Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.
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106,081 - 106,100 of 115,251 Comments Last updated 11 min ago
THE LONE WORKER

Madison, TN

#111911 Apr 23, 2014
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Eating of the tree of knowledge means becoming aware - of actions and consequences, of the past and future, and of the meaning of death. Thus death has always existed, but once we achieved a certain level of consciousness, we were the only creature to really understand what it means. We lost our innocence, we left the "garden of eden".
Allegorically, its a great poetic expression of the sense both of an individual growing up and of a species developing true self awareness and conscious understanding.
As a literal creation theory, its ridiculous. And as a representation of God its pitifully small minded, clearly the work of primitive goatherds representing The Creator as some petty little tyrant who gets "angry", "jealous", and "regretful", not to mention so spiteful He kills nearly every living thing even while knowing its not going to solve anything.
What a joke that there are still people who take this seriously as anything other than a creation myth.
This is what happened , and it really doesn't matter who thinks it is a myth. The Bible is true and it says our Creator is our father in heaven who has the kingdom and the power forever. The disobedience was the thing that brought death into the picture, as far as I can understand this. The good news is that God so LOVED us that he sent his only begotten Son into the world so that we can inherit a better life than this one on this earth.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111912 Apr 23, 2014
MrBob Jones wrote:
Well idk theres been many christian scientists, and you've obviously been sitting on your ass alot longer, as this is my fourth post compared to your 50th, and because you spoke in past tense, when you said "have been teachers",says alot. Thanks
There's no such thing as a Christian scientist. There IS such a thing as scientists who are Christian, but none of them have made creationism pass the scientific method.
MrBob Jones wrote:
What did you mean you freaking morons i did not say I'm a creationists and its not solid it honestly is full of holes you can chose to believe it i dont care but take time to look at all the possible holes instead of only focussing on the solid stuff
Evolution doesn't have the holes you think it has. There is the opinion of the science community, who accept that there is no scientific controversy over evolution. And then there's the opinions of liars for Jesus who were refuted decades ago, but even today keep repeating their lies to a gullible public audience who want to hear that they're going to heaven and don't give a crud about science.

Remember, we don't need to believe because we have evidence.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#111913 Apr 23, 2014
thulium wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you're getting into Higgs Boson, the God Particle. lol
Actually what we can demonstrate in a lab is matter creating artificial light. I have not heard of a type of light creating matter, only converting matter into another form. Don't worry, I use my imaginations for something useful. And I just enrolled in Physics class in Mechanics and Wave and I know this is an Evolution forum so perhaps it would not help answer my questions.
Look at matter/anti-matter pair production. Light does create matter.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#111914 Apr 23, 2014
thulium wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you're getting into Higgs Boson, the God Particle. lol
Actually not. The Higgs is another aspect of things dealing with *mass*, not *matter*. Not all matter has mass and not everything with mass is considered matter. And the Higgs mechanism is not the only way mass arises: in fact most ordinary matter does not get its mass in this way; only the very heavy quarks and leptons do.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111915 Apr 23, 2014
SevenTee wrote:
OK DUDE
Name every single species
No need. No-one on the entire planet can do that.
SevenTee wrote:
and cite the fossil record (where it was found and where it is stored)
I can give you the names of a whole bunch with linkys to many more, but if you're interested in where they were found and stored you can do that yourself just by looking at the names. Not that storage has any bearing on any of this in the slightest.
SevenTee wrote:
going back to the beginning of time
Again, no need even to go anywhere NEAR that far. But I understand your need for rhetoric in order for you to avoid evidence by merely proclaiming I haven't capitulated to your baseless uneducated demands. After all, no matter what I present it's not like you have the ability to even discuss it, much less refute the subject.(shrug)
SevenTee wrote:
that demonstrates without a shadow of doubt that man "evolved" from a man-ape form.
Okay - your mom and dad.

They ARE apes you bozo.

See, all I need to do is go back just ONE generation to validate my position. All because you don't have the slightest education on the subject you speak of.
SevenTee wrote:
Do not skip any section of time
I don't give a crud about your demands, all I need to do is provide enough evidence beyond reasonable doubt that you are unable to refute.

