Evolution vs. Creation

Full story: Best of New Orleans

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008.

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The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#106339
Nov 20, 2013
 
SBT wrote:
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Mr. Morton makes some pretty outlandish claims here, there are no "strongly suggests" or "this could be" he asserts "is", "cant's" etc... When theorists start talking in absolute terms such as there could be "no mountains or earthquakes" or it would all fail etc., makes me suspect. This is also 10 years old.
Browns updated eveidence gives his idea credence because he hypothesized such years back and now is proven correct, when no one believed it (deep drill results).
Oh right, that must be why they use Morton's data to find oil deposits and not a hack like Brown.

Keep in mind that your boys DID send creationists out into the field during the eighties SPECIFICALLY to find evidence of the "flood". When they came back empty handed and told them the evidence demonstrated a (very) old Earth they stopped sending people out. And instead they made careers of spreading BS on the internet by misrepresenting science all from the comfort of their own armchairs.

You still ready to tackle the numerous problems with your position yet? You know, the stuff we've been telling you for months which you still haven't got around to dealing with yet?

Thought not.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#106340
Nov 20, 2013
 

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The Dude wrote:
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I think it's quite possible that Judeo-Christian mono-theism may well have had roots in Aten monotheism but personally I'm not convinced that the path was that direct. Though certainly the Bible pinched parts of Egyptian mythology (Moses in a basket and Jesus walking on water were done by earlier Egyptian characters), just as Christians plagiarised the Jews and Muslims plagiarised the Christians. Basically they were too lazy to make up their own myths.
Akhenaten ruled and his religion lasted for about 17 years. While possible, it seems unlikely that he had a lasting influence.
Patriot

Savannah, GA

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#106342
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Are you Atheists Members of the Libertarian Party?
Are you hard at work trying to convert Religious Folks to Atheism?

Murray Rothbard - RationalWiki
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Nov 12, 2013 ... Murray Rothbard (1926-1995) was an Austrian school economist and ... He worked within the Libertarian Party during the 1970s and 1980s,...

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An Open Letter to Murray Rothbard on Andre Marrou, the Libertarian Party, and that "vexing" hole in the libertarian system -- Children. by Doris Gordon

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Exposing the Racist History Of Libertarianism And Murray ...

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Oct 3, 2011 ... Murray Rothbard was the student of Ludwig Von Mises and a friend of ... This part of libertarian history is a part that the libertarians would like to ...

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#106343
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
Are you Atheists Members of the Libertarian Party?
Are you hard at work trying to convert Religious Folks to Atheism?
Wrong forum, doofus.
Patriot

Savannah, GA

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#106344
Nov 20, 2013
 

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The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it's quite possible that Judeo-Christian mono-theism may well have had roots in Aten monotheism but personally I'm not convinced that the path was that direct. Though certainly the Bible pinched parts of Egyptian mythology (Moses in a basket and Jesus walking on water were done by earlier Egyptian characters), just as Christians plagiarised the Jews and Muslims plagiarised the Christians. Basically they were too lazy to make up their own myths.
Pinched? Plagiarized? I would point out to you that there Was NO Jewish Religion as we know it today BEFORE Moses. Moses is credited with writing the First Five Books of the Holy Bible, called the "Torah
" by the Jews. Moses was NOT taught the Jewish Religion, there was NONE, other than what they picked up from the Babylonians, and other peoples that they came in contact with.

Moses was a Prince of Egypt, adopted into the Royal Family, and Heir to the Throne of Egypt. No doubt Moses had a lot of Heirs in front of him, but nevertheless Moses was part of the Royal Family. Moses was taught the Ancient Egyptian Religion from several Egyptian sources, including the book that WE named "Egyptian Book of the Dead."
The Ancient Egyptians called that book, "The Book of the Great Awakening,"and it describes the Spirit returning to consciousness AFTER the Death of the Body. If you survive the death of the body, which depends on your beliefs, or lack thereof, you will discover that you float and fly in the air, and you are carried about by your thoughts.
You have to concentrate on walking to regain the ability to walk. The same situation holds true to get your Spirit to regain all the abilities of the now deceased body.
The Egyptian Book of the Dead discusses this phenomena, and there is a Chapter devoted entirely to regaining the use of your legs, and learning again to WALK upon the Earth.

