Evolution vs. Creation

High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Full Story
Patriot

Savannah, GA

#106299 Nov 19, 2013
Jesus Christ.... Mind Reader and Master of Thoughts

Matthew 12:25 Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them,...
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New Living Translation Jesus knew their thoughts and replied, "Any kingdom divided by civil war is doomed. A town or family splintered by feuding will fall apart.

Luke 5:22 Jesus knew what they were thinking and ...
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But perceiving their thoughts, Jesus replied to them, "Why are you thinking this in your hearts? International Standard Version Because Jesus knew that they ...

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Jesus knew their thoughts and said to them: "Any kingdom divided against itself will be ruined, and a house divided against itself will fall. New Living Translation

“The strength of science is”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

founded in facts.

#106300 Nov 19, 2013
SBT wrote:
<quoted text>
I appreciate that you took in the video. Studying where I did, there was a whole team of Geologists that worked in the mid-ocean rifts. Chatted w/some about their work. Learned a few things that were also integrated into courses. Brown has alot going for him in his hypothesis here that resonated w/me. Why were the frozen mammoths peppered with meteorite shrapnel for one. I could give you more from the rift zones, alot more.
On turtles, they control their buoyancy and conserve air, totally diff than other reptiles so they would be deposited in upper strata, and they are.
On genetics all agree that things are corrupting not enhancing. Further supports my point, going back = pure gene data and an evo proof Cell/DNA mechanism. So by that if mutations are the rule we should be more broken down in Ayala's "Genetic load". Were are having those issues. The evo genetic experts are simply flooding the media with corn data to hide whats going on, they are going backward's and lose every time someone turns the microscopes up a few more power. Your side has a real problem on the DNA/Cell side and would be annihilated in a public debate anytime, anyday.
Consider "junk" DNA. Consider fold markers, the list goes on and grows nearly every quarter, then someone quickly conjures up a new evolutionary explanation. Then my side picks them apart and your side say's all we do is act like critics and don't do any real science. Partly true because your folks have many more spin masters to keep in check. Partly wrong because our fullltime people came out of research mainly too keep those boys honest, a real chore these days. Least Dean Kenyon, evo hero of the 70"s, was man enough to come clean. That's the truth. To be scientific, you must explain the non-life barrier and you can't.
At uniform erosion rates, all the mountains of earth would be worn flat in <20MY, love it when they get dated old. Why are the Himalayas sea floor? They show little sign of erosion, with that weather a few thousand years should have them rounded off. Check into it.
Why do you think there were mammoths shot full of meteorites in the mid-ocean rifts?

The dead turtles control their buoyancy and conserve air so that the dead turtles can place themselves in the proper strata?

All who or what agree with the notion that something is corrupting? What is corrupting? Is it the dead turtles?

Going back to when? What is pure DNA data? Is there impure DNA data?

The only thing your side ever picked with the remote possibility of success was your noses. I see from above you have a hand in that.

So any question that hasn't been answered means a designer did it. God of the gaps. Nothing new there.

All your side does is write a bunch of gobbledygook that gets refuted and in some cases even before it is published. Then nontechnical drudges like you and MazHere run around trumpeting this misinformation as if it were fact. I don't know whether you all are dishonest or just stupid.

“The strength of science is”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

founded in facts.

#106301 Nov 19, 2013
davy wrote:
...and the colored girls sing, doo doo doo doo doo doo doo doo...
<quoted text>
It was sad to hear of the passing of Lou Reed.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Dubai, UAE

#106303 Nov 19, 2013
SBT wrote:
<quoted text>
I dont see evolution in the fossil record. The fossil record shows one thing truly; in each specific deposit world-wide, huge and varied groups of unrelated animals, aquatic and land, were drowned together in sediments. That is what we actually see and hold in our hands with no exception.
Evo paleontologists pick one bone from here, one from there and line them up in evolutionary fashion holding out evo as the only "scientific" interpretation. Never mention the above. Findings are sorted with a viewpoint in mind and leave out the broader truth. Thats what makes it into the kids science texts.
Take the Karoo, we have vertical fossil exposures thousands of feet thick, do we see evo as we move from bottom to top - No. We go to the Grand Canyon, working up the grand staircase, we see huge evo sections (Ordovician, Silurian), missing. Do we see evolution - no. Do we see sea floor life at the bottom of the GS yes in order of mobility, NOT evolutionary common ancestry sequence. One viewpoint vs another. One says many kinds buried catastrophically, another says each layer represents an eon of evolved life. The creation viewpoint is supported with eyewitnesses. Evo requires important things to be provable. Creation requires reasonable evidence also.
We have DNA and the cell operation squarely on our side. How did the complex and stasis in DNA coding come in the very beginning? We see this from Prokaryote fwd as it has never changed nor evolved. With that outside system controlling all life and the worlds oldest book saying what it says as a witness, is this not reasonable? How can man invalidate this position? How can we standback and allow children not to know these truths?
Ah the old "flowers could run faster than ferns" argument.

