are you kidding me?
***milwaukee69 jumping out of seat, bites edge of beer cup, starts applauding***

Where have you been for the last 6 months?

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#191
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>
You okay, dude? I've read some of your priors and you didn't seem to be quite this bummed before and I'd also not seen a lot of personal attacks from you on posters with different POVs on other issues.
What's changed, bud? You voted for Obama and he hasn't managed to contain the overspending, the inefficiency, the ineffectiveness and expansion that's been baked into the U. S. budget since Reagan.
So where have you been the last 40+ years? I applaud your recent awakening / realization that our government and representatives are not necessarily trying much to represent any of us. Shame on them!
I've also noticed you seem unaware of the impact that the decisions to carry 2 wars off-book, while passing Medicare Part D and cutting everyone's taxes, while pandering to the DOD has had on our deficit.
I've always thought it ironic that the guy who used the term "fuzzy math", made the intellectually and morally dishonest decision to use what can only be called "fuzzy math" by carrying 2 wars off-book.
How could we expect a good result after using questionable accounting practices and our refusal, for the first time in our history, to not raise taxes at a time of war, as a "shared sacrifice" for all of us?
The ensuing backlash, had President McCain immediately bailed on Iraq and Afghanistan and cancelled Part D would have been interesting to observe. Do you actually think he would would have done that? LOL
If you believe President Romney would have made these bold political moves, you have a much higher opinion of him than I do. Is he a bad guy? No, but he doesn't strike me as being a political free-thinker.
I'm always entertained by folks who must blame the POTUS for all the dysfunction, all the out-of-control spending and all the current deficits, without blaming the prior POTUS and prior representatives.
By all appearances, you seem to be a guy with buyer's remorse (since, after all, you voted for Obama at least once) and seem to now be bordering on clinical depression. There's help for that out there!
The answer to the thread topic is everybody's to blame! The DEMS, REPs, INDIEs, the POTUS and every prior POTUS. Am I comfortable with the political system? NO! Do I just blame BO? Are you kidding me?
Very well said!

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#192
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Ohio Cowgirl wrote:
<quoted text> What constitutes poor, there are the working poor.
Like I said I talk to a guy from England who said they have the same thing and it works well for them...
England has socialized medicine. It's completely different. A big problem with socialized medicine is long waits for specialists and lower quality of care. Itís well known:

http://www.nytimes.com/2007/08/12/opinion/12s...

So, while many folks argue for a single payer system, where the government pays all the costs, which would be socialized medicine, it would certainly reduce costs of healthcare, but overall quality of care would go down. WE have the highest quality of care for those who have insurance and we have higher survival rates for many diseases, but we pay A LOT for a high quality of care

The big draw back to our system is that not all adults (most kids are covered by welfare programs, however) have insurance, and many folks feel it is unjust. If we wanted to make caring for them a priority there are two ways we could address this. We could have a single payer system, where everyone is covered, but then everyone who already has insurance would receive a lower standard of care, which is a known problem with socialized medicine. Sorry, if my wife has cancer, I donít want her to wait to see a specialist just so someone can get free healthcare. Why should the quality of the healthcare that I currently work for and earn for me and my family go down just so that someone who doesnít earn and work for theirs can have better quality healthcare? Even leaving to one side whoís paying for it,(not them) is their life worth more than mine? I donít think so.

So many folks who currently have insurance do not want a single payer system, even though it would reduce costs and provide greater access. I am one of these folks for the reasons I mentioned above.

So what Obamacare does instead is it simply keeps the current system in place, which is very costly, and simply has other people pay for these folks to have insurance. If you have a flex spending account, like me, and would have put more than 2.5k into it this year, you essentially had a tax increase to pay for other people to get medical insurance. That hits a lot of middle class folks. There were also some taxes on the wealthy, which I think they can afford, but there is also a 3.9 percent tax on medical devices, which will simply be passed off onto everyone and thus make the cost of healthcare more expensive for everyone. On top of that, there were huge premium increases for a lot of folks, simply due to the law.

So, thatís what has happened. Regardless of how folks feel about it, itís kinda silly to call that act the ďAffordable Care Act,Ē(as I have said it really should be called the ďhaving other people pay for other peopleís insurance actĒ) given that it does almost nothing to make healthcare more affordable, except for the folks who are getting healthcare welfare under it. For everyone else, we will be paying more Ö much more as time goes on. And when Amnesty for illegals eventually happens, there are going to be a lot more folks getting free healthcare because of it and costs are going to go through the roof.

“Pillars of Creation....”

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#193
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Ohio Cowgirl wrote:
<quoted text> A weapon? Really?? lmao!
Words used as a club, you were trying to shut him up, put him in his place..........

Intimidation..........

I could have chose other words, but we both know thats hardly the point..........

Heres a word for ya.

Deflection..........