If you believe the Ancient Egyptians, a wandering band of nomadic desert dwellers suddenly developed the engineering techniques overnight to build the complicated and near perfect pyramids all by themselves, you are an imbecile.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#106346
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
Pinched? Plagiarized? I would point out to you that there Was NO Jewish Religion as we know it today BEFORE Moses. Moses is credited with writing the First Five Books of the Holy Bible, called the "Torah
" by the Jews. Moses was NOT taught the Jewish Religion, there was NONE, other than what they picked up from the Babylonians, and other peoples that they came in contact with.
Moses was a Prince of Egypt, adopted into the Royal Family, and Heir to the Throne of Egypt. No doubt Moses had a lot of Heirs in front of him, but nevertheless Moses was part of the Royal Family. Moses was taught the Ancient Egyptian Religion from several Egyptian sources, including the book that WE named "Egyptian Book of the Dead."
The Ancient Egyptians called that book, "The Book of the Great Awakening,"and it describes the Spirit returning to consciousness AFTER the Death of the Body. If you survive the death of the body, which depends on your beliefs, or lack thereof, you will discover that you float and fly in the air, and you are carried about by your thoughts.
You have to concentrate on walking to regain the ability to walk. The same situation holds true to get your Spirit to regain all the abilities of the now deceased body.
The Egyptian Book of the Dead discusses this phenomena, and there is a Chapter devoted entirely to regaining the use of your legs, and learning again to WALK upon the Earth.
If you believe the Ancient Egyptians, a wandering band of nomadic desert dwellers suddenly developed the engineering techniques overnight to build the complicated and near perfect pyramids all by themselves, you are an imbecile.
Overnight? You don't know much about Egyptian history, do you? Pyramid construction techniques developed over a period more than 1000 years.

Level 9

Since: Sep 08

Everett, WA

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#106347
Nov 20, 2013
 

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LOL, there is no "hydrolate theory". To be a theory a hypothesis first must be developed and tested many times and pass those tests or be rewritten and tested by scientists of the world. There never was even a "hydroplate hypothesis".

And the maker of the "hydorplate theory" forgets one easy fact that debunks his idiocy. The energy of that worldwide eruption would cook everything on the Earth. Let's run through some of his own numbers.

He claimed that the energy of 3 * 10^13 hydrogen bombs would be released. So using a value of 2 * 10^17 Joules (a moderate thermonuclear device) we get 6 *10 ^30 Joules released. Most of that would be immediately be released to the atmosphere. Let's say about half to be on the safe side. The atmosphere masses 5 * 10^18 kilograms and air has a specific heat of just over 1000 joules/kilogram degree Celsius. Whew.

So we take the Energy times divided by the mass and divide that by the specific heat to get 3 *10^30 joules/5*10^18 kilograms/1000j?kgC = 15*10^(30 - 18 -3)= 15 BILLION DEGREES CELSIUS!!

Okay, poor Noah and family are not cooked, they are ionized!!

I can't change the amount of energy your good "doctor" claimed was released, perhaps I can make it easier for Noah et al. if we spread it out. So how long did the waters rise? Wasn't it on the order of 40 days and 40 nights. Lets spread that out over 40 days. Okay, now the amount of heat released each day is only enough to raise the temperature of the atmosphere 375 million degrees each day, every day, for 40 days and nights.

Hmm, Noah and family are still ionized. Okay how about if only 1% of the energy went into the atmosphere. Lets see what happens then. Aha! Now we are getting somewhere. Noah and company would only be heated up 7.5 million degrees Celsius. Oops. Still ionized.

In fact if only one thousandth of a percent of all of that energy was released into the atmosphere over a 40 day period the temperature of the atmosphere would still have gone up 7,500 degrees Celsius. The rest would have to go into the crust of the Earth and I have not calculated what problems that would have caused yet.

So with only the smallest of fractions of the energy going into they atmosphere the so called hydroplate theory not only kills everybody on the Earth, it cooks them to a cinder as well.