Of course keep in mind we've all already done that for you.

MULTIPLE times over.

For YEARS.

And we're STILL waiting for just ONE fundie to address it.
SevenTee wrote:
and cite multiple sources for each phase.
No problem, just need to post the same thing I always do.

http://www.topix.com/forum/news/evolution/T9Q...

You've never been able to deal with it before, you won't now. Darwin got famous not for being the anti-Christ, but because he came up with scientific ideas which made successful predictions. He himself said there was a lack of transitional fossils in his day, but today the situation is VERY different. And those fossils ALONE demonstrate that. Bear in mind also that there are OTHER lines of evidence which also converge, which show that the hypothesis of common ancestry works. Of course all we need is just ONE line of evidence, but the fact we HAVE the rest is just a juicy bonus that you fundies could only dream about. Now they turn up in your nightmares. It just so happens that your nightmares are real.(shrug)
SevenTee wrote:
Good Luck
Not necessary.
SevenTee wrote:
BTW I know you can not even come close so just say "I Give Up" I accept Evolution on Faith in my 6 grade Science teacher
Notice that I did not. And notice that I also pointed out other lines of investigation which also pass the scientific method that I haven't even NEEDED to mention yet. You won't refute them either, but then you can't even refute this. So seems you "know" diddly squat. So since I DO know that you can't even come close just say "I give up" and accept that you reject evolution based on your faith that the Flinstones is a science documentary.(shrug)

Or alternatively, just provide even ONE piece of evidence which passes that scientific method that demonstrates the existence of invisible Jew wizards.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111916 Apr 23, 2014
MrBob jones wrote:
<quoted text>
That youve honestly been on this site alot longer just sitting around on the computer and i am actually a pshycologist
Since you can't even spell it something tells me you're actually our young homeschooled pal from a few weeks back. As we well know creationists have a bad habit of lying for Jesus (STILL waiting for an apology of SevenTee from when he got caught quotemining) but some also try pretending to be doctors or scientists or some other well-to-do authority so they can pretend to know more about something they don't even know.

Of course it doesn't matter even if they ARE real scientists. All that matters is what they know and what they can demonstrate. That's why very few genuine scientists have ever come here to make a fool of themselves on some random public website to argue against biology. Any who would would likely already be known as a crank.(shrug)

In short, Dr Bob, psychology doesn't make you an expert in biology.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111917 Apr 23, 2014
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
here Dude,..answer the question
No problem. If cosmology was as much of a problem for biology as you said it would you could never have been born.

There, that was easy wasn't it?(shrug)

I mean, the SLoT, Bo? Srsly? Even other YEC's know not to use that one.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111918 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>This happens because of what God said when he was angry with Adam and his wife. Death and disorder are in existence because of man. Actually all of creation was affected because of this. Read GENESIS 3:17&18&19 And unto Adam he said, Because thou hast hearkened unto the voice of thy wife, and hast eaten of the tree, of which I commanded thee, saying, Thou shalt not eat of it: cursed is the ground for thy sake; in sorrow shalt thou eat of it all the days of thy life; Thorns also and thistles shall it bring forth to thee; and thou shalt eat the herb of the field; In the sweat of thy face shalt thou eat bread, till thou return unto the ground; for out of it wast thou taken: for dust thou art, and unto dust shalt thou return.
Ah, so that conflicts with Bo's assertion that there was "order" at the beginning of the arrow of time then. As according to your model there was high entropy at the beginning, then God made it all groovy, then he's gonna let it all slide again back into another state of high entropy.

See, this is what happens to you fundies when you attempt to prove magic Jews with "scientific evidence".

“Up with which, I will not put”

Since: Jul 08

Sao Paulo

#111919 Apr 23, 2014
thulium wrote:
<quoted text>
So now you're getting into Higgs Boson, the God Particle. lol
Actually what we can demonstrate in a lab is matter creating artificial light. I have not heard of a type of light creating matter, only converting matter into another form. Don't worry, I use my imaginations for something useful. And I just enrolled in Physics class in Mechanics and Wave and I know this is an Evolution forum so perhaps it would not help answer my questions.
So you've read a bit of Lederman and you want to drag the "God Particle" to your defense? Matter in the beginning of time came from Gamma ray photons and heat.