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The thing we have to consider is that we already promise the elderly and the disabled healthcare and SS. Those programs are not on a sustainable course. As it stands now, medicare will be completely exhausted by 2024, I believe. To the extent we provide Obamacare welfare to working age adults (I have no problem providing Medicaid to children Ö there is almost nothing I wonít do for children in need), we will have to make even bigger cuts to SS and Medicare. In a lot of ways, Obamacare was like making another slice in the pizza pie at the expense of making all the other slices smaller. It wonít be good for seniors, who IMO are far more vulnerable than working age folks.

Taxes will be going up for sure, but make no mistake, cuts are coming Ö itís just a question of where. So those getting free healthcare, should realize their gain is the loss of so many other needy people and the loss of many other families who are just struggling to get by themselves.

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#195
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Ohio Cowgirl wrote:
<quoted text> Again like I said I think there will be many changes to Obamacare..
Oh thats right, when they passed it they didnt even know what was in it. We'll have to wait and see..........
Doh!!!

I dont think its gonna turn out to well based on what we've seen so far........

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Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>
You okay, dude? I've read some of your priors and you didn't seem to be quite this bummed before and I'd also not seen a lot of personal attacks from you on posters with different POVs on other issues.
What's changed, bud? You voted for Obama and he hasn't managed to contain the overspending, the inefficiency, the ineffectiveness and expansion that's been baked into the U. S. budget since Reagan.
So where have you been the last 40+ years? I applaud your recent awakening / realization that our government and representatives are not necessarily trying much to represent any of us. Shame on them!
I've also noticed you seem unaware of the impact that the decisions to carry 2 wars off-book, while passing Medicare Part D and cutting everyone's taxes, while pandering to the DOD has had on our deficit.
I've always thought it ironic that the guy who used the term "fuzzy math", made the intellectually and morally dishonest decision to use what can only be called "fuzzy math" by carrying 2 wars off-book.
How could we expect a good result after using questionable accounting practices and our refusal, for the first time in our history, to not raise taxes at a time of war, as a "shared sacrifice" for all of us?
The ensuing backlash, had President McCain immediately bailed on Iraq and Afghanistan and cancelled Part D would have been interesting to observe. Do you actually think he would would have done that? LOL
If you believe President Romney would have made these bold political moves, you have a much higher opinion of him than I do. Is he a bad guy? No, but he doesn't strike me as being a political free-thinker.
I'm always entertained by folks who must blame the POTUS for all the dysfunction, all the out-of-control spending and all the current deficits, without blaming the prior POTUS and prior representatives.
By all appearances, you seem to be a guy with buyer's remorse (since, after all, you voted for Obama at least once) and seem to now be bordering on clinical depression. There's help for that out there!
The answer to the thread topic is everybody's to blame! The DEMS, REPs, INDIEs, the POTUS and every prior POTUS. Am I comfortable with the political system? NO! Do I just blame BO? Are you kidding me?
In terms of personal attacks, when someone repeatedly calls me Fox News, they kind of open themselves up to being given a virtual smack down. I know all too well how that term is brandished about. So donít play dumb, cause I wonít.

If you had read my posts you'd know that of the 6 trillion dollars in debt Obama incurred, only 600 billion is attributable to Bush's wars. So 10% of Obamaís debt is on Bush, fine, okay.

Also, if Obama wanted to correct Bushís mistake of not paying for the Part D, maybe he should have used the revenues raised to pay for Obamacare to pay for that instead. He doesnít get to complain that Bush did all these things that he didnít pay for, then increases taxes and not use them to pay for things that already werenít being paid for, but instead uses them for another massive entitlement program. Thatís not very Presidential to say, well the other guy did this and Iím not going to fix it. That doesnít help us. Thatís not good for the country.

BO is a big part of the problem. Poor leadership Ö stupid decisions Ö blame Bush ... refusal to fix what ails us (including the stuff he said Bush did and were bad for our country)Ö kick the can down the road and let someone else deal with it. Thatís his leadership style.

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Jan 4, 2013
 

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Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
In terms of personal attacks, when someone repeatedly calls me Fox News, they kind of open themselves up to being given a virtual smack down. I know all too well how that term is brandished about. So donít play dumb, cause I wonít.
If you had read my posts you'd know that of the 6 trillion dollars in debt Obama incurred, only 600 billion is attributable to Bush's wars. So 10% of Obamaís debt is on Bush, fine, okay.
Also, if Obama wanted to correct Bushís mistake of not paying for the Part D, maybe he should have used the revenues raised to pay for Obamacare to pay for that instead. He doesnít get to complain that Bush did all these things that he didnít pay for, then increases taxes and not use them to pay for things that already werenít being paid for, but instead uses them for another massive entitlement program. Thatís not very Presidential to say, well the other guy did this and Iím not going to fix it. That doesnít help us. Thatís not good for the country.
BO is a big part of the problem. Poor leadership Ö stupid decisions Ö blame Bush ... refusal to fix what ails us (including the stuff he said Bush did and were bad for our country)Ö kick the can down the road and let someone else deal with it. Thatís his leadership style.
Most of Barry's best moves were continuations of Bush policies..........