Level 1

Since: Jul 12

Australia

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#106348
Nov 20, 2013
 

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The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
I think it's quite possible that Judeo-Christian mono-theism may well have had roots in Aten monotheism but personally I'm not convinced that the path was that direct. Though certainly the Bible pinched parts of Egyptian mythology (Moses in a basket and Jesus walking on water were done by earlier Egyptian characters), just as Christians plagiarised the Jews and Muslims plagiarised the Christians. Basically they were too lazy to make up their own myths.
..and evolutionists plagiarised an old scroll that told them thousands of years prior to 'science' that animal life began in the sea.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

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The Borderland of Sol

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#106349
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
Pinched? Plagiarized? I would point out to you that there Was NO Jewish Religion as we know it today BEFORE Moses. Moses is credited with writing the First Five Books of the Holy Bible, called the "Torah
" by the Jews. Moses was NOT taught the Jewish Religion, there was NONE, other than what they picked up from the Babylonians, and other peoples that they came in contact with.
Moses was a Prince of Egypt, adopted into the Royal Family, and Heir to the Throne of Egypt. No doubt Moses had a lot of Heirs in front of him, but nevertheless Moses was part of the Royal Family. Moses was taught the Ancient Egyptian Religion from several Egyptian sources, including the book that WE named "Egyptian Book of the Dead."
The Ancient Egyptians called that book, "The Book of the Great Awakening,"and it describes the Spirit returning to consciousness AFTER the Death of the Body. If you survive the death of the body, which depends on your beliefs, or lack thereof, you will discover that you float and fly in the air, and you are carried about by your thoughts.
You have to concentrate on walking to regain the ability to walk. The same situation holds true to get your Spirit to regain all the abilities of the now deceased body.
The Egyptian Book of the Dead discusses this phenomena, and there is a Chapter devoted entirely to regaining the use of your legs, and learning again to WALK upon the Earth.
If you believe the Ancient Egyptians, a wandering band of nomadic desert dwellers suddenly developed the engineering techniques overnight to build the complicated and near perfect pyramids all by themselves, you are an imbecile.
*sigh*

The Egyptians (who kept excellent records, even of military defeats) have no records of this "Prince of Egypt" at all.

Nor of the so-called "Captivity".

Also, the Egyptians of the period were not "nomadic desert -dwellers.

They were the greatest civilization of the day, at least in the area, and lived mostly in settled towns and cities, great cities, in the Nile Basin.

Great Bog, do you know nothing of history?

Never mind. Tag that question as rhetorical.

“Pissing people off since 1949”

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#106350
Nov 20, 2013
 

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MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
..and evolutionists plagiarised an old scroll that told them thousands of years prior to 'science' that animal life began in the sea.
Uh-huh.

And ignored the part that said plants existed before the sun.
Patriot

Savannah, GA

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#106351
Nov 20, 2013
 

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MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
Overnight? You don't know much about Egyptian history, do you? Pyramid construction techniques developed over a period more than 1000 years.
You are talking about the Many FAILED attempts to construct pyramids, that were little more than piles of rocks, that more than once simply collapsed.
OVERNIGHT they built near perfect pyramids with highly complex interiors.
Modern stone carvers say that even with all their modern equipment, they would not even attempt to duplicate what the Ancient Egyptians did.
Some of the vaults are carved into square boxes, and they are made of some of the Hardest Stone known to man.
I have seen several modern stone contractors say those near perfect stone boxes can NOT be duplicated with today's technology.

Level 9

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Everett, WA

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#106352
Nov 20, 2013
 

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MazHere wrote:
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..and evolutionists plagiarised an old scroll that told them thousands of years prior to 'science' that animal life began in the sea.
No, the raggedy old piece of paper has nothing to do with evolution. The order is terribly wrong, the cause is totally wrong.

Evolution bases its theories upon observations. Plain and simple.

They don't make your mistake of interpreting observations to fit your presupposed answers. If the evidence supported "devolution" so would scientists. They really want to know the answer, regardless of what the answer is. You think you have the answer and you really want the evidence to fit it.

