Evolution vs. Creation

Evolution vs. Creation

There are 201128 comments on the Best of New Orleans story from Jan 6, 2011, titled Evolution vs. Creation. In it, Best of New Orleans reports that:

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

Join the discussion below, or Read more at Best of New Orleans.

The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#107402 Dec 6, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Dear subduction zone, according to you an idea taught in public schools has been tested hundreds of times? The untested idea that life arose from primordial seas has been, and is being taught in public schools! This is exactly what you accuse creationists of wanting to do! You just want your religion to be the exclusive one.
You already lost this one in court.

Multiple times.

Try again if you like. I love the smell of fried fundies in the morning.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#107403 Dec 6, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Dear subduction zone, according to you an idea taught in public schools has been tested hundreds of times? The untested idea that life arose from primordial seas has been, and is being taught in public schools! This is exactly what you accuse creationists of wanting to do! You just want your religion to be the exclusive one.
More of your gibbering about "science is a religion", I see.
There are many suggestions of where and how life might have begun and not one is held as absolute. The religious stories of origin are held by such as you as the inviolate "truth", without any trace of evidence, objectivity or logical reasoning.
You accuse science of making (and being) the same blithe droning noise of which Creationists are proud of simply because it's all you can hear.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#107404 Dec 6, 2013
cancer suxs wrote:
<quoted text>
No one alive has ever seen him or her or felt any god like powers...YOU HAVE ANY PROOF YOUR GOD IS REAL?
Are you even capable of reading? PROOF is ONLY for MATH. SCIENCE deals with FACTS AND EVIDENCE. So it goes like this:

Do I have EVIDENCE of God? The answer is no. But I don't have evidence of aliens either, but there's no reason why aliens can't exist.

Does literalistic creationism have any evidence? No. In fact there is lots of evidence against it. Therefore going by the evidence, creationism is most certainly false.

The idea of a God however CANNOT be TESTED for either way. That doesn't necessarily mean that such an entity doesn't exist. But it does mean that the idea is not scientific as it is not capable of making scientific predictions that can be falsified.

Now, if you wanted to state that there is no evidence of a God and therefore no reason to presume that such a thing exists, then that would be a reasonable statement. If you want to state that the Earth's history contradicts a literalistic interpretation of the Bible, therefore the invisible wizard in the Bible they call "God" can't be real, then that's not necessarily an unreasonable statement either.

But to categorically that *a* God does not exist period? Scientifically speaking, that is not correct.

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#107405 Dec 6, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
And of course Zimmerman had no indication of racism in the past. He was involved in tutoring students of low income families and had ran a petition against some police who were involved in some violence towards a black subject. Of course he may have been planning ahead perhaps Timmy thinks.
Even if he was racist and had been profiling Martin what he did was not illegal. Profiling as he is accused of doing is not illegal. Nor is it illegal profiling if a black man profiles a white man in his neighborhood. As long as he does not act physically on his beliefs. It is not illegal to be dumb and racist. It is no excuse for someone to attack you.
The timeline discrepancy of one man walking and another driving does not support your justifications of GZ's actions.
Given the circumstance, I would not be the least bit surprised if GZ had made efforts to physically detain/restrain TM for the police. Given that he was clearly stalking TM, I consider it a certainty that GZ committed the first aggression and most probable that he made the first physical contact. But TM is dead, and the victor gets to write the history.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#107406 Dec 6, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
More of your gibbering about "science is a religion", I see.
Of course it's a religion. Science doesn't actually work. Medicine doesn't work. This computer of yours doesn't actually work. It's all magic!

Bummer is that our 'magic' does stuff and his doesn't.

(evil grin)

Level 1

Since: Jan 12

Memphis, TN

#107407 Dec 6, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
And of course Zimmerman had no indication of racism in the past. He was involved in tutoring students of low income families and had ran a petition against some police who were involved in some violence towards a black subject. Of course he may have been planning ahead perhaps Timmy thinks.
Even if he was racist and had been profiling Martin what he did was not illegal. Profiling as he is accused of doing is not illegal. Nor is it illegal profiling if a black man profiles a white man in his neighborhood. As long as he does not act physically on his beliefs. It is not illegal to be dumb and racist. It is no excuse for someone to attack you.
But Zimmerman DID act physically as far as racial profiling...when he decided to follow Martin. And with his handgun at his side it is evident that Zimmerman was looking for and hoping a confrontation, as he was prepared to handle it. The only reason that Zimmerman got off was because he was charged with a crime of which he was innocent, FIRST DEGREE. It should have been second degree or manslaughter. But let's not get it twisted, anyone that carries a handgun legally is always looking for a reason to have to use it even if they are the ones getting cocky and creating a situation. And the fact that most of the jurors were cherry-picked because of their disbelief in the whole "modern-day racism" thing, Zimmerman was gonna walk free anyway because he was the one getting his ass whooped by Martin but only because of the young brotha confronting Zimmerman about following him around like a rapist or something!!