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#198
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
In terms of personal attacks, when someone repeatedly calls me Fox News, they kind of open themselves up to being given a virtual smack down. I know all too well how that term is brandished about. So donít play dumb, cause I wonít.
If you had read my posts you'd know that of the 6 trillion dollars in debt Obama incurred, only 600 billion is attributable to Bush's wars. So 10% of Obamaís debt is on Bush, fine, okay.
Also, if Obama wanted to correct Bushís mistake of not paying for the Part D, maybe he should have used the revenues raised to pay for Obamacare to pay for that instead. He doesnít get to complain that Bush did all these things that he didnít pay for, then increases taxes and not use them to pay for things that already werenít being paid for, but instead uses them for another massive entitlement program. Thatís not very Presidential to say, well the other guy did this and Iím not going to fix it. That doesnít help us. Thatís not good for the country.
BO is a big part of the problem. Poor leadership Ö stupid decisions Ö blame Bush ... refusal to fix what ails us (including the stuff he said Bush did and were bad for our country)Ö kick the can down the road and let someone else deal with it. Thatís his leadership style.
Congratulations! You made ChiliJ's post even better with this lame response.

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Sublime1 wrote:
<quoted text>
In terms of personal attacks, when someone repeatedly calls me Fox News, they kind of open themselves up to being given a virtual smack down. I know all too well how that term is brandished about. So donít play dumb, cause I wonít.
If you had read my posts you'd know that of the 6 trillion dollars in debt Obama incurred, only 600 billion is attributable to Bush's wars. So 10% of Obamaís debt is on Bush, fine, okay.
Also, if Obama wanted to correct Bushís mistake of not paying for the Part D, maybe he should have used the revenues raised to pay for Obamacare to pay for that instead. He doesnít get to complain that Bush did all these things that he didnít pay for, then increases taxes and not use them to pay for things that already werenít being paid for, but instead uses them for another massive entitlement program. Thatís not very Presidential to say, well the other guy did this and Iím not going to fix it. That doesnít help us. Thatís not good for the country.
BO is a big part of the problem. Poor leadership Ö stupid decisions Ö blame Bush ... refusal to fix what ails us (including the stuff he said Bush did and were bad for our country)Ö kick the can down the road and let someone else deal with it. Thatís his leadership style.
I noticed that you didn't specifically reply to most, if not all of the points in my prior. Instead, your reply contains generalities, for the most part. I understand from your priors you work hard and believe others take advantage of the taxes that you pay. Please tell us what field you now work in and what fields have you studied in?

I believe that we need to retool the budget process, gain increased efficiency, achieve higher effectiveness and get less duplication of services. Our government needs to do much better than it has to live within its means. So to earn my extra 4%, I expect DEMS and REPs to make adult, just, measured and thoughtful cuts to our expenditures.

If the POTUS and our representatives can't do that, I'll vote against each one that is up for reelection in 2014, 2016... I get it, as a former, fallen Obama supporter, you're angry. You helped elect the POTUS and you feel he let you down. So tell us: what did you expect him to do that he hasn't done and are your expectations reality-based?

A final note: while you probably don't care, in the adults' eyes here, you lose credibility as an honest broker when you call your POTUS juvenile names like O'Bummer. Adults have grownup discussions about things every day. The first guy who loses his cool, name-calls or otherwise confirms his emotions are ruling him loses the argument.

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Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>
I noticed that you didn't specifically reply to most, if not all of the points in my prior. Instead, your reply contains generalities, for the most part.

What points would you like me to specifically address? My post contained generalities? Oh really? And your post about how everyone is a bad guy and not only Obama and itís been that way for along time, wasnít speaking to generalities.

[QUOTE who="Chilli J"]<quoted text>I understand from your priors you work hard and believe others take advantage of the taxes that you pay.
It doesnít really matter what I feel on a personal level about folks who have allowed themselves to become wards of the state. The main point you should take away from my posts is that we canít afford all the handouts. The numbers donít lie. Absent significant spending cuts, the whole ship goes down starting in 2021. Even with tax increases (and Iím not talking about the ones they just passed Ö those are nothing compared to what is needed) unless you want to double everyoneís taxes.
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>Please tell us what field you now work in and what fields have you studied in?
Please explain to me why thatís relevant and Iíll consider it.
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>I believe that we need to retool the budget process, gain increased efficiency, achieve higher effectiveness and get less duplication of services.
You say ^^^ this and you accuse me of generalities in the same post? Thatís fíing awesome. Thanks for the laugh.

