Evolution vs. Creation

Jan 6, 2011 Read more: Best of New Orleans 159,121
High school senior Zack Kopplin is leading the fight to repeal the Louisiana Science Education Act of 2008. Read more

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#104712 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Adding to the above:
Distance, mass, time are real.
Metres, kilograms, and seconds are units we made up so that its possible for us to quantify and compare real distances, masses, and times. We can change the unit of measurement without changing how much distance, mass, or time is really there. If I say you have 454 grams or 1 pound of butter its still the same amount of butter. The units are imaginary, the quantity of butter is real.

Here is the quantitative difference between abstract measures and the abstract concept of god. We can measure out with real physical; devices and demonstrate using science the very thing that only exists physically in abstract thought. Such as Metres, kilograms, and seconds, state lines points on a compass.
Volts watts and all abstract units can be shown to physically exist. Because these things exist in reality but are understood in abstract in relation to the physical reality.

Unfortunately Charles, I nor anyone else can measure out to demonstrate the physical reality of god. With any known device tool or method and what makes it even more illusionary, is the fact it cant be demonstrated to be real by any effect that can be measured.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#104713 Nov 5, 2013
MazHere wrote:
<quoted text>
Excuse me for interupting your rant, but..... ranting does not change what the word 'observation' refers to.
What is observed is galaxies moving away from the milkyway as if it is central to the universe.
This is wrong. What we observe is an expansion with the property that *every* galaxy would see other galaxies moving away from it. No galaxy is central because there is no center of expansion.
What BB offers is a mess that satisfies a philosophy, the Copernican principle, and uses mysteries to explain 97% of itself.
No, the BB describes quite well the expansion of the universe, the abundances of light elements, the structure of the cosmic background radiation, the effects of gravitational lenses, etc. It does hypothesize dark matter and dark energy, which make up about 97% of the *energy* density, but that is a very different thing than simply fitting a philosophy.

“Think&Care”

Since: Oct 07

Location hidden

#104714 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
Abiogenesis is a theory that attempts to explain the origin of life through random natural processes.
Wrong. Abiogenesis attempts to explain the origin of life through natural processes. But those processes are NOT random.

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#104715 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> So, science is imaginary?
Chuck, I don't know if this will help, but think of property lines or political boundaries between countries. Those lines exist on maps, but the representations on the map don't reflect an actual line of natural origin on the ground. They are a human construct based on real principles and established by consensus (for lack of a better term) that allow us to define an area of land. Longitude and latitude are established in the same way, based on scientific principles, but they are conceptual and not physical.

“Don't be mad at me.”

Level 9

Since: Jan 11

I'm just a little bunny.

#104716 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Adding to the above:
Distance, mass, time are real.
Metres, kilograms, and seconds are units we made up so that its possible for us to quantify and compare real distances, masses, and times. We can change the unit of measurement without changing how much distance, mass, or time is really there. If I say you have 454 grams or 1 pound of butter its still the same amount of butter. The units are imaginary, the quantity of butter is real.
Beat me to the punch and nicely done.

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104717 Nov 5, 2013
CrimeaRiver wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in the UK, Winter fell on an October
Here in Dubai we think its winter when you can swim in a pool that isnt cooled.
CrimeaRiver

South Ockendon, UK

#104718 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in Dubai we think its winter when you can swim in a pool that isnt cooled.
lololol - I've never heard of a pool needing to be cooled.... now i've heard everything

Level 6

Since: Mar 12

Location hidden

#104719 Nov 5, 2013
Charles Idemi wrote:
<quoted text> I am indirectly telling you that, science is limited. It does not knows everything. In reality, no body wants to die?
Everybody knows that science dies not know everything.

But we have at least learned a lot more by using the scientific method than we ever did listening to crazy men who thought the Lord of the Universe was whispering eternal truths into their ears.

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#104720 Nov 5, 2013
Chimney1 wrote:
<quoted text>
Here in Dubai we think its winter when you can swim in a pool that isnt cooled.
Are you serious? Do you have to cool swimming pools?

Level 2

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#104721 Nov 5, 2013
Aura Mytha wrote:
<quoted text>
Life arise from organic matter, no modern hypothesis says something different. Organic matter is long chains of covalently bonded carbon atoms. The Earth pumps these type molecules out from the deep sea vents. These also fall out the sky. So your analogy is wrong from the start, perhaps you mean abiogenesis is a process that life arises from inanimate matter. But your unwillingness to think this is possible , does not negate the possibility it did.
Here is the evolutionist in all his scientific glory, I'm unwilling to think dead matter can become alive, and that doesn't negate it could have happened? The reason I don't think it happened is there has never ever been one shred of scientific evidence that it did or ever could happen. Here the evolutionist shows his faith in the unseen .I thought you guys spoke all the time about evidence? apparently not.

Level 2

Since: Dec 08

Location hidden

#104722 Nov 5, 2013
polymath257 wrote:
<quoted text>
Wrong. Abiogenesis attempts to explain the origin of life through natural processes. But those processes are NOT random.
Ha,Ha,Ha, oh yeah !

Here You go to! redefining the definition of the theory to fit your version of what you believe. You are as bad as sucking bone and Dud

“Pissing people off since 1949”

Level 8

Since: Apr 08

Seffner, FL

#104723 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Ha,Ha,Ha, oh yeah !
Here You go to! redefining the definition of the theory to fit your version of what you believe. You are as bad as sucking bone and Dud
How was that a redefinition?