“See how you are?”

Level 5

Since: Jul 12

Earth

#107408 Dec 6, 2013
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Of course it's a religion. Science doesn't actually work. Medicine doesn't work. This computer of yours doesn't actually work. It's all magic!
Bummer is that our 'magic' does stuff and his doesn't.
(evil grin)
Allow me to suggest the fundie retort.
"Oh, yeah? Well, umm.. Oh yeah? Well, drop your computer in a bucket of Holy water and God will stop letting it light up and stuff, and I prayed to get over a cold and a week later it was gone!! If science is such a great religion, how come you can't explain how the Flood happened? Huh? Huh? So There!"

Since: Mar 11

St. Croix valley

#107409 Dec 6, 2013
ChromiuMan wrote:
<quoted text>
Allow me to suggest the fundie retort.
"Oh, yeah? Well, umm.. Oh yeah? Well, drop your computer in a bucket of Holy water and God will stop letting it light up and stuff, and I prayed to get over a cold and a week later it was gone!! If science is such a great religion, how come you can't explain how the Flood happened? Huh? Huh? So There!"
i spilled about half a pint on my laptop while it was on...

it made a funny noise and shut down right away...i let it dry for a week and outside of sticky keys for quite a while, it seems to work fine..(and i had just replaced the keyboard on it!)

i think that was a miracle...or just the fact that is spilled good beer on it. if i had tossed budweiser or miller lite on it it probably would have croaked...

“Get Extreme or Go Home. ”

Since: Nov 13

United States

#107410 Dec 6, 2013
You think maybe his Dad, Robert Zimmerman, a retired former Orange County magistrate judge had anything to do with prior charges on George disappearing and maybe some influence on the Martin case?

According to a records search on Zimmerman, he was previously arrested for domestic violence, resisting an officer without violence and resisting an officer with violence — a felony.

All three of those arrests, however, were mysteriously closed with no semblance of charges for Zimmerman. So how was someone with a violent past including that of battery against an officer able to carry a 9 mm handgun?

“Get Extreme or Go Home. ”

Since: Nov 13

United States

#107411 Dec 6, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
Here is the similar case I was talking about. And this man was much more aggressive than Zimmerman:
http://rochester.ynn.com/content/news/490926/...
What this doesn't say is what the other two boys testified. They could have backed the mans story. We don't know. But we do know there were two other people left alive that could testify in this case.

“Get Extreme or Go Home. ”

Since: Nov 13

United States

#107412 Dec 6, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
On whether or not Martin was doing anything suspicious all we have is Zimmerman's statement where he stated that he was just walking in the rain. In Zimmerman's opinion, which I will admit without bias, the way that Martin was walking through the neighborhood on a cold rainy day did not make much sense. Personally if it is cold and rainy out I tend to go quickly to and from my goal. Perhaps that is what he saw.
Zimmerman may have been a wanna be cop, but that does not mean Martin had a legal right to attack him.
You keep harping about it being cold that night. The mean temp was 61 degrees. The high temp was 69 degrees and the low temp was only 53 degrees. That 53 degrees was probably hit in the very early morning hours as usual.

So as you can see it was not a "cold" night as you keep saying. Just a little cool at the lowest temperature of 53 degrees.

http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/K...

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#107413 Dec 6, 2013
muffy wrote:
<quoted text>
I'm not going to speak badly about Nature, I'm sure they do good work.
One of the most attractive things I've read about the "scientific method" is that there is a system of checks and balances that weeds out the bad stuff (fluke results, fraud, mistakes, happy accidents, etc.) And that sounds great, in theory. In theory, communism works. In theory. But I understand that scientists are only human and usually need to be funded to do their work. I expect there's a lot more funding for "original research" than for "copying what someone else has done just to be sure".
I disagree. I think the fund is more often than not based on the importance of the research. The mating calls of bull frogs might not get as much attention as cancer research.
muffy wrote:
So probably the old, important stuff has been checked a lot. Gravity seems to be working ok, I'm almost convinced we flew a man to the moon...
GEEZ!
muffy wrote:
...and I'm willing to believe that antibiotics are effective because science. But I have a feeling that most of the published work that comprises the sum of scientific understanding is wrong. And not just wrong, but so wrong as to be not-useful either. And maybe that could be fixed if someone (maybe a couple of people) actually tried to replicate everything.
Yet in spite of all the things that might be wrong, you eat better than your ancestors, you are healthier and live longer than your ancestors, you have a computer and a cell phones and live in a home that has its environment controlled.

You're missing the entire point. Published papers is a technical and complicated was of saying "Hey, guys! Look at this. What do you think?"

Do YOU have a better way to handle the process?