Too funny.

“I started out with nothing”

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

#106304 Nov 20, 2013
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Boofhead. Is this the best you can do?
Suck it up. You have yet another falsification to add to the that great garbage bin of falsified empirical evidence that goes to further support the basis of all evolutionary prattle...
Simulations show that for most study designs and settings, it is more likely for a research claim to be false than true. Moreover, for many current scientific fields, claimed research findings may often be simply accurate measures of the prevailing bias. In this essay, I discuss the implications of these problems for the conduct and interpretation of research.
http://www.plosmedicine.org/article/info:doi/...
Drippychin,(you want to vomit verbal abuse do not be surprised when the favour is returned, I can assure you that I can be considerably more pointed if need be)

It is all I need to do, as well as the facts being obvious, the facts are facts. You are ignoring time, as is usual for a godbot you assume that time relates directly to your personal experience of three score years and ten. That time period is not even a drop in the ocean compared to 400 million years. Science admits to error, usually in the realms of fractions of a percent, a fractions of 400 million is still big number compared to your understanding of life span.

This is of course only one reason why you arguments fail.

I see you have attempted to obfuscate the discussion by throwing in an irrelevant link (another sure sign of a person with little or no argument) I note that the comments section of the link you posted are quite critical of the authors findings and statistical methods as is Wikipedia who stated :-“… found major flaws in Ioannidis's methods, noting that Ioannidis (who did not collaborate with any statisticians on the article) appeared to have confused alpha level with p value and also built the assumption that most findings are likely to be false into his reasoning, thereby making his logic circular.”
http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/John_P._A._Ioann...

That’s is of course the good christian way to do things, make a decision and then manipulate the data to suite that decision. Unfortunately for such ‘research’(and I use the word in the widest possible sense) methods other researches and readers are not as gullible as you seem to be

Of course when it comes to science, a study design is not a fact, that is the whole concept. Design a study and then evaluate it, if the study is found to be flawed it is discarded, if it is found to be valid then further study is planned and the results built upon.

Or perhaps you would prefer to rely on medicines that are untested or that have failed the tests designed to show their effectiveness and safety? Honey, you stick to your bronze age chanting to your god for forgiveness and witch doctor laying on of hands medicine, me, I’ll choose advanced, designed, scientifically tested and medical board approved medicine any time.

Of course some scientific fields rely on “accurate measures” your term. Again the nature of science is that new evidence may falsify the old. Unlike the babble where new evidence is rejected out of hand, often with verbal abuse and violence in a childish attempt to quell the facts

You are perfectly entitled to your faith but when you use that faith (belief) in a vain attempt to discredit proven fact by offering discredited articles then you are not only abusing the facts you are also lying for and about your god.

“I started out with nothing”

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

#106305 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
Why is it easier for some folks to Believe that a Monkey made a Human Being, than to Believe that God made a Human Being ??
Evolution on a small scale? Yes, everything Adapts to it's environment.
Because some folks are no gullible enough to consider “doh, I dun no wot apened so it mus be god wot did it by magic” to be more than indoctrination of children by the ignorant.

“I started out with nothing”

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

#106306 Nov 20, 2013
MikeF wrote:
<quoted text>
You might note the Egyptian did not believe in one god except for a very short period of one nutty pharaoh.
Also argued that the nutty pharaoh belief was the source of the Hebrew one god belief and also spawned the son (sun) of god belief

SBT
Level 2

Since: Jun 13

United States

#106307 Nov 20, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>Dude, two words:
Plate tectonics.
You should not lie about talking to geologists.
Good topic, first, I had that post in draft mode, closed my laptop last night and woke up to a post! opened it this am, was still in edit mode. Oh well. See if I can do better today.

As you know, we are sitting along the Ring of Fire in the west. Brown maintains that as our solar systems only planet with a crust, that "all the fountains of the great deep burst forth" meant the deep aquifer's that were part of the first earth hydrological system of springs and mists ripped apart and then pushed the plates in one worldwide event, Pangia to Present. When you look at the well logs from the rifts, you see magnetic reversals in the now lithified magma along defined and consistent lines as you go down to drill limits, like was observed in the Steens scarp face. Think about that. Theres more.

The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106308 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
<quoted text>
LOL, oh yes it is that simple.....
According to the Jews they spent many unhappy years living with the Egyptians, and Moses, who was a Prince of Egypt and raised as an Egyptian wrote the First Five books of the Bible.
If you compare the Ancient Egyptian Book of the Dead with the Holy Bible, you discover that much of the Bible is verse for verse, word for word identical.
Therefore the Bible is false.

After all it shows that God is not the only God and that God is not all powerful. Plus there's the part where Moses allegedly led people OUT of Egyptian controlled territory, across the desert unnoticed by a single Egyptian garrison, and to freedom - back INTO what was known as Egyptian controlled territory at the time.

Either way though the fact remains that Adam and Eve never existed, donkeys and lizards don't talk, and the Earth is not a flat square circle at the center of the universe.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106309 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
Why is it easier for some folks to Believe that a Monkey made a Human Being, than to Believe that God made a Human Being ??
Evolution on a small scale? Yes, everything Adapts to it's environment.
O hai! I see u not yet had an edumacation. Plz to be coming backs when u can has one. Kthxbai!

SBT
Level 2

Since: Jun 13

United States

#106310 Nov 20, 2013
Brown has postulated for many years that when the drills go deep enough, they should hit the original remnant aquifer at 7-10 miles down, in the last several years they have. Another feature along the rifts is the parallel lines of magma "stretch marks". These lines are the seams made at the 6 hour ebb and flow of the lunar cycles acting on the crust as new material was pushed out by the lunar effect that warped the curst.
See Dr. Walt Browns video in the links on this site;

http://www.genesisalive.com/2013/10/the-first...

More on the Aquifer network and Ox16/18 issue;

http://www.genesisalive.com/2013/10/the-first...

The paper cited in the above mentions the ratio of Ox16/18 where scientists are perplexed why its off in early-earth polar samples, different due to how far water makes contact with terrain before being used by flora. More smoking gun evidence that the hydro system was exactly what the Bible records.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106311 Nov 20, 2013
SBT wrote:
I appreciate that you took in the video.
Didn't waste my time.(shrug) I appreciate you didn't bother dealing with my post either.
SBT wrote:
Brown has alot going for him
As a liar for Jesus can always make money off the rubes. You should try it.
SBT wrote:
On genetics all agree that things are corrupting not enhancing.
Reality does not agree with you, plus this contradicts many other creationists which I'm sure you will agree with when it's convenient.
SBT wrote:
Further supports my point, going back = pure gene data and an evo proof Cell/DNA mechanism.
No, since you have zero evidence.
SBT wrote:
The evo genetic experts are simply flooding the media with corn data to hide whats going on
So it's all part of the evil evolutionist worldwide atheist Satanic conspiracy.

Therefore evidence doesn't matter since it's either part of the cover up or covered by the cover up which you can't uncover.

Must suck to be you.
SBT wrote:
Your side has a real problem on the DNA/Cell side and would be annihilated in a public debate anytime, anyday.
Ah, THAT'S why you keep losing in court too, as WELL as the scientific arena.

And here.
SBT wrote:
Then my side picks them apart and your side say's all we do is act like critics and don't do any real science. Partly true
COMPLETELY true as your folks sit on their fat azzes while ours do the work, while you lazy bums criticize science you know nothing about and were not even involved in. All you need is a comfy seat, an internet connection, and stupid fundies to lap it all up.
SBT wrote:
At uniform erosion rates, all the mountains of earth would be worn flat in <20MY,
Fundies can't count. Plus refuse to take other factors into account such as mountain building. At GLOBAL FLOOD erosion rates there would BE no mountains. Plus even better you then NEED evolution to happen to account for biological variation from a tiny population.

Of course that tiny population are now crispy-critters, but...
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106312 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
One should never assume that ONE Single "Holy" Book has all the answers.
Good, glad we agree that the book's BS.
Patriot wrote:
God was around LONG Before the Bible and it's people came into existence. ONE Source should never be used in attempts to prove or disprove the existence of a Supreme Being.
Actually only one sauce was ever needed.

Pasta sauce.

See, it wasn't Amen Ra. It was RAMEN!
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106313 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
Albert Einstein was correct when he said that space and time are curved.
Albert Einstein and Science are WRONG when they say the "Fastest thing in the universe is the Speed of Light."
The Fastest thing in the Universe is the Speed of Thought.... roll that around in your brain....
Actually I thought I heard about some brain research which showed that the electro-chemical processes of our brains are limited by the speed of light? Not that this would affect invisible Jews of course, especially since they HAVE no brains.

Which is why 'God' ain't science.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106314 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
Jesus Christ....
Yeah, Jesus Christ, P, you sure love to preach...

We don't care.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106315 Nov 20, 2013
DanFromSmithville wrote:
Going back to when? What is pure DNA data? Is there impure DNA data?
Sure there is. Adam and Eve were white.

I know because I looked it up on the internet.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106316 Nov 20, 2013
SBT wrote:
<quoted text>
Good topic, first, I had that post in draft mode, closed my laptop last night and woke up to a post! opened it this am, was still in edit mode. Oh well.
Don't worry, no-one's missed anything.(shrug)

“ The Lord of delirious minds.”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#106317 Nov 20, 2013
Patriot wrote:
Angels have the power to shape shift and assume ANY Form, from bears, to little green men, to the "Grays with the big oval eyes" to anything else imaginable.
Look at the main Gods of Ancient Egypt. Look at the other ancient religions and their strange looking Gods, half man, half bird or beast. These things are called Mythology. I am not so certain.
The Ancient Egyptians spent most of the Gross Domestic Product of Egypt on Religion, Temples, and Statues. If they didn't see anything unusual right in their midst, what do you think drove them to do such a thing?
2 Kings 2:23-24
New International Version (NIV)
Elisha Is Jeered
23 From there Elisha went up to Bethel. As he was walking along the road, some boys came out of the town and jeered at him.“Get out of here, baldy!” they said.“Get out of here, baldy!” 24 He turned around, looked at them and called down a curse on them in the name of the Lord. Then two bears came out of the woods and mauled forty-two of the boys.
So angels are shape shifting aliens , gottcha.

Level 1

Since: Mar 13

Location hidden

#106318 Nov 20, 2013
Professor wrote:
Even if evolution is true (and there is plenty of evidence to support it), scientists cannot explain how the very first cell came into existence.
After the Big Bang, the universe was sterile. SOMETHING happened to cause life to appear out of nothing.
So you're saying it was not sterile before the "Big Bang"

Humans are exactly like a virus or bacteria. We multiply and will gradually but surely use up all the resources on this planet.

Recently the Hubbell images of deep space were analyzed and were found to closely resemble the magnified images of the brain of rats. Think of how a thought occurs in a human brain. electronically there is a sudden explosion requiring coordination of all other associated cells. As the thought process is solved by either remembering or forgetting the thought dissolves and things settle to normal again.

I believe we're like the mites beneath a strand of grass in our lawns. All we see, all we study is the grass.
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#106319 Nov 20, 2013
SBT wrote:
Brown has postulated for many years that when the drills go deep enough, they should hit the original remnant aquifer at 7-10 miles down, in the last several years they have. Another feature along the rifts is the parallel lines of magma "stretch marks". These lines are the seams made at the 6 hour ebb and flow of the lunar cycles acting on the crust as new material was pushed out by the lunar effect that warped the curst.
See Dr. Walt Browns video in the links on this site;
http://www.genesisalive.com/2013/10/the-first...
More on the Aquifer network and Ox16/18 issue;
http://www.genesisalive.com/2013/10/the-first...
The paper cited in the above mentions the ratio of Ox16/18 where scientists are perplexed why its off in early-earth polar samples, different due to how far water makes contact with terrain before being used by flora. More smoking gun evidence that the hydro system was exactly what the Bible records.
Sorry SBT, but I don't see anything in there that shows anything like the Galaxy class USS Enterprise-D is even possible, much less ever built. The reason being they AT LEAST need a fusion-powered engine to reach mimimum safe distance. Oh, plus fancy force-fields to survive all the asteroids, comets and meteorites that were apparently being shot out of the Earth at such speeds as to reach escape velocity.

When you HAVE that then your global flood MIGHT be able to work.

Take your time.

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