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Everett, WA

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#106353
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
You are talking about the Many FAILED attempts to construct pyramids, that were little more than piles of rocks, that more than once simply collapsed.
No, they were simple early pyramids. How were the "FAILED" in any way?
OVERNIGHT they built near perfect pyramids with highly complex interiors.
I have never seen any evidence for that. Let's see your evidence.
Modern stone carvers say that even with all their modern equipment, they would not even attempt to duplicate what the Ancient Egyptians did.
So you are talking about incompetent modern carvers. As far as moving the blocks that was a relatively easy task.
Some of the vaults are carved into square boxes, and they are made of some of the Hardest Stone known to man.
Umm no. Largely built of limestone, they definitely are not built of the "hardest stones known to man". The hardest rock you will find there is granite, and that is only moderately hard.
I have seen several modern stone contractors say those near perfect stone boxes can NOT be duplicated with today's technology.
Aah, so you have talked with morons then.

What is so hard about making a straight line or a ninety degree angle? We have known how to do that for, well since the pyramids were built.

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#106354
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Subduction Zone wrote:
LOL, there is no "hydrolate theory". To be a theory a hypothesis first must be developed and tested many times and pass those tests or be rewritten and tested by scientists of the world. There never was even a "hydroplate hypothesis".
And the maker of the "hydorplate theory" forgets one easy fact that debunks his idiocy. The energy of that worldwide eruption would cook everything on the Earth. Let's run through some of his own numbers.
.
Well I suppose if there never was a theory, then the maker of the theory would not have had anything to say about it and you would have nothing to refute.

Oxygen may have filled Earth's atmosphere hundreds of millions of years earlier than previously thought, suggesting that sunlight-dependent life akin to modern plants evolved very early in Earth's history, a new study finds.

http://www.livescience.com/39938-earth-had-ox...

The bottom line is scientists have little to no clue about earths history, and keep changing their minds.

So let's recap this 'science' you evos like to suggest you use. Certain predictions can be made from a creationist and evolutionary paradigm.

1. Adaptation is limited and organisms will remain in their familial groups. All recent genomic research runs counter clockwise to evolutionary expectations and indeed there is plenty of biased data that supports the creo paradigm that the genome is restricted and limited in its ability to adapt from microbe to dinosaur.

2. The genome will be found to be fully functional. A creator has no need to put junk in the genome as evos predicted. So far we are up to a definite 80% and well credentialled researchers eg Gingeras from ENCODE, fully expect that to rise to 100%.

3. All organs will be found to have some function. A creator as no need to make functionless organs. This has been validated with the evolutionary myth of 'NO function' being falsified.

4. Organisms will be found to appear suddenly in the fossil record and in line with a documented account of the appearance of life. This continues to be valdiated. eg Tetrapods, Cambrian explosion, animal life began in the sea.

Hence evolutionists would rather die than admit the evidence for creationism keeps mounting while evos continue to look silly with their flavours of the month and falsifications of previous claims.
Patriot

Savannah, GA

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#106355
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
No, the raggedy old piece of paper has nothing to do with evolution. The order is terribly wrong, the cause is totally wrong.
Evolution bases its theories upon observations. Plain and simple.
They don't make your mistake of interpreting observations to fit your presupposed answers. If the evidence supported "devolution" so would scientists. They really want to know the answer, regardless of what the answer is. You think you have the answer and you really want the evidence to fit it.
Do you mean observations like they did with Piltdown Man in England? These Scientific Observers constructed a stone age man based on a jaw bone and ran with it. Piltdown Man was in all the scientific journals and it was the rage of the times.
The Jaw Bone turned out to be from a HOG !! So much for Scientific Objective Observation.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#106356
Nov 20, 2013
 
Patriot wrote:
Are you Atheists Members of the Libertarian Party?
Are you hard at work trying to convert Religious Folks to Atheism?
What does atheism have to do with anything? See it in the thread title? Nope. Science doesn't care about your beliefs. Science just works.
Patriot

Savannah, GA

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#106357
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Piltdown Man

Piltdown Man - the greatest hoax in the history of science?|...
www.nhm.ac.uk/nature-online/science-of.../pil... - Similar to Piltdown Man - the greatest hoax in the history of science?|...
Follow the story of Piltdown Man, once hailed as our early human ancestor but exposed as a shocking scientific fraud 40 years later. Who did it and why?