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#107414 Dec 6, 2013
timn17 wrote:
Are you suggesting that profiling is ok?
To paraphrase Dr House: Everybody profiles.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#107415 Dec 6, 2013
Extreme Ways wrote:
You think maybe his Dad, Robert Zimmerman, a retired former Orange County magistrate judge had anything to do with prior charges on George disappearing and maybe some influence on the Martin case?
According to a records search on Zimmerman, he was previously arrested for domestic violence, resisting an officer without violence and resisting an officer with violence — a felony.
All three of those arrests, however, were mysteriously closed with no semblance of charges for Zimmerman. So how was someone with a violent past including that of battery against an officer able to carry a 9 mm handgun?
I already went over those.

No, his dad did not have anything to do with those charges disappearing.

Please try to get something new. And even if that was the case, he still had his gun legally, even if you did not like how he got it legally. He still had a legal right to defend himself if he was attacked.

Why do you keep bringing up these red herrings? Oh yes, to detract from the fact that you are wrong.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#107416 Dec 6, 2013
Extreme Ways wrote:
<quoted text>
You keep harping about it being cold that night. The mean temp was 61 degrees. The high temp was 69 degrees and the low temp was only 53 degrees. That 53 degrees was probably hit in the very early morning hours as usual.
So as you can see it was not a "cold" night as you keep saying. Just a little cool at the lowest temperature of 53 degrees.
http://www.wunderground.com/history/airport/K...
Cold is relative. For Floridians this was cold.

I had someone in an unairconditioned store I used to own on a day when it was over 90 inside. She had on a light weight sweater since she had moved to Singapore and the temperature felt a little cool to her.

You have to look at some facts in context. For Floridians it was a cold night. Someone from Minneapolis would be walking around in shorts and a short sleeved shirt. That would not mean that the natives were wrong in considering it "cold".

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#107417 Dec 6, 2013
DeAngelo of Memphis wrote:
<quoted text>But Zimmerman DID act physically as far as racial profiling...when he decided to follow Martin. And with his handgun at his side it is evident that Zimmerman was looking for and hoping a confrontation, as he was prepared to handle it. The only reason that Zimmerman got off was because he was charged with a crime of which he was innocent, FIRST DEGREE. It should have been second degree or manslaughter. But let's not get it twisted, anyone that carries a handgun legally is always looking for a reason to have to use it even if they are the ones getting cocky and creating a situation. And the fact that most of the jurors were cherry-picked because of their disbelief in the whole "modern-day racism" thing, Zimmerman was gonna walk free anyway because he was the one getting his ass whooped by Martin but only because of the young brotha confronting Zimmerman about following him around like a rapist or something!!
He may have. He may have been age profiling too.

And he was not charged with "FIRST DEGREE". He was charged with Second Degree homicide and at the end they added an option to charge him with Manslaughter. And the jury was "cherry picked" by both sides.

The defense does not have free reign on who will be in a jury, nor does the prosecution. They both have an equal number of rejections without reason and after that you have to show a reason why a particular juror should be excluded.

And remember, the evidence showed that Martin did not just confront Zimmerman, that would have been legal. He physically attacked him. That is not legal. At that point Zimmerman had the right to shoot to defend himself.

And please, get your facts right about the case. Such gross errors as claiming that he was charged with First Degree Murder when that is clearly not the case blows your own argument out of the water. He was charged with the crimes you thought he should have been charged with and he still was found innocent:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/State_of_Florida...

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#107418 Dec 6, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
To paraphrase Dr House: Everybody profiles.
Yup, and it is only illegal when an organization uses it on a widespread basis. Individuals cannot help but to profile. It is human nature.

“Get Extreme or Go Home. ”

Since: Nov 13

United States

#107419 Dec 6, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
Cold is relative. For Floridians this was cold.
I had someone in an unairconditioned store I used to own on a day when it was over 90 inside. She had on a light weight sweater since she had moved to Singapore and the temperature felt a little cool to her.
You have to look at some facts in context. For Floridians it was a cold night. Someone from Minneapolis would be walking around in shorts and a short sleeved shirt. That would not mean that the natives were wrong in considering it "cold".
I lived in Orlando for 4 1/2 years back in the mid 80's working construction on Disney World when it was adding on back then. So I know how weather feels in Florida.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

#107420 Dec 6, 2013
Extreme Ways wrote:
<quoted text>
I lived in Orlando for 4 1/2 years back in the mid 80's working construction on Disney World when it was adding on back then. So I know how weather feels in Florida.
To you.

It took me over 10 years living in the Pacific Northwest before I ever said "it's cold", except for perhaps in the summer.

“Up with which, I will not put”

Since: Jul 08

Sao Paulo

#107421 Dec 6, 2013
TerryL wrote:
<quoted text>Man... if only there were a device available the gave people access to crap loads of information just by typing a few words and searching...
There is, and if I could spell Oijee board I'd have an answer for you.

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