"Artificial light"? Whaa?

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#111920 Apr 23, 2014
MrBob jones wrote:
<quoted text>
That youve honestly been on this site alot longer just sitting around on the computer...
My current position and my consulting business requires me to be on a computer most of the day. Topix just breaks up the boredom.
MrBob jones wrote:
...and i am actually a pshycologist
Odd then that you can't even spell the word.

“Up with which, I will not put”

Since: Jul 08

Sao Paulo

#111921 Apr 23, 2014
DanFromSmithville wrote:
<quoted text>What's the matter. Trouble reading English or just too stupid to understand how you were caught in a lie.
Oh, that is right there are just droves of people from Red Deer, Canada suddenly posting on this forum.
And all with the same grammar skills.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

#111922 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>This is what happened , and it really doesn't matter who thinks it is a myth. The Bible is true and it says our Creator is our father in heaven who has the kingdom and the power forever. The disobedience was the thing that brought death into the picture, as far as I can understand this. The good news is that God so LOVED us that he sent his only begotten Son into the world so that we can inherit a better life than this one on this earth.
On one hand we have an old book of dubious origin that even contradicts itself in many places. It claims the world is about 6000 years old, Adam and Eve and all the animals were separately created, death did not exist, and the Earth was created before the stars, and there was a global flood about 4500 years ago.

NONE of these claims remotely matches the combined observations of thousands of scientists over centuries, each checking the others' work, each happy to prove the other wrong and test conclusions critically and empirically.

If there is a God He created the universe. Men can fake books, but they cannot fake the universe. If you want to know how Godidit and must compare the work of modern science with an absurd fable that fails in just about every possible truth test, be my guest. You have absolutely NO evidence that creation occurred the way your old book claims. We have plenty of evidence that it happened in other ways, whether Godidit or not.

You are an Idolator of the Bible, a work of man, not a lover of God or God's works. And you refuse GOD and the works revealed to our EYES and BRAINS but accept the Bible because this load of old tribal Jewish hooey offers you a cheap BRIBE.

You guys are so transparent. Pure cowardice.
THE LONE WORKER

Madison, TN

#111923 Apr 23, 2014
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Ah, so that conflicts with Bo's assertion that there was "order" at the beginning of the arrow of time then. As according to your model there was high entropy at the beginning, then God made it all groovy, then he's gonna let it all slide again back into another state of high entropy.
See, this is what happens to you fundies when you attempt to prove magic Jews with "scientific evidence".
The New Heaven and Earth will not ever end, and there will be no more death.
THE LONE WORKER

Madison, TN

#111924 Apr 23, 2014
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
On one hand we have an old book of dubious origin that even contradicts itself in many places. It claims the world is about 6000 years old, Adam and Eve and all the animals were separately created, death did not exist, and the Earth was created before the stars, and there was a global flood about 4500 years ago.
NONE of these claims remotely matches the combined observations of thousands of scientists over centuries, each checking the others' work, each happy to prove the other wrong and test conclusions critically and empirically.
If there is a God He created the universe. Men can fake books, but they cannot fake the universe. If you want to know how Godidit and must compare the work of modern science with an absurd fable that fails in just about every possible truth test, be my guest. You have absolutely NO evidence that creation occurred the way your old book claims. We have plenty of evidence that it happened in other ways, whether Godidit or not.
You are an Idolator of the Bible, a work of man, not a lover of God or God's works. And you refuse GOD and the works revealed to our EYES and BRAINS but accept the Bible because this load of old tribal Jewish hooey offers you a cheap BRIBE.
You guys are so transparent. Pure cowardice.
So , I gather that you do not believe the creation was a miracle which happened by the power of God which has no limits.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

#111925 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>This is what happened , and it really doesn't matter who thinks it is a myth. The Bible is true and it says our Creator is our father in heaven who has the kingdom and the power forever. The disobedience was the thing that brought death into the picture, as far as I can understand this. The good news is that God so LOVED us that he sent his only begotten Son into the world so that we can inherit a better life than this one on this earth.
What a childish and irresponsible notion this is, that GOD can take away your sins.

