Evolution vs. Creation

Evolution vs. Creation

There are 209486 comments on the Best of New Orleans story from Jan 6, 2011, titled Evolution vs. Creation. In it, Best of New Orleans reports that:

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Best of New Orleans.

FREE SERVANT

United States

#108220 Jan 23, 2014
MAAT wrote:
I keep forgetting what the akronym stands for.
Infrastructure for Preservation - with focus on Earth Science (SCIPID-es)3 is an .... Self-configuration means have a complete knowledge of preserved formats
SCPID stands for Systems Cycles and Patterns Intelligent Design .
The Dude

Macclesfield, UK

#108221 Jan 23, 2014
FREE SERVANT wrote:
<quoted text>What is old is now new to some.
Still not caring Mikey.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108222 Jan 23, 2014
FREE SERVANT wrote:
<quoted text>SCPID stands for Systems Cycles and Patterns Intelligent Design .
I don't think anyone here argues that there are no Systems, Cycles, or Pattern occurring in nature.

But you have to provide evidence for an Intelligent Deity that set all this in motion.

Good luck.

You'd be the first ever to do so.
FREE SERVANT

United States

#108223 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
I don't think anyone here argues that there are no Systems, Cycles, or Pattern occurring in nature.
But you have to provide evidence for an Intelligent Deity that set all this in motion.
Good luck.
You'd be the first ever to do so.
The evidence for an intelligent designer is in all of our material world and universe. Intelligence in nature is different from what we might think of as being smart or clever in many living things on earth. Nature follows patterns which are set within systems and living things have understanding and rationality and abilities to judge and adjust rhythms within their makeup. All systems work by cycling and following patterns and this arrangement had to have been set up by an intelligent cause with creativity showing acute judgement and rationality.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#108224 Jan 23, 2014
FREE SERVANT wrote:
<quoted text>SCPID stands for Systems Cycles and Patterns Intelligent Design .
I believe the proper acronym would then be IN-SCPID, with the IN standing for "Information Null."

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108225 Jan 23, 2014
FREE SERVANT wrote:
<quoted text>The evidence for an intelligent designer is in all of our material world and universe. Intelligence in nature is different from what we might think of as being smart or clever in many living things on earth. Nature follows patterns which are set within systems and living things have understanding and rationality and abilities to judge and adjust rhythms within their makeup. All systems work by cycling and following patterns and this arrangement had to have been set up by an intelligent cause with creativity showing acute judgement and rationality.
No, no, no....that is not "evidence".

That is your opinion.

In order for your opinion to have any weight, you have to first scientifically and objectively prove the existence of this Intelligent Designer, then show SPECIFICALLY how He (She/It) arranged for, and set into motion these systems, cycles and patterns.

The key words above are "scientifically" and "specifically".

Now go to work!

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108226 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
No, no, no....that is not "evidence".
That is your opinion.
In order for your opinion to have any weight, you have to first scientifically and objectively prove the existence of this Intelligent Designer, then show SPECIFICALLY how He (She/It) arranged for, and set into motion these systems, cycles and patterns.
The key words above are "scientifically" and "specifically".
Now go to work!
Same can be said for the Universe and life. Of course your answer will be the BBT and abiogenesis but there had to be something that set those two into motion. What scientific evidence is there for what set those two it into motion? Show SPECIFICALLY how they both got set into motion.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108227 Jan 23, 2014
Kong my point being no one knows how it all got started and no one can show specific evidence on how it all got started.
FREE SERVANT

United States

#108229 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
No, no, no....that is not "evidence".
That is your opinion.
In order for your opinion to have any weight, you have to first scientifically and objectively prove the existence of this Intelligent Designer, then show SPECIFICALLY how He (She/It) arranged for, and set into motion these systems, cycles and patterns.
The key words above are "scientifically" and "specifically".
Now go to work!
Where should we commence? Maybe we could start with how things are set up here on earth with rhythms and repetition related to 24 hour cycles in most living things.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108230 Jan 23, 2014
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Same can be said for the Universe and life. Of course your answer will be the BBT and abiogenesis but there had to be something that set those two into motion. What scientific evidence is there for what set those two it into motion? Show SPECIFICALLY how they both got set into motion.
Certainly!

Everything comes down to the four fundamental forces of nature:

Electromagnetism
Strong nuclear force
Weak nuclear force
Gravity

No matter what "System" or "Cycle" or "Pattern" (or combination thereof), only the above forces are being used.

Without the evidence of this designer, all you have is PHILOSOPHY, and the default SCIENCE position is that of a designerLESS existence.