Piltdown Man: British archaeology's greatest hoax | Robin ...
www.theguardian.com/.../piltdown-man-archaeol... - Similar to Piltdown Man: British archaeology's greatest hoax | Robin ...
Feb 4, 2012 ... When revealed as a fraud, several eminent men were put in the frame. Robin McKie meets the scientists who aim to put an end to the mystery.

Piltdown Man is revealed as fake - PBS
www.pbs.org/wgbh/aso/databank/entries/do53pi.... - Similar to Piltdown Man is revealed as fake - PBS
"Piltdown Man Hoax Is Exposed," announced the New York Times on November 21, 1953. "Part of the skull of the Piltdown man, one of the most famous fossil ...
Images for Piltdown Man

Search for images of Piltdown Man
The Piltdown Man, 1912 - The Museum of Hoaxes
www.museumofhoaxes.com/hoax/archive/.../the_p... - Similar to The Piltdown Man, 1912 - The Museum of Hoaxes
Woodward's reconstruction of the Piltdown man skull. During the early twentieth century the scientific community was eagerly searching for the fossil 'missing ...
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#106358
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
Pinched? Plagiarized? I would point out to you that there Was NO Jewish Religion as we know it today BEFORE Moses. Moses is credited with writing the First Five Books of the Holy Bible, called the "Torah
" by the Jews. Moses was NOT taught the Jewish Religion, there was NONE, other than what they picked up from the Babylonians, and other peoples that they came in contact with.
Moses was a Prince of Egypt, adopted into the Royal Family, and Heir to the Throne of Egypt. No doubt Moses had a lot of Heirs in front of him, but nevertheless Moses was part of the Royal Family. Moses was taught the Ancient Egyptian Religion from several Egyptian sources, including the book that WE named "Egyptian Book of the Dead."
The Ancient Egyptians called that book, "The Book of the Great Awakening,"and it describes the Spirit returning to consciousness AFTER the Death of the Body. If you survive the death of the body, which depends on your beliefs, or lack thereof, you will discover that you float and fly in the air, and you are carried about by your thoughts.
You have to concentrate on walking to regain the ability to walk. The same situation holds true to get your Spirit to regain all the abilities of the now deceased body.
The Egyptian Book of the Dead discusses this phenomena, and there is a Chapter devoted entirely to regaining the use of your legs, and learning again to WALK upon the Earth.
If you believe the Ancient Egyptians, a wandering band of nomadic desert dwellers suddenly developed the engineering techniques overnight to build the complicated and near perfect pyramids all by themselves, you are an imbecile.
Yep, they built the pyramids. Around one hundred and sixteen have been discovered so far. And what they show is a clear learning curve. And as far as we know, they had no need for assistance from invisible magic Jews.

But they might have had assistance from invisible magic men with wolf heads and bird heads.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

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#106359
Nov 20, 2013
 

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MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
..and evolutionists plagiarised an old scroll that told them thousands of years prior to 'science' that animal life began in the sea.
Thousands of years of failing to get God to pass the scientific method and your sense of humour only shines when you try to talk science.

That's what I call ironic.

“H-o-o-o-o-o-o-ld on thar!”

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The Borderland of Sol

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#106360
Nov 20, 2013
 

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Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
You are talking about the Many FAILED attempts to construct pyramids, that were little more than piles of rocks, that more than once simply collapsed.
OVERNIGHT they built near perfect pyramids with highly complex interiors.
Modern stone carvers say that even with all their modern equipment, they would not even attempt to duplicate what the Ancient Egyptians did.
Some of the vaults are carved into square boxes, and they are made of some of the Hardest Stone known to man.
I have seen several modern stone contractors say those near perfect stone boxes can NOT be duplicated with today's technology.
"OVERNIGHT"??
*helpless laughter*
The Great Pyramid of Khufu alone took 20 years to build. Had a peak workforce of an estimated 40,000. And they were NOT slaves. They were a sort of corvée, except that they got paid, housed, fed, and given beer. And many of them were highly skilled artisans.

Also, ANY modern engineer could build a pyramid, give the funding. The principles are not complicated - although the precise methods used by the Egyptians are still under discussion. Several viable methods have been advanced.

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