Weíve already gotten a lot of the low hanging fruit when it comes to savings. So as nice as it sounds, youíre not going to get to a balanced budget with this. Any economist who isnít a partisan hack acknowledges that unless we become China and our economy suddenly starts growing at 6-9 percent annually (donít hold your breath) we need some rather significant spending increases AND significant spending cuts. The level of debt cannot rise any faster than growth or else we go backwards and every year we have less and less to spend on programs and more to spend on interest.
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>Our government needs to do much better than it has to live within its means. So to earn my extra 4%, I expect DEMS and REPs to make adult, just, measured and thoughtful cuts to our expenditures.
I agree. I would be willing to pay thousands of more in taxes every year, but that doesnít get us out of our fiscal mess, without spending cuts. And when you look at the fact that 60% of our budget is on non-discretionary spending (i.e. entitlements), you really canít get there without cuts to those programs.

You may wonder why I despise obamacare so much Ö itís because I know that program will simply lead to more cuts to these other programs. You simply cannot get out of our debt problem without reforming them. Increased efficiency wonít get us there.

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#201
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Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>If the POTUS and our representatives can't do that, I'll vote against each one that is up for reelection in 2014, 2016...
Thatís exactly why I didnít vote for him the second time. Thatís exactly why I didnít vote for McCain the first time (that and Palin Ö she was just to scary dumb to be one step away from President)Ö after 8 years of Bush and the free for all in spending, worthless war in Iraq, Part D that wasnít paid for Ö I felt a message had to be sent to the republican party Ö that message was that many of us voting for them arenít the religious right and couldn't care less about their social agenda ... despise it and that wing of the party Ö and if they are always going to stick to their guns when it comes to the religious rightís agenda and merely talk a big game when it comes to fiscal conservatives agenda, fiscal conservatives such as myself wonít vote for them.
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>I get it, as a former, fallen Obama supporter, you're angry. You helped elect the POTUS and you feel he let you down.
As I said, I really felt I had no choice but to vote for him, especially after Palin was named VP and started doing stupid talk on talk shows about how sheís an expert on foreign policy because Putin flies over Alaska on his way to DC. She is dumber than a doorknob, and regardless of my views, someone such as her being that close to the Presidency would be a threat to our nation.
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>So tell us: what did you expect him to do that he hasn't done and are your expectations reality-based?

So as not to inundate you, why donít we just start with Obamacare. Just watch this video and tell me where this guy guyís observations are off the mark. I donít know much about the guy, but he doesnít seem like a neocon or a republican hack. He seems very moderate and on point and he says he can even understand Obama not abiding by everything he said in his campaign Ö pay particular attention to what he said about big pharma when campaigning and what he actually did:

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

And if you arenít going to take the time to watch things I post or read them or address what they say (like many on here do when I have these sorts of debates), just tell me now and we can end the discussion, because itís pointless. Iím not republican hack or here to show myself how right I am. It takes time and effort to inform, and I donít like my time to be wasted.

[QUOTE who="Chilli J"]<quoted text>A final note: while you probably don't care, in the adults' eyes here, you lose credibility as an honest broker when you call your POTUS juvenile names like O'Bummer. Adults have grownup discussions about things every day. The first guy who loses his cool, name-calls or otherwise confirms his emotions are ruling him loses the argument.
I canít call the POTUS Oídummy, but your buddy Ferrerman can use terms such as Rmoney and teabaggers? Seems to me the so called adults are very selective about who loses credibility, which basically means there thoughts on the matter have no credibility in the first place to lose, when it comes to me...

“Licensed to Ill”

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#202
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Ferrerman wrote:
<quoted text>Congratulations! You made ChiliJ's post even better with this lame response.
Oh look, the peanut gallery showed up.

You're not biased or anything, are you? <rolls eyes>

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The most important part of my post 201 got f'd up, so I will repeated it below:
Chilli J wrote:
<quoted text>So tell us: what did you expect him to do that he hasn't done and are your expectations reality-based?
So as not to inundate you, why donít we just start with Obamacare. Just watch this video and tell me where this guy guyís observations are off the mark. I donít know much about the guy, but he doesnít seem like a neocon or a republican hack. He seems very moderate and on point and he says he can even understand Obama not abiding by everything he said in his campaign Ö pay particular attention to what he said about big pharma when campaigning and what he actually did:

http://www.youtube.com/watch...

And if you arenít going to take the time to watch things I post or read them or address what they say (like many on here do when I have these sorts of debates), just tell me now and we can end the discussion, because itís pointless. Iím not republican hack or here to show myself how right I am. It takes time and effort to inform, and I donít like my time to be wasted.

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#204
Jan 4, 2013
 

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Rider on the Storm wrote:
<quoted text>
Most of Barry's best moves were continuations of Bush policies..........
I know, and I didn't like most of them.

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