The burden of proof for this Designer falls upon those making the argument FOR this Intelligent Designer.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108231 Jan 23, 2014
...add to above:

If your position is that God *SET UP* the Four Fundimental Forces of Nature, in order to "run the Universe", I have no problem with that.

But Genesis is still a mythical fairy tale.

If there's a God, the evidence He left for us to study suggest that He used the forces and timescales as described by science -- including the Theory of Evolution -- to do His bidding.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108232 Jan 23, 2014
And the default science position of a designerLESS existence is philosophy. When it comes down to it philosophy, belief and thought is all anyone has for evidence on how the universe and life got started.
FREE SERVANT

United States

#108234 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
...add to above:
If your position is that God *SET UP* the Four Fundimental Forces of Nature, in order to "run the Universe", I have no problem with that.
But Genesis is still a mythical fairy tale.
If there's a God, the evidence He left for us to study suggest that He used the forces and timescales as described by science -- including the Theory of Evolution -- to do His bidding.
Speaking of timescale, we should also mention timing. Everything in nature has obtained a regulation of the speed or of the moment of occurrence of something so as to produce the most effective results. Built in self sustained rhythms in living things can be adjusted to the local environment and an oscillation of about 24 hours is around the earth day.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108235 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
Certainly!
Everything comes down to the four fundamental forces of nature:
Electromagnetism
Strong nuclear force
Weak nuclear force
Gravity
No matter what "System" or "Cycle" or "Pattern" (or combination thereof), only the above forces are being used.
Without the evidence of this designer, all you have is PHILOSOPHY, and the default SCIENCE position is that of a designerLESS existence.
The burden of proof for this Designer falls upon those making the argument FOR this Intelligent Designer.
Electromagnetism
Strong nuclear force
Weak nuclear force
Gravity
Time

None of this is supposedly to have existed before the BBT. So how can it come down to the four(five since I added time) fundamental forces of nature:

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108236 Jan 23, 2014
replaytime wrote:
And the default science position of a designerLESS existence is philosophy. When it comes down to it philosophy, belief and thought is all anyone has for evidence on how the universe and life got started.
Science: "knowledge about or study of the natural world based on facts learned through experiments and observation"
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sci...

Supernatural: " unable to be explained by science or the laws of nature : of, relating to, or seeming to come from magic, a god, etc."
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sup...

What -- taken together -- do the two above definitions tell you about the limitations that science has?

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108237 Jan 23, 2014
replaytime wrote:
<quoted text>
Electromagnetism
Strong nuclear force
Weak nuclear force
Gravity
Time
None of this is supposedly to have existed before the BBT. So how can it come down to the four(five since I added time) fundamental forces of nature:
The *KNOWN* laws of physics break down as one approaches the moment of the Big Bang. There are undoubtedly other, UNKNOWN forces at work....perhaps God(?)...but since it us your claim, you have to prove it.

“Nihil curo de ista tua stulta ”

Since: May 08

Orlando

#108238 Jan 23, 2014
EXPERT wrote:
<quoted text>
You are clueless
What a succinct, profound rebuttal!

Too bad you cannot expound upon it more.

“Proud Member”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

The Basket of Deplorables

#108239 Jan 23, 2014
FREE SERVANT wrote:
<quoted text>Speaking of timescale, we should also mention timing. Everything in nature has obtained a regulation of the speed or of the moment of occurrence of something so as to produce the most effective results. Built in self sustained rhythms in living things can be adjusted to the local environment and an oscillation of about 24 hours is around the earth day.
Why are you pregnant?

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108240 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
Science: "knowledge about or study of the natural world based on facts learned through experiments and observation"
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sci...
Supernatural: " unable to be explained by science or the laws of nature : of, relating to, or seeming to come from magic, a god, etc."
http://www.merriam-webster.com/dictionary/sup...
What -- taken together -- do the two above definitions tell you about the limitations that science has?
It tells me science can only study what it sees and only try to understand what it sees. Science cannot study what it cannot see or understand what it cannot see and in a since is not concerned with what it cannot see or understand..

Just because something cannot be seen or understood does not mean it is not there.

“Ask Randy From Ballwin”

Level 5

Since: Mar 13

He Is A Sock Know It All

#108241 Jan 23, 2014
Kong_ wrote:
<quoted text>
The *KNOWN* laws of physics break down as one approaches the moment of the Big Bang. There are undoubtedly other, UNKNOWN forces at work....perhaps God(?)...but since it us your claim, you have to prove it.
I am not claiming God. I am asking you what scientific evidence exists that set the universe (before BBT) in motion and life in motion (before abiogenesis).

Point being no one has a clue when it all comes down to how the universe and life were set into motion. The start of both are based off of philosophy, belief and thought.

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