How about those who you have harmed by your sins, flesh and blood humans? Now if they forgive you, you just got lucky, but even GOD does not have the moral right to forgive you, if those you have harmed do not. But you go running to this God and throw yourself at his mercy, as if that makes any difference.

You did what you did.

As if some mug getting fake slaughtered on a cross 2000 years ago can make a damned bit of difference to the fact that you stole 1000 dollars or cheated on your wife or lied to your friend, today.

This craving to be forgiven and not even by the people your sins have harmed, its absurd and a bit pathetic, if not actually evil.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

#111926 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>So , I gather that you do not believe the creation was a miracle which happened by the power of God which has no limits.
After the Big Bang, the science and the evidence is pretty clear.

I have no idea how the Big Bang came to be, though God is one possible hypothesis that I do not discount.

However, I do discount the manner of creation as depicted in the Bible. The ONLY reason anybody still takes that seriously, you have already admitted. Fear for their souls (death), and irresponsibility regarding their wrongdoings, which they would dearly like to see expunged from the record.

Don't be saying logically absurd things like "God has no limits". If your God exists, of course He does. For example, God has no Free Will, since God a billion years ago already knew exactly what God today would do and think. God cannot change His mind! He already knew he was going to! So God either has a limit in changing His mind or a limit in knowing the future.

See, I am not really discounting the possibility of God as a notion. I am merely pointing out that His representation in the Bible, along with the history of creation it presents, is simply childish and absurd, and I am tired of hearing morons trying to corrupt science in defence of this stupidity.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#111927 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>So , I gather that you do not believe the creation was a miracle which happened by the power of God which has no limits.
Of course it is YOU that is placing limits on the Almighty.

YOU are restricting His act of creation to what simple ignorant shepards cobbled together over campfires a few thousand years ago. NOT the evidence that God (if He DOES exist) left for us to study.

As Chimney (I think) put it to you, you are worshiping a book written by MAN.
That is idolatry.

Lets hope that God can forgive you for that.
THE LONE WORKER

Madison, TN

#111928 Apr 23, 2014
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
What a childish and irresponsible notion this is, that GOD can take away your sins.
How about those who you have harmed by your sins, flesh and blood humans? Now if they forgive you, you just got lucky, but even GOD does not have the moral right to forgive you, if those you have harmed do not. But you go running to this God and throw yourself at his mercy, as if that makes any difference.
You did what you did.
As if some mug getting fake slaughtered on a cross 2000 years ago can make a damned bit of difference to the fact that you stole 1000 dollars or cheated on your wife or lied to your friend, today.
This craving to be forgiven and not even by the people your sins have harmed, its absurd and a bit pathetic, if not actually evil.
The forgiveness of sins that Jesus gives us is required for us to inherit eternal live in a place where there will be no wrongdoings. Our stupidity of our past will be forgotten. There is only one way to that wonderful place and Jesus is the way. If we invite Jesus into our hearts and lives, then we become his friends and he has promised that he has gone to prepare a place for his friends where their sins of their past will be put away from them.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#111929 Apr 23, 2014
THE LONE WORKER wrote:
<quoted text>The New Heaven and Earth will not ever end, and there will be no more death.
Well gee that's nice and all Mikey, but the point was that before that happens we still gotta deal with THIS spacetime continuum which generally operates with accordance to physics. And since you and Bo were talking about that and NOT the later glory of New Heaven and Earth yackety yadda, I was merely pointing out that each of your ideas about THIS reality were inconsistent.
THE LONE WORKER

Madison, TN

#111930 Apr 23, 2014
Having to live with the memories of every bad and terrible thing we have ever experienced would be torment in itself. Jesus can forgive us of the past and not just in this world but the one to come.

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