“I started out with nothing”

Level 6

Since: Nov 10

and still got most of it left

#104724 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Ha,Ha,Ha, oh yeah !
Here You go to! redefining the definition of the theory to fit your version of what you believe. You are as bad as sucking bone and Dud
Just because you donít understand the theory does not mean everyone does not understand it.

Abiogenesis is the idea of life originating from non-living material

No random involved
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#104726 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Here is the evolutionist in all his scientific glory, I'm unwilling to think dead matter can become alive, and that doesn't negate it could have happened? The reason I don't think it happened is there has never ever been one shred of scientific evidence that it did or ever could happen. Here the evolutionist shows his faith in the unseen .I thought you guys spoke all the time about evidence? apparently not.
Of course there's evidence. We've pointed it out to you many times.
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Ha,Ha,Ha, oh yeah !

Here You go to! redefining the definition of the theory to fit your version of what you believe. You are as bad as sucking bone and Dud
No redefinition needed. Our position all along is that abiogenesis involves natural chemical processes giving rise to life. Since chemistry is chemistry, that means it's NOT random. Remember, the opposite of random is NOT "intelligence".

Tell us Bo, does combining hydrogen and oxygen "randomly" create neon or helium?

You may remember me pointing out that our position doesn't violate its own axioms while yours does in literally MILLIONS of ways. Have you managed to address this glaring discrepancy in your position yet?
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#104727 Nov 5, 2013
SBT wrote:
I posted a challenge and predicted you could never get started. I was right.
<snip fundie rhetorical BS>
No you weren't.
SBT wrote:
http://www.pnas.org/content/ea rly/2013/06/19/1301664110.abst ract
I posted a challenge, explain the evolution of only one of the 11 coils in the motor and why it runs only on protons or giveup. And by they way, I'll warn you, none these folks have yet to figure out how the motor even starts, so good luck.
If that's the case then neither do you. Something which you already admitted. While everything we DO know is thanks to the evolutionary biologists that you reject for theological reasons. And while you've been dazzling your fellow fundies with faux techy-talk you STILL haven't been able to address why Yersinia pestis completely undercuts your claims. As if Goddidit with magic didn't do that already anyway.

That's why you always fail to present evidence. That's why you lost Dover. Because your side always "forgets" to bring it.

Carry on being a lying hypocrite, SBT. It's all you know.(shrug)

“ Knight Of Hyrule”

Level 8

Since: Dec 10

Location hidden

#104728 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
<quoted text>
Here is the evolutionist in all his scientific glory, I'm unwilling to think dead matter can become alive, and that doesn't negate it could have happened? The reason I don't think it happened is there has never ever been one shred of scientific evidence that it did or ever could happen. Here the evolutionist shows his faith in the unseen .I thought you guys spoke all the time about evidence? apparently not.
There is evidence this happened.
Starting with stromatolites , the biosphere was created.
The mystery begins with "How did Cyanobacteria evolve?"
From self replicating molecules that formed into RNA chains.
We have been able to make organic matter form into self replicating molecules. It only need time to form into Cyanobacteria. While we haven't been able to quite make what is considered life, we are close...very close, and the evidence is that this is how it happened. The organic matter is there , and we have found several ways it could have made the jump to living.
It won't be long before we do, find out how it happened.

http://www.ucmp.berkeley.edu/bacteria/cyanofr...

http://news.discovery.com/tech/biotechnology/...

http://www.wired.com/wiredscience/2009/05/rib...

Level 1

Since: Jul 12

Australia

#104729 Nov 5, 2013
The Dude wrote:
<quoted text>
Very good linking to a source where membership is needed then using a Watchtower fundie source to translate for us, because they would never lie, would they? Therefore we can't see precisely what it is he's talking about.
No problem - just find the organism that's not a chimp with the genome that's, base for base, closest to human.
I know evos have many problems. They have yet to understand what 'the same' means and perhaps should go ask Alice is Wonderland which theory on abiogenesis she supports.

SBT
Level 2

Since: Jun 13

United States

#104730 Nov 5, 2013
Subduction Zone wrote:
<quoted text>
The correct term is evidence, and of course we have evidence that supports common ancestry.
The fact that we have evidence of common ancestry for all complex life implies that there was common ancestry for microscopic life. We also have evidence in the similarity of DNA of different bacteria.
Try not to make foolish claims in the future.
Here is the MO-1 machinery in action. This will keep your theorists busy for a long time. 7 motors and 24 flagella integrated unto a planetary gear system. The gearing is interlocked so the exact flagella counter-rotates in perfect synchronization with it's counterpart. The mindless Time Gods are pretty clever.

"Try not to make foolish claims in the future".

http://www.pnas.org/content/suppl/2012/11/22/...

http://creation.com/germ-7-motors-in-1
The Dude

Birkenhead, UK

#104731 Nov 5, 2013
bohart wrote:
Here Dude!,...here Dud,Dud,dud
Have you figured out what ..spontaneous generation from inorganic matter means?
You should, it's the theory you believe in!
or as I've long suspected, you don't even know what you believe in. Like the other evo fools on here ,it's all about what you are against.
Yes, it means not random and not inanimate. Have you managed to figure out why your position is more rational than ours yet? Still waiting.

Remember that in everything in your posts there has been nothing I have not already dealt with. Unfortunately the same can't be said for you with ours.

SBT
Level 2

Since: Jun 13

United States

#104732 Nov 5, 2013
Course they have not isolated all the controlling mechanisms of MO-1 as of yet. Biochemists can't be busied with such things nor understand the type of gearing they are